Hmmm.... My Filco Zero does not have any transposition errors.

[wellington1869]

Watch, I take my credit card, angle it carefully, chop down carefully and....

trewq
trewq
trewq
trewq
trewq
trewq
trewq
trewq
trewq
trewq
trewq

Either Welly did the credit card test wrong or they have fixed it.  Bummer since this is a pretty nice compact keyboard with these Fukkas - and pretty cheap too especially for a 6-key rollover keyboard.

even if they fixed it i've lost all interest in owning a filco, so it doesnt matter  I doubt they've fixed it anyway; never seen a fukka board that works.

[gr1m]

When I bring the card down like a guillotine, I get qwert instead of trewq. Do you mean, bring it down like a guillotine but with the right side of the card lower than the left?

[wellington1869]

I'm beginning to this this whole transposition error thing is much ado about nothing..

lol ripster, what do you mean 'beginning to think'? You've poo-poo'ed errors (when it came to filcos, that is) right from the start. And no, mine wasnt the only test that confirmed transcription issues; i got the idea from others who had complained.

if they fixed it thats great, tho i'm dubious about that, and  you're defense of your favorite vendor against all reason is well documented on this site, all the more reason to be dubious.

Btw, your favorite vendor really missed you while you were gone. lol. read the whole thread, its entertaining as hell.

[ch_123]

[wellington1869]

I'm the black guy

[wellington1869]

I got a "No Questions Asked" return policy with my Filco Zero.

ah, so thats the reward for 3 years of loyal service!!
I'd think you'd have gotten a gold watch and a plaque by now

[wellington1869]

btw did you pick that up in japan? what are those funky characters on the keys?  Is it real fukkas? They still make those?  I thought the world had abandoned fukkas.

if thats a genuine working fukka, shee-it, i guess japan is where they're at.

[ch_123]

All this fuss over fake Alps.

Hurr durr.

[Henry]

btw did you pick that up in japan? what are those funky characters on the keys?  Is it real fukkas? They still make those?  I thought the world had abandoned fukkas.

if thats a genuine working fukka, shee-it, i guess japan is where they're at.

They still make and sell those, I got one from a friend in Japan recently. Mine is a qwerty US and has transposition errors, as far as I can tell, but I don't type fast enough to notice them anyway.

[elbowglue]

Japanese Filco Zero dosen't have transposition, that's pretty good, if you like the japanese layout of the keyboard.  Although I need to see a Filco Zero in normal US layout without transposition problem.  Too bad they aren't available new anywhere either.

[microsoft windows]

If you learned to type on a manual you'd never have to worry about key transposition errors.

[didjamatic]

Does anyone have one of these for sale/trade in ANSI or ISO layout?

[washuai]

I thought everyone knew where you can get a Filco Zero online.

[muchadoaboutnothing]

much ado about nothing.

You rang?

[Henry]

Then how do you know you have one with transposition errors?  I doubt the US vs Japanese part makes any difference.

I haven't used your rigorous test protocol, but mashing 4 keys with my fingers always produces the same output, whichever key is pressed first. I admit that knowing exactly when an ALPS switch is actuated isn't obvious, but I believe my fingers can introduce enough variation to run a meaningful test...
Unfortunately I'm currently 9000 km away from this keyboard and I can't do the credit card test.

I thought everyone knew where you can get a Filco Zero online.

This is almost twice the price it is sold for in Japan. White Fukkas aren't worth it, imho.

[gr1m]

So I bought your mother Fukkas. (hehehe pun)

[maxlugar]

If you learned to type on a manual you'd never have to worry about key transposition errors.

WTF does that mean???

Oh, never mind.

[washuai]

I never said it was sensible to buy from GeekStuff4U, in terms of price, etc.  I merely mentioned it was do-able.  That is interesting that the ANSI has different ALPS, than the [STRIKE]ISO[/STRIKE] Nihon layout zero, though.  It is that round trip ticket to Japan that makes buying it at the source cost more.  I prefer nonclicky, so that part is probably the only good thing.  
Seriously, if I'm gonna import a keyboard, it is gonna have reds or topres.

