First Mechanical Keyboard Advise

[DuckPig]

Hi everyone

I would like to buy my first mechanical keyboard, but I'm still unsure, which I should buy. I never hold a MK in my hands, I use Rubberdome since my first computer. I need my MK 90% of the time for gaming and 10 for typing. I don't live in the US or Canada, the prices here in Switzerland are very different. The Corsair K70 looks very interessting to me, the aluminium, the media keys, the volume-wheel, the LED's and this red "gaming" keycaps. It costs 175 USD. The 2nd MK I found was the Ducky Shine 3, which costs 165 USD. But then I heard, that many people had problems with the LED's. The Filco Majestictouch (2) isn't available, i dont really know, whick Keyboard I should buy.


DuckPig

[Defect]

Hello and welcome

For gaming, you will want to find a board with MX Blacks or MX Reds with at least 6KRO.

For layout, I recommend TKL (tenkeyless) or smaller.

For gaming, you probably don't want backlighting as it will disrupt your eyes.  Plus you will never be looking down at your keyboard anyways.  If you like backlit, get a Ducky with red backlighting.

What games do you play?

[DuckPig]

I almost play RPG's, for exmaple Skyrim or other Games, where you have to press the keys W A S D and often SHIFT 90% of the game. I rarely play FPS-Games

[vindaon]

I recommend trying out switches before you decide on a keyboard. Do you have any electronics stores nearby, like a Swiss equivalent of Best Buy or something? They may have some mech keyboards on display that you can play around with.  Alternatively you can get a cheapo switch tester to play around with.

You probably wouldn't want to drop 150+ on switches you don't like.

[DuckPig]

I think Reds are the best for a gamer, but you won't fins any store near my house, where you could test those switches. You can be happy if they have 1 MK, but thats not very helpfull 'cause you can only test one of the cherry switches. I don't find a Test-Sample on ebay

[chyros]

If you mostly play RPGs you really don't need more than 2KRO. I've played some very twitchy games that require some intense keyboard work and have never had a keyboard with more than 2KRO - there were only a few cases where I actually needed more than that. It doesn't hurt to have it on though.

I can definitely mirror what Vindaon said - it's very much worth trying out switches first. You don't necessarily need a real tester unit (they tend to be quite expensive actually) but a tryout at a store maybe is definitely recommended.

[DuckPig]

Ok, I hopefully will find a store where I can try these switches out
But back to the KB, which should I choose?

[chyros]

Ok, I hopefully will find a store where I can try these switches out
But back to the KB, which should I choose?

There is genuinely no way anyone can answer this for you if you have no experience yet. If you know what kinds of switches you like, people can suggest other switches or boards you might like, but if you don't know any yet, you're just going to have to start trying out some things to begin with .

[Merranza]

Proud owner of a K70 RGB. I do have red switches and I love them for gaming and typing. But then again, you could read hundreds of threads/posts on switches; the only way you'll find what's good for you is by trying them out. I initially thought brown switches were the way to go for me by reading online posts and when I got them, I didn't like them so I went back to the store and exchanged my keyboard for red switches.

If you opt for Corsair, I strongly suggest you go with the RGB model. Main reason is that Corsair changed their switches with RGB by putting the LED under each key switch protecting them from electro static discharge which is a real plague for the K70 regular model. K70 are having a lot of problems with LED dying while the RGB is much more stable. You just have to configure your LED to red

[Altis]

Just to add some conflict and confusion here, I actually tend to prefer Browns over Reds for FPS gaming (similar needs to RPG). Reds are a little more prone to accidental presses.

[bowji]

I recommend trying out switches before you decide on a keyboard. Do you have any electronics stores nearby, like a Swiss equivalent of Best Buy or something? They may have some mech keyboards on display that you can play around with.  Alternatively you can get a cheapo switch tester to play around with.

You probably wouldn't want to drop 150+ on switches you don't like.

Just to add some conflict and confusion here, I actually tend to prefer Browns over Reds for FPS gaming (similar needs to RPG). Reds are a little more prone to accidental presses.

I suggest getting a switch tester first to see what switch type you prefer because each switch is different with their own unique feeling. The general consensus is that linear switches(MX reds/blacks) are ideal for gaming, but some people cant stand the feeling of them. If this mechanical keyboard is going to be your first+last mechanical keyboard, you would want try the available switches for the right/perfect one, or if you plan on collecting a few, having a switch tester is handy. Once you know what switch type you like it will open up more choices for you to choose from. Remember, switch type preference is personal and very subjective, its a feeling hard to express with words without trying.

