TECK troubles with key presses

[chuisfree]

Hi everyone,

I have had my TECK keyboard now for almost two years.  I love the layout and the feeling of the keys.  However, I seem to be having some very frustrating problems with key presses.  I am not a speed typist, but I am not slow. I am having a problem where keys are doubling and/or not registering. 

I have upgraded the firmware (although this appears to overwrite the custom layout I have, so I don't think it has actually been upgraded, since I reapplied my custom layout).  I have also experimented with increasing the debouncing time to eliminate the doubling, but to no avail.  Increasing the time seems to result in a higher frequency of missing key registers.

When a key press doesn't register, it will not register for 2 or three clicks somtimes, and I often feel that I have to SLAM the key to type the letter.

It appears to be problems with specific keys: r, g and h are the worst, they work correctly perhaps 3 in 5 presses, with the rest of the presses resulting in either a double letter or not registering.  The c and t keys are also troublesome, but less so.  The middle backspace key never doubles but it often fails to register.

The rest of my keys seem fine.  I am using the model 229, with brown cherry mx switches and some little red o-rings (I am a heavy typer and the keys are loud!) I bought through a link I found on this site.  I have removed and cleaned the keys, replaced the o-rings, etc., all to no avail.

I am out of ideas and I am feeling desperate and upset.  I really love this layout and the non-staggered keys, the main buttons in the middle, etc.  I even love that it's "different" (no one messes with my keyboard!).  But I have a thesis to write and these key problems are maddening.

So, I need advice.  Is my board just old?  Do I need a new one?  At the price they ask, and given that I've only had it about 2 years, I'm hesitant to repurchase one ...
Am I crazy?  If it was just doubling, then I would think that increasing the debouncing time would help, but the key strokes that fail to register are even more maddening.

Slight tangent:  I've also seen that Matias has an ergo keyboard coming out soon that looks interesting, although I'm not clear yet on whether the keys are reprogrammable.
http://matias.ca/ergopro/pc/

Finally, I am not capable of opening or soldering or anything highly technical.  Ok. I await any help you may have to offer.

[davkol]

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=25055

[chuisfree]

Well.  That topic you have referred me to is certainly intense.  After reading the posts from October until now, I've decided to go ahead and try with the rubbing alcohol. 

[davkol]

If you've seen the latest few posts, they talk about the firmware a lot. Good luck; I'm afraid you'll need it.

[jacobolus]

If you’re willing to really put some elbow grease in, you could always pull out the microcontroller, wire the rows and columns of the switch grid to a Teensy 2.0, and run hasu’s tmk_keyboard firmware, which has a much better debounce routine.

[chuisfree]

If you�re willing to really put some elbow grease in, you could always pull out the microcontroller, wire the rows and columns of the switch grid to a Teensy 2.0, and run hasu�s tmk_keyboard firmware, which has a much better debounce routine.

Yeah, it's not even that I'm unwilling to do that, it's that I'm unable to do that.  I wouldn't even dare open the case and I have no knowledge of electronics or circuitry or any of this.

If you've seen the latest few posts, they talk about the firmware a lot. Good luck; I'm afraid you'll need it.

I've seen the talk of the firmware.  I've updated the firmware to v4.00 but as I tried to say, there does not seem to be support for the customized layout feature.  When you create a new layout, and then upload it using their software, it is only v3.40 (I think).  So, the latest firmware doesn't seem to apply. 

The problem is really maddening though.  I'm consistently shocked by the fact that the key press will double and then fail to register 3 or more consecutive presses.  What's also annoying is that if I type at normal speed, I get disordered letters (e.g. "that" is sometimes written as "taht" or "thaht" when I am SURE I didn't type in that order). 
As it is now, I feel that I HAVE to bottom out to get the r-key to register consistently, and even then, it's iffy.

[chuisfree]

I have a followup question.  I cannot find isopropyl alcohol ANYWHERE here in France and they do not sell it "pure" like rubbing alcohol. 
I am able to find denatured alcohol that is 2,5% isopropyl, 4,5% butyl alcohol, and 90% ethyl alcohol. 

I've read a lot of forum posts online discussing whether isopropyl can be switched for denatured but the responses seem contradictory. Some say that it will leave a residue and shouldn't be used in electronics.

Can I get an opinion from someone a bit more knowledgeable?

[chuisfree]

Are bumps allowed?  I'd really like to know know if anyone can weigh in on my alcohol problem before I wash my keyboard in it ...

[hoggy]

You could try asking in the 'making things together' subforum....

