Ceiling Leak at Work. Is my Model M Salvageable?

[mattlach]

So I came in to work this morning to find that a slow leak probably has been dripping on to my desk all weekend, and got all over my Model M (A Lexmark made 52G9700 from 1993)

Result:


Leak at Work by mattlach, on Flickr

(Sorry for the crappy cellphone pic, my real camera is at home)

When cleaning off my desk there was a disgusting sticky black wet substance on it.  It smelled sweet and BBQ-sauce like.   I presume its from the tar of the roof panels.   This stuff appears to have gotten in the keyboard.  I've made sure not to power it up. (though it was connected to my laptop-less powered down Dell docking station all weekend.  I don't think it gets power when the docking station is off, but I could be wrong.)

Do you guys think this is salvageable?   What is the best way to clean it?

Should I start disassembling it, and popping out all the keys and washing with Q-tips and rubbing alcohol or is there a better way?

I've heard of some who speak of putting these in the dishwasher...   Is that really safe?

I'd appreciate any suggestions.

Thanks,
Matt

[chimera15]

If it didn't get to the electronics it should be perfectly salvageable.  You need to get some pop rivets though probably.

[jpc]

Don't dishwasher the entire thing. You can run the keys through a dishwasher, for example in a mesh bag (like a lingerie laundry bag.)

If you have a 5.5mm nut driver, you can open the case, remove the main assembly and controller, and run the case through the dishwasher. You might lose the birth certificate from the case bottom though.

You want to keep the main assembly and the controller dry if possible.

I have seen M's come back from spills just by letting them air dry for a few days, and then cleaning the barrel plate with a q-tip and alcohol to remove sugary goo.

Roof tar might be a bit worse. My condolences...

[theferenc]

Just to add, if it got down on to the membrane, to restore it you will likely need to wipe down the membrane, and thoroughly clean the springs and hammers.

Which, unfortunately, requires that you bolt mod the thing, which can be sort of a frustrating process (at least for me).

Depending on how much crap got in to the assembly, you might be better served buying a "new" one for production use, and retiring this one until you can ensure it is completely cleaned.

Then again, it depends on how much time you're willing to invest. If 4-5 hours of disassembly, drilling, driving bolts, and cleaning sounds like your idea of a good time, I say go for cleaning! And for the record, to me that does sound like fun.

[godly_music]

Even if it got to the electronics, as long as the keyboard has not been powered on while wet, there's probably no damage. What I did with my Cherry is clean the whole thing with ethyl alcohol (the stuff we use to fire up the grill usually). It didn't damage any plastic on mine, but it has been suggested that this may happen depending on the alcohol used and the kind of plastics in the keyboard.

So in general, wet electronics are fine until power runs through them. I don't fully understand why you wouldn't put the controller etc. in the dishwasher too, it's just a matter of getting it a 100% dry afterwards. For which pure alcohol is good, it sucks the moisture right out.

[funnyperson1]

It should be fine if you follow the advice above.   I washed my Model M in the sink once after I spilled some soda on it.  Even though I plugged it in while it was still wet inside (I had some keys stuck), it eventually came out good as new once dry.

[Ascaii]

Talk to your employer if they will replace the keyboard. Consider filing with their insurance.

The fact if you will be able to salvage it, is one only time can answer, and your first priority should be to make sure you have a financial cushion in case your board is totalled.

If it was just water, i'd say your can definitely save it, but if you have "contaminated" fluids, which will leave residue when dry, like tar...that might be tricky.

Alcohol or a mild cleaning agent and some gentle hands on time with your keyboard might save it. Also, i'd recommend complete disassembly and maintenance while you are at it. Remove the springs, switch the ones from the rarely used keys(f-keys) to the heavily used keys (e,i,t,etc). This is a good opportunity for a complete bolt-mod as well.

best of luck to you!

[keyb_gr]

I'd do the following:

1. Remove and clean keys with water + dishwashing detergent + a cloth. If that's not an easy job, it could get messy.
2. Assess amount of liquid that got inside. Is this a board with drain holes?
3. If barrel plate seems seriously dirty, open up case (holding it front edge down) and clean case parts and keyboard ass'y as above.
4. Allow stuff to dry and test the board.
5. If it works fine, apparently none of the crap got into the membranes. If it acts up, a nuts and bolts mod job might still save the board.

