Ergonomic? You gotta be joking

[Rusty Rat]

At today’s computer fair one of the dealers who gets a lot of my business gave me a new in the box Keytronic KT2001 ‘ergoforce’ to add to my collection. ‘Ergonomic’ because it has Varied Force Technology? Whats that rubber bands over rubber domes? I think there was a thread on here about these keyboards. Well at least it didn’t have ‘environmentally’ friendly on the box. By today’s standards a Model M is ergonomic because there is less chance of RSI and environmentally friendly because they last a very long while before ending up in Landfill.

Unicomp could promote BS technology as being environmentally friendly, if a cheap rubber dome lasts 2 years and a BS 20 years that is a lot of difference in landfill irrespective of whether they are made with ABS or so called friendly plastics.

[chimera15]

Varied force technology sounds like that board that Microsoft was working on, that has pressure sensitive keys.  So for normal keypresses all you would have to do is barely touch the key for it to make a keypress, or you could actually set the gram force that you want the key to activate at.  If it's true it will be very ergonomic and customizable to individuals.  It basically turns a keyboard into like an electronic musical keyboard that has pressure sensitive keys instead of just an open and close switch.  It opens up a lot of possibilities for keyboards, and really is the cutting edge of keyboard design.

Of course keyboards are probably going to be useless when wacom gets rolling on it's spacial capacitance  touchscreens, that will do the same thing, but in 3d space.

[audioave10]

I would say that my Key Tronic is a better than usual rubber-dome keyboard, but that's all it is.

[chimera15]

Ah, 5 levels of pressure sensitivity I guess, or maybe like Ripster showed, different grams depending on the key preset...if that's what it is it's a gype since the future really is being able to set your own sensitivity.

http://www.keytronic.com/home/products/specs/euro_kt2001.htm

[chimera15]

I've heard it's not a myth that people have been electrocuted from lightning storms through their keyboards.  I never saw how it was possible.  Maybe it was one of these keyboards? lol

[Rusty Rat]

As an expert on ESD that little added joke made me smile. Odds on it is not actually connected to a ground pin. Might even do some tests with a low voltage megger on the pins and the spacebar.

[Rusty Rat]

chimera thanks for the advertising link. MPRII has little to with ESD - it just sounds good. Good advertising copy? They could have quoted meaningful MILSPECS or other standards.

Chances of getting whacked by lightning through a keyboard = zero - the cable will melt first. To prove we can set up an experiment with ripster and a IBM Mini. Give the keyboard 500k through a keytek unit.

I think ripster should do this as part of his keyboard research.

[kishy]

The metal backplate of a Model M (which that wire goes to, it seems) is grounded to the PS/2 ground pin. On the computer side, that ground should continue right on to the computer case itself, which is in turn grounded on the electrical outlet.

Hmm...gonna have to investigate this now. I seem to be combining the concept of negative ground with computers...

[Rusty Rat]

The metal backplate of a Model M (which that wire goes to, it seems) is grounded to the PS/2 ground pin. On the computer side, that ground should continue right on to the computer case itself, which is in turn grounded on the electrical outlet.

Hmm...gonna have to investigate this now. I seem to be combining the concept of negative ground with computers...

That actually goes back to the IBM glory days of over engineering with floating reference points on everything. Since keyboards really don’t contain much in the way of sensitive components its more of a gimmick nowadays like those silly static straps people hang on the back of cars.

[chimera15]

http://www.chacha.com/question/could-i-get-electrocuted-through-my-keyboard-or-mouse-or-monitor-if-lightning-struck-the-house

roflol

http://www.thetoque.com/040113/internetsafety.htm

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=216951

[Rusty Rat]

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=216951

That confirms everything silly thing I have heard about MAC users.

[hyperlinked]

That confirms everything silly thing I have heard about MAC users.

I know. They're ALL like that.

[ch_123]

The metal backplate of a Model M (which that wire goes to, it seems) is grounded to the PS/2 ground pin. On the computer side, that ground should continue right on to the computer case itself, which is in turn grounded on the electrical outlet.

Hmm...gonna have to investigate this now. I seem to be combining the concept of negative ground with computers...

Don't forget Greenock's grounded spacebars.

[ch_123]

I know. They're ALL like that.

The amazing thing was that the Mac survived that incident.

[hyperlinked]

The amazing thing was that the Mac survived that incident.

Hmm... I didn't even read the thread.

Interesting incident. I know a guy who got zapped by lighting in a similar way, but not through a computer. In Boston some years ago, our house either got hit by lighting or something leading into our house got hit by lighting. He was standing barefoot on a metal radiator trying to snap a photo of the lightning storm outside. He got enough of a charge that his legs gave out from under him and he felt this numbness surge through his legs.