[berserkfan]

I have a followup question.  I cannot find isopropyl alcohol ANYWHERE here in France and they do not sell it "pure" like rubbing alcohol. 
I am able to find denatured alcohol that is 2,5% isopropyl, 4,5% butyl alcohol, and 90% ethyl alcohol. 

I've read a lot of forum posts online discussing whether isopropyl can be switched for denatured but the responses seem contradictory. Some say that it will leave a residue and shouldn't be used in electronics.

Can I get an opinion from someone a bit more knowledgeable?

DO NOT use denatured alcohol in place of isopropyl. These often kill keycaps. I am not so sure what would happen to the PCB, but considering the fact that TECK has no quality, the PCB might very well dissolve. 

[chuisfree]

Well, I used the 95 degree pure alcohol.  It's not isopropyl, but I can't seem to get that in France (unless I want to pay big bucks to have it shipped by the liter, which I do not).

I gave it a bath and it seemed to work pretty great for a week.  Since then, some of the other keys have started misbehaving ... keys that weren't really a problem before (I'm looking at you, M and F). 

Just to be clear, I removed all the key caps before doing the alcohol bath. 

At this point, I think I am going to wait for the Matias Ergo Pro to be out and just go with that.  I really love my TECK, but I don't want to pay $250 again.  The keyboard is only 18 months old and it really started having problems about 13 months in. 

Unless you guys have some input?  Is it possible mine just **** the bed early from some malfunction or something? 

[tufty]

At this point, I think I am going to wait for the Matias Ergo Pro to be out and just go with that.  I really love my TECK, but I don't want to pay $250 again.  The keyboard is only 18 months old and it really started having problems about 13 months in. 

Unless you guys have some input?  Is it possible mine just **** the bed early from some malfunction or something?

I'm almost certain it's firmware, not hardware.  Whereabouts in France are you?

[naz]

is there anything that the user (a non programer user) can do if is firmware related??? i have the same problem with a new diverge keyboard.

[tufty]

In your case, I'd suggest contacting blahlicus directly.

[Sc0tTy]

Well this sucks... My H has suddenly stopped responding to most keypresses :/
Still waiting on a 229 being ordered so that I can send this one back.

[Sc0tTy]

Ayt, my 229 arrived today.

I'll do some reviewing later and side-by-side comparison with the 209.

First half an hour though the typing experience seems good

[berserkfan]

The best firmware upgrade you guys can have, if you're living in Europe, is to buy a 128 key Tipro. It's only 30 Euros in Germany on average. You get far superior quality and reliability and full programmability and the only downside is 2kro. You can customize the layout and I'm using a Teck-like split layout on mine also.

Teck has been plagued by firmware problems all along. Time to try something different! Let these guys improve their boards and build their own credibility from the beginning.

[Sc0tTy]

So I put my 209 and 229 next to each other and did a comparison, check it out here: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=68255.msg1618728

[chuisfree]

At this point, I think I am going to wait for the Matias Ergo Pro to be out and just go with that.  I really love my TECK, but I don't want to pay $250 again.  The keyboard is only 18 months old and it really started having problems about 13 months in. 

Unless you guys have some input?  Is it possible mine just **** the bed early from some malfunction or something?

I'm almost certain it's firmware, not hardware.  Whereabouts in France are you?

Hi Tufty, sorry for the late response. 
I feel a bit stuck with the "firmware/hardware dilemna".  I've tried updating the firmware, but it doesn't allow for any changes to the layout with the newest firmware update. 
[It's been awhile since I last investigated, but it seemed that I could EITHER have the latest firmware with no customization as to the layout OR have the the previous version of the firmware but with customization.  I don't think updating the firmware made much of a difference with the key presses being missed]

Since giving it the alcohol bath, it seems "better".  I still have days where certain keys just refuse to work, yet they work fine a few days later.  It really makes me feel like I'm going mental.  The other day the "8" key stopped working unless I repeatedly slammed it and yet there's no problem today.  Oh well. 

I still think I'll wait for Mathia's keyboard and I'm looking forward to reading some reviews.

Also, to answer your question, I am in Lille, in the north of France.  I see you're in the Alps and thus a lucky son of a gun.

[intelli78]

Hi Tufty, sorry for the late response. 
I feel a bit stuck with the "firmware/hardware dilemna".  I've tried updating the firmware, but it doesn't allow for any changes to the layout with the newest firmware update. 
[It's been awhile since I last investigated, but it seemed that I could EITHER have the latest firmware with no customization as to the layout OR have the the previous version of the firmware but with customization.  I don't think updating the firmware made much of a difference with the key presses being missed]

Since giving it the alcohol bath, it seems "better".  I still have days where certain keys just refuse to work, yet they work fine a few days later.  It really makes me feel like I'm going mental.  The other day the "8" key stopped working unless I repeatedly slammed it and yet there's no problem today.  Oh well. 

