Regarding Group Buys

[didjamatic]

This might earn me some flames but I wanted to throw this out.

A group buy is when people pool their money to gain buying power to access special pricing and/or to get a manufacturer's attention to produce something.
In a group buy, everyone pays money up front, before the order is placed and you all share risk with the person organizing the group buy.
In exchange for this risk and delay in receiving the product, you all get the discounted price.  Usually the person organizing it passes the items through making very little profit. Often they will just get their products for free in exchange for handling the group buy.
This makes sense.  For everyone.

A business buys a product with their money and they are the ones taking on risk and having to invest.  (or they get investors/a loan)
Once the product is received it is sold at a profit to the business owner who risked funding the purchase.
This is the way normal businesses operate.
And it makes sense.  For everyone.

But on here I keep seeing group buys where people want money upfront for a product they don't yet have, but they don't pass the products through at the discounted wholesale prices.
The organizer of the group buy has no risk, yet wants a fat return on the sale of what others fronted the money for.
This bugs the hell out of me and doesn't make sense for any who buy them.

If you want profit, front the money yourself and then sell the products at a profit.
If you want to organize  a group buy, pass the products through with a modest fee in exchange for organizing it.  Typically the organizer gets their products free or something to that effect.
Having it both ways doesn't make sense.

[demik]

wrong forum

[didjamatic]

I check in periodically and buy things from sellers from time to time but man, I don't get the group buy mentality shift that has occurred.
Holy smokes Rip, you've been busy - nearly 57k posts!

This does seem to be the right forum, as it pertains specifically to group buys, but feel free to move it if you like.

[Taracta]

Is there any particular group buy(s) that you are referring to didjamatic?

[didjamatic]

Weird, I see more people that I know on another forum than on this one and mostly new names on GH.  Was it the group buys?

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[didjamatic]

Is there any particular group buy(s) that you are referring to didjamatic?

Nah, I'm not going to pick on anyone.  It's more a philosophical and ethical gripe.
I see lots of people doing great things on here.

[captain]

Well written!

[cactux]

Where are you heading with this thread? How many GB have you organize? So you are implaying that the people that organize GB is because the want a 3 dollar keycap free, that they have some money from the vendors, that they stole peoples money ?. If you think like that you are in the wrong community.
Organize your first GB and share your experience instead of talking about something that you have not done before.

[mbc]

Where are you heading with this thread? How many GB have you organize? So you are implaying that the people that organize GB is because the want a 3 dollar keycap free, that they have some money from the vendors, that they stole peoples money ?. If you think like that you are in the wrong community.
Organize your first GB and share your experience instead of talking about something that you have not done before.

You didn't read his post. He is basicly saying that a lot of people call their SALES group buy and he is right

[didjamatic]

Where are you heading with this thread? How many GB have you organize? So you are implaying that the people that organize GB is because the want a 3 dollar keycap free, that they have some money from the vendors, that they stole peoples money ?. If you think like that you are in the wrong community.
Organize your first GB and share your experience instead of talking about something that you have not done before.

I don't believe I've implayed anything.  I was also not saying that anything has been stolen.  And as for my track record, I've probably moved a greater volume of keyboards than most people on this forum combined and done so with satisfied buyers/sellers on the other end.  I was one of the first people to do custom doubleshot key caps for others on any keyboard forum.  Sixty beat me placing his order for Geek Hack caps but I had actually been working with signature plastics before then -  sending a keyboard and back and forth, etc.  I was the first person to note that GH on a keyboard corresponded to Geek Hack and did caps for it.  I've also helped countless newbies who wanted to do their own thing with their questions, and happy to help.  I just did most of it before the feedback system was in place.  My other life has been quite busy and I haven't had the time to buy/sell boards like I used to.  But I have supported others in their endeavors on this and other forums and lurked on and off.
/End_Keyboard_Awesomeness_Brag

Usually I don't speak up about things like this, but it's been bugging me for a long time.  

