Author Topic: [IC] GMK Toxic  (Read 53767 times)

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Offline nyry43

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #50 on: Thu, 19 September 2019, 06:13:34 »
I think this set will look really nice with the Toxic mods!

Offline konstantin

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #51 on: Thu, 19 September 2019, 06:53:57 »
Having two identical keys is really annoying.

UK iso has
\| R3
# R4

DE ISO has
<> R3
# R4

So surely R4 should be #.
Personally I'd like <> R3. I'll make a stat of EU use of that if you need some hard numbers.

The baseline ISO compat that this set has is correct. R4 <> is an acceptable alternative, and it's up to the runner's preference whether they want to have R4 \| or <>, but in any case it's fine as is. You get duplicate legends either way; that's why it's baseline compatibility and not actual ISO-UK or ISO-DE.

That being said, I too prefer R4 <> over R4 \| and vote for it being in the set. R3 #~ most definitely shouldn't be in the set, though.

You've got your row numbers the wrong way around, by the way.
« Last Edit: Thu, 19 September 2019, 06:59:17 by constexpr »

Offline Jedi

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #52 on: Thu, 19 September 2019, 17:09:16 »
Gosh the nostalgia of this set now if we can just get approval to do a run for GMK Skull Squadron my life will be complete.

Online Rob27shred

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #53 on: Thu, 19 September 2019, 18:14:23 »
Well ****, you got me again T0mb3ry. This is an instabuy for me for sure. I already got DCS Toxic & JTK Toxic, working on getting SA Toxic, so for a colorway I love so much it's definitely a no brainer for me. BTW, seriously love the Desolator kit!
« Last Edit: Wed, 25 September 2019, 16:45:23 by Rob27shred »

Online Rob27shred

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #54 on: Thu, 19 September 2019, 18:15:16 »
Gosh the nostalgia of this set now if we can just get approval to do a run for GMK Skull Squadron my life will be complete.

Amen, that would be another one I'd sell a kidney to get LOL!

Offline stoic-lemon

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #55 on: Thu, 19 September 2019, 22:30:05 »
Yeah, Skull Sqaudron would be amazing :D

Offline depletedvespene

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #56 on: Sat, 21 September 2019, 07:42:29 »
Having two identical keys is really annoying.

UK iso has
\| R3
# R4

DE ISO has
<> R3
# R4

So surely R4 should be #.
Personally I'd like <> R3. I'll make a stat of EU use of that if you need some hard numbers.

The baseline ISO compat that this set has is correct. R4 <> is an acceptable alternative, and it's up to the runner's preference whether they want to have R4 \| or <>, but in any case it's fine as is. You get duplicate legends either way; that's why it's baseline compatibility and not actual ISO-UK or ISO-DE.

That being said, I too prefer R4 <> over R4 \| and vote for it being in the set. R3 #~ most definitely shouldn't be in the set, though.

You've got your row numbers the wrong way around, by the way.

If I may...

It's not about "ISO-UK" or "ISO-DE". Physical layout and national layout should be considered separately. In that light...

The base kit is obviously made to support the US English national layout over both ANSI and ISO (and ANSISO and ISANSI) physical layouts (note how it does not have an AltGr key). To that effect, the 1.0u R3 \| key is absolutely necessary, as it's the direct replacement of the R2 1.5U \| key.

Whether the R4 key should be either \| or <> is... up to debate and ultimately the choice of the IC/GB runner. It turns out that there IS no actual rule in a spec mandating either, so either of these three choices are valid (and all have advantages and disadvantages):

1) 1.25U left Shift + \| (coming in from the PC tradition; implemented as-is by MS; the alpha can be reused by the UK English national layout and a few others).
2) 1.25U left Shift + <> (coming in from the terminal tradition; the alpha can be reused by the German national layout and several others).
3) 2.2U left Shift + no extra alpha (ANSISO physical layout; rarely seen nowadays, but somewhat common back in the '80s).


The base kit, as it stands now, satisfies both 1) and 3) without issue, so that's fine. Support for national layouts other than US English should be considered later on, starting from this initial point.

Online Rob27shred

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #57 on: Sat, 21 September 2019, 08:35:55 »
Well I guess this will just have to be my most expensive set of the year since its on oco.

