Author Topic: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?  (Read 2477 times)

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Offline Maledicted

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How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« on: Wed, 15 January 2020, 19:03:56 »
I thought this one might be an interesting one to throw out there. It seems to me that there's often a lot of overlap when it comes to people who like quality things, between people who like old fashioned things, and people who like to feel some guttural connection to the tools that they put to use. It seems to me that keyboard enthusiasts like to feel some sort of symbiotic unity with the flow/function of their boards. I know people who like stick shifts usually feel similarly. They want a more direct connection to the workings of their vehicle.

Have we got an abnormally high concentration of manual/standard drivers here?

Offline Steezus

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #1 on: Wed, 15 January 2020, 19:16:03 »
I absolutely love to drive a manual. I've only done 110k miles in the past 7 years of having of license but I'd say 3/4 of them were done in a manual.
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Offline Maledicted

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #2 on: Wed, 15 January 2020, 19:24:39 »
I absolutely love to drive a manual. I've only done 110k miles in the past 7 years of having of license but I'd say 3/4 of them were done in a manual.

I would consider that a pretty decent amount of driving myself, but I know some people manage to put that on a car in just a few years. I had my license for a few years and decided I wanted a stick shift, before I knew how to drive one. My dad and uncle knew though. I saved my money and bought a used 5 speed 2001 Saturn SC2. My dad drove it home, and they both helped teach me to drive it. I have never turned back, and I still own that car 10 years later.


Offline Steezus

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #4 on: Wed, 15 January 2020, 19:55:52 »
I absolutely love to drive a manual. I've only done 110k miles in the past 7 years of having of license but I'd say 3/4 of them were done in a manual.

I would consider that a pretty decent amount of driving myself, but I know some people manage to put that on a car in just a few years. I had my license for a few years and decided I wanted a stick shift, before I knew how to drive one. My dad and uncle knew though. I saved my money and bought a used 5 speed 2001 Saturn SC2. My dad drove it home, and they both helped teach me to drive it. I have never turned back, and I still own that car 10 years later.

My very first car was a stick shift. I figured learning to drive a manual in a sense was like learning to ride a bike, something you'll never forget but may get a little rusty at when time spent away from the practice. Valuable knowledge that could someday come in handy. I think everybody should at least try to learn how to drive a manual.
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Offline Maledicted

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #5 on: Wed, 15 January 2020, 20:17:10 »

Would that be an affirmative? lol

My very first car was a stick shift. I figured learning to drive a manual in a sense was like learning to ride a bike, something you'll never forget but may get a little rusty at when time spent away from the practice. Valuable knowledge that could someday come in handy. I think everybody should at least try to learn how to drive a manual.

My first car was a hand-me-down, I don't know that I would have had the forethought to get one right away anyway though. I would agree with the usefulness aspect, but it seems that manual transmissions aren't even commonly offered as an option anymore, when automatics used to be an optional upgrade. I still agree with the idea that everyone should learn though, if only just to understand how much gas they're wasting for no reason with their bizarre acceleration/general driving habits.

Whenever I have to drive somebody else's car I'm sort of in the inverse scenario, where I go something like, "Oh god, there's no clutch. What do I do with my left foot?" and reach out for the shifter that's obviously not where it should be, and certainly isn't going to move where I want it to if I do find it.

Offline Steezus

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #6 on: Wed, 15 January 2020, 20:32:23 »
My very first car was a stick shift. I figured learning to drive a manual in a sense was like learning to ride a bike, something you'll never forget but may get a little rusty at when time spent away from the practice. Valuable knowledge that could someday come in handy. I think everybody should at least try to learn how to drive a manual.

My first car was a hand-me-down, I don't know that I would have had the forethought to get one right away anyway though. I would agree with the usefulness aspect, but it seems that manual transmissions aren't even commonly offered as an option anymore, when automatics used to be an optional upgrade. I still agree with the idea that everyone should learn though, if only just to understand how much gas they're wasting for no reason with their bizarre acceleration/general driving habits.

Whenever I have to drive somebody else's car I'm sort of in the inverse scenario, where I go something like, "Oh god, there's no clutch. What do I do with my left foot?" and reach out for the shifter that's obviously not where it should be, and certainly isn't going to move where I want it to if I do find it.

I've had the occasional slip-up when pulling out of the driveway in an automatic where I'll slam on the brakes with my left foot thinking it's the clutch. My left foot gets lonely and my mind starts to wander off when driving an automatic.
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Offline Maledicted

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #7 on: Wed, 15 January 2020, 20:56:45 »
I've had the occasional slip-up when pulling out of the driveway in an automatic where I'll slam on the brakes with my left foot thinking it's the clutch. My left foot gets lonely and my mind starts to wander off when driving an automatic.

