Author Topic: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14.5mm front height (GB opens Oct. 29)  (Read 28579 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline dani_

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 22
  • Location: Santa Barbara, California
    • Mesa Keyboards
[IC] Mesa TKL - 14.5mm front height (GB opens Oct. 29)
« on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 00:48:34 »

Mesa TKL





Updates

Discord: https://discord.gg/rX7BZhK

  • April 15, 2020: First prototype is on the way, should arrive first week of May.
  • May 3, 2020: Updated renders while I wait for the prototype.
  • June 8, 2020: IC Poll posted! Prototype assembled and tested, build album, typing test, water test.
  • June 27, 2020: Preliminary pricing and options
  • August 2, 2020: Second round of prototypes in production, update layout options
  • October 11, 2020: R2 Prototypes complete, final GB details, web store is live, raffle opens Oct. 29!





The GB raffle will open Oct. 29 at 7:00pm PST. and will stay open for one week! The link will be posted here when it's live.






Introducing Mesa TKL, a keyboard designed to minimize the height of the first row of switches. I find that switch height is a big determinant in how comfortable I find a keyboard, especially over long typing sessions. To this end, I've opened a slot in the bottom of the case to let the PCB hover just above the desktop. The slot is positioned so that the bottom-most components on the PCB are flush with the bottom face of the case which itself sits on silicone feet 0.5mm above the desktop. The result is that the first row of switches are 0.5mm higher than they would be if you simply laid the PCB/Plate assembly directly on your desktop. I've illustrated this in the image below:


The front height measurement doesn't exactly capture what I'm trying to achieve with this keyboard (as it depends on bezel width, typing angle, sidewall height, &c.) but it can serve as a rough comparison with other keyboards being produced. 19mm-21mm seems to be about standard in the community, so you can expect Mesa to sit approximately 5mm lower than you're used to.

I'm pretty excited about this concept and am eager for feedback so if you're interested please respond with your questions or suggestions.





Specs

Case:
  • Typing angle: 8.5deg
  • Weight: 2.6kg
  • Front height: 14.5mm (including silicone feet)
  • Plate mount: PORON gasket
  • Sound damping: EVA foam plate-PCB and PCB-case
  • Case Material: aluminum with black or white e-coat
  • Weight and plate Material: media-blasted stainless-steel

PCB:
  • Soldered with ISO support
  • QMK/Via firmware
  • ESD protection
  • No lighting
  • USB-C daughter board

Layouts:


Other Design Considerations
  • Plate vibration is dampened at three points to give this keyboard as tight a sound as possible: 20 PORON gaskets mechanically isolate the plate from the case; a foam fill layer sits between the plate and PCB; and two more PORON strips beneath the PCB dampen any residual vibration.
  • I don't like heavily branded keyboards so I will not be putting any logos or lettering on the case itself. The exposed portion of the PCB will bear a trademark but that will be the extent of any branding.
  • Despite having a low front height, the case is actually quite high-profile: the skirts of Cherry Profile keycaps sit 1.5mm below the surface of the case.


Group Buy Structure

Price: $450 + taxes + shipping
Colors: black or white e-coat
MOQ: 20 each for WK and WKL
Limit: 50 units total
Raffle: Opens Oct. 29 @7pm PST for one week.

Currently Working On

  • More (and better) renders
  • Prototype
  • Interest check form
  • Prototype from new factory
  • Finalize options and price
  • Set GB date
  • Group buy begins Oct. 29!





Second Prototypes

Full build album: https://imgur.com/a/z0eRyX9

E-white + Stainless Steel Prototype






Anodized Black + Brass Prototype
Note: This configuration will not be available in the GB!
It's just here to give you an idea of what the keyboard looks like in black.
The black colorway what will be available is e-black + stainless steel.






First Prototype

Typing Test

Water Test




Renders


More





Old Renders

More




« Last Edit: Sat, 17 October 2020, 16:29:48 by dani_ »

Offline xondat

  • i'm not a star
  • * Maker
  • Posts: 5292
  • Location: United Kingdom
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #1 on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 00:53:05 »
Its finally happened!

Will be following and maybe picking one up if it comes into reality.

