Suggestions for tactile AND clicky switch? Hotswappable kits?

[t4keheart]

Hi everyone,
I'm new here, and relatively new to mechanical keyboards in general... and I'm looking for some suggestions.

First of all, I'd like to buy a hot-swapable kit or board (not the GMMK). Is something like this hot-swappable?
https://kbdfans.com/collections/fully-assembled-keyboard/products/fully-assembled-tofu65-mechanical-keyboards?variant=30682766016651

Next, I'm looking for suggestions on a switch that's tactile AND clicky.

I have tried mx blues, browns, razer greens, and mx red/speed silver.

I like the clack of the reds/silvers from the keys bottoming out, but I need some tactility.
I don't really like the browns... bump isn't pronounces enough for me.

I'd like something that clicks but also has a pronounced feedback. I do software development and like my input to be deliberate, not so much for speed.

Interestingly enough, I was at bestbuy the other day and tried out the G815- and I actrually really liked it. Feels really nice to type on, but had cheap abs keycaps and for almost 200$, I expect better honestly.

Thanks!

[Maledicted]

That pcb apparently comes set up either with or without hot swap sockets, although that listing doesn't seem to give an option. Cursory Google searches suggest the PCB is the same one used in this:

https://kbdfans.com/products/kbd67

I have never built one of the fancy kit boards, and own no hot swappable boards, but I do know that if you buy something OEM that is hot swappable, make sure it doesn't have Outemu switches. Their sockets are apparently spaced just a bit differently from other Cherry clone switches.

What you refer to as tactile and clicky is considered by the community to simply be clicky, as reasonable tactility usually creates a click. Most tactile switches do not have much tactility at all, although there are exceptions.

What was your impression of Cherry MX Blue? Too light, too heavy, just right? Was the tactility sufficient?

Most people have moved away from Cherry entirely. I don't mind Cherry MX Blue, it is kind of like the Honda Civic of clicky switches, but there are better options out there, depending on your tastes. As far as modern clicky switches go, I have been loving Kailh Box Jades and Navies. Much smoother than Cherry MX, with sharper, less rattly, more refined tactility. Even the jades are heavier than Cherry MX Blue, however. (There are lighter weighting options in this family of switches, but they also have less tactility)

Do you want only things that are new, or have an interest in switches that are no longer produced as well?

[t4keheart]

thanks for the input! I agree with your description of the mx blues... imo they weren't terrible, but a little light and "cheap" feeling.. if you know what I mean. This may sound nit-picky, but I prefer a lower pitched 'click'. Compared to the blues, I would want sopmething just a little heavier, with a little more tactility.

I actually really like the "clack" sound of my keys bottoming out on my huntsman (mx red/ speed silver clones), only problem there is the keys are too light and have no tactility. I'm a pretty aggressive typer and tend to bottom out all the time, and I don't mind that. My problem with the light linears is that the keys are too easy to push and I often smash the wrong keys and have to go back. I write code for a living so I like my keystrokes to be deliberate, with tactility, but not too incredibly stiff.

I was looking at a keyboard with the box jades, but then I discovered that hot swap keyboards exist, which seems like an awesome idea because then I wouldn't have to worry at all about getting 'perfect switches' on my first attempt.

I don't have much preference in new vs oldschool if the feel is right... but I like the options available with the hot swap idea. I'm not confident enough in my soldering abilities to be switching out switches at this point.

[Techno Trousers]

Box jade are my favorite Cherry-mount switch. Best tactility and feel, IMO.

[Maledicted]

Absolutely, any time. If blues were too light and cheap, but you don't want anything too heavy, and like lower pitches and greater tactility in switches, then I wouldn't hesitate to suggest Kailh Box Jades. They're a fantastic clicky switch. Amongst the best I have ever tried, new or old. They have a deeper sound than most other box switches, and certainly deeper than your average Cherry clone from other manufacturers.

Maybe this is just because I have been soldering for a long time, but Cherry switches have been around a very long time. Everything that was mounted on a PCB back then was gigantic. Soldering switches is amongst the easiest soldering you'll ever have to do, especially if there's no desoldering involved, but a nice desoldering pump makes that a breeze too (the electronic ones, the manual ones work in a pinch though). I have looked, cursorily, around Amazon for hot swap boards myself, not sure that I'll get one though at any point.

For deep, satisfying tactility in classic switches, SKCM alps clickies would be your best friend, better than any Box switches, but blue alps, in particular are very desirable, usually come in some archaic keyboard layout, and modern options for their installation are less prevalent than Cherry.

[Sintpinty]

What was your impression of Cherry MX Blue? Too light, too heavy, just right? Was the tactility sufficient?