I think I have done that at least once or twice. It takes enormous mental gymnastics for me to just let cars like that drive themselves.

Offline AJM

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #8 on: Thu, 16 January 2020, 05:18:11 »
I had manual transmission cars all my (driving) life (= 30 years), only slightly interrupted by 3 years with a semi-automatic sequential gearbox.
But that's pretty normal for Europe - until recently, when engines got very limited rev ranges (presumably for efficiency reasons), which necessitates an absurd number of gears, which are no longer manageable "by hand".

Offline jacethesaltsculptor

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #9 on: Thu, 16 January 2020, 05:53:38 »
I've always owned an Automatic,

but by chance, I did learn stick when I worked with my father, who owned a small toyota manual truck. It drove well and I've played with the idea of getting that sort of truck again.

Whenever I have to drive manual I think of working because of that, but otherwise I drive an automatic.
« Last Edit: Fri, 17 January 2020, 06:33:04 by jacethesaltsculptor »

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #10 on: Thu, 16 January 2020, 07:02:26 »
A lot of people I know that were serious manual kinda guys, have in recent years started to port over to automatics.

I personally have an auto but secretly like manuals. My next car, as soon as they are more available (Suzuki Jimny gen 4) will be a manual.

In saying that, I don't prefer manual for going to work or the shops. But I prefer manual when driving for fun, offroad or blapping around town.

I would not be surprised if this thread pretty much indicates that most Europeans lean towards manual whilst USA/Australia (lol like 5 of us) are more prominent auto drivers.

Offline fohat.digs

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #11 on: Thu, 16 January 2020, 07:17:24 »
3 of my first 5 cars were manual, and they are great fun on the open road, but for city dwellers they just aren't enjoyable. Especially in larger metropolitan areas, sitting in traffic and shifting in and out of first gear multiple times per minute is excruciating. And continuously standing on the clutch is worse.

Decades ago, straight shifts were cheaper, lasted longer, and produced better gas mileage, but today those advantages are mostly gone.
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Offline StickyBlueJuice

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #12 on: Thu, 16 January 2020, 07:36:01 »
Currently driving a manual.
Wouldn't mind trying an automatic though. Even if I think it'd be weird.

Online Rob27shred

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #13 on: Thu, 16 January 2020, 08:00:49 »
Manual all the way for me! Any automatic vehicle I drive just doesn't feel like it shifts right after using manual transmissions for so long. Automatics seem to wind the gear out way too long, which isn't an issue or anything. It just feels funny & I always find myself telling the vehicle to shift in my head LOL!

Offline Maledicted

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #14 on: Thu, 16 January 2020, 08:01:40 »
I know, all too well, how torturous driving in heavy traffic is with a stick shift. I have taken far too many trips through Chicago and Milwaukee. The rest of the trip is still worth not being behind the wheel of an automatic for me. I also know that many of the benefits of stick are decreasing, but having total control over the torque going to the wheels at any given moment is really nice, especially in the snow. It seems to me that many automatics are still terrible at gauging what gear they should be in while climbing steep hills as well.

I wonder why it is that Australia is so different from Europe in terms of manual vs automatic, considering its European roots.

So far, it does seem like almost everybody that's responded at least likes manual vehicles.

It does seem that some people, as they get older, don't want to deal with shifting anymore. My uncle had reverted to automatic for years and years as well, long before he even helped me learn to drive stick, but he just got a stick shift again in the last few years.

Offline OtherBarry1992

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #15 on: Thu, 16 January 2020, 09:35:41 »
Manuals all the way. Right now I have an S2000 and an FRS. Love them

Offline Kavik

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #16 on: Thu, 16 January 2020, 12:04:57 »
Dude, this is weird. This is the second time in a couple of days that someone has created a thread on a topic that I was thinking about that day.

In the US, most cars are automatics. I think for ease of use and convenience this is ok, but I think I would have more fun driving a manual. I have only driven a manual four or five times though. I'm sure by the time I get around to having a manual, it will be illegal to drive cars at all because they'll all be autonomous.

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #17 on: Thu, 16 January 2020, 12:19:03 »
Dude, this is weird. This is the second time in a couple of days that someone has created a thread on a topic that I was thinking about that day.

In the US, most cars are automatics. I think for ease of use and convenience this is ok, but I think I would have more fun driving a manual. I have only driven a manual four or five times though. I'm sure by the time I get around to having a manual, it will be illegal to drive cars at all because they'll all be autonomous.

It's the internet,  There must be a composite trigger somewhere online, CES probably.

The info then filters down through the Hive and triggers the logical loops on car topics.

Offline Maledicted

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #18 on: Thu, 16 January 2020, 12:40:16 »
Dude, this is weird. This is the second time in a couple of days that someone has created a thread on a topic that I was thinking about that day.