Good luck with your search 

[Lain1911]

Definitely switch tester first as it will affect your future purchases. I recommend a ten keyless as well. I know people who play with blues so don't count any out until you try. Quickfire Rapid, or Ducky Zero, or Filco would probably be good.

[skuko]

get a switch tester first to find out what your preference is, as already suggested by other in this thread. then buy stuff from classifieds, much cheaper

shameless plug: i will be listing my filcos up for sale soon, keep an eye out

[Oobly]

Ducky Shine 3 with Reds. Reasoning:

1. Shine 3 is a solid, plate mounted board with very good quality.
2. It has standard size keycaps and layout, so you can fit aftermarket keycap sets on.
3. Reds are good for gaming in general (although some prefer Browns and some, myself included, prefer Clears).
4. It's available in your country and should have support if something goes wrong.
5. They hold their resale value fairly well and if you decide you don't like Reds for some reason, you can sell it and buy another without too much loss.
6. If you try Reds and decide you want something else, you have a good reference for what you don't like or would prefer (spring strength, some tactility, etc). I usually recommend Browns for this reason, since they have some tactility (but not as much as Clears) and are quite similar to Reds in other ways, but since it's mostly for gaming, Reds are a bit more suited since a larger portion of the community prefer linear switches for gaming.

Corsair are not as good quality as Ducky and the K70 has non-standard bottom row keycaps.

[rowdy]

Welcome to Geekhack!

I have three Ducky Shines and none have had any problems with the LEDs.  One has had heavy usage every day for more than a year with zero problems.

MX reds are possibly the least mechanical switch.  People migrating from rubber domes might start using MX reds, and wonder what all the fuss is about.

MX blues and greens have the click, and MX blacks offer much more resistance than rubber dome.

However there are a lot of fans of MX reds (see above).

Personally I find reds too light, and prefer blacks or greens.

As Oobly mentioned, if you get one keyboard and decide you don't like it, or start to wonder whether a different keyboard or switch might feel better, you can either start collecting keyboards, or sell the first one to a friend (if you look after it should should not lose much on the deal, and chalk the difference up to getting to experience a different keyboard/switch).

[DuckPig]

Ok, so the Ducky Shine 3 seems to be very solid, but what about Steelseries 6GV2 or Cooler Master Quick Fire TK? Those are much cheaper, does anyone have experiences with them? Are they build solid to and have a standard layout?

[saturnotaku]

The Quickfire is a great choice if it's more readily available and cheaper in your country. It also has a standard layout so you can easily replace the caps.

[Oobly]

Ok, so the Ducky Shine 3 seems to be very solid, but what about Steelseries 6GV2 or Cooler Master Quick Fire TK? Those are much cheaper, does anyone have experiences with them? Are they build solid to and have a standard layout?

Neither of those have standard layout, although the QuickFire is okay otherwise. I don't know much about the Steelseries, but it's got an even more weird layout than the TK.

[Merranza]

Welcome to Geekhack!

I have three Ducky Shines and none have had any problems with the LEDs.  One has had heavy usage every day for more than a year with zero problems.

MX reds are possibly the least mechanical switch.  People migrating from rubber domes might start using MX reds, and wonder what all the fuss is about.

MX blues and greens have the click, and MX blacks offer much more resistance than rubber dome.

However there are a lot of fans of MX reds (see above).

Personally I find reds too light, and prefer blacks or greens.

As Oobly mentioned, if you get one keyboard and decide you don't like it, or start to wonder whether a different keyboard or switch might feel better, you can either start collecting keyboards, or sell the first one to a friend (if you look after it should should not lose much on the deal, and chalk the difference up to getting to experience a different keyboard/switch).

Each time I read this kind of comment about mechanical switches feeling, I kinda scratch my head. How can a mechanical switch feel less mechanical than other mechanical switch?

Since you say reds are the "least mechanical switch", I'm looking into the difference between reds and other kind of mechanical switches: linearity and lightness. Since the only difference between browns and reds is the linearity of the switch (tactile feedback for browns since both require the same amount of force to bottom out), my guess is that you consider the lack of tactile bump is what makes a switch feel "less mechanical". The tactile feedback of browns is so light that a rubber dome keyboard offers more resistance than brown switches. Does that make a rubber dome keyboard more "mechanical" than a brown switches keyboard?