To be fair Oco usually sets GB pricing for the sets at normal prices. Their in stock sets are a different story & I agree the Oco tax for them is a bit beyond what I'd be willing to pay for most kits. I would expect this base kit to be around $130 to $150 through Oco in GB, then jump to the usual $180 once the GB ends & they are just selling extras. While I'm not a fan of the sharp price increase after the GBs I can see where they are coming from. They are one of few if not the only site you can just pick up a well known GMK, JTK (although their pricing for them has always been fair IMO), or SP set without having to get into the original GB.
« Last Edit: Wed, 25 September 2019, 16:46:40 by Rob27shred »

Online Rob27shred

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #58 on: Sat, 21 September 2019, 08:51:36 »
I mean, I guess I'll have to get it b/c it's a Tob3ry deal.  But I like that JTK Toxic is only $80 :(

If you just want to have a set in the Toxic colorway I would recommend the JTK version. JTK sets have been slowly creeping closer to matching GMK quality too. I was very happy with how my JTK Toxic & JTK Yolch sets turned out. I could nitpick certain things that GMK does better, like sharper legends & zero cold molding marks, but at up to $100 less for for a JTK set vs a GMK set I can live with those flaws unless they are extremely bad. Also JTK has continually been upgrading & fixing their molds to rectify those issues with every set they run. So for me personally I am really glad to have a keycap manufacturer like JTK in the community that can deliver 85% to 90% the quality of GMK with a close to 50% price drop compared to GMK.

Although I get why you may buy into this instead. I also like to support the more prolific designers like T0mb3ry, Zambumon, Olivia, etc. Not only because they make some bad ass colorways/designs, but also to help keep those guys/gals in the keyset design game! So I'll definitely be grabbing a set of GMK Toxic & a good bit of it's add-on kits primarily to support T0mbr3y & secondary to complete the whole collection of Toxic. I got the JTK & DCS versions already, this GMK run will be an upcoming GB so I can definitely get in on that without issue, which just leaves me trying to find SA Toxic at a somewhat reasonable price to complete the collection.
« Last Edit: Wed, 25 September 2019, 16:49:19 by Rob27shred »

Offline kawaiicheung

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #59 on: Mon, 23 September 2019, 00:14:57 »
I think the R4-1.25U-novelties should be 8, so do the R4-1.5U, 6 I feel a bit strange.

By the way, will there be plans to deskmat like carbon? I am so sad that I found a big scratch on my carbon deskmat.

Offline T0mb3ry

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #60 on: Mon, 23 September 2019, 01:06:56 »
I think the R4-1.25U-novelties should be 8, so do the R4-1.5U, 6 I feel a bit strange.

By the way, will there be plans to deskmat like carbon? I am so sad that I found a big scratch on my carbon deskmat.
The R4 novelties are meant to replace super and menu keys in each particular mod color. It's not meant to fill out entire bottom row.

Yeah Toxic deskmat is quite possible.

Offline DJSwayde

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #61 on: Mon, 23 September 2019, 08:06:18 »
Yes please.
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Offline mimalik

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #62 on: Mon, 23 September 2019, 08:14:57 »
Hey T0mb3ry, how about some R0 and R5 love in this drop??

Offline T0mb3ry

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #63 on: Mon, 23 September 2019, 08:28:57 »
Hey T0mb3ry, how about some R0 and R5 love in this drop??
I would love to do that but let's see first how it goes with "traditional " rows...

Offline norb

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #64 on: Mon, 23 September 2019, 10:54:34 »
would it be possible to add some kind of gas mask novelty in the style of the warning signs? fits the theme and would be dope af imo.

hey T0mb3ry, in case you overlooked it, any word on the possibility of this?

Offline 1391401

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #65 on: Mon, 23 September 2019, 11:17:54 »
What is the history behind the Salt key? 
People I've given money to from this webform who never respond to me and have not shipped me anything: ctrlalt.io 1 2, Team Readline Reputable alternatives to GH group buys: http://pimpmykeyboard.com, https://www.massdrop.com,

Offline rmendis

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #66 on: Mon, 23 September 2019, 11:25:59 »
Oh dang, been hoping for this forever! Instabuy!