In the US, most cars are automatics. I think for ease of use and convenience this is ok, but I think I would have more fun driving a manual. I have only driven a manual four or five times though. I'm sure by the time I get around to having a manual, it will be illegal to drive cars at all because they'll all be autonomous.

You will certainly have loads of fun driving stick, so long as you can avoid a lot of heavy traffic.

I'm not going to buy into autonomous cars at all until they stop killing people, and even then, they can cart me off to prison then. I'm not going to trust a program to navigate the highway for me. The only possible plus I see is, hopefully, software driving more efficiently/sanely than the average yahoo, instead of slamming on their brakes constantly for no reason, cutting everyone off at 20mph under the limit, drifting into other lanes/not using turn signals, etc.

I'm pleasantly surprised to see so many people align with what I figured may be the case.

Offline TheBeardedClimber

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #19 on: Thu, 16 January 2020, 13:30:58 »
Oh man. Driving the stick is the best. I have been thinking of getting an older stick wrangler to drive on the weekends. Waiting until I pay off my current car first.

Offline Maledicted

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #20 on: Thu, 16 January 2020, 13:40:52 »
Oh man. Driving the stick is the best. I have been thinking of getting an older stick wrangler to drive on the weekends. Waiting until I pay off my current car first.

I have always thought a Wrangler would be fun, that gas mileage though.

Offline TheBeardedClimber

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #21 on: Thu, 16 January 2020, 14:09:18 »
Oh man. Driving the stick is the best. I have been thinking of getting an older stick wrangler to drive on the weekends. Waiting until I pay off my current car first.

I have always thought a Wrangler would be fun, that gas mileage though.

!00% agree, that gas mileage is a killer. If I could snag one cheap and just drive it around town its no big deal, but right now I could never justify it as a daily driver.

Offline Olumin

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #22 on: Thu, 16 January 2020, 14:58:01 »
People from the US (were automatics are the norm) feel superior about driving a manual only until they get sick of it in city traffic and get themselves an automatic again. In Germany you learn on a manual. I can drive them of cause, but I never could stand them. Drove an automatic ever since I got my licence.

I suppose in Germany automatics are still considered a luxury, because back in the day they came at a premium. Not so much today, most cars on the road in Europe are still manuals however.

EDIT: I know most people who like to drive stick like to drive for fun. If its about the experience of driving a car, of cause there is no replacement for a manual. I however, dont drive for fun. I was never a car guy. They get me from A to B.

« Last Edit: Thu, 16 January 2020, 15:03:54 by Olumin »

Offline Maledicted

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #23 on: Thu, 16 January 2020, 15:18:17 »
I don't think it has anything to do with feeling superior. It is just a better experience, and your car is a lot more controllable, and reliable. If you read all of the posts, you would see that I have driven manual exclusively for the past 10 years. I'll never go back.

Offline noisyturtle

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #24 on: Thu, 16 January 2020, 17:33:46 »
I do prefer manual.
Can't drive them, but I do prefer them.
It's the idea of having more control that's appealing, knowing all the while I couldn't handle it.

Offline chyros

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #25 on: Fri, 17 January 2020, 01:13:31 »
It's very satisfying driving a manual. Both of my cars have been true old four-on-the-floor specimens. There's just something deeply connecting driving a manual.

That said, it's not as much fun in traffic jams, and especially when driving in other countries, when renting a car, I generally go automatic. Much less to worry about.

Haven't driven a car for years now though - I couldn't justify keeping one anymore.
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Offline invariance

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #26 on: Fri, 17 January 2020, 02:27:29 »
My preference would be for a manual, but relegated to autos as the wife has an auto-only licence.  :(
I havent driven a great variety cars, but I would say with a manual the driver is more connected with the experience: aware of engine revs to initiate a gear change, the change in forces are more pronounced with the gear change (especially if linger between gears and give it more throttle when engaged), sound of the engine as it moves over a greater rev range.
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Offline iri

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #27 on: Fri, 17 January 2020, 06:47:30 »
I prefer an automatic.
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Offline jacethesaltsculptor

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #28 on: Fri, 17 January 2020, 06:51:32 »
It's very satisfying driving a manual. Both of my cars have been true old four-on-the-floor specimens. There's just something deeply connecting driving a manual.

That said, it's not as much fun in traffic jams, and especially when driving in other countries, when renting a car, I generally go automatic. Much less to worry about.

Haven't driven a car for years now though - I couldn't justify keeping one anymore.

I adore that in Europe, you guys have decent enough mass transit and things close enough to be able to just walk.

Whenever I travel outside of the U.S. I always get very used to that, since nothing in the U.S. is ever conveniently close. (Maybe more so on the East Coast.)

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #29 on: Fri, 17 January 2020, 06:54:40 »
I prefer an automatic.

I didnt know Lada Niva came in automatic.