My point condensed so everyone can understand:  If you want others to front the money for a group buy - that's awesome, do it and keep your margins small.  If you are fronting the money yourself, charge whatever you want and it will sell or not sell based on demand.

Mods be nice or end up looking like this guy and people leave forums in droves from it.  Don't get so pissy when someone has an opinion, especially a valid one.

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[Quarzac]

I agree with Didja here, mostly. I think GB organizers have a right to adjust their profit margins in accordance with the amount of time they will be putting into the buy. If they're going to run an insanely large buy and put mountains of time and effort into it, they're entitled to a little more than someone who ships out 25 sets.

[didjamatic]

Woah, I didn't notice your subtle avatar change, who is that?

[TexasFlood]

http://geekhack.org/showthread.php?31626-Random-avatar-stuff&p=598432&viewfull=1#post598432

And please stay on topic or I'll have to report you, demongolate you, move your post, or otherwise say tsk, tsk.

demongolate? I learned a new word, is that the word of the day?

[didjamatic]

Um, matrix glitch?  Did my post just move?

[DanGWanG]

Where are you heading with this thread? How many GB have you organize? So you are implaying that the people that organize GB is because the want a 3 dollar keycap free, that they have some money from the vendors, that they stole peoples money ?. If you think like that you are in the wrong community.
Organize your first GB and share your experience instead of talking about something that you have not done before.

Don't implay anything about anyone without doing any research.  How rude!

[cactux]

^ I am ASKING if he implies that

[squarebox]

I like didjamatic, he speaks the words many know about but suffer in silence.

[Glissant]

To whomever moved this thread. This is so not off-topic. If anything this should have been moved to the feedback/suggestions part of the forums. Two simple reasons; It's about geekhack and it's feedback on something that a lot of members are paying attention to. (Added reasons to clarify that I think this off-topic bull**** has to be crystal clear if threads/posts are going to be moved/deleted because of being "off-topic" to one moderator or another.)


About the resellers hiding behind the guise of a group buy; Shouldn't somebody be addressing this? At least make it clear that some members would like to know when they are a part of something that is an actual group buy, and not a reseller's wet dream. I think the way it is being dealt with at DT seems like an OK way of doing it.

There is not a lot to add because I completely agree with didjamatic. If you want to make a profit that is closer to retail sales than a couple of bucks for making a group buy happen, you should clearly not be advertising it as a group buy.
The definition of a group buy is very clear.


Edit: And I just can't keep quiet about it.
Cactux, you were clearly implying a whole bunch with your post. Just because there are question marks behind a sentence, that doesn't make them questions that you actually expect an answer to.

This just proves that you weren't even asking any real questions:

Organize your first GB and share your experience instead of talking about something that you have not done before.

Thankfully didjamatic isn't a beginner at this forum stuff, so he dealt with it himself.

[didjamatic]

I didn't think I was alone in my thoughts, glad to hear I'm not.

[laffindude]

I may not like what's going on, but it is a buyers' market. Who am I to say anything if the buyers are willingly getting rammed by certain sellers. Well, more power to them if they have customers lining up ass first.

[royalsego]

GB organizers always say how it is a pain in the ass for them to do this, yet they do it over and over again, obviously there's a good profit margin to be made, because i get charged 6 bucks for bubble mailer and the stamp obviously says 1.xx and on top of the 'handling fee' that's added to each order

i don't know why they dont just post in quotes of what melissa's e-mail entails, for community by community

"My time is valuable, I do this because I want the set, so I will be charging blah blah to handle your orders and my time invested." then 2 weeks later, said person runs another GB

[Glissant]

If people want to make money on stuff, that's fine, but saying that it's a group buy simply for convenience or subterfuge is what I think is wrong. If anything we need to have clear guide lines. I am sure people won't care much if the listing is called "Keycap sale" instead of "Group buy".