Offline 002 DC

  • Posts: 45
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #2 on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 00:53:11 »
hmmmm

Offline PikaJoyce

  • Posts: 128
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #3 on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 00:56:42 »
While you may think sockets look cleaner than joints, having sockets exposed like that would make it seem less durable in the long run especially if the board is being traveled with.

Example would be putting board in bag and if it gets knocked around, the sockets may come loose.

How do you propose to prevent that from happening?

Offline tex_live_utility

  • Posts: 924
  • MX brown apologist
    • twitch.tv/salt_rock_lamp
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #4 on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 01:04:58 »
Couldn't you reduce or eliminate the need for the hole in the bottom by lowering the typing angle? 8.5 is on the steep side.
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
Twitch: salt_rock_lamp | YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd7YXZjilUutJ6ShZWrvQtg | Instagram: @salt_rock_keyboards


Offline nephlock

  • Posts: 211
  • Location: Utah
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #5 on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 01:17:19 »
A lot to like here! Love the exposed idea, but also vote for a solder pcb option! Badge is cool even if just an accent bar. Only thing Im not quite sold on is the sharp corners and having the chamfer in the seam. Definitely following this

Offline TheAutoManCan

  • Posts: 71
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #6 on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 01:30:40 »
Its a really unique and creative design, Ill give you that. But, having the PCB exposed in that way is a big no-no for me.

Offline sohju

  • Posts: 14
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #7 on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 01:47:13 »
Heavy hand + steel tabletop = short circuit.  Don't get me wrong, it's a pretty good design. But exposing the PCB makes you vulnerable with short circuits.

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


Offline Exemplar

  • Posts: 20
  • Location: BC, CA
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #8 on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 02:00:11 »
Especially with the give of a material like rubber or Poron, I think this may be risky. The design looks great, I just worry that making the sacrifice of having an open bottom may be too much for the sake of a low front height.
Da pacem, Domine, in diebus nostris
Quia non est alius
Qui pugnet pro nobis
Nisi tu Deus noster.

Offline hkiri

  • Posts: 162
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #9 on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 02:08:39 »
Obligatory question: Does it support ISO?

Edit:
Just realized it is a Hotswap PCB. RIP ISO.

Offline Zeelobby

  • Posts: 724
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #10 on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 05:21:55 »
Have to agree with others. Exposed PCB is a pass for me. Either reducing the angle to allow a thin base, or honestly even putting a plastic layer across that section (hopefully transparent!) to keep the case thin at that point but reduce shorting would not be preferable.  Still a unique design regardless, and if firm on the opening I wish you luck!
« Last Edit: Fri, 06 March 2020, 06:09:26 by Zeelobby »

Offline Snapple

  • Posts: 14
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #11 on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 06:06:17 »
Please add Win Key!

Offline Dakk1d

  • Posts: 46
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #12 on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 06:31:15 »
Have to agree with others. Exposed PCB is a pass for me. Either reducing the angle to allow a thin base, or honestly even putting a plastic layer across that section (hopefully transparent!) to keep the case thin at that point but reduce shorting would not be preferable.  Still a unique design regardless, and if firm on the opening I wish you luck!

I agree with all of the above. :thumb:
A visible PCB is a cool and unique idea but you should not be able to actually touch it.

Also doesnt a low front height and a higher than standard typing angle kind of contradict each other? With a lower front height i would want a lower angle to be able to keep my wrists straight.
\_(ツ)_/

Offline eniigma

  • Posts: 552
  • Location: USA
    • Storefront:
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #13 on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 09:58:06 »
very unique and nice looking board!

a couple of things:
-if you're optimizing this for comfort (with the lower front height), why a 8.5 degree angle? seems pretty high
-what is the thickness of the wall in the bottom of the case that has the hole for the PCB? I would be concerned about that being too thin
-if your board is optimized for much flex at all,  it's likely gonna hit the table/bottom of case. not sure if this would work, but maybe you could expand the bezels and put like a thin foam sheet in the bottom that'll sit in a lip in the bottom case. that way, I wouldn't be concerned about getting grime inside of the board, and you won't have mispresses if it has flex

other than that, great work! looking forward to seeing where this goes

Offline Captain Shwah

  • Posts: 84
  • Location: California
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #14 on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 10:15:26 »
Hey man! Cool to see what you've been working on since the meetup  :)