I still think I'll wait for Mathia's keyboard and I'm looking forward to reading some reviews.

Also, to answer your question, I am in Lille, in the north of France.  I see you're in the Alps and thus a lucky son of a gun.

Hey chuisfree. I recently got a TECK 207 and was experiencing similar problems. However, I seem to have fixed it by creating a custom layout using their web software, and choosing the 15ms debounce option. Since I flashed the custom firmware, I haven't had a single error. The website warns that 15ms debounce may cause missed keypresses, but I type fast (100wpm+) and it hasn't been a problem Give this a shot, it might solve your problems.

[tufty]

Also, to answer your question, I am in Lille, in the north of France.  I see you're in the Alps and thus a lucky son of a gun.

Ah, too far away.  If you were nearer, I'd have liked to run some hands*-on tests on your board.  I'd suggest trying intelli78's suggestion, see if that improves matters.  That should get you Yuri's latest firmware, which has a way better debouncer than the "stock" firmware

Simon

* and 'scope probe

[MykB77]

I posted this somewhere else based on what was done by another member.  Simply unplug the keyboard, remove the key cap for the affected key and put a small drop of the alcohol down the stem to wet the switch... then press it a bunch of times and then let it dry.  This fixed my space bar and my n key.  They had been doubling and then started to not register key presses.  This method COMPLETELY fixed the issue.  In my case, this was not anything to do with the firmware.  I am pretty sure crud gets down into the switch and gums it up.

[Sc0tTy]

It seems there is also a TECK with Clear switches available now.
https://www.trulyergonomic.com/store/truly-ergonomic-mechanical-keyboard-firm-tactile-cherry-mx-compatible-clear-keyswitches-229-english
https://www.trulyergonomic.com/store/mechanical-keyswitches--cherry-mx-brown-red-blue-black-clear--truly-ergonomic-mechanical-keyboard


Noticed it by accident, they didn't announce it.

[chris.kemper]

My Work TECK has never had a sticky key... it was one of the first TECKS and it is pounded on for 50+ hours/week.

My Home TECK (purchased about 2 months later) has had many problems with 'sticky' keys, but only receives about 6 hours of use/week and spends its life under the dust cover.  After much support, firmware updates, custom mappings, etc, sending in for warranty replacement (and brand new one received), etc the solution that has since always worked (and the others did not) when keys begin to stick:  an hour bath in 90% rubbing alcohol.  Fully submerge... push each key a bunch of times, let sit for 30 min then turn over and let sit upside down for 30 min (try to push all the keys upside down too).

In my case, the home TECK gets dog dander down into the keys and this gums up the keys (despite great house filtering and the dogs not being allowed into this area of the home).

[tad]

Same issue here with a "new" refurbed 209. Followed the advice of a forum member in another thread: apply a single drop of high-concentration isopropyl alcohol into the depressed switch, then press the switch repeatedly until dry. Cleared the problem right up. In my case, I had issues with the E, R, and T keys. Out of the box, the M and Up keys had similar issues but those seem to have cleared up with a day's use.

[Sc0tTy]

Seems that they updated the site:

[possumgumbo]

My Work TECK has never had a sticky key... it was one of the first TECKS and it is pounded on for 50+ hours/week.

My Home TECK (purchased about 2 months later) has had many problems with 'sticky' keys, but only receives about 6 hours of use/week and spends its life under the dust cover.  After much support, firmware updates, custom mappings, etc, sending in for warranty replacement (and brand new one received), etc the solution that has since always worked (and the others did not) when keys begin to stick:  an hour bath in 90% rubbing alcohol.  Fully submerge... push each key a bunch of times, let sit for 30 min then turn over and let sit upside down for 30 min (try to push all the keys upside down too).

In my case, the home TECK gets dog dander down into the keys and this gums up the keys (despite great house filtering and the dogs not being allowed into this area of the home).

Have you ever had to do this for ANY other mechanical keyboard? I have a 30 year old Omnikey, and it has never been cleaned or maintained. Is this a problem/solution necessary with Cherry boards, or just the TECK? I am attempting to return mine due to extremely frequent keystroke misses.
 
I had to go back to my MS Natural Elite, and my shoulder pain has returned.

[tufty]

Is this a problem/solution necessary with Cherry boards

It's not a problem common to Cherry-switched keyboards.

[possumgumbo]

Is this a problem/solution necessary with Cherry boards

It's not a problem common to Cherry-switched keyboards.

Thanks. I didn't think so; I just wanted to make sure, before I finished constructing my own.