[WTB] various Alps-mount keyboards or loose switches

[jacobolus]

Hi folks,

I want to get my hands on some of every Alps-mount switch I can find (at least the modular switches; not sure about Acer switches or similar), so that I can (a) measure their force curves, and (b) build a custom switch tester and send it around on tour (likely out of CNC-cut hardwood and direct wired, but I’m not totally sure about the materials or construction methods yet), including the nicest example of every type of Alps switch I can find.

To that effect, I’m interested in buying whole keyboards, keyboards without keycaps, or (ideally) loose switches of any type that I don’t currently have. (And feel free to ask about types I do already have; I might be happy to take some more, though no promises. I am especially interested in very good condition SKCM brown, ivory, blue, amber, orange, or tactile green switches)

If anything in these lists is confusing, see: http://deskthority.net/wiki/Alps_mount_recognition

Here’s what I have copies of so far:

- Alps SKFL: white sliders (standard), yellow sliders (locking), cyan sliders (extra heavy)

- 2-3 types of Alps integrated domes

- Alps SKCL: green, extra-heavy green, cream/ivory, yellow, green with LED, yellow with LED, double-click off-white (with gray housing)

- Alps “plate spring”: white, double-clicking white

- Alps SKCM: brown, ivory, blue, amber, white, orange (w/ both white/gray switchplate), salmon, slightly heavier salmon, black, cream (dampened), white (dampened), tactile green (with and without slits), locking cream, locking gray

- Matias: quiet, clicky

- Omron B3G-S: white (tactile), amber (clicky), white (stiffer clicky), cyan/blue (lighter not-too-tactile clicky)

- SMK “second generation” with Alps mount: white (tactile), locking white, cyan/blue (clicky)

- Mitsumi “standard mechanical” with Alps mount

- KPT

- XM 4-tab clones: green (clicky, from a Ducky 1087XM)

- Acer switches (though I don’t think these can be easily incorporated into a switch tester)


Here’s what I’m looking for:

- TEC switches, or other switches similar to KPT/TEC
- Tai Hao Aruz
- Cherry MX with Alps mount (clicky or linear)
- Alps “common mount low profile”
- Alps SKCL (linear) brown, gray
- Omron “Alps-style switch” (name from Deskthority wiki)
- Omron B3G-S very-lightly-tactile white (different from standard Omron B3G-S white)
- Alps buckling spring
- Alps SKBM/SKBL white, black, gray, yellow (to be honest I’m not too excited about these though, so it’ll have to be pretty cheap)
- Mitsumi “mini mechanical”
- Various other Alps clones. e.g. the ones in the DSI “big font” keyboards.
- Any other discrete Alps-mount switches that I don’t know about

I’m also interested in any unusual / nice sets of Alps keycaps, especially ones with unusual shapes/profiles.

In general, I’m pretty cheap about this.... I’m not going to spend $100 for some really ****ty clone switches. But if you’ve got something that you think is useless and you want to unload it for $10–50 (depending on how nice / how interesting I think it is), dumping it on me might be a nice alternative to leaving it in the bottom of your closet or throwing it out.

[jacobolus]

So apparently the way this works is I just add a “bump” post every day or two until I get tired of it. I guess that’s why I don’t post in classifieds too much – seems like a very ineffective disorganized system. But hey, maybe someone will bite.

[demik]

you're welcome to add your 2 cents on how to fix this "disorganized system" to the admins.

sure, they'll ignore it, but you can at least say you tried.

or, like everybody else, you can wait until you find what you need.

[jacobolus]

I think any fix would involve a whole lot of developer effort, of which there’s not much surplus at the moment. So it’s probably pretty unlikely. Anyway, this is somewhat off-topic.

Give me your Alps-mount switches everyone!

[jacobolus]

bump

[jacobolus]

bump

[dorkvader]

I have one of those horrible dauphin keyboards NIB if you want it for cheap. It was one of these:
http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=44955.msg935689#msg935689

[CPTBadAss]

I've got a board with Acer Blacks that I bought for the keycaps. Would you be interested in the switches?

