My first mechanical keyboard ISO-ES

[ancalotoru]

Dear all,

After finally reading a lot and seeing tons of video reviews, I am encouraged to post a thread here looking for some of your wisdom. As the title suggests, this is my very first mechanical keyboard and I would like to properly pick a good one. In the past I have been using a Razer mechanical keyboard, clicky style that suddenly broke and I just replaced it by a Logitech k380.

I am opening this because I have not seen a proper PCB or full DIY kit that suits my needs. I would like to get the following, either assembled, to assembly, or to buy parts and then mount them by myself.

• Size: With arrow keys. Preferably 65% but others could work.
• Connectivity: USB-C and Wireless
• Layout: ISO
• KeyCaps: Spanish with the famous Ñ letter
• PCB: Hot Swap is a plus but can manage with soldering
• Switches: Silent, preferably linear. I was expecting some by Kielh or Gateron. Don't know exactly which ones, but silent pls

Also, since this is my very first keyboard, I would not like to spend a lot of money. Basically, I am not trying to be mean, but don't think that having a 500€ keyboard to start with is a good starting point.

Other aspects to consider:
Since I has been struggling to get some information, I would like, for the rest of hobbyist to make this process more clear and easy. In this sense, It is appreciated if when posting you do with some clarifying aspects and a bit of explanation.

The motivation of this thread is to keep people entering into the mechanical keyboards world, and also to raise the voice of European people that use ISO layout. Many many companies just don't care about us, only selling the ANSI layouts.

Finally, if someone is referring to a groupby, that's totally fine, but for clearness on the post, and for newcomers to this, please let keep clear what a groupby is and which good and bad things one can expect from such buyings.

Thanks a lot, looking forward to reading your comments!

[Surefoot]

Try a Keychron q1/q2 with ISO layout (q1 is 75%, q2 is 65%). Get the switches you want separately (recommending Bobagums or Gateron Ink Silents), and get a keycap set that supports "ISO South" (usual name for ISO ES/PT/etc.).
Keyboard is in stock at Candykeys (EU). You can get the switches from Keygem for example or just anywhere. For the keycaps it's a bit more delicate: most of the time it will be a group buy, as there are not many sets that supports that ISO variant and are in stock.

[ancalotoru]

Thanks a lot for your reply. For easiness, I will post more details about the product you have recommended me.

The one I liked most is the 65% so the keychron Q2.

Features:

• Size: 65% with possibly a volume knob
• Connectivity: Just USB-C
• Layout: ISO
• Keycaps: Self source - you can find them in a group by. I have seen some in keychron for about 40 pounds in the UK website of keychron PBT plastic
• Switches: Self source. You commented that I can have them in Keygem or anywhere.
• PCB: Hot Swap
• RGB: Full RGB
• Others: Aluminum plate, aluminum case, foam inside to reduce noise

Thanks a lot for your comment. Are there any upgraded versions with bluetooth?

[Surefoot]

For BT you'll have to look at a few group buys passing by that provide specific keyboards that support that, but they are usually way more expensive. I recommended the Q1/Q2 because of that's the best option with low price, high quality, and good mount system, that supports ISO with hot swap.
If you really want BT you'll have to wait for a GB to happen, and then deliver (usually you'll have to wait 1 year, sometimes more) - maybe not a biggie if you have to wait for keycaps anyway.
Here's one: https://zoom65.com/ (EU vendor is MyKeyboard) (you are in luck, these are not frequent. If you really want BT, jump on this)
Otherwise have a look there from time to time (and of course here on GH, in the [IC] and [GB] sections):
https://www.mechgroupbuys.com/keyboards
Note that BT keyboards need a plastic part (at least) in order for the signal to go through...

(edit) and for keycaps: sometimes the ISO ES support is in a kit named "International" you'll find all the additional EU keys, just make sure there are the ISO ES specific ones for each row If you are ready to pay more you can buy GB extras from usual vendors - they'll be in stock.

[ancalotoru]

Thanks a lot for the comment! I did not reply sooner because I have been throughly looking at the products you suggested. These are very impressive! The zoom65 looks much refined than an entry level keyboard, at least, their advertisement is very nice and it explains some features that for me at least are kind of "premium".

For the shake of other readers, I will only point out that the zoom65 does not have any kind of LED lights.

When comparing both, the Keychron Q2 and the Zoom 65, the main difference is the bluetooth and, in the case of the Zoom65, you get an aluminum piece to improve the sound and the weight of the keyboard. However, you lose the LED lights that the Q2 has. Furthermore, in terms of money, both are nearly the same. The Q2 is about 159$ in its barebones ISO knob version and the zoom65 in European dealers is 179€ (179$ in the international dealers). Shipping not included that is free for the European dealer.

To this, you need to add the switches and the keycaps (if you have ANSI, you get these just for extra 20$), which I would say there may be another 100$ / 100€. Of course an entry level PBT keycaps without any fancy staff in it.