This is a neat concept. I'm definitely curious to see how the cutout affects the sound of the bottom rows, especially given that many of us use thick desk pads these days. That flush front with the high back look amazing.
Noxary X60 | Norbatouch | Klippe | EXENT | Lustro | Pearl | TGR 910 CE | Canoe | Mech27v2 | Noxary 268.1 | Alu & Poly Singas | Norbaforce  | TGR Alice | TX84se | TM No. 1 | Aegis | TGR Jane v2 | TX1800v2 | LZ MP | Sirius | Noxary 268.2 Poly | Southpaw FS | Kepler

Offline equalunique

  • Posts: 534
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #15 on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 10:24:11 »
I never wanted a tkl before now

Edit: Keep the exposed PCB, low profile, & angle.
« Last Edit: Fri, 06 March 2020, 16:39:38 by equalunique »

Offline The Equals D

  • Posts: 37
  • Location: Texas
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #16 on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 10:31:26 »
Wow, this is pretty neat I love the idea of minimizing the front height, I'd get one if I wasn't so clumsy and positive i'd break the exposed part. Also since the pcb looks to not be a standard connector placement, it would be good to also have a solder version available.

Offline dani_

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 22
  • Location: Santa Barbara, California
    • Mesa Keyboards
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #17 on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 11:18:48 »
Thank you all for the feedback so far, I really appreciate you taking the time.

I have a pretty hectic day today but I plan to go through all of the replies this evening and post a response then.

Offline kokugatsu

  • Posts: 138
  • Location: East of Eden
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #18 on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 11:19:36 »
I think having a polycarb cover/lid under the pcb slot would look great and address some of the above concerns.

Offline alxbrn

  • Posts: 12
  • Location: Denmark
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #19 on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 14:44:57 »
Cool, but exposed pcb = I'm out.

Offline chits

  • Posts: 32
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #20 on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 14:51:12 »
the idea is neat and I'm all for new things. Surely there's a simple way to still 'expose' the PCB without actually exposing it. good luck, I'll be following this one.

Offline Owl

  • Posts: 112
  • Location: United States
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #21 on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 19:39:19 »
The geometry of the board is gorgeous in my opinion. The edges and lines are really good. Like the others though, I share concerns with the exposed PCB. Even if there isn't an immediate danger or threat to the exposed PCB, it's still "solving" an issue that a wrist rest already solves for most people. And for me, it would make using my wrist wrest now look really goofy. I am still interested and curious though and may even be curious enough to one if it goes to GB with this design.

Offline Venatorious

  • Posts: 244
  • Location: Dallas,Texas
  • Gotta Start Somewhere
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #22 on: Fri, 06 March 2020, 20:43:02 »
Alps pls!

Offline dani_

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 22
  • Location: Santa Barbara, California
    • Mesa Keyboards
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #23 on: Sat, 07 March 2020, 00:48:35 »
Thank you all again for your feedback, please keep it coming as I start putting together an IC form. You've raised some great points and I'll do my best to address them below. Let me know if I missed anything.

Re: exposed PCB
You've expressed a lot of concerns about about the exposed PCB so I'll tackle these first.
1. Short circuiting. I don't see this as a big issue for a few reasons:
    a. I can't think of anything under your keyboard conductive enough to cause a short circuit including any deskmat material. Even if you spilled water and shorted the switch contacts it wouldn't harm you keyboard - that's how they work any way :)
    b. I'll address it in detail below but the pcb should not flex enough to cause an issue.
    c. There are no supply or ground contacts on the exposed portion of the PCB so even if there was an accidental short, it wouldn't do any damage. Worst case, you get a phantom key press.
2. Damage to the PCB. In my experience circuit boards are pretty robust, so the only real danger might be knocking SMT components loose. I can look into moving the switch diodes for the 1st row of switches into the covered part of the case to prevent this so if the final design moves to soldered switches, there will be nothing to knock loose.