Offline chyros

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #30 on: Fri, 17 January 2020, 09:43:26 »
It's very satisfying driving a manual. Both of my cars have been true old four-on-the-floor specimens. There's just something deeply connecting driving a manual.

That said, it's not as much fun in traffic jams, and especially when driving in other countries, when renting a car, I generally go automatic. Much less to worry about.

Haven't driven a car for years now though - I couldn't justify keeping one anymore.

I adore that in Europe, you guys have decent enough mass transit and things close enough to be able to just walk.

Whenever I travel outside of the U.S. I always get very used to that, since nothing in the U.S. is ever conveniently close. (Maybe more so on the East Coast.)
I never use public transport or walk anywhere either. I cycle everywhere.

This is mainly possible because of the high population density here (more than 15 times as dense as the US, and about a quarter again as dense as the city of Sydney) and lack of any appreciable elevation xD .
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Offline fohat.digs

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #31 on: Fri, 17 January 2020, 09:53:21 »

and lack of any appreciable elevation


This is the big thing. Hills are killer, and you quickly realize that stretches that seemed "flat" in a car are far from it in reality (says someone who has lived the majority of his life in the foothills of the Appalachians).   
"I never understood wind. I know windmills very much, I have studied it better than anybody. I know it is very expensive. They are made in China and Germany mostly, very few made here, almost none, but they are manufactured, tremendous if you are into this tremendous fumes and gases are spewing into the atmosphere. You know we have a world, right? So the world is tiny compared to the universe. So tremendous, tremendous amount of fumes and everything. You talk about the carbon footprint, fumes are spewing into the air, right spewing, whether it is China or Germany, is going into the air. A windmill will kill many bald eagles. After a certain number, they make you turn the windmill off, that is true. By the way, they make you turn it off. And yet, if you killed one, they put you in jail. That is OK. But why is it OK for windmills to destroy the bird population?" - Donald Trump - Turning Point USA speech - 2019-12-22

Offline iri

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #32 on: Fri, 17 January 2020, 10:54:21 »
Speaking of hills, I would actually prefer a (diesel) manual when driving on very hilly terrain.
(...)Whereas back then I wrote about the tyranny of the majority, today I'd combine that with the tyranny of the minorities. These days, you have to be careful of both. They both want to control you. The first group, by making you do the same thing over and over again. The second group is indicated by the letters I get from the Vassar girls who want me to put more women's lib in The Martian Chronicles, or from blacks who want more black people in Dandelion Wine.
I say to both bunches, Whether you're a majority or minority, bug off! To hell with anybody who wants to tell me what to write. Their society breaks down into subsections of minorities who then, in effect, burn books by banning them. All this political correctness that's rampant on campuses is b.s.

-Ray Bradbury

Offline fohat.digs

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #33 on: Fri, 17 January 2020, 12:35:54 »
Speaking of hills, I would actually prefer a (diesel) manual when driving on very hilly terrain.

For example, in stalled traffic facing uphill?
"I never understood wind. I know windmills very much, I have studied it better than anybody. I know it is very expensive. They are made in China and Germany mostly, very few made here, almost none, but they are manufactured, tremendous if you are into this tremendous fumes and gases are spewing into the atmosphere. You know we have a world, right? So the world is tiny compared to the universe. So tremendous, tremendous amount of fumes and everything. You talk about the carbon footprint, fumes are spewing into the air, right spewing, whether it is China or Germany, is going into the air. A windmill will kill many bald eagles. After a certain number, they make you turn the windmill off, that is true. By the way, they make you turn it off. And yet, if you killed one, they put you in jail. That is OK. But why is it OK for windmills to destroy the bird population?" - Donald Trump - Turning Point USA speech - 2019-12-22

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #34 on: Fri, 17 January 2020, 13:06:35 »
Speaking of hills, I would actually prefer a (diesel) manual when driving on very hilly terrain.

For example, in stalled traffic facing uphill?
Stalled traffic is a pain in a manual. Have only driven manuals in my life, but wouldn't mind automatic aka driving on easy mode.
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Offline Maledicted

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #35 on: Fri, 17 January 2020, 13:54:47 »
I couldn't stand to live in a major metropolitan area. My little city of 30,000 is already too big for me.

If anybody has a problem with starting from a stop on a hill ... they probably should be driving an automatic, or my stupid 2012 Chevy Sonic apparently.

Chevy thought in their infinite wisdom, that people who want full control over their car should have traction control that can't be entirely turned off without pulling out the ABS fuse. They also added some stupid feature that holds the car in place for a second or two when starting from a stop on an incline. They touted it as some major innovation. I freaking hate it to no end. The pedals aren't even pneumatic, and the power steering is electronic, so it has come to the point that using my Logitech G27 in a video game feels more real than driving that car.