Aside from the difference of tactile feedback/resistance, I'm also having some difficulty making any kind of connection between reds and rubber dome. We're talking about comparing a keyboard where the actuation point stands right in the middle of its total key travel and that bottoms out crisply with a distinctive clack to a keyboard that actuates all the way down and ends up with a mushy feeling.

Seriously, reds, browns, blues, greens... all mechanical switches have a very distinctive feel to them and you can like/dislike them for various reasons but... how can you compare any mechanical switches to a rubber dome?

[ablooga]

Get a Razer Blackwidow.
It's probably took the most mechanical keyboard V-Cards in the history of mechanical keyboards

[mougrim]

Look at Unicomp SpaceSaver. It is THE keyboad, not like modern flimsy stuff

[DuckPig]

Ok, unfortunately the Unicomp SpaceSaver isn't available in my country, I heard bad things about the Razor BlackWidow

[Oobly]

Ducky Shine 3 with Reds. Reasoning:

1. Shine 3 is a solid, plate mounted board with very good quality.
2. It has standard size keycaps and layout, so you can fit aftermarket keycap sets on.
3. Reds are good for gaming in general (although some prefer Browns and some, myself included, prefer Clears).
4. It's available in your country and should have support if something goes wrong.
5. They hold their resale value fairly well and if you decide you don't like Reds for some reason, you can sell it and buy another without too much loss.
6. If you try Reds and decide you want something else, you have a good reference for what you don't like or would prefer (spring strength, some tactility, etc). I usually recommend Browns for this reason, since they have some tactility (but not as much as Clears) and are quite similar to Reds in other ways, but since it's mostly for gaming, Reds are a bit more suited since a larger portion of the community prefer linear switches for gaming.

Corsair are not as good quality as Ducky and the K70 has non-standard bottom row keycaps.

Quoted for emphasis...

If it's the price that bothers you, the Coolermaster QuickFire Rapid (TKL) and XT (full size) are good mechanical boards at a lower price point and come with Red switches, too.

[mougrim]

Ok, unfortunately the Unicomp SpaceSaver isn't available in my country, I heard bad things about the Razor BlackWidow

You can order it from UK, like I did with mine

[Novus]

Good advic from everybody here.
Personally I would recommend the HHkB type S or the Leopold 750.

[DuckPig]

@mougrim: Which Shop, can u post a URL?
@the1onewolf: Unfortunately both aren't available in my country

What about the Corsair K65?

[mougrim]

@mougrim: Which Shop, can u post a URL?
@the1onewolf: Unfortunately both aren't available in my country

What about the Corsair K65?

http://keyboardco.com/

[DuckPig]

Thanks

[wyatt8740]

I still will always recommend Model M's. They are affordable (even on ebay, but they can be had for free if found in the physical world!) - and after getting a chance to try MX blues last week, I can say I prefer the buckling spring, mainly for the heaviness of the keys.

I highly recommend a Model M. If they aren't your thing, Blues still feel pretty great, and are probably a wee bit quieter and are still good. For the weight of a Model M, the MX green switch is often called 'A heavy MX Blue'. It supposedly has a weight nearly as high as the Model M.

With a MX blue or green, however, you can activate a switch without it clicking, because the part that makes the click is a separate component that is pushed down slightly after activation point. With a Model M, the buckling of the spring is both what activates the switch and what causes the click - there will never be a time when a buckling spring will activate without a click.

That's just my tastes - but I highly recommend a Model M for a first board. I've got one, and I'm getting more adventurous with trying other kinds of switches, but I keep coming back to the buckling spring.

[ConscienceDrop]

Model M's are great, but they are really not okay for gaming. Low KRO actually matters in gaming where you actually might have to have 4-6 keys pressed down at the same time.

filco would always be my first recommendation for a sturdy ass gaming keyboard that you wont get sick of and can probably hand down to your kids.
Ducky also amazing and popular among gamers, they have some "fun" flash but are still reasonable enough in design that you wont get sick of them in a year.
Leopold are also f'ng amazing. And if they come with PBT that just saves you a step IMO because keys were truly meant to be PBT by the gods

Don't buy corsair garbage.

[chicken]

Switchwise, I would advise buying a switch tester, and find what suits you best. 99% of the time, switches don't matter in game. I had no improvement in-game after buying my first mech, and you shouldn't worry too much about it. KRO is probably your main concern. If you think you'll be pressing a lot of keys (more than 6) at the same time, find a board with NKRO. If not, then it doesn't matter too much.