[Henry]

Japanese layout != ISO. And they don't use different switches. As previously explained, Filco have been using Fukkas for a while now, even though boxes still mention XM switches.

The only Filco Zeros with XM switches you can still find are the (possibly) blemished ones sold under the FKBN87Z/EB-Y part number.

[Lenny_Nero]

When I bring the card down like a guillotine, I get qwert instead of trewq. Do you mean, bring it down like a guillotine but with the right side of the card lower than the left?

Yeah, you mean like this...

treqw
qwetr
trqwe
etrqw
qwetr

My Zero keyboard with a credit card across TREWQ as above, I did it about 20+ times, but I thought that this group summed it up best, and these were not 'cherry' picked they came out in this line one after another.

But TBH I would say mine is "cattle trucked" ...to use the technical term.

[Lenny_Nero]

I had just re-plugged in my Zero to do this test as it was not being used.

As for doing it, I have been doing this as I had read about it, teh problem is because of the speed in which the board is scanned and the reason for teh angled/dropped side of the card is to run against teh direction of the scanning.

Not at any time did I let teh card slide off, and if I did I would not have counted teh results because, TBH I cant see how its possible to have the card miss out one key, when that key is in teh way ?
How does the flat side of the card miss it out ?

Even so, I did it with the shorter side of the card (as shown below) in places around the board. Just as a guess I would think that the newer fixed boards would be available to buy in that area of teh world first and the later revision boards will filter down/across the world as time goes on.

...and just to show the point I have left this un spell checked to show the problem, its strange I dont get the teh errors with other boards

opi
iop
opi
opi
opi

klj
klj
klj
klj
klj


nmb
nmb
bnm
nmb
nmb
nmb
bnm


ghj
hjg
hjg
hjg
hjg


gfd
gfd
gfd
dgf

cvx
xcv
xcv
cvx
xcv


etr
tre
etr
tre
etr
etr

weq
qwe
qwe
qwe

[Lenny_Nero]

I also feel that the so called 'blemished' boards (that are not marked from what I haev [and again] seen) were teh first run of the Zero board and they either switched [ to the Fukka switch to combat the timing problems.

Or just because they wanted another switch ?
...something I doubt they would do for the fun or because of the 'feel' of that switch over this one, IMO it was done to try to get past the problems, or they did as said and did some more work on teh timing/scan rate.

Its much easer to try another switch than re-build the hard/firmware, and that would be the reason to out the XM switched versions as 'blemished' boards. It gives you another get-out clause for stock coming back.

Just a quick skim thru this post/thread I have to say that I read that as pure BS, either he cant type at 100wpm, more like 10, or he is not looking at what he had typed, (of course he could have just lied as he has stock to sell and a contract to keep) look at these last two posts both done with my Zero, as with the other I have not spell checked as I would normally do, see any transposition  errors ?

Last time I had to do a test I was 62 wpm at 98% over teh full 14 hours, I doubt I am really any faster now because of problems with my joints I did not have then.

I like the board for the money it cost 40 quid, if I had given 100 plus it would not be that same matter, I also have a few blue ALPS boards, one that has controller problems that I plan to try once more to 'try' to fix it then they will be moved to this board.

That said the small 15x6 Access cherry black board I haev just got might do and this can go back to my rack.

[ch_123]

I'm not sure if it's localized to just Filco Zeros, there seems to be a lot Alps boards that have these sorts of issues. Sixty told me that even the ALPS AT-101 itself had them if you hit 120WPM+.

[Henry]

I'm back in Switzerland.

Filco Zero Tenkeyless ANSI with Fukkas, bought in Japan in March 2010.
ewq
ewq
qwe
qwe
qwe
...

[itlnstln]

ALPS and their brethren are some loud-ass switches.  My Northgate had to be the loudest keyboard I have ever heard.

[Henry]

Are you bringing the short side of the credit card down at an angle?

Yes, right side angled down.

Have you replicated the test with a known good keyboard like the Filco Cherry MXs?

No problem with my FC200R.

[kriminal]

okay you can sell me your filco zero if you guys dont like em

[itlnstln]

That sounds a lot more fun than just typing on them.  I've been doing it wrong this whole time.

[ricercar]

If I have bad credit, am I immune to transposition errors?