It's very satisfying driving a manual. Both of my cars have been true old four-on-the-floor specimens. There's just something deeply connecting driving a manual.

That said, it's not as much fun in traffic jams, and especially when driving in other countries, when renting a car, I generally go automatic. Much less to worry about.

Haven't driven a car for years now though - I couldn't justify keeping one anymore.

I have never even had a pleasure of driving a 4 speed before. What sort of cars were they? They must have been old.
« Last Edit: Fri, 17 January 2020, 14:09:47 by Maledicted »


Offline fohat.digs

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #37 on: Fri, 17 January 2020, 16:06:19 »

Chevy thought in their infinite wisdom,

I have never even had a pleasure of driving a 4 speed before.


You all know that I am really old. 2 of the cars that I drove regularly when I started were my grandparents' Chevrolet Bel Airs, first a 1957 with a 6 cylinder and "3 on the tree" and then, not long afterwards, they traded for a 1966 with a small V-8 and the 2-speed "Powerglide" automatic. That thing would do 60 mph in first gear!

I also drove a couple of "4 on the tree" cars, early-1960s Mercedes and Wolselys as I recall, both well worn with a lot of mileage. Finding the middle column of gears in there was like using a combination of dowsing and clairvoyance. 
"I never understood wind. I know windmills very much, I have studied it better than anybody. I know it is very expensive. They are made in China and Germany mostly, very few made here, almost none, but they are manufactured, tremendous if you are into this tremendous fumes and gases are spewing into the atmosphere. You know we have a world, right? So the world is tiny compared to the universe. So tremendous, tremendous amount of fumes and everything. You talk about the carbon footprint, fumes are spewing into the air, right spewing, whether it is China or Germany, is going into the air. A windmill will kill many bald eagles. After a certain number, they make you turn the windmill off, that is true. By the way, they make you turn it off. And yet, if you killed one, they put you in jail. That is OK. But why is it OK for windmills to destroy the bird population?" - Donald Trump - Turning Point USA speech - 2019-12-22

Offline chyros

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #38 on: Fri, 17 January 2020, 17:04:06 »

and lack of any appreciable elevation


This is the big thing. Hills are killer, and you quickly realize that stretches that seemed "flat" in a car are far from it in reality (says someone who has lived the majority of his life in the foothills of the Appalachians).
Wher eI lived in the UK, I had to cycle up a really steep road to get to university. It was steep enough that I would dismount to do it. It's not so bad if it's just one street you have to hike up, but more than that and it becomes somewhat futile, I'd think xD .

That said, I'm sure it helps that if I cycle 30 minutes in any direction, I pass through two towns :p .
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Offline iri

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #39 on: Fri, 17 January 2020, 17:04:48 »
Speaking of hills, I would actually prefer a (diesel) manual when driving on very hilly terrain.

For example, in stalled traffic facing uphill?
Great example. Will there also be landmines and toddlers running in between cars?
(...)Whereas back then I wrote about the tyranny of the majority, today I'd combine that with the tyranny of the minorities. These days, you have to be careful of both. They both want to control you. The first group, by making you do the same thing over and over again. The second group is indicated by the letters I get from the Vassar girls who want me to put more women's lib in The Martian Chronicles, or from blacks who want more black people in Dandelion Wine.
I say to both bunches, Whether you're a majority or minority, bug off! To hell with anybody who wants to tell me what to write. Their society breaks down into subsections of minorities who then, in effect, burn books by banning them. All this political correctness that's rampant on campuses is b.s.

-Ray Bradbury

Offline Maledicted

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #40 on: Fri, 17 January 2020, 17:33:40 »
You all know that I am really old. 2 of the cars that I drove regularly when I started were my grandparents' Chevrolet Bel Airs, first a 1957 with a 6 cylinder and "3 on the tree" and then, not long afterwards, they traded for a 1966 with a small V-8 and the 2-speed "Powerglide" automatic. That thing would do 60 mph in first gear!

I also drove a couple of "4 on the tree" cars, early-1960s Mercedes and Wolselys as I recall, both well worn with a lot of mileage. Finding the middle column of gears in there was like using a combination of dowsing and clairvoyance.

That's really cool. I sometimes wonder if I was born in the wrong time.

Great example. Will there also be landmines and toddlers running in between cars?

Well, of course. Isn't that already part of your daily commute?


Offline Sniping

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #41 on: Sat, 18 January 2020, 03:29:44 »
I feel like people make way too big of a deal about it sometimes. People are definitely crossing the line when they get to the point of saying stuff like "I can't drive anything without three pedals". I know a couple of people that say that kind of thing. I drive a normal soccer mom SUV most of the time, and drive my manual sports car maybe a quarter of the time. Most of the time I'm doing normal city/town driving where there's no way I could possibly drive the way I want to drive my faster car.
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Offline Maledicted

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #42 on: Sat, 18 January 2020, 14:59:45 »
I feel like people make way too big of a deal about it sometimes. People are definitely crossing the line when they get to the point of saying stuff like "I can't drive anything without three pedals". I know a couple of people that say that kind of thing. I drive a normal soccer mom SUV most of the time, and drive my manual sports car maybe a quarter of the time. Most of the time I'm doing normal city/town driving where there's no way I could possibly drive the way I want to drive my faster car.