I think these are still valid concerns so I will certainly do some testing with one of the extra prototype PCBs to validate my claims. That said, I consider the opening to be a core part of the design and I'm okay with trading some durability for it.

As to adding a covering, I think it defeats the purpose of the keyboard. The PCB/plate gets pushed back up and at that point there are any number of amazing TKLs out there that fit the bill.

Re: hotswap sockets
I've never had any issues with hotswap sockets and I do have a few loose hotswap pcb's knocking around in my bin-o'-parts so I don't anticipate this being an huge issue. Soldered PCB's are much easier to produce so if there is a desire to do so, fine by me! This will for sure make it onto the interest check form.

Re: typing angle
I hear the criticism and concede that having a low front height and relatively steep typing angle flies against conventional ergonomics. However I personally find the combination to be the most comfortable without a wrist rest (just a matter of preference, but I don't like using them). Despite owning a few high-end keyboards, my daily driver remains a now 7-year-old Topre realforce. It's ugly as sin, poorly constructed, and (at the risk of making enemies) feels as though someone poured molasses all over some perfectly good zealios. But with the feet down I think the gemotery is bang-on. Mesa is a bit milder than the realforce at 8.5deg to the Topre's >10deg angle, mostly because I think 8deg is just about perfect for GMK keycaps (the extra 0.5deg give me a bit more clearance for the USB port). Like the opening in the case, I see this as a feature that you're either into or not. Without it though, I think this is just another TKL that doesn't really differentiate itself from big field of amazing keyboards produced by this community.

Re: flex
For obvious reasons this board is not designed to allow any flex. The the gasket mount is strictly for acuostic purposes. The gaskets will be under high compression (hence 12 case screws) and based on my testing should not give more .2mm total. The silicone layer between the PCB and Plate should add a bit rigidity as well. If you really lean on the plate and use a thick deskmat some of the PCB components might make contact but as I mention above, I don't think there are any deskmats conductive enough to cause an issue. Again though, I will absolutely do some stress testing with the prototype.

Re: ISO and Alps PCBs
I don't anticipate enough interest to make these options possible but I'm happy to open source the PCB which you can then modify to your liking.

Re: winkey
WKL is not hugely important to me so it just depends on how much interest there is. I will be certain to put this in the IC form.

Re: case thickness
The bottom of the case is 3mm thick and tapers down to just under 1.5mm thick behind the lip around the opening.

Offline Zeelobby

  • Posts: 724
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #24 on: Sat, 07 March 2020, 07:39:07 »
1a: God and here I was just thinking about working at a metal desk and shorting the board out due to flex. This is definitely a spilled drink death magnet! Sure spilling drinks on other keyboards kills them, but ANYONE whose ever spilt a drink just on the desk next to a keyboard can tell you the first thing it does is try to hide under stuff. And while sure, shorting switches happens and we can always buy 6 extra pcbs to switch out when we kill one, that's not exactly good functional design, lol.

Really hope you go with some covering solution (still think clear acrylic or PC would be the coolest) otherwise from a practicality standpoint this is still a no from me.

Offline equalunique

  • Posts: 534
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #25 on: Sat, 07 March 2020, 08:09:59 »
Please keep the lower portion of the PCB exposed. If you cover it, then this is will devolve into yet another TKL kit no more special than any other IC/GB TKL on here. It's obviously not in serious danger even if something does cause a temporary "short" - basically the same effect a normal keypress would have.

I'm a fan of the 8.5 degree angle.

There's a new TKL IC every month for anyone here who wants a covered PCB & lower angle.

Offline Zeelobby

  • Posts: 724
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #26 on: Sat, 07 March 2020, 08:58:21 »
Please keep the lower portion of the PCB exposed. If you cover it, then this is will devolve into yet another TKL kit no more special than any other IC/GB TKL on here. It's obviously not in serious danger even if something does cause a temporary "short" - basically the same effect a normal keypress would have.

I'm a fan of the 8.5 degree angle.

