Author Topic: What's so great about USB C  (Read 5307 times)

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Offline Leslieann

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #50 on: Fri, 19 June 2020, 22:15:23 »
Correct me if i'm wrong, but i have heard that one of the main advantages to USB C is that the cable itself is the area where you see wear and tear (loosening over time) rather than the port itself. its much easier to replace a cable than a port.
That was micro B.
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Offline Maledicted

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #51 on: Sun, 21 June 2020, 17:53:05 »
I've heard of this design consideration at a different port. It might have been also considered for USB C. But I don't think it is an advantage compared to USB A. I haven't heard of a broken USB A female port.

I have seen plenty of broken female USB type A ports. They always make me wonder what in the hell somebody was doing to break them though. I haven't had a single one fail on me, personally.

Correct me if i'm wrong, but i have heard that one of the main advantages to USB C is that the cable itself is the area where you see wear and tear (loosening over time) rather than the port itself. its much easier to replace a cable than a port.

This might be true (no idea if it is) but it's not relevant on keyboards which are almost permanently connected to a computer. Might be more relevant to phones, where the plug is changed multiple times a day, in which case how often have you experienced loose or worn ports on phones?

I have seen lots, mostly micro USB. Type c has plenty of time to grow though, since I have seen a few problems with it already in laptop computers after less than a year of fielding it in our school district.

Offline jamster

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #52 on: Sun, 21 June 2020, 20:56:07 »
I've heard of this design consideration at a different port. It might have been also considered for USB C. But I don't think it is an advantage compared to USB A. I haven't heard of a broken USB A female port.

I have seen plenty of broken female USB type A ports. They always make me wonder what in the hell somebody was doing to break them though. I haven't had a single one fail on me, personally.

Correct me if i'm wrong, but i have heard that one of the main advantages to USB C is that the cable itself is the area where you see wear and tear (loosening over time) rather than the port itself. its much easier to replace a cable than a port.

This might be true (no idea if it is) but it's not relevant on keyboards which are almost permanently connected to a computer. Might be more relevant to phones, where the plug is changed multiple times a day, in which case how often have you experienced loose or worn ports on phones?

I have seen lots, mostly micro USB. Type c has plenty of time to grow though, since I have seen a few problems with it already in laptop computers after less than a year of fielding it in our school district.

I've only recently become aware that some current keyboards don't offer any strain relief by routing the cable under the case. Most of the GH group buy cases, or any of the (Mass)Drop boards. I wonder if it's metal cases in general.

In this situation, I can imagine that the durability of the connector can be important, as boards get shoved around on desks.

But really, not having strain relief for a USB connector coming out a right angles from a bulky desk mounted case is a... stupidly compromised design decision from the start.

Offline Maledicted

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #53 on: Sun, 21 June 2020, 22:05:47 »
I've heard of this design consideration at a different port. It might have been also considered for USB C. But I don't think it is an advantage compared to USB A. I haven't heard of a broken USB A female port.

I have seen plenty of broken female USB type A ports. They always make me wonder what in the hell somebody was doing to break them though. I haven't had a single one fail on me, personally.

Correct me if i'm wrong, but i have heard that one of the main advantages to USB C is that the cable itself is the area where you see wear and tear (loosening over time) rather than the port itself. its much easier to replace a cable than a port.

This might be true (no idea if it is) but it's not relevant on keyboards which are almost permanently connected to a computer. Might be more relevant to phones, where the plug is changed multiple times a day, in which case how often have you experienced loose or worn ports on phones?

I have seen lots, mostly micro USB. Type c has plenty of time to grow though, since I have seen a few problems with it already in laptop computers after less than a year of fielding it in our school district.

I've only recently become aware that some current keyboards don't offer any strain relief by routing the cable under the case. Most of the GH group buy cases, or any of the (Mass)Drop boards. I wonder if it's metal cases in general.

In this situation, I can imagine that the durability of the connector can be important, as boards get shoved around on desks.

But really, not having strain relief for a USB connector coming out a right angles from a bulky desk mounted case is a... stupidly compromised design decision from the start.

Agreed.

Offline Leslieann

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #54 on: Sun, 21 June 2020, 22:06:45 »
I have seen plenty of broken female USB type A ports. They always make me wonder what in the hell somebody was doing to break them though. I haven't had a single one fail on me, personally.
I have a few, keep in mind I use them for work, so I use them way more than the average person.

On my Macbook the previous owner had stuck a stick or something and it grabbed the contacts and pulled them up, repeated attempts to use it by them simply squished them up into the back of the socket further and further. Amazingly, it still worked in 2.0 mode for a bit. I did manage to fix it but that was a challenge, and not as cheap as I would have liked, especially considering this wasn't mentioned before I got it.

I've had several panel mount sockets and extensions go bad. I use these on my desk dash panel to make usb ports integrated into my desk and monitor shelf.  What usually happens is the metal housing gets loose and the male connector goes in crooked or off center. This will cause the port to shut down until you reboot. I've also seen MANY case front panel connectors go bad for the same reason as above. Basically many female sockets are extremely cheap and loosen over time, combine this with cheap USB sticks and you end up with problems.