I could see that being the case in California if you don't have a particular preference, or something, especially if the land is especially flat. And if you live in a major metropolitan area, that's reasonable even if you do prefer manual vehicles.

All automatics without relatively big engines that I have even ridden in have had heart attacks going up major hills (I'm talking like 60+ degree incline behemoths). I also like having the extra control of not only choosing a gear, but controlling the application of power to the wheels through that gear, when starting from a stop in icy/slushy/snowy conditions. This also extends to engine braking in adverse conditions. The deceleration is then perfectly controlled without much concern of losing traction. Added to this is the fact that if your brakes completely fail on the highway (this has happened to me) you can engine brake to safely decelerate, and even still drive the thing home/to a shop. Additionally, I'm still relatively certain that manual transmissions, being far less complex than automatic transmissions, are still far more reliable/bulletproof than automatics, and I'm the sort of guy that buys a car used, for cheap (in cash), and drives it for years and years until it falls apart. I think the only possible exception to this is if they somehow made a transmission as (nearly) simple as a stick shift, mechanically, and offloaded (most of) the mechanical complexity onto the computer, although that also just adds more unnecessary software that can go haywire as well.

I do not even own any sports cars. I wish that I did. If I'm going to own anything, it is going to have a stick shift. Practical reasons, like above, are a major factor in that, but so is simple enjoyment of driving. Automatics are just boring. I can drive somebody else's car for 15 minutes, and I already feel my soul draining from my body. The transition is always a bit of a system shock as well, since I usually go at least a year or more without having driven any automatics, although that just takes some time to overcome.

I can certainly understand people who refuse entirely to drive manual vehicles, for their own very valid practical reasons, especially if they have a considerable disposable income. I cannot understand people who do not accept the inverse from others.

Offline iri

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #43 on: Sat, 18 January 2020, 16:11:20 »
Great example. Will there also be landmines and toddlers running in between cars?

Well, of course. Isn't that already part of your daily commute?
Landmines are banned in Soshlist Yurop, but toddlers are still legal.
(...)Whereas back then I wrote about the tyranny of the majority, today I'd combine that with the tyranny of the minorities. These days, you have to be careful of both. They both want to control you. The first group, by making you do the same thing over and over again. The second group is indicated by the letters I get from the Vassar girls who want me to put more women's lib in The Martian Chronicles, or from blacks who want more black people in Dandelion Wine.
I say to both bunches, Whether you're a majority or minority, bug off! To hell with anybody who wants to tell me what to write. Their society breaks down into subsections of minorities who then, in effect, burn books by banning them. All this political correctness that's rampant on campuses is b.s.

-Ray Bradbury

Offline AJM

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #44 on: Sun, 19 January 2020, 06:46:32 »
..... All automatics without relatively big engines that I have even ridden in have had heart attacks going up major hills (I'm talking like 60+ degree incline behemoths) .....

Sorry for being a smart arse, but 60 degree would mean an incline of 173 percent!
I think the record for vehicles with tires is held by the Unimog with around 110 percent (= 47.4 degrees).

I think you mean 60 percent (= 31 degrees), which is still impressive, considering that the steepest road in the world (according to the Guinness book of records) is 37.5 percent (= 20.5 degrees).

Offline iri

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #45 on: Sun, 19 January 2020, 09:01:54 »
Yeah, in Harlech I was very grateful for my torquey diesel and the ability to select the gear myself...
(...)Whereas back then I wrote about the tyranny of the majority, today I'd combine that with the tyranny of the minorities. These days, you have to be careful of both. They both want to control you. The first group, by making you do the same thing over and over again. The second group is indicated by the letters I get from the Vassar girls who want me to put more women's lib in The Martian Chronicles, or from blacks who want more black people in Dandelion Wine.
I say to both bunches, Whether you're a majority or minority, bug off! To hell with anybody who wants to tell me what to write. Their society breaks down into subsections of minorities who then, in effect, burn books by banning them. All this political correctness that's rampant on campuses is b.s.

-Ray Bradbury

Offline Maledicted

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #46 on: Sun, 19 January 2020, 18:09:35 »
Sorry for being a smart arse, but 60 degree would mean an incline of 173 percent!
I think the record for vehicles with tires is held by the Unimog with around 110 percent (= 47.4 degrees).