There's a new TKL IC every month for anyone here who wants a covered PCB & lower angle.
So the unique feature is something you'll never see and can destroy your PCB... Hard pass. Lol

And it's not keypress shorts people are worried about, but actual component shorts and static discharge. It's why PCBs are insulated. Static discharge into the PCB usually does more than just trigger a switch click.

Fail to see how covering it with a transparent material makes it any less unique. If anything releasing the plate file later for that bit would give people cool color and underglow options.
« Last Edit: Sat, 07 March 2020, 09:04:29 by Zeelobby »

Offline dani_

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 22
  • Location: Santa Barbara, California
    • Mesa Keyboards
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #27 on: Sat, 07 March 2020, 11:36:29 »
Please keep the lower portion of the PCB exposed. If you cover it, then this is will devolve into yet another TKL kit no more special than any other IC/GB TKL on here. It's obviously not in serious danger even if something does cause a temporary "short" - basically the same effect a normal keypress would have.

I'm a fan of the 8.5 degree angle.

There's a new TKL IC every month for anyone here who wants a covered PCB & lower angle.
So the unique feature is something you'll never see and can destroy your PCB... Hard pass. Lol

And it's not keypress shorts people are worried about, but actual component shorts and static discharge. It's why PCBs are insulated. Static discharge into the PCB usually does more than just trigger a switch click.

Fail to see how covering it with a transparent material makes it any less unique. If anything releasing the plate file later for that bit would give people cool color and underglow options.

As I mentioned above, there are no sensitive components in the exposed area. The power rails, MCU, crystal, &c. are above the navigation cluster, safely out of the way of any spills. There is also a 4mm lip on the high side of the opening so that you'd have to have pretty serious spill to get liquid in to the case itself.

I don't intend to add a covering because it defeats the main design constraint which is setting the PCB as low as possible. The opening is functional, not an aesthetic feature. Adding a cover would add ~3mm height accounting for clearance, material and fasteners at which point it's not really that much lower than other keyboards. Again, to me the height of the plate/PCB is the main feature.

There's no question that with an open case the PCB is more susceptible than it otherwise would be, but I think permanent damage is an outside risk. I will definitely be testing this once I have prototypes in hand.

I intend to release the plate and PCB anyway so in the event that a PCB is somehow flooded and destroyed, you won't be left high and dry (pun absolutely intended).

Offline chits

  • Posts: 32
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #28 on: Sat, 07 March 2020, 11:44:30 »
Can't fault you for sticking to your guns. I hope the prototype testing is rigorous enough to assuage potential buyers. Good luck!

Offline Venatorious

  • Posts: 244
  • Location: Dallas,Texas
  • Gotta Start Somewhere
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #29 on: Sat, 07 March 2020, 15:44:16 »
As I mentioned above, there are no sensitive components in the exposed area. The power rails, MCU, crystal, &c. are above the navigation cluster, safely out of the way of any spills. There is also a 4mm lip on the high side of the opening so that you'd have to have pretty serious spill to get liquid in to the case itself.

I don't intend to add a covering because it defeats the main design constraint which is setting the PCB as low as possible. The opening is functional, not an aesthetic feature. Adding a cover would add ~3mm height accounting for clearance, material and fasteners at which point it's not really that much lower than other keyboards. Again, to me the height of the plate/PCB is the main feature.

There's no question that with an open case the PCB is more susceptible than it otherwise would be, but I think permanent damage is an outside risk. I will definitely be testing this once I have prototypes in hand.

I intend to release the plate and PCB anyway so in the event that a PCB is somehow flooded and destroyed, you won't be left high and dry (pun absolutely intended).

That makes sense on the covering add height to the board, now just add in alps and I'm in :)

Offline Zeelobby

  • Posts: 724
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #30 on: Sat, 07 March 2020, 16:07:56 »
Yeah. Maybe with rigorous testing. Wish you the best of luck with the GB. It's just my personal opinion that adding cool looking stuff to the board bottom is kind of pointless. Something that might cause additional failure, doubly so. Adding even just a mm of plastic would still love that, be unique, and be cool to look at, and I definitely feel like wouldn't destroy the whole purpose of the board.

But it's definitely your vision and I can't fault you for that. Enough people will probably be interested to hit MOQ anyway.