[jacobolus]

I've got a board with Acer Blacks that I bought for the keycaps. Would you be interested in the switches?

Possibly, though I’m not sure how easy it would be to integrate Acer switches into a switch tester, since they’re not discrete. Let me think about it and get back to you.

[Daniel Beardsmore]

Ah, I never read the classifieds here. I only read the Keyboards forum here, while I read all of DT.

My thoughts have been for some time: I would like someone with photography skills to re-shoot my switch collection for the wiki. Ideally photos with a pure white background, and in high resolution (owing to how using the flash restricts me to 1/60 sec exposure, I can only use the middle 1/9 of my lens, or 0.56 MP). Whoever can demonstrate that he or she is up to this challenge, can have my switch collection. I'm not prepared to part with it otherwise, as it would be a waste to give them to anyone who's not going to deliver (and the OP here has no track record of wiki work — whoever gets my switches needs to be wiki contributor).

However, I got a bag of 20 of the yellow mini Mitsumis, with two destroyed and eight claimed, so I'm happy to part with a few more of them as I'm not short of them.

As a note, the "XM 4-tab clones" from the Ducky are not representative. Ducky placed custom orders with Xiang Min for reduced force switches, so they're lighter. They're normally 60 or 65 g (depending what you read) and Ducky's are 55 g. The official part number is KSB-C (and KSB-N for the linears) but the Ducky ones might have been assigned a different code. I got my Ducky-spec KSB-C and KSB-N from MK; their website is currently down, so I can't say whether they're still on sale.

BTW, I got my amber Alps switches here: http://www.blujay.com/?page=ad&adid=3138253

[jacobolus]

Ah, I never read the classifieds here. I only read the Keyboards forum here, while I read all of DT.

No worries. :-)

My thoughts have been for some time: I would like someone with photography skills to re-shoot my switch collection for the wiki.

I’d be happy to do this for all the Alps-mount switches I already have, though it might take me a while. No promises about any other switches. After I have the pictures, can you walk me through whatever needs to be done on the uploading / wiki editing side? (File naming conventions, categorization, inclusion in whatever relevant pages, etc.)

No need to send me anything just yet though.

However, I got a bag of 20 of the yellow mini Mitsumis, with two destroyed and eight claimed, so I'm happy to part with a few more of them as I'm not short of them.

I’d be happy to buy 2–4 from you.

As a note, the "XM 4-tab clones" from the Ducky are not representative. Ducky placed custom orders with Xiang Min for reduced force switches, so they're lighter. They're normally 60 or 65 g (depending what you read) and Ducky's are 55 g.

Know what other keyboards have XM switches? Or know anyone else who has some they removed from a keyboard and now want to unload?

BTW, I got my amber Alps switches here: http://www.blujay.com/?page=ad&adid=3138253

I have two Apple //c A2S4100 keyboards, full of amber Alps switches. Unfortunately one of them was in really bad condition, but the other is in okay shape. (Still slightly scratchy though; for the switch tester I’ll likely transplant the spring, slider, and click leaf from an amber Alps switch into the housing / switchplate of a pristine condition blue Alps switch.)

[Daniel Beardsmore]

Well, I need to be confident about your photography first, since I can't exactly look at your existing work as a guide to your skill level and determination. Adding images to the wiki is a complete doddle — I have no idea why people are so pathetic about it. I'll spend an hour or two taking the photos, another hour or two selecting the least terrible photos and cleaning them up (colour balance, levels, dust, that camera smudge etc), and finally adding them to MediaWiki takes a few minutes: it's really that easy (and documented, I might add).

I'll post you off some mini Mitsumis, but an address would be useful …

Confirmed Xiang Min KSB usage is on the wiki:

http://deskthority.net/wiki/Xiang_Min_KSB_series#Keyboards

Most of what we called "XM" switches are probably not, though we can't be sure as they share the same metal parts now with Hua-Jie switches.