I think you mean 60 percent (= 31 degrees), which is still impressive, considering that the steepest road in the world (according to the Guinness book of records) is 37.5 percent (= 20.5 degrees).

Maybe not quite 60 then? 30 degrees is nothing here though. We have many very steep hills here. I live in an area that they say was basically carved out of the earth by passing glaciers as they melted. If you're not going up a hill, you're usually going down one.

Offline fohat.digs

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #47 on: Sun, 19 January 2020, 21:10:39 »
Having worked in surveying and civil engineering, I can say that slopes and grades can be very deceptive.

Most ordinary vehicles cannot enter or exit a driveway that is 1:4 because the "breakover" is so great that the frame hangs on the ground.

The basic point stands, however. For most of the past 25 years I have driven 4-cylinder Toyota Camrys with automatics, and while they are plenty peppy on regular roads, they really struggle on steep slopes.
"I never understood wind. I know windmills very much, I have studied it better than anybody. I know it is very expensive. They are made in China and Germany mostly, very few made here, almost none, but they are manufactured, tremendous if you are into this tremendous fumes and gases are spewing into the atmosphere. You know we have a world, right? So the world is tiny compared to the universe. So tremendous, tremendous amount of fumes and everything. You talk about the carbon footprint, fumes are spewing into the air, right spewing, whether it is China or Germany, is going into the air. A windmill will kill many bald eagles. After a certain number, they make you turn the windmill off, that is true. By the way, they make you turn it off. And yet, if you killed one, they put you in jail. That is OK. But why is it OK for windmills to destroy the bird population?" - Donald Trump - Turning Point USA speech - 2019-12-22

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #48 on: Mon, 20 January 2020, 00:59:27 »
Having worked in surveying and civil engineering, I can say that slopes and grades can be very deceptive.

Most ordinary vehicles cannot enter or exit a driveway that is 1:4 because the "breakover" is so great that the frame hangs on the ground.

The basic point stands, however. For most of the past 25 years I have driven 4-cylinder Toyota Camrys with automatics, and while they are plenty peppy on regular roads, they really struggle on steep slopes.

that's why they have the different modes on the stick

Online yui

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #49 on: Mon, 20 January 2020, 02:03:34 »
I feel like people make way too big of a deal about it sometimes. People are definitely crossing the line when they get to the point of saying stuff like "I can't drive anything without three pedals". I know a couple of people that say that kind of thing. I drive a normal soccer mom SUV most of the time, and drive my manual sports car maybe a quarter of the time. Most of the time I'm doing normal city/town driving where there's no way I could possibly drive the way I want to drive my faster car.
from my experience, i drive a manual car all day everyday (and a fairly old one at that still 5 speeds though) but before this one i drove an automatic, and the transition is hard, and now 2 years later when i try to drive my mother's automatic i nearly crash it because there is a brake instead of the clutch pedal on the left, so what i am saying is if you drive both regularly it isn't hard to switch but when you get used to one or the other it takes quite a bit and i see why peoples would not want to drive automatic when they are used to manuals.
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Offline iri

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #50 on: Mon, 20 January 2020, 03:26:33 »
30 degrees is nothing here though.
Then your area should apply for a Guinness record.
(...)Whereas back then I wrote about the tyranny of the majority, today I'd combine that with the tyranny of the minorities. These days, you have to be careful of both. They both want to control you. The first group, by making you do the same thing over and over again. The second group is indicated by the letters I get from the Vassar girls who want me to put more women's lib in The Martian Chronicles, or from blacks who want more black people in Dandelion Wine.
I say to both bunches, Whether you're a majority or minority, bug off! To hell with anybody who wants to tell me what to write. Their society breaks down into subsections of minorities who then, in effect, burn books by banning them. All this political correctness that's rampant on campuses is b.s.

-Ray Bradbury

Offline chyros

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #51 on: Mon, 20 January 2020, 06:26:59 »
30 degrees is nothing here though.
Then your area should apply for a Guinness record.
I agree, surely that can't be :p . Almost everyone heavily overestimates slope. 30  is barely even passable on foot. They give out warning signs from 7% on.

Baldwin Street in Dunedin, NZ has a roughly 30% incline and was previous world holder. For reference:

« Last Edit: Mon, 20 January 2020, 06:29:16 by chyros »
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Offline Maledicted

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #52 on: Mon, 20 January 2020, 08:18:03 »
I agree, surely that can't be :p . Almost everyone heavily overestimates slope. 30  is barely even passable on foot. They give out warning signs from 7% on.

Baldwin Street in Dunedin, NZ has a roughly 30% incline and was previous world holder. For reference:

Show Image


Maybe the city should look into applying for that record then, because I'm pretty sure it is steeper than that image. I heard a cyclist died once on it.

Offline fohat.digs

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #53 on: Mon, 20 January 2020, 08:46:37 »
That is a concrete pavement with a concrete patch in it.