As a summary, it is a pity that for an affordable ISO layout keyboard you have to spend such amount, definitely you are getting a much higher quality than a 40€ amazon ANSI mechanical keyboard, but even though these are all plastic, you can get your hands into a mechanical keyboard to start with, and maybe try some switches.

I will probably get the zoom65, but is weird that there are no more options. I mean, in Europe ISO is the standard, I can deal with the keycaps, that these are country specific, but regarding the layout, it shouldn't be that difficult to produce both alternatives... I have also looked for ISO PCBs, but these are not worth the money, maybe 60€ for just the PCB, adding housing and the rest of parts easily passes the zoom65 or Q2 price.

Thanks a lot for your comments!

[suicidal_orange]

it is weird that there are no more options. I mean, in Europe ISO is the standard, I can deal with the keycaps, that these are country specific, but regarding the layout, it shouldn't be that difficult to produce both alternatives...

Cheap, wireless and a non standard layout (65%, ISO is usually not a problem except keycaps) - in a world where most people use the crappy keyboard built into their laptop there will not be many.

Is the wire really that offensive?

[Surefoot]

RGB wont be seen through most keycaps as good quality keycaps are never transparent (with maybe one exception, that transparent SA set that's been running recently, but it's not cheap at all..). You'll see that it's not needed at all to get a good looking keyboard.

As a summary, it is a pity that for an affordable ISO layout keyboard you have to spend such amount,

Please note that this is extremely cheap (read: entry level) for a custom mechanical keyboard. You are dipping a toe in this hobby, you'll see how expensive it can get..

I mean, in Europe ISO is the standard, I can deal with the keycaps, that these are country specific, but regarding the layout, it shouldn't be that difficult to produce both alternatives...

Two reasons, first you'll find a lot of custom keyboards that support ISO (maybe 2 out of 3) - but very few custom keyboards support BT, so you are limiting your choices by a lot with that requirement, especially given that custom keyboards are usually 100% made out of metal which blocks BT signal (btw you are very lucky that there's the zoom65 right now - these BT customs are very few and far between).
Second reason, Europe seems to mostly ignore this hobby for some reason, the main market seems to be the US and South Korea, both of which are using ANSI layout. Lots of debates as to why or how happened here and I wont enter into the arguments, but the fact remains that ISO buyers are a small minority.

(edit) dont forget stabilizers: getting good ones is a challenge to start with (I recommend the Gateron Ink stabs that are sold from Keygem - but they are really expensive..) and then you'll have to mod them in order to eliminate all kinds of rattle and parasitic noises.

[ancalotoru]

RGB wont be seen through most keycaps as good quality keycaps are never transparent (with maybe one exception, that transparent SA set that's been running recently, but it's not cheap at all..). You'll see that it's not needed at all to get a good looking keyboard.
Yes totally agree with the RGB staff, it's not a requirement for me at all. Just wanted to point out this aspect.

Two reasons, first you'll find a lot of custom keyboards that support ISO (maybe 2 out of 3) - but very few custom keyboards support BT, so you are limiting your choices by a lot with that requirement, especially given that custom keyboards are usually 100% made out of metal which blocks BT signal (btw you are very lucky that there's the zoom65 right now - these BT customs are very few and far between).
Second reason, Europe seems to mostly ignore this hobby for some reason, the main market seems to be the US and South Korea, both of which are using ANSI layout. Lots of debates as to why or how happened here and I wont enter into the arguments, but the fact remains that ISO buyers are a small minority.

Regarding the ISO layout, I agree that maybe in Europe we are just a few and that totally makes sense with the lack of keyboards. Yet, I found it a pity.

(edit) dont forget stabilizers: getting good ones is a challenge to start with (I recommend the Gateron Ink stabs that are sold from Keygem - but they are really expensive..) and then you'll have to mod them in order to eliminate all kinds of rattle and parasitic noises.

Didn't look into these. I will dig about some of these and look for alternatives. As far as I have read, good stabilisers really make a difference but I trust myself into the modding part so really doing some lubbing or modding is not an issue for me.

it is weird that there are no more options. I mean, in Europe ISO is the standard, I can deal with the keycaps, that these are country specific, but regarding the layout, it shouldn't be that difficult to produce both alternatives...

Cheap, wireless and a non standard layout (65%, ISO is usually not a problem except keycaps) - in a world where most people use the crappy keyboard built into their laptop there will not be many.

Is the wire really that offensive?

The main problem that I see is that I mainly work with two computers, the personal one and the one of the office. I would not like to have to wire it whenever I take the laptop. Also, my workplace is not super big and I tend to move the keyboard apart to have enough space for writing, having cables complicates this. Even though I could manage the cable thing, for the difference in price between the Q2 and the Zoom65, is not worth it even to consider.

Btw, thanks suicidal_orange for joining the discussion!