[DuckPig]

I have the opportunity to get a used Corsair K70 for a very good price, Are the corsair Keyboards bad quality, or why shouldn't I buy a Corsair Keyboard?

[Oobly]

I have the opportunity to get a used Corsair K70 for a very good price, Are the corsair Keyboards bad quality, or why shouldn't I buy a Corsair Keyboard?

They're okay hardware-wise, but the software is poor, the layout is non-standard and the stock keycaps are not very good. And the non-standard layout means you can't easily replace them all with a new set if you don't like how the stock keycaps feel.

[DuckPig]

Ok, I only knew 10$ rubberdome keyboards so probably I will find the stock caps great
Does anybody have both keyboards?

[Dihedral]

I have the opportunity to get a used Corsair K70 for a very good price, Are the corsair Keyboards bad quality, or why shouldn't I buy a Corsair Keyboard?

I think that if you have a good oppertunity go for it. They really aren't that bad.

[DuckPig]

Unfortunately I hadn't get the K70, so I was cheking inline stores to buy the ducky shine 3 as I suddenly saw Das Keyboard Model S for sale
Now I wonder which of them is better.

[Oobly]

Unfortunately I hadn't get the K70, so I was cheking inline stores to buy the ducky shine 3 as I suddenly saw Das Keyboard Model S for sale
Now I wonder which of them is better.

Ducky Shine 3.

Just buy it.

[Dihedral]

Unfortunately I hadn't get the K70, so I was cheking inline stores to buy the ducky shine 3 as I suddenly saw Das Keyboard Model S for sale
Now I wonder which of them is better.

How much is the das. At full price, the ducky any day, but in a really good sale the das could be a viable option.

[DuckPig]

It's 15 Bucks cheaper than the Ducky
Is there a difference between the Shine 3 and the Zero?

[BrewCaps]

+1 Filco

[Oobly]

It's 15 Bucks cheaper than the Ducky
Is there a difference between the Shine 3 and the Zero?

The Ducky is worth the difference.

The Shine is made by a different OEM with better quality control and higher quality of work and parts, but the Zero is still a very good keyboard.

[DuckPig]

Ok, Thank you very much guys, I'm getting a new Ducky Shine 3 with Green LED

[Dihedral]

Ok, Thank you very much guys, I'm getting a new Ducky Shine 3 with Green LED

Awesome! What switches?

[TopreFan333]

Ok, I only knew 10$ rubberdome keyboards so probably I will find the stock caps great
Does anybody have both keyboards?

So true. The things keyboard "connoisseurs" complain about are very very minor sometimes. Just buying a decently keyboard with quality switches will feel just stellar compared to mushy generic keyboards. Seems like after that, people spend small fortunes and heaps of their time chasing after comparatively tiny increments of improvement. All good if it's a hobby, why not -- but if you're just after having a good keyboard, you can probably safely skip the expensive flourishes.

[mougrim]

Ok, I only knew 10$ rubberdome keyboards so probably I will find the stock caps great
Does anybody have both keyboards?

So true. The things keyboard "connoisseurs" complain about are very very minor sometimes. Just buying a decently keyboard with quality switches will feel just stellar compared to mushy generic keyboards. Seems like after that, people spend small fortunes and heaps of their time chasing after comparatively tiny increments of improvement. All good if it's a hobby, why not -- but if you're just after having a good keyboard, you can probably safely skip the expensive flourishes.

Yeah, we're all can be perfectionists sometimes

[DuckPig]

Ok, Thank you very much guys, I'm getting a new Ducky Shine 3 with Green LED

Awesome! What switches?

Red Switches

[mougrim]

Ok, Thank you very much guys, I'm getting a new Ducky Shine 3 with Green LED

Awesome! What switches?

Red Switches

Hmm... Not bad for typing. Although I cant stand linear switches, they are not bad

[skuko]

sent you a pm mate

[FullTwisting]

Ok, Thank you very much guys, I'm getting a new Ducky Shine 3 with Green LED

I was hoping to get a Ducky Shine 3 TKL with blue switches for my first mechanical, but I having trouble finding any Duckys at all!  Where are you buying from?

[Merranza]

Ok, Thank you very much guys, I'm getting a new Ducky Shine 3 with Green LED

Awesome! What switches?

Red Switches

I was waiting for your answer.

You made the right choice

Broke the 100 WPM barrier yesterday with my reds (I don't touch type)

Poke the boobs, they're amazing!