Most people have moved away from Cherry entirely. I don't mind Cherry MX Blue, it is kind of like the Honda Civic of clicky switches, but there are better options out there, depending on your tastes. As far as modern clicky switches go, I have been loving Kailh Box Jades and Navies. Much smoother than Cherry MX, with sharper, less rattly, more refined tactility. Even the jades are heavier than Cherry MX Blue, however. (There are lighter weighting options in this family of switches, but they also have less tactility)

To me switching from a rubber dome to cherry mx blue was like trying a mustang from an hand me down car

[killyou]

Kailh BOX Pink, preferrably with swapped springs from BOX White is BY FAR the best clicky switch. It's my all around favourite switch and I cannot go back to regular tactile or linear switches after using Kailh BOX Pinks with white springs for months now.

[Techno Trousers]

The Kailh box click bar mechanism is the best innovation in mechanical switches in years.

[Zekromtor]

Except, of course, when it clicks without activating. See my thread on clicks w/o activation. Personally I'd avoid BOX clickies altogether and only consider their tactile line.

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=104211.0

[treeleaf64]

Except, of course, when it clicks without activating. See my thread on clicks w/o activation. Personally I'd avoid BOX clickies altogether and only consider their tactile line.

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=104211.0

Not really a problem if you're just typing. This might only happen if you are gaming or something like that on the heavy switches like Navy or Pale Blue.

[Maledicted]

I think his thread only mentioned pale blues. I literally could not manage it with any box thick clicks. I tried both jades and navies, multiple switches on either board. I haven't put pale blues in any boards, and don't plan to, so who knows if that's a bad batch or what.

[killyou]

Except, of course, when it clicks without activating. See my thread on clicks w/o activation. Personally I'd avoid BOX clickies altogether and only consider their tactile line.

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=104211.0

Zealio v2 switches also have messed up activation and tactility point and noone says anything. I'm writing this post using Kailh BOX Pinks and activation is aligned perfectly with the click.

[treeleaf64]

Except, of course, when it clicks without activating. See my thread on clicks w/o activation. Personally I'd avoid BOX clickies altogether and only consider their tactile line.

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=104211.0

Zealio v2 switches also have messed up activation and tactility point and noone says anything. I'm writing this post using Kailh BOX Pinks and activation is aligned perfectly with the click.

Why do you like the BOX pink with white springs more than anything else?

[Venaros]

Except, of course, when it clicks without activating. See my thread on clicks w/o activation. Personally I'd avoid BOX clickies altogether and only consider their tactile line.

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=104211.0

Zealio v2 switches also have messed up activation and tactility point and noone says anything. I'm writing this post using Kailh BOX Pinks and activation is aligned perfectly with the click.

 

Unless you type with very little force and/or very slowly, presses without activation won't be an issue with Zealios v2. If you're talking about how the tactile bump and actuation point don't line up, I guess many people (myself included) just don't really care about that, especially people who bottom out all the time.

[pixelpusher]

Box pinks sound so much better than the other box clicky options.  Haven’t tried the new sherbet switches

[Maledicted]

Box pinks sound so much better than the other box clicky options.  Haven’t tried the new sherbet switches

Jades sound pretty nice too. My box switch tester didn't include pinks, but those Youtube videos do make them sound wonderfully bassy. My only concern is that a lot of people seem dissatisfied with the tactility, some saying they're no more tactile than box whites, which barely feel like anything at all to me. I'll see though if KPRepublic ever gets their 130 switch testers back in stock. I ordered one, but they told me they had none a few days later and now ... Chinese New Year.

[Zekromtor]

I'm surprised the BOX royals aren't more popular. I'm starting to really like them. They're so tactile, you kind of can't help but bottom out, but I'm not one to get pain from that.

[Techno Trousers]

I'm surprised the BOX royals aren't more popular. I'm starting to really like them. They're so tactile, you kind of can't help but bottom out, but I'm not one to get pain from that.

I haven't tried box royals, but that tactility bump is so steep and high in the travel! Interesting. Do they feel more like Alps than Cherry?

https://plot.ly/~haata/508

[Maledicted]

I haven't tried box royals, but that tactility bump is so steep and high in the travel! Interesting. Do they feel more like Alps than Cherry?

https://plot.ly/~haata/508

More like alps in that they're actually tactile instead of scratchy, and smoother in general than Cherry. I'm pretty sure that the box tactiles still achieve tactility the same way that cherries do though, with a little hump on the slider, just theirs is shaped better. I would have to find my tester again though.

[killyou]

Why do you like the BOX pink with white springs more than anything else?

Let's start with stating that Kailh BOX clicky switches are as someone already mentioned the best innovation in MX type switches in years. Kailh BOX clicky switches are very smooth, low wobble and they have a shorter travel just a bit and it is perfect for these switches. There are couple of BOX clicky wariants and they come with different click bar thicknesses and spring weights.