Offline shuangmu

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #67 on: Mon, 23 September 2019, 11:49:20 »
Cool!
                                                                           
                                                                                                                                              =)                                              
            

Offline T0mb3ry

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #68 on: Mon, 23 September 2019, 12:01:02 »
would it be possible to add some kind of gas mask novelty in the style of the warning signs? fits the theme and would be dope af imo.

hey T0mb3ry, in case you overlooked it, any word on the possibility of this?

If i do not answer it does not mean i overlooked it. I read every post.

I really considered your suggestion but i don't have proper concept for this novelty which does meet my standards. Novelty design is difficult depending on what you want to display. If i don't like a novelty i just do not introduce it. The suggestion is good tho, it does match the theme.

Oh dang, been hoping for this forever! Instabuy!

I too waited for this forever! I am glad it is happening.

What is the history behind the Salt key? 

Its a long story. But short story is: we pulled back a kit in a drop due to incorrect pricing and many people got salty. Then i made that novelty and we reintroduced the other kit with corrected pricing then everything was OK.

So if you have salty key and you get salty, then push the salty key and its going to be OK ;)

Offline norb

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #69 on: Tue, 24 September 2019, 10:59:59 »
thanks for the clarification and consideration, too bad you didn't come up with something worthy. still in without a doubt!

Offline Slayer77

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #70 on: Tue, 24 September 2019, 16:35:24 »
Will we see an Asian proxy? Please say yes, and hopefully ilumkb. Also why no IC on Reddit for more traction?

Offline T0mb3ry

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #71 on: Tue, 24 September 2019, 17:16:20 »
Will we see an Asian proxy? Please say yes, and hopefully ilumkb. Also why no IC on Reddit for more traction?

I don't know honestly. As i said i don't have a grip on vendors. All i do is kit design. And i improvise little bit with new novelties.

Offline psxndc

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #72 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 03:25:12 »
Gosh the nostalgia of this set now if we can just get approval to do a run for GMK Skull Squadron my life will be complete.

Hold the phone - is Skull Squadron on the radar???

Sorry to get OT, I just figured Skull Squadron was long gone, so this caught me off guard. And I can't delete my post. :-/
« Last Edit: Wed, 25 September 2019, 03:29:44 by psxndc »
Ortho. Always.

Offline T0mb3ry

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #73 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 03:34:07 »
Gosh the nostalgia of this set now if we can just get approval to do a run for GMK Skull Squadron my life will be complete.

Hold the phone - is Skull Squadron on the radar???

Sorry to get OT, I just figured Skull Squadron was long gone, so this caught me off guard. And I can't delete my post. :-/
If you want to know then ask Matt3o. Otherwise nobody said it's on the radar.

Offline woodruff

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #74 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 06:52:25 »
Hello OP, can you do something about the three identical \| R1 R3 R4 keys that ISO users find in their set? You could at least focus on losely approximating and existing ISO layout (with the keys already in your set, without adding anything)... thanks

Offline T0mb3ry

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #75 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 07:06:52 »
Hello OP, can you do something about the three identical \| R1 R3 R4 keys that ISO users find in their set? You could at least focus on losely approximating and existing ISO layout (with the keys already in your set, without adding anything)... thanks
I already replied to you in this regard. The filler keys are fine. You will find such fillers in most keysets. Btw. R1 pipe key is for HHKB alike layout and not for ISO.

Offline woodruff

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #76 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 07:14:36 »
Hello OP, can you do something about the three identical \| R1 R3 R4 keys that ISO users find in their set? You could at least focus on losely approximating and existing ISO layout (with the keys already in your set, without adding anything)... thanks
I already replied to you in this regard. The filler keys are fine. You will find such fillers in most keysets. Btw. R1 pipe key is for HHKB alike layout and not for ISO.

This isn't constructive thinking  :p
And about the HHKB layout... if someone makes it in ISO, don't you end up with three identical keys? :'(

Offline mimalik

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #77 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 08:28:17 »
Needless to say, some renders plz. Also which grey tone are you planning to use?

Offline T0mb3ry

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #78 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 08:30:24 »
Needless to say, some renders plz. Also which grey tone are you planning to use?
Custom one. I am waiting for dcs Toxic samples which I will use for color matching.