My complete loose switch list, including stock Xiang Min switches; you can see that I don't have enough of most of the switches to just give them away to anyone who won't make good use of them:

http://deskthority.net/wiki/User:Daniel_beardsmore#Switches

Apparently I have 29 of the Mitsumis … slightly odd figure, and apparently I have a lot more than I thought. Enough to make a whole keypad if anyone wanted.

[peachesenregalia]

I have an old Royal typewriter keyboard for sale that uses Alps knock-offs that I haven't seen documented anywhere. The switches are linear and they make a godawful pinging sound, but the keycaps are unique and if you want to do anything with the whole assembly, the PCB is only a matrix with the rows and columns conveniently broken out into separate crimp housings. See this thread: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=65714.0

Also, the price is perhaps excessive, but I'm willing to sell it for less.

[Daniel Beardsmore]

Those are classed as USw LABW01; you will find them near the bottom of Alps mount recognition.

I've added yours to the list.

[jacobolus]

I have an old Royal typewriter keyboard for sale that uses Alps knock-offs that I haven't seen documented anywhere.

I got HaaTa to buy a Panasonic video editor keyboard with switches like those, and then shortly afterward someone else on Deskthority also bought one, which is linked from that wiki page Daniel just linked.

I don’t really want to spend $60 for something which switches that seem kind of uninspiring, even if the keycaps are fun – but I’d buy a few loose switches for $5 + shipping, or the whole board for $10 + shipping.

[Daniel Beardsmore]

I'd be happy to buy a few switches too should the board get split up. I can take slightly better photos than rzwv

[Heliosphere]

I'd love to try out the switch tester if it gets finished, maybe at a Bay Area meetup before it gets sent on tour. I just received an orange Alps keyboard from intelli that I plan to eventually salvage for switches. However, I'm quite busy at the moment so it might be a while before taking it apart. I'd be willing to sell you a few of the orange Alps once I've salvaged it.

[jacobolus]

Okay, KPT keyboard on the way:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/291354391012?orig_cvip=true




Still looking for other types of Alps-mount switches. If someone has a Zenith ZKB-2 with Alps-mount mini Mitsumis, I’d love to buy/trade it.

[Daniel Beardsmore]

Not sure I'd want to spend fifty bucks to get me a 2-unit Tai-Hao backspace ;-)

Those Alps-mount Mitsumis might take you a lifetime to find. If you're eyeing up the KPT Vortex though, don't forget the hordes of KPT clones, assuming KPT switches aren't clones themselves. KPT clone keyboards (Podworld, Micronorth etc) are fairly widespread.

The ones that have me really curious are Tai-Hao Aruz switches. Currently we have very little dating evidence for them, and they're extremely rare. Those seem to have clones of their own too, as alps.tw has at least one with branding that Tai-Hao assured me was nothing to do with them.

[ramnes]

Are you interested in an AEKII with white-cream Alps?

They just are cream Alps, but white.

[jacobolus]

Are you interested in an AEKII with white-cream Alps?

Actually, I have one of those that I got for cheap along in a set of 4–5 AEK IIs, so now I actually have ones with Alps salmon, cream, and dampened white switches, and also a “Mitsumi standard mechanical” one. Most of the switches are in rough shape, but I should be able to take them apart and clean them and/or mix and match parts with other better-condition switches for the purpose of making a switch tester to compare.

Thanks though.

[jacobolus]

Not sure I'd want to spend fifty bucks to get me a 2-unit Tai-Hao backspace ;-)

Do you need a 2-unit Tai-Hao Alps-mount backspace? I can send it to you.

[Daniel Beardsmore]

Only if it's from a duff keyboard — I harvested the Tai-Hao keycaps from my OK-100M, which feels really nice to type on, but it ghosts awfully (ignoring various other flaws).