Offline Nerdbot5000

  • Posts: 14
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #31 on: Sat, 07 March 2020, 19:27:32 »
TKLs aren't for me, but I fully support your effort in trying to minimize height. If this exposed pcb design is successful, it would be great to see this for other %s.

Offline lush_bunny

  • Posts: 360
  • Location: Philippines
  • CLACK CLACK M**********R
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #32 on: Sat, 07 March 2020, 23:14:30 »
Not sure if I want to follow another TKL IC, but this sounds interesting as heck. I share the concerns others have already raised, so now I'm just crossing my fingers and hoping you can pull off a robust working prototype. Good luck!

Offline gnhuy91

  • Posts: 120
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #33 on: Sat, 07 March 2020, 23:17:37 »
so I heard we need some Alps votes, count me in

Offline Venatorious

  • Posts: 244
  • Location: Dallas,Texas
  • Gotta Start Somewhere
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #34 on: Sun, 08 March 2020, 00:36:46 »
so I heard we need some Alps votes, count me in

Mein brother

Offline Aquilla

  • Posts: 6
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #35 on: Thu, 12 March 2020, 13:29:43 »
Really nice design. I hope that there will be a solution to that exposed pcb... really not a fan of it (but we will see what will happen).
ISO support would be really nice. I hope there will be many other people too, so we can get that out of the box.

Really interesting how this will turn out though, keep it up.

Offline dom

  • Posts: 153
  • Location:
  • XOXO
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #36 on: Thu, 12 March 2020, 15:02:03 »
I respect your thinking!

1. Exposed PCB is made for a reason (a nice design choice), I love it, a bit risky as others pointed out, but I don't feel any fear about it (I might be ignorant or just stupid one).

2. No branding, this is also huge for me (doh!), there are lots of designs with "unpleasant" branding, which destroys the entire esthetics for me. Thank you for thinking about the end-user, not only about yourself. Look at the "7V" as an example (fantastic board, with crappy logo - IMO only of course).

3. The badge over the navigation, at least for me this is an unnecessary element, which (as you mentioned) adds complexity and therefore cost. I will never understand the "why" behind elements like this on the boards. Each board should differentiate itself in different ways and not by adding elements, which act as "form over function" delegates.
But hey! 100 people = 100 opinions  :D

Respect!
And looking forward to seeing the progress!

« Last Edit: Thu, 12 March 2020, 15:05:14 by dom »

Offline Zeelobby

  • Posts: 724
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #37 on: Thu, 12 March 2020, 15:38:17 »
Yeah. Some people are all about badging and weights. Some aren't. In the end it's good there's options for both.

Offline dom

  • Posts: 153
  • Location:
  • XOXO
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #38 on: Thu, 12 March 2020, 15:41:30 »
Yeah. Some people are all about badging and weights. Some aren't. In the end it's good there's options for both.

Agree!  :thumb:

Offline monteyalps

  • Posts: 37
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #39 on: Thu, 12 March 2020, 16:02:31 »
Very interested to see if this will pull through, with alps support I may have to take another hit this year and build another alps tkl :o

Offline The_Royal

  • Posts: 374
  • Location: 40% Embassy
  • That's what I call, a Sunday.
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #40 on: Thu, 12 March 2020, 16:30:13 »
My Thoughts/Suggestions:

I love the big move you are doing here.  I love exposed PCB designs but I think what would really take this over the top is 3-Things...



1.) Move the switch diodes up into the upper "closed" portion of the case so that just the Hotswap Sockets are exposed.

2.) Castellate the Edges of the PCB as well as the Stabilizer holes so that they are gold/silver plated and aren't just milled FR4.

3.) What if you got in touch with Kailh and inquire about getting Custom Colored(plastic portion) sockets for use on the PCB.  That, along with a killer silkscreen, could make for a beautiful and stunning Bottom View of your board.




Just my general thoughts.  Good luck with this.  I think this is gonna be one hell of a board.  :cool:

Offline Zeelobby

  • Posts: 724
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #41 on: Thu, 12 March 2020, 16:35:44 »
My Thoughts/Suggestions:

I love the big move you are doing here.  I love exposed PCB designs but I think what would really take this over the top is 3-Things...