Offline 5thoughts

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #79 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 09:51:48 »
I was literally just thinking I would love a gmk toxic set. I have the jtk set and love it. I have been looking for mods and novelties to go with it. I have artisans already, but would love to see what is offered with this set.


I hear a lot of negativity about the gmk necro set, but that is what I am typing on now. It is my first gmk set and I really dig typing on it.

So, all that is just to say, I am definitely interested in this set!

-L-

Offline Slayer77

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #80 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 10:29:29 »
Will we see an Asian proxy? Please say yes, and hopefully ilumkb. Also why no IC on Reddit for more traction?

I don't know honestly. As i said i don't have a grip on vendors. All i do is kit design. And i improvise little bit with new novelties.

IC on Reddit?

Offline T0mb3ry

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #81 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 10:31:42 »
IC on reddit is technically not possible due to how reddit works. Tho i will definitely make a post on reddit once i get first renders.
« Last Edit: Wed, 25 September 2019, 10:34:12 by T0mb3ry »

Offline Ensaum

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #82 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 10:42:43 »
Would be interested to see what people think of using text+icon mods to keep in line with the original set.

I second this. Icon only mods are the 2019 trend that needs to die (fight me).

Offline depletedvespene

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #83 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 11:34:11 »
Hello OP, can you do something about the three identical \| R1 R3 R4 keys that ISO users find in their set? You could at least focus on losely approximating and existing ISO layout (with the keys already in your set, without adding anything)... thanks
I already replied to you in this regard. The filler keys are fine. You will find such fillers in most keysets. Btw. R1 pipe key is for HHKB alike layout and not for ISO.

This isn't constructive thinking  :p
And about the HHKB layout... if someone makes it in ISO, don't you end up with three identical keys? :'(


Not really. An "ISO HHKB-like layout" would have a vertical ("ISO") Enter key, which would take the place of the R2 1.5U key that's used for Backspace in an HHKB layout, forcing the usage of a 1U Backspace key in R1 (and the other space would be filled by the `~ key).

Long story short, the \| in US English layouts gets moved around A LOT and can be found in each of the FIVE (not four) rows in the alpha block. Let's go one by one:

US English over ANSI: horizontal Enter and R2 1.5 \| key. This is what you'll find on "normal" US keyboards.

US English over HHKB-style: horizontal (ANSI) Enter remains untouched, while the R2 1.5 key becomes a backspace; the 2U R1 Backspace key is split into two 1U alphas: \| (moved over from R2) and `~ (moved over the top left corner of the alpha block, where Esc has been placed into).

US English over ANSISO: horizontal Enter key and R3 1.0 \| key. R2 1.5 \| and R3 1.0 \| are direct replacements of each other, and some PCBs are smart enough to map them the same way, detecting which spot has an actual switch soldered into. Note that in an ANSISO keyboard, the left Shift key is still 2.25U long (meaning there is no key between it and Z).

US English over ISO: horizontal Enter key and R3 1.0 \| key AND an R4 1.0 \| key between (1.25U) left Shift and Z. There is no actual spec mandating what alphas should go to this third key — instead, there are two different traditions about it: PC style puts \| there, while terminal style puts <> there. Both approaches are equally valid and both have advantanges and disadvantages (note that Microsoft goes with the former; also, the R4 1.0 \| key is mandatory for UK English).

US English over BAE: EEEEEEEEEEWWWWWW. Big Ass Enter takes the place of both the Enter and the \| keys (whether you start off ISO or ANSI), forcing the movement of \| elsewhere. Some keyboards split the 2U Backspace key into two 1U keys: R1 1 \| and R1 1U Backspace. Others split the right Shift key on the right side, placing the \| key in the spot left behind, and even other old keyboards move this alpha to the bottom row, between RALT and RCTRL (this from a time before the Windows keys showed up).

So, after all this, a "good" base kit needs the \| key present at least three times: 1.0U R1, 1.5U R2 and 1.0U R3; if going with the PC style for ISO, R4 1.0U as well (applicable to two of the three BAE styles, too).

Hope this helps!


P.S.: I'm purposefully ignoring some exotic physical layouts that would require an R2 1.0U \| key (14.5U keyboards) and a repeated R4 1.0U \| key (ISBAE hybrids). Yay!