I still need several keycaps for my AT102W in Tai-Hao cream+grey — 2u backspace, caps lock (stem is like 1 mm out or so, thank you Silitek), ISO backslash in cream instead of grey, ISO return, UK ISO #/~ and the entire front row including the Windows keys. I've got all NIB keycaps, but they're from an old Asian layout keyboard. No great rush as no-one's using that keyboard right now anyway.

I wouldn't really split up a KPT keyboard :-) That one you've bought looks brand new, and KPT switches seem to have a good reputation for feel from what I recall.

Full, detailed disassembly photos of the one you're getting are here:

http://kbtalking.cool3c.com/article/13939

We'll have to see if you get both types of switch, or just the one type.

[jacobolus]

I think I might have a Tai Hao Alps ISO enter, but I'm not sure where. If I find one ever I'll be glad to mail it to you along with a 2u backspace, of which I think I have another. I don’t know of any keyboards with 1.25u Tai Hao Alps modifiers, though, and I’m pretty sure I don’t have any UK-specific keycaps.

I’m not too worried about splitting up a KPT keyboard, considering I’m going to harvest at least a few switches from it for experiments and switch testers. If the switches turn out to be really nice, maybe I’ll make something else out of them.

[Daniel Beardsmore]

The first thing to do with that KPT is photograph it thoroughly — alps.tw's one has a weird mixture of keycaps, while yours is in excellent condition.

So far as I know, the 104-key Focus FK-2001 has 1.25 u Tai-Hao modifiers, although the Windows and menu keys are pad printed.

[jacobolus]

Daniel, you might want to get one of these: http://www.ebay.com/itm/271074243953

[Nover]

IIRC, Daniel doesn't use ebay. But I for one thank you for the link.

[Daniel Beardsmore]

Correct, I've vowed never to use them, as they're scum :-P

Probably a good thing otherwise I'd have keyboards for chairs, keyboards for tables and keyboards for a bed by now …

[jacobolus]

Quick review of the KPT, mostly copied from https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=66443.msg1597918#msg1597918

I must say, I’m not a huge fan of the switches. As far as I can tell this thing is pretty close to brand new (no box, but there’s not much texture loss or yellowing on the ABS caps, and it’s very clean inside and out). The top two rows have a totally different switch feel from the rest of the keys (vaguely Alps-like feel, vs. the others which feel closer to amber Omrons) which is pretty disconcerting (just like this board http://kbtalking.cool3c.com/article/13939). Both types of switches are pretty inconsistent from switch to switch, and tend to wobble quite a bit and then bind when hit off-angle. The Omron type are stiff to get past the click, and then the spring basically drops away and so they bottom out pretty hard.

The switches I have are somewhat scratchy, similar to modern MX switches (or a bit worse). I think it’s something inherent to the plastic material used and internal switch geometry, not dirt/dust inside (as sometimes happens to Alps switches). I suspect lube would help quite a bit though. [I admit I could be wrong here, it might just be that this particular keyboard got a bunch of grit inside everything, and then the guy who sold it to me cleaned it up very well before sale.]

The bottom 4 rows’ switches are very clicky though, as I said, somewhat like amber Omrons. I like these a bit better than the more Alps-like ones on the top rows.

The plastic switchplate makes the whole board feel very light/flimsy/cheap. The 1x2 plus and enter keys and the 2x1 zero on the numpad, the 2.25x1 left shift, and the 2x1 backspace are totally unstabilized, and don’t work very well unless pressed from the center.

Daniel, I’ll try to get it documented when I have the time to desolder everything.

[jacobolus]

bump

[XMIT]

I wonder how far you got with a portable measuring tool. I'm working on selling something like 600 keyboards with at least 20 different switch types including some of the Alps variants listed in the OP. There is more information about this on the "other" forum. But if you do have a portable force-travel measuring tool I would like to borrow it. Please send me a PM if you do, thanks.

[jacobolus]

No, I don’t. HaaTa’s prototype force curve device is built on an arbor press.. definitely not portable.

In general, good measuring tools are going to be very big and heavy. (The force gauge itself could be fairly small, but you want to strap it to something very sturdy to get reliable distance measures.)