1.) Move the switch diodes up into the upper "closed" portion of the case so that just the Hotswap Sockets are exposed.

2.) Castellate the Edges of the PCB as well as the Stabilizer holes so that they are gold/silver plated and aren't just milled FR4.

3.) What if you got in touch with Kailh and inquire about getting Custom Colored(plastic portion) sockets for use on the PCB.  That, along with a killer silkscreen, could make for a beautiful and stunning Bottom View of your board.




Just my general thoughts.  Good luck with this.  I think this is gonna be one hell of a board.  :cool:
Damn. This man right here took it to 11. Id take all the risks if that was exposed on the bottom.

Offline lush_bunny

  • Posts: 360
  • Location: Philippines
  • CLACK CLACK M**********R
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #42 on: Thu, 12 March 2020, 21:20:51 »
Can we talk color? Id hate to be impressed by the tests, jump on board, and start saving money only to find out the board wont have the colors I want.  :(

Offline Aquilla

  • Posts: 6
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #43 on: Fri, 13 March 2020, 09:02:40 »
Can we talk color? Id hate to be impressed by the tests, jump on board, and start saving money only to find out the board wont have the colors I want.  :(

For colors, I think the standards like black/dark grey, light grey and white are a must. Maybe a deep blue and a deep red for starters....

Offline Zeelobby

  • Posts: 724
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #44 on: Fri, 13 March 2020, 09:24:17 »
Well if us non-designers can just throw out colors I'd take putrid green and neon chartreuse XD

Offline FRANCO

  • Posts: 86
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #45 on: Fri, 13 March 2020, 15:10:36 »
This might be odd, but the way the middle USB port looks makes me want this board lol

Offline dani_

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 22
  • Location: Santa Barbara, California
    • Mesa Keyboards
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #46 on: Sat, 14 March 2020, 19:53:00 »
A quick update on what I've been up to this past week:

1. I'm reworking the PCB since moving the bottom row of diodes proved impossible in the previous layout. I hope to be done this weekend with prototypes ordered early next week.

2. I've been getting in touch with a lot of CNC suppliers, pricing out prototypes and various scales of production. I have some promising leads but if anyone has a good recommendation, I'm all ears.

3. Finally, I'd like to spend some time making better renders but I'll do that once the prototype is in-flight since that will take at least a month to complete.

Cheers, stay safe, and don't hoard toilet paper!

Offline Aquilla

  • Posts: 6
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #47 on: Sun, 15 March 2020, 10:13:27 »
A quick update on what I've been up to this past week:

1. I'm reworking the PCB since moving the bottom row of diodes proved impossible in the previous layout. I hope to be done this weekend with prototypes ordered early next week.

2. I've been getting in touch with a lot of CNC suppliers, pricing out prototypes and various scales of production. I have some promising leads but if anyone has a good recommendation, I'm all ears.

3. Finally, I'd like to spend some time making better renders but I'll do that once the prototype is in-flight since that will take at least a month to complete.

Cheers, stay safe, and don't hoard toilet paper!

Nice. Make sure to test the prototypes by pressing the escape key. I am having concerns that the far left and right sides dont have enough support and might tilt to the left or right. :) Just a heads-up to watch out for that,
Everything else looks real nice

Offline kokugatsu

  • Posts: 138
  • Location: East of Eden
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #48 on: Sun, 15 March 2020, 10:41:21 »
+1 for solder over hot swap

Offline The_Royal

  • Posts: 374
  • Location: 40% Embassy
  • That's what I call, a Sunday.
Re: [IC] Mesa TKL - 14mm front height
« Reply #49 on: Sun, 15 March 2020, 12:08:30 »
I know people are concerned with the exposed portion of the PCB for static-related issues.

What if you incorporated some sort of thin barrier like a ridged sheet of .05-1mm Of Polyimide (Kapton) that slides in as the bottom window cover?



I have zero issues with fully exposed PCB but some people I know in dryer areas do experience quite a lot of ESD and dust issues with there boards.

Not sure how well it would integrate but Im just spitballing here.