Offline depletedvespene

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #84 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 11:39:41 »
Would be interested to see what people think of using text+icon mods to keep in line with the original set.

I second this. Icon only mods are the 2019 trend that needs to die (fight me).

I disagree. I want icon only mods to become the standard... but for a i18n reason, not for the aesthetics. Now, if we could agree on a proper icon set...

Offline Evo_Spec

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #85 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 12:33:37 »
Oh shoot, I might just have to get this simply because I have the toxic BBv2 to match it.
.                 .  
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Offline Ensaum

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #86 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 14:28:51 »
Would be interested to see what people think of using text+icon mods to keep in line with the original set.

I second this. Icon only mods are the 2019 trend that needs to die (fight me).

I disagree. I want icon only mods to become the standard... but for a i18n reason, not for the aesthetics. Now, if we could agree on a proper icon set...

Then why not include icon mod packs for our international friends? It's just so frustrating that every set recently is icon only. It looks so disjointed imo and I've passed on several sets recently solely for this reason.

Offline depletedvespene

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #87 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 15:41:01 »
Would be interested to see what people think of using text+icon mods to keep in line with the original set.

I second this. Icon only mods are the 2019 trend that needs to die (fight me).

I disagree. I want icon only mods to become the standard... but for a i18n reason, not for the aesthetics. Now, if we could agree on a proper icon set...

Then why not include icon mod packs for our international friends? It's just so frustrating that every set recently is icon only. It looks so disjointed imo and I've passed on several sets recently solely for this reason.


It's a bit more complicated. Many non-US national layouts are happy to keep English legends for mods, with a few notable exceptions (German and both main Spanish layouts being the prime examples). The recent trend/fad of icons for mods covers the keys in the alpha block, but many sets forget to include the nav cluster and the supranav keys. To make things even worse, there's still some disagreement about what icons to use on certain keys (the Caps Lock being the worst battlefront in this regard, with three main options and even a marginal fourth one) and some keys don't even have a candidate icon that is generally recognized as such.

If it were for me, there would be a standardized set of icons (*) for each mod, and the differences between, say, a UK English keyboard and a German one, both with the same physical form factor and same set of keycaps, would be exclusively in the alphas. But we're still a long, long way from that.


(*) A good comparison would be traffic signals: they're standard, and every country has agreed to use the same set, so it doesn't matter if you are driving in, say, Hungary, if you come upon a red octagon, you'll know it means "STOP". In the same way, the symbol ⤉ would mean "Page Up" to everyone (even if in the local language is it's called "retroceder página" ("Ré Pag"), etcetera).

Offline Ensaum

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #88 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 16:04:20 »
Would be interested to see what people think of using text+icon mods to keep in line with the original set.

I second this. Icon only mods are the 2019 trend that needs to die (fight me).

I disagree. I want icon only mods to become the standard... but for a i18n reason, not for the aesthetics. Now, if we could agree on a proper icon set...

Then why not include icon mod packs for our international friends? It's just so frustrating that every set recently is icon only. It looks so disjointed imo and I've passed on several sets recently solely for this reason.


It's a bit more complicated. Many non-US national layouts are happy to keep English legends for mods, with a few notable exceptions (German and both main Spanish layouts being the prime examples). The recent trend/fad of icons for mods covers the keys in the alpha block, but many sets forget to include the nav cluster and the supranav keys. To make things even worse, there's still some disagreement about what icons to use on certain keys (the Caps Lock being the worst battlefront in this regard, with three main options and even a marginal fourth one) and some keys don't even have a candidate icon that is generally recognized as such.

If it were for me, there would be a standardized set of icons (*) for each mod, and the differences between, say, a UK English keyboard and a German one, both with the same physical form factor and same set of keycaps, would be exclusively in the alphas. But we're still a long, long way from that.


(*) A good comparison would be traffic signals: they're standard, and every country has agreed to use the same set, so it doesn't matter if you are driving in, say, Hungary, if you come upon a red octagon, you'll know it means "STOP". In the same way, the symbol ⤉ would mean "Page Up" to everyone (even if in the local language is it's called "retroceder página" ("Ré Pag"), etcetera).

Would something like the micons kits cover this?