- Kailh BOX White - lightest of them all, they have the thinnest click bar which produces the highest pitched click sound. They are too light for me and there is little tactility due to the thin clickbar and weight.
- Kailh BOX Heavy Pale Blue - Kailh BOX White with stronger spring. Not a lot of tactility and too hard for me.
- Kailh BOX Jade - Kailh BOX White spring + heavy click bar. You cannot feel any travel because when you overcome the heavy clickbar they just collapse to the very bottom and sometimes they have issues with upstroke because clickbar is so heavy the spring when decompressing might not overcome the clickbar on the upstroke. Still a lot of people like it because they are loud and have deep click sound.
- Kailh BOX Navy - Kailh BOX Jade with stronger spring. They have a very good balance of heavy click bar and heavy spring, similar deep sound profile to Jade but they are too heavy for me. IMO they are better than Jade but too heavy.
- Kailh BOX Pink - newest addition to clicky collection it has mid-sized click bar and angled differently than others and according to others it produces quieter click when on upstroke. By default spring weight is probably something between Kailh BOX White and BOX Heavy Pale Blue.

Stock BOX Pinks are very good switches but still on the harder side. When the spring is replaced with Kailh BOX White spring they loose that hard bottom out force, they have better tactility and are perfect for both writing and you can play games for extended periods of time without pain in your hands. You can feel the entire travel of the switch as they are tactile but just in right amount so you do not bottom out immediately. They have a deeper sound profile than BOX White and slightly more higher pitched than Jade and Navy. Before going with these switches I was rocking MX Clears, Zealio v1 and Zealio v2 for the past 3 years. I've had these since probably half a year and I still try to write as much as I can because I just enjoy them so much and I'm having a hard time using anything else. I have an exact same board with MX Blues and the difference is night and day, so much that I will either replace MX Blues with Zealio v1 or just get rid of it entirely. If there is one switch I can recommend that will be Kailh BOX Pink and if you want to put a little effort into it then string swap as well.

Any other mass produced clicky switches are not even close to any of the aforementioned switches.

edit: also Kailh BOX Pinks at least in my case have 0 spring noise and activation is right on the break of the click bar so overall it's a good design on all fronts (this might be also correct for other clicky BOX switches but I don't have them anymore to confirm).

[Maledicted]

Hey FYI I'll add that the TrackPoint mechanical keyboards are a nice programmable upgrade to these Lenovo ones. Anyone who really likes this concept should def check those out.

Sent from my Ono-Sendai Cyberspace 7 using Tapatalk

- Kailh BOX Jade - Kailh BOX White spring + heavy click bar. You cannot feel any travel because when you overcome the heavy clickbar they just collapse to the very bottom and sometimes they have issues with upstroke because clickbar is so heavy the spring when decompressing might not overcome the clickbar on the upstroke. Still a lot of people like it because they are loud and have deep click sound.
- Kailh BOX Navy - Kailh BOX Jade with stronger spring. They have a very good balance of heavy click bar and heavy spring, similar deep sound profile to Jade but they are too heavy for me. IMO they are better than Jade but too heavy.

I can't speak for pinks (unfortunately) but I actually have not had any problem with the upstroke on jades. It certainly isn't as snappy as navies, but it has no problem returning even on gigantic AT style spacebars and big ass enter keys (verified in my recently Frankenstined Unitek K151L). In my first box jade transplant, I put a navy in the only stabilized switch on the board (just in case, based on these reports). This turned out to be completely unnecessary. I, at least, can feel the travel, and it actually seems most similar of all of the box switches to clicky complicated alps to me in that the tactility is stiff, but the slider drops easily upon overcoming it. The springs are also just light enough for most people. I think that's what people most like, even if they may not be able to describe it.

The navies actually approach the whites in pitch, much higher than jades, for whatever reason. The navies could be described as extra crispy though, due to the very heavy spring. They're loud, crisp, and return with gusto.

[juusu]

Stock BOX Pinks are very good switches but still on the harder side. When the spring is replaced with Kailh BOX White spring they loose that hard bottom out force, they have better tactility and are perfect for both writing and you can play games for extended periods of time without pain in your hands.

You might wanna give Kailh BOX Noble Yellow switches a try (the clicky from the so-called "chinese style" BOX switch lineup). I'm not sure about the exact specs, but I have it in a switch tester over here and it feels exactly like I imagine a BOX pink with a white spring would feel like.

I still prefer pinks, though - they are by far my favourite clicky switch. Haven't had a chance to try the NK sherbet yet, though - sounds like it might be a serious contender.