I can't help but wonder how they kept it in place until it hardened.
"I never understood wind. I know windmills very much, I have studied it better than anybody. I know it is very expensive. They are made in China and Germany mostly, very few made here, almost none, but they are manufactured, tremendous if you are into this tremendous fumes and gases are spewing into the atmosphere. You know we have a world, right? So the world is tiny compared to the universe. So tremendous, tremendous amount of fumes and everything. You talk about the carbon footprint, fumes are spewing into the air, right spewing, whether it is China or Germany, is going into the air. A windmill will kill many bald eagles. After a certain number, they make you turn the windmill off, that is true. By the way, they make you turn it off. And yet, if you killed one, they put you in jail. That is OK. But why is it OK for windmills to destroy the bird population?" - Donald Trump - Turning Point USA speech - 2019-12-22

Offline bliss

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #54 on: Fri, 24 January 2020, 15:57:38 »
It depends on the character of the vehicle. Manual transmission can be fun, but also frustrating when badly implemented (speaking from experience - the fun one in my example is an Italian hot hatch and it would greatly suck with automatic.)

For luxury vehicles on the other hand I prefer automatic, greatly calms down the experience unless you cross the Alps all the time. :D

And let's not forget paddle shifters and dual- and multi-clutch transmissions, where you also have a degree of manual control. Did not have a chance to try that yet. Would it not be fun to try Koenigsegg's Light Speed Transmission with Ultimate Power On Demand?
Quote
Because each gear pair has a clutch, switching from one gear to another with the LST simply requires simultaneously opening and closing the respective clutches. Its like a dual-clutch that never has to predict which gear comes next; its ready for whatever the driver wants. Koenigsegg calls this ultimate power on demand, or UPOD. The goal is to put you in the optimum gear for acceleration without hesitation.

UPOD works by giving the driver two shifting options. Pull the paddle shifter back one notch, and you shift one gear. Pull it all the way back, and the LST downshifts to the ideal gear for maximum acceleration. It works with upshifts as well, putting you into the highest gear possible without bogging down the engine. A console-mounted shift lever performs a similar function.

Offline Maledicted

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #55 on: Fri, 24 January 2020, 16:55:39 »
It depends on the character of the vehicle. Manual transmission can be fun, but also frustrating when badly implemented (speaking from experience - the fun one in my example is an Italian hot hatch and it would greatly suck with automatic.)

For luxury vehicles on the other hand I prefer automatic, greatly calms down the experience unless you cross the Alps all the time. :D

And let's not forget paddle shifters and dual- and multi-clutch transmissions, where you also have a degree of manual control. Did not have a chance to try that yet. Would it not be fun to try Koenigsegg's Light Speed Transmission with Ultimate Power On Demand?
Quote
Because each gear pair has a clutch, switching from one gear to another with the LST simply requires simultaneously opening and closing the respective clutches. Its like a dual-clutch that never has to predict which gear comes next; its ready for whatever the driver wants. Koenigsegg calls this ultimate power on demand, or UPOD. The goal is to put you in the optimum gear for acceleration without hesitation.

UPOD works by giving the driver two shifting options. Pull the paddle shifter back one notch, and you shift one gear. Pull it all the way back, and the LST downshifts to the ideal gear for maximum acceleration. It works with upshifts as well, putting you into the highest gear possible without bogging down the engine. A console-mounted shift lever performs a similar function.

I don't know that I have ever driven a luxury vehicle, unless a 1990s Buick counts? lol. Can't form an opinion on that one. Why is it that luxury vehicles, in particular, may not be enjoyable with a manual transmission?

That Koenigsegg transmission is interesting, but it seems to just be cheating even more than regular paddle shifters. Are there any paddle shifters that work in conjunction with a clutch pedal? I suppose of all of that type, I would probably prefer the Koenigsegg setup, as opposed to screwing around with repeatedly pulling levers for a single spurt of acceleration, but I can't imagine I wouldn't still infinitely prefer a stick shift. I have never driven a car with shifters of that sort though either.

Offline bliss

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #56 on: Sat, 01 February 2020, 13:51:28 »
Are there any paddle shifters that work in conjunction with a clutch pedal?

I suppose the shifter is similar to this sick push/pull paddle :p

Real driving though - still remember the footage from the '90s:

It's a keyboard thing - appreciation of a proper mech human-machine interface :thumb:

Offline psxndc

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Re: How many of you guys also prefer manual transmission cars?
« Reply #57 on: Sat, 01 February 2020, 21:22:29 »
My family growing up only owned manual cars. The only two cars I've ever bought that were automatics were those I shared with now-exes that refused to learn a stick. My current car is a manual and the only way I see ever giving up on manuals in the future is if I switch to an electric car.