Online Rob27shred

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #89 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 16:43:09 »
Would be interested to see what people think of using text+icon mods to keep in line with the original set.

I second this. Icon only mods are the 2019 trend that needs to die (fight me).

I disagree. I want icon only mods to become the standard... but for a i18n reason, not for the aesthetics. Now, if we could agree on a proper icon set...

Then why not include icon mod packs for our international friends? It's just so frustrating that every set recently is icon only. It looks so disjointed imo and I've passed on several sets recently solely for this reason.


It's a bit more complicated. Many non-US national layouts are happy to keep English legends for mods, with a few notable exceptions (German and both main Spanish layouts being the prime examples). The recent trend/fad of icons for mods covers the keys in the alpha block, but many sets forget to include the nav cluster and the supranav keys. To make things even worse, there's still some disagreement about what icons to use on certain keys (the Caps Lock being the worst battlefront in this regard, with three main options and even a marginal fourth one) and some keys don't even have a candidate icon that is generally recognized as such.

If it were for me, there would be a standardized set of icons (*) for each mod, and the differences between, say, a UK English keyboard and a German one, both with the same physical form factor and same set of keycaps, would be exclusively in the alphas. But we're still a long, long way from that.


(*) A good comparison would be traffic signals: they're standard, and every country has agreed to use the same set, so it doesn't matter if you are driving in, say, Hungary, if you come upon a red octagon, you'll know it means "STOP". In the same way, the symbol ⤉ would mean "Page Up" to everyone (even if in the local language is it's called "retroceder página" ("Ré Pag"), etcetera).

Would something like the micons kits cover this?

That actually isn't a bad ideal, although I believe Mito made the decisions on what symbols go with what keys more on aesthetics than functionality. With some work though I'm sure Micons could be adapted to a universal standard for modifier symbols. Unfortunately a universal standard for the modifier symbols on all keycaps is something that we probably will never see. Manufacturers most likely figure that if you know how to use a keyboard then you'll know what key is what regardless of the symbol used for it.

« Last Edit: Wed, 25 September 2019, 17:19:11 by Rob27shred »

Online Rob27shred

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #90 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 16:58:56 »
Needless to say, some renders plz. Also which grey tone are you planning to use?
Custom one. I am waiting for dcs Toxic samples which I will use for color matching.

If you run into issues getting them I got a set of DCS Toxic with a **** ton of extra keys I am not currently using or plan on using anytime soon so I could always loan you some for color matching. I also got a set of JTK Toxic, although I think trying to match the original DCS colors would be best. The alphas are definitely more of a very dark grey than black & with JTK's Toxic it's just straight up black. He did do a pretty good job of matching the chartreuse though so not sure if that was an aesthetic decision or he just couldn't get it matched?

Offline depletedvespene

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #91 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 17:04:59 »
Would be interested to see what people think of using text+icon mods to keep in line with the original set.

I second this. Icon only mods are the 2019 trend that needs to die (fight me).

I disagree. I want icon only mods to become the standard... but for a i18n reason, not for the aesthetics. Now, if we could agree on a proper icon set...

Then why not include icon mod packs for our international friends? It's just so frustrating that every set recently is icon only. It looks so disjointed imo and I've passed on several sets recently solely for this reason.


It's a bit more complicated. Many non-US national layouts are happy to keep English legends for mods, with a few notable exceptions (German and both main Spanish layouts being the prime examples). The recent trend/fad of icons for mods covers the keys in the alpha block, but many sets forget to include the nav cluster and the supranav keys. To make things even worse, there's still some disagreement about what icons to use on certain keys (the Caps Lock being the worst battlefront in this regard, with three main options and even a marginal fourth one) and some keys don't even have a candidate icon that is generally recognized as such.

If it were for me, there would be a standardized set of icons (*) for each mod, and the differences between, say, a UK English keyboard and a German one, both with the same physical form factor and same set of keycaps, would be exclusively in the alphas. But we're still a long, long way from that.


(*) A good comparison would be traffic signals: they're standard, and every country has agreed to use the same set, so it doesn't matter if you are driving in, say, Hungary, if you come upon a red octagon, you'll know it means "STOP". In the same way, the symbol ⤉ would mean "Page Up" to everyone (even if in the local language is it's called "retroceder página" ("Ré Pag"), etcetera).