He ended up being fine. His legs felt funny for a day or two, but he otherwise got away without a scratch. His modem wasn't so lucky though.

[ch_123]

Hah.

I bet it's all that aloomanum in the Mac. If it was a PC it would melt, maybe explode, but you'd probably be ok.

Also, I've read that it's only cheap computer PSUs that get fried by lightning, and that a decent one can take a short surge of about 2,500V without blowing up.

[Rusty Rat]

Hah.

I bet it's all that aloomanum in the Mac. If it was a PC it would melt, maybe explode, but you'd probably be ok.

I think you're right, if they used the real version of the metal - it would not be a problem. But perhaps  our  American friends may not understand us.

[Nonmouse]

I've heard it's not a myth that people have been electrocuted from lightning storms through their keyboards.  

Ummm....  Do you see the ironeh in this?

(Please tell me it was intentional.)

[chimera15]

Hah.

I bet it's all that aloomanum in the Mac. If it was a PC it would melt, maybe explode, but you'd probably be ok.

Also, I've read that it's only cheap computer PSUs that get fried by lightning, and that a decent one can take a short surge of about 2,500V without blowing up.

Interestingly enough, I worked for a short time in a computer repair place, and the most frequent repair I had to do was motherboard replacement because of lightning strikes.  The most common problem was that the modem or lan line was the thing that took the hit, not the power supply.  Almost always the power supply was in perfect shape, but the rest was crispy.

[kishy]

Cable Modem BNCs

BNC:


RF coax "F connector":

[Oqsy]

Yeah, ripster upgraded his cable line and cable modem to use BNCs so that he could make the post above.  Plus its much quicker to disconnect/reconnect when needed.  There's a post about it around here somewhere...

[nads93uk]

Ah, 5 levels of pressure sensitivity I guess, or maybe like Ripster showed, different grams depending on the key preset...if that's what it is it's a gype since the future really is being able to set your own sensitivity.

http://www.keytronic.com/home/products/specs/euro_kt2001.htm

that would be great for gaming, back in the day of Street Fighter I, the harder you pressed punch/kick, the harder the punch/kick would be

so you can make it so if you press it hard, you can run faster

correct me if im wrong

[chimera15]

that would be great for gaming, back in the day of Street Fighter I, the harder you pressed punch/kick, the harder the punch/kick would be

so you can make it so if you press it hard, you can run faster

correct me if im wrong

Yeah, absolutely.  A whole range of stuff becomes possible when a keyboard is pressure sensitive instead of just on off.

[chimera15]

I wonder how difficult it would be to make a mechanical pressure sensitive board.  The one microsoft was playing around used some kind of next gen thing to make a rubber dome pressure sensitive, but there must be mechanical switches out there that have pressure sensitivity to them as well....

http://hackaday.com/2009/08/09/pressure-sensitive-keyboard/

[nads93uk]

I wonder how difficult it would be to make a mechanical pressure sensitive board.  The one microsoft was playing around used some kind of next gen thing to make a rubber dome pressure sensitive, but there must be mechanical switches out there that have pressure sensitivity to them as well....

http://hackaday.com/2009/08/09/pressure-sensitive-keyboard/

NKRO over USB?

[Rusty Rat]

Good advice ... I use a UPS but rarely plug in the Cable Modem BNCs but since the electricity comes in through ground everything down the line probably takes the hit.  Now I gotta go find some cables - lightning season!

Ripster you are living very very dangerously providing a backdoor into your computer. Modem boards etc have so little spare physical capacitance even small hits can cause soft failure to their components.

I think you guys use 120V and two pin plugs? Us 240V lot have an Earth/Ground pin on plugs and people forget (or don’t know) this is always connected (even if the power is switched off) A big localized ground strike can really raise the Earth potential and feed it back to the power point. Bingo heaps of potential difference and plenty of damage.

Basic UPS are as good at protecting from direct and indirect strikes as rubber domes are for typing on.

[Rusty Rat]

Waaah???

Show Image

You know 3M did something like this about 20 years ago. Small dissipative strip to attach to a space bar. Stopped the chances of a discharge spark causing a localised RF spike. In the good old days a lot of computers had lousy inwards RF shielding and were quite easy to knock down.

Seems like a knock off of the 3M idea, but knowing 3M I bet they made the space bar from Kromene for Keytronics. When I get the chance I am going to test the electrical properties of that space bar. (Out off idle curiosity and having the test equipment to do so)