Who messed with his XT?

[JPG]

Saw someone selling an XT spacebar assembly. Knowing how it's a pain to put it back together from what I read, my first thought was that someone in here messed with is, was unable to put it back and is now trying to at least get some money out of it haha!

[fohat.digs]

I think that there are a lot of people around here that give up way too quickly.

Personally, I have dis-assembled and re-assembled all the main types of IBM Model Fs, many times (dozens) each, and I am very good at it.

Having said that, I never get it right on the first go and always have to break it down and built it back, multiple times, every time, which is a tedious and fussy proposition, not least because it requires removing all the keys and replacing them all every time.

To get your Model F completely nice and well-tuned in under 3 complete tries is something to be proud of. That is after you know the tricks. The first time, expect to do it at least 5-10 times and that may not be enough.

So often I hear somebody wailing about how "impossible" it is to re-assemble an XT spacebar when they tried it 4 times without using props. They are idiots. It would take me 4 tries and I know exactly how to do it and what tricks I need.

Before you complain about an XT spacebar, make sure that you have tried it a dozen times using a weighted loop of thread and maybe some tape and clamps for good measure.

[JPG]

I think that there are a lot of people around here that give up way too quickly.

Personally, I have dis-assembled and re-assembled all the main types of IBM Model Fs, many times (dozens) each, and I am very good at it.

Having said that, I never get it right on the first go and always have to break it down and built it back, multiple times, every time, which is a tedious and fussy proposition, not least because it requires removing all the keys and replacing them all every time.

To get your Model F completely nice and well-tuned in under 3 complete tries is something to be proud of. That is after you know the tricks. The first time, expect to do it at least 5-10 times and that may not be enough.

So often I hear somebody wailing about how "impossible" it is to re-assemble an XT spacebar when they tried it 4 times without using props. They are idiots. It would take me 4 tries and I know exactly how to do it and what tricks I need.

Before you complain about an XT spacebar, make sure that you have tried it a dozen times using a weighted loop of thread and maybe some tape and clamps for good measure.

I have not tried it (yet). For now, my XT spacebar is a thumb gym. I just found it funny.

[Pacifist]

Luckily I found out what a PITA XT bars were so they were never removed

[berserkfan]

Saw someone selling an XT spacebar assembly. Knowing how it's a pain to put it back together from what I read, my first thought was that someone in here messed with is, was unable to put it back and is now trying to at least get some money out of it haha!

(Attachment Link)

That is NOT me. But I wish it was ME. I just haven't gotten around to selling pieces of my Model Fs.

[kishy]

I really don't get the frustration over the XT spacebar. I took mine apart before I'd ever really heard much about the supposed difficulty and had it back together in maybe 2 attempts without trouble.

The key is to reassemble the metal rod mechanism before you put the plates back together, and just balance the capacitive flippy piece (highly technical term for it) on the spring. No floss, no fussing with mating the spacebar to the metal rod, easy.

[berserkfan]

I really don't get the frustration over the XT spacebar. I took mine apart before I'd ever really heard much about the supposed difficulty and had it back together in maybe 2 attempts without trouble.

The key is to reassemble the metal rod mechanism before you put the plates back together, and just balance the capacitive flippy piece (highly technical term for it) on the spring. No floss, no fussing with mating the spacebar to the metal rod, easy.

Um, this is Kishy speaking, a guy who has modded like, what, 1000 ancient keyboards with totally unique layouts?

Clumsy folks like me, on the other hand, have track records of destroying all keyboards I touch. Just ask Soarer, wcass and IvanIvanovich. Every month or so I email them for help or advice on something that I screwed up. Between the three of them you should be able to tell how many keyboards I rendered inoperative.

Not surprisingly, if you look up all my back posts, you will discover that I have only sold keyboard parts before. The only keyboard I have ever sold on this forum didn't even belong to me (was my friend's.)

[kishy]

I really don't get the frustration over the XT spacebar. I took mine apart before I'd ever really heard much about the supposed difficulty and had it back together in maybe 2 attempts without trouble.

The key is to reassemble the metal rod mechanism before you put the plates back together, and just balance the capacitive flippy piece (highly technical term for it) on the spring. No floss, no fussing with mating the spacebar to the metal rod, easy.

Um, this is Kishy speaking, a guy who has modded like, what, 1000 ancient keyboards with totally unique layouts?

Clumsy folks like me, on the other hand, have track records of destroying all keyboards I touch. Just ask Soarer, wcass and IvanIvanovich. Every month or so I email them for help or advice on something that I screwed up. Between the three of them you should be able to tell how many keyboards I rendered inoperative.