[mattlach]

I'd do the following:

1. Remove and clean keys with water + dishwashing detergent + a cloth. If that's not an easy job, it could get messy.
2. Assess amount of liquid that got inside. Is this a board with drain holes?
3. If barrel plate seems seriously dirty, open up case (holding it front edge down) and clean case parts and keyboard ass'y as above.
4. Allow stuff to dry and test the board.
5. If it works fine, apparently none of the crap got into the membranes. If it acts up, a nuts and bolts mod job might still save the board.

Thank you (and everyone else) for your help.


What is a nuts and bolts mod?

[jpc]

Thank you (and everyone else) for your help.


What is a nuts and bolts mod?

See the "bolt modded" link in my sig.

Basically, the interior of the Model M is held together with permanent plastic rivets. You can chisel these rivets off, drill them out, and replace them with nuts and bolts. This has two purposes: it replaces plastic rivets that have broken due to age or abuse, and it allows you to access the keyboard internals-- the membranes, springs, and hammers that make up the BS switch.

[REVENGE]

Personally, I'd denture tab all the keytops (4 tabs oughta get even extremely filthy, greasy tops clean) and then use 100% isopropyl alcohol to clean up the internals.

[mattlach]

See the "bolt modded" link in my sig.

Basically, the interior of the Model M is held together with permanent plastic rivets. You can chisel these rivets off, drill them out, and replace them with nuts and bolts. This has two purposes: it replaces plastic rivets that have broken due to age or abuse, and it allows you to access the keyboard internals-- the membranes, springs, and hammers that make up the BS switch.

Wow...  That's a lot of work...  

It almost seems worth it to just buy another one for $30 at that rate....

[itlnstln]

It's been awhile since I asked this, but...

Can you replace some of the internals of a Model M with new stuff from Unicomp?  I don't think you can, IIRC, because of the controller, but if you can, it might be worth your time to clean the case and keys (if you want to maintain some of the IBM aura), and just replace the guts with a Customizer from Unicomp.

If I ever get my office around this damn place (I think I'm the highest paid muh****er around here still sitting in a cube), I think I might bring an M to work for the lulz.  If I find out that I have a bunch of broken rivets, I would replace the internals with a Customizer and skip the nut and bolt mod.

[mattlach]

How long would you guys wait for the insides to dry out before testing it out?

I can't tell if anything made its way through to the inside of the keyboard, so I want to err on the side of caution...

[theferenc]

I usually give it a few days, then flip it over, give it a few more.

I base this on IBM keystems taking a couple days to dry by themselves when just sitting exposed to air.

Alternatively, a 180 degree oven works fairly well. If you have access to a drying oven in a chem lab, I would recommend using that, as well, since it's much more highly regulated than your home oven.

I would avoid the home oven unless you have a calibrated potentiometer to ensure the temperature doesn't get too hot. Interesting note: some home ovens will hit nearly 600 degrees when set to 400 prior to turning off the elements, then cool down to just above 250 prior to turning back on. Not the most precise instruments in your home, especially if it's a provided by a landlord.

[mattlach]

It's a IBM Model M, not an iPad.

Just plug the damn thing in and see what happens.

Haha,  fair enough.

It's probably dried out already anyway, what with the relative humidity being under 35% and all....

[kill will]

i would be so upset if that happened to me at an office.  

your office should definitely pay for a NIB Black M13.

[bettablue]

Just to add, if it got down on to the membrane, to restore it you will likely need to wipe down the membrane, and thoroughly clean the springs and hammers.

Which, unfortunately, requires that you bolt mod the thing, which can be sort of a frustrating process (at least for me).

Depending on how much crap got in to the assembly, you might be better served buying a "new" one for production use, and retiring this one until you can ensure it is completely cleaned.

Then again, it depends on how much time you're willing to invest. If 4-5 hours of disassembly, drilling, driving bolts, and cleaning sounds like your idea of a good time, I say go for cleaning! And for the record, to me that does sound like fun.

Sounds like fun to me too.  I would love to get inside one of these for a project like that.  I donn't want to do that kind of work on mine though.  I would only do it if mine had something serious tha forced my to take it apaart.  But, I do have the nut driver just for that purpose.

[mattlach]

Just realized I forgot to post an update here.

I wound up pulling all the keycaps and inspecting underneath.  It looked as if a little of the brown dirty tar-water got in onto the plastic splash guard, but it did not look as if anything went through the key holes down to the board underneath.

I would up giving it a thorough cleaning, wiping down the inside with isopropyl alcohol wipes, and cleaning each keycap off the keyboard with more isopropyl alcohol.

The keyboard now looks like new, and works fantastically too.

Thanks for all the help everyone!

--Matt