Would something like the micons kits cover this?

Sorry, I meant to say a standardized set of good icons.

Offline appaboy

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #92 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 17:07:49 »
Would be interested to see what people think of using text+icon mods to keep in line with the original set.

I second this. Icon only mods are the 2019 trend that needs to die (fight me).

i guess all of the non-english keyboards in the late 80s to 90s were just riding the 2019 hype train  :))
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Offline Ensaum

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #93 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 17:38:13 »
Would be interested to see what people think of using text+icon mods to keep in line with the original set.

I second this. Icon only mods are the 2019 trend that needs to die (fight me).

i guess all of the non-english keyboards in the late 80s to 90s were just riding the 2019 hype train  :))

Obviously not, so it's a good thing I was clearly talking about recent custom sets and not vintage non-english sets..

Offline Ensaum

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #94 on: Wed, 25 September 2019, 17:51:55 »
Would be interested to see what people think of using text+icon mods to keep in line with the original set.

I second this. Icon only mods are the 2019 trend that needs to die (fight me).

I disagree. I want icon only mods to become the standard... but for a i18n reason, not for the aesthetics. Now, if we could agree on a proper icon set...

Then why not include icon mod packs for our international friends? It's just so frustrating that every set recently is icon only. It looks so disjointed imo and I've passed on several sets recently solely for this reason.


It's a bit more complicated. Many non-US national layouts are happy to keep English legends for mods, with a few notable exceptions (German and both main Spanish layouts being the prime examples). The recent trend/fad of icons for mods covers the keys in the alpha block, but many sets forget to include the nav cluster and the supranav keys. To make things even worse, there's still some disagreement about what icons to use on certain keys (the Caps Lock being the worst battlefront in this regard, with three main options and even a marginal fourth one) and some keys don't even have a candidate icon that is generally recognized as such.

If it were for me, there would be a standardized set of icons (*) for each mod, and the differences between, say, a UK English keyboard and a German one, both with the same physical form factor and same set of keycaps, would be exclusively in the alphas. But we're still a long, long way from that.


(*) A good comparison would be traffic signals: they're standard, and every country has agreed to use the same set, so it doesn't matter if you are driving in, say, Hungary, if you come upon a red octagon, you'll know it means "STOP". In the same way, the symbol ⤉ would mean "Page Up" to everyone (even if in the local language is it's called "retroceder página" ("Ré Pag"), etcetera).

Would something like the micons kits cover this?

Sorry, I meant to say a standardized set of good icons.

Lol, yeah I don't like micons either, but it's the same idea you suggested. I have seen some gmk sets with full icon nav like this (https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0267/1905/products/R_406_2017-06-22_1024x1024.png?v=1518244055) in the past too.

Offline shuangmu

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #95 on: Thu, 26 September 2019, 07:03:15 »
interesting :)
                                                                           
                                                                                                                                              =)                                              
            

Offline 1391401

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #96 on: Thu, 26 September 2019, 22:02:22 »
my subjective gripe with both the GMK and SP non-icon-only mod legends is that they look non-uniform and the typeface is like some kind of comic sans (with SP being the worst IMHO).  I really like the look of the gmk 9009 r3 style mod legends [1] mainly because they feel cohesive with the rest of the set. 

[1] https://dixiemech.com/gmk9009r3
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Offline Ensaum

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #97 on: Thu, 26 September 2019, 22:59:24 »
my subjective gripe with both the GMK and SP non-icon-only mod legends is that they look non-uniform and the typeface is like some kind of comic sans (with SP being the worst IMHO).  I really like the look of the gmk 9009 r3 style mod legends [1] mainly because they feel cohesive with the rest of the set. 

[1] https://dixiemech.com/gmk9009r3

9009 is one of the few sets I agree looks better with icon mods (especially now with the reworked icons). Not really seeing how the typeface looks like comic sans though since it's the same font as the alphas just smaller but ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Offline norb

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #98 on: Sat, 19 October 2019, 08:41:43 »
i hope this is not dead?

Offline T0mb3ry

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Re: [IC] GMK Toxic
« Reply #99 on: Sat, 19 October 2019, 09:17:39 »
i hope this is not dead?

No its not dead. I am waiting for renders.