Not surprisingly, if you look up all my back posts, you will discover that I have only sold keyboard parts before. The only keyboard I have ever sold on this forum didn't even belong to me (was my friend's.)

LOL. I appreciate the sentiment, but I'm not some sort of keyboard assembly god.

Alright, some people aren't as good at taking things apart and putting them back together. Fair point. It happens to be a skill of mine, whether it was small household appliances as a kid, moving on to my bike(s), computer(s) and now car(s)...

Just saying - sometimes you've gotta think outside the box. Most people I've seen seem to talk about trying to hook the spacebar back onto the rod from above. My initial approach (which works remarkably well) was to assemble that first, then assemble the rest of the board around that, upside down.

[False_Dmitry_II]

I really don't get the frustration over the XT spacebar. I took mine apart before I'd ever really heard much about the supposed difficulty and had it back together in maybe 2 attempts without trouble.

The key is to reassemble the metal rod mechanism before you put the plates back together, and just balance the capacitive flippy piece (highly technical term for it) on the spring. No floss, no fussing with mating the spacebar to the metal rod, easy.

Um, this is Kishy speaking, a guy who has modded like, what, 1000 ancient keyboards with totally unique layouts?

Clumsy folks like me, on the other hand, have track records of destroying all keyboards I touch. Just ask Soarer, wcass and IvanIvanovich. Every month or so I email them for help or advice on something that I screwed up. Between the three of them you should be able to tell how many keyboards I rendered inoperative.

Not surprisingly, if you look up all my back posts, you will discover that I have only sold keyboard parts before. The only keyboard I have ever sold on this forum didn't even belong to me (was my friend's.)

LOL. I appreciate the sentiment, but I'm not some sort of keyboard assembly god.

Alright, some people aren't as good at taking things apart and putting them back together. Fair point. It happens to be a skill of mine, whether it was small household appliances as a kid, moving on to my bike(s), computer(s) and now car(s)...

Just saying - sometimes you've gotta think outside the box. Most people I've seen seem to talk about trying to hook the spacebar back onto the rod from above. My initial approach (which works remarkably well) was to assemble that first, then assemble the rest of the board around that, upside down.

I've never messed with those before, but I use the same method for putting alps switches back together. I put everything inside the top half of the switch, including the spring. Then hold the keyboard upside down and push the switch up into place.

[jacobolus]

[...] I use the same method for putting alps switches back together. I put everything inside the top half of the switch, including the spring. Then hold the keyboard upside down and push the switch up into place.

Is there any other way to do it? This way is clearly the best... though you don’t have to hold the keyboard upside down. It works perfectly well if you just rotate it about 90°, so that the spring is horizontal as put the switch back together.

(Actually, it’s even slightly easier if the switch is just loose, and you don’t have to hold a whole keyboard in the air.)

[False_Dmitry_II]

I've seen people put the spring and click/tactile leaf into the bottom of the switch, and then only have the slider in the top and try to just plug it in. Doesn't seem like it should work to me.

[jacobolus]

It works but it’s definitely much trickier.

[Hellmark]

Right now I am typing on my XT Model F, and there are a few keys that you really have to mash down on to get them to work. Scroll lock, alt, caps, and 0/Ins. I have been somewhat hesitant to take it apart because of potential difficulty to get it back together. At a new job, and need a good keyboard with USB support, so this is my only option at the moment. When I can get things together to come up with USB support for my M, I'll probably be more willing to take a try at fixing this XT. Kinda sucks, same make and model system I had before at my old job, with the exception of the dock, is the version without PS/2 support.

[fohat.digs]

same make and model system I had before at my old job

Huh?

Are you using a Teensy or Hagstrom?

The mechanical action of the keys are physical mechanical problems related to springs and seating. Try pulling them up and re-seating them carefully. Lean the keyboard forward, or even almost upside-down to get them centered correctly.

[Hellmark]

Sorry for the confusion. I hadn't got around to doing USB conversion for my M yet because the system I used it on at my old job had a laptopdock that supported PS/2. Wasn't critical, so got back burnered. New job I have the same exact model laptop, but the docks they have are the smaller version without PS/2 support.

I've been playing with the XT a bit more, but still have to mash the keys to get it to register.

[Parak]

Oooor maybe someone merely modded their AT to a standard spacebar with two more modifiers and now no longer needs the gigantobar...

(not I)