I also had a thumbstick (male) go bad, the contacts got peeled up and squashed back, like the Macbook, it still worked in 2.0 mode for a bit allowing me to recover the data. It's the only male I've had go bad and it was absolutely a front panel that had caused, like my Macbook it too had been peeled back inside. It felt funny so I pulled it out and used the port next to it, then later when I got home I went to use it and it just completely destructed taking my panel mount socket with it.


All in all I've probably seen over half a dozen female type-A go bad. I've seen only one type B socket go bad (I'm careful with them), but probably a dozen type-B cables get damaged. Also after having many sticks get bent from leaning systems and falling laptops most of my sticks now are of the all metal type, these tend to have a better housing and be less likely to damage the contacts but I have one that has been known to stretch out some of the cheaper female socket housings. This one also tends to be a real pain getting a constant 3.0 connection in some cheaper sockets.


But really, not having strain relief for a USB connector coming out a right angles from a bulky desk mounted case is a... stupidly compromised design decision from the start.

This was one of the first things I pointed out in my review of the GMMK keyboard, and worse, they didn't use mini or type-C, they used a micro-B in this fashion.
The only good part of this is that you can get a magnetic USB connector, which I installed right away, they don't make those for mini-B. Still, type-C would have been far better.
« Last Edit: Sun, 21 June 2020, 22:10:40 by Leslieann »
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Offline Maledicted

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #55 on: Sun, 21 June 2020, 22:30:15 »
I have seen plenty of broken female USB type A ports. They always make me wonder what in the hell somebody was doing to break them though. I haven't had a single one fail on me, personally.
I have a few, keep in mind I use them for work, so I use them way more than the average person.

I also use them for work. I'm just always very careful with ones that feel cheap, especially front panel ones, as you've mentioned. I have some really cheap USB 3.0 ones in what was once the 5.25" DVD drive bay in my work destop, since it doesn't even natively have USB 3.0.

On my Macbook the previous owner had stuck a stick or something and it grabbed the contacts and pulled them up, repeated attempts to use it by them simply squished them up into the back of the socket further and further. Amazingly, it still worked in 2.0 mode for a bit. I did manage to fix it but that was a challenge, and not as cheap as I would have liked, especially considering this wasn't mentioned before I got it.

Ironically, I seem to see a lot of the most bizarre/abusive damage on devices that were very expensive when new myself. That sucks to hear. How did you manage to fix it? I have fixed some similarly-abused female type a sockets as well by fiddling around with some bent paperclips and skinny flathead screwdrivers to bend the pins back into shape. I imagine some dental picks would have really helped. In some extreme cases I have bent the whole housing open to get things in place again.

I've had several panel mount sockets and extensions go bad. I use these on my desk dash panel to make usb ports integrated into my desk and monitor shelf.  What usually happens is the metal housing gets loose and the male connector goes in crooked or off center. This will cause the port to shut down until you reboot. I've also seen MANY case front panel connectors go bad for the same reason as above. Basically many female sockets are extremely cheap and loosen over time, combine this with cheap USB sticks and you end up with problems.

I do a bit of that myself. I have one of these in my desk at home:



I like how it does triple duty as a desk cable grommet, powered USB 3.0 hub, and 3.5mm audio passthrough. The cover is a nice touch too.

I also had a thumbstick (male) go bad, the contacts got peeled up and squashed back, like the Macbook, it still worked in 2.0 mode for a bit allowing me to recover the data. It's the only male I've had go bad and it was absolutely a front panel that had caused, like my Macbook it too had been peeled back inside. It felt funny so I pulled it out and used the port next to it, then later when I got home I went to use it and it just completely destructed taking my panel mount socket with it.

I have never had that happen, though I have some really cheap flash drives.

All in all I've probably seen over half a dozen female type-A go bad. I've seen only one type B socket go bad (I'm careful with them), but probably a dozen type-B cables get damaged. Also after having many sticks get bent from leaning systems and falling laptops most of my sticks now are of the all metal type, these tend to have a better housing and be less likely to damage the contacts but I have one that has been known to stretch out some of the cheaper female socket housings. This one also tends to be a real pain getting a constant 3.0 connection in some cheaper sockets.

All metal unibody flash drives are really nice.

But really, not having strain relief for a USB connector coming out a right angles from a bulky desk mounted case is a... stupidly compromised design decision from the start.

This was one of the first things I pointed out in my review of the GMMK keyboard, and worse, they didn't use mini or type-C, they used a micro-B in this fashion.
The only good part of this is that you can get a magnetic USB connector, which I installed right away, they don't make those for mini-B. Still, type-C would have been far better.

I have thought about getting some of those, especially for my Oculus Quest.

Offline jamster

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #56 on: Sun, 21 June 2020, 22:36:49 »
But really, not having strain relief for a USB connector coming out a right angles from a bulky desk mounted case is a... stupidly compromised design decision from the start.

This was one of the first things I pointed out in my review of the GMMK keyboard, and worse, they didn't use mini or type-C, they used a micro-B in this fashion.
The only good part of this is that you can get a magnetic USB connector, which I installed right away, they don't make those for mini-B. Still, type-C would have been far better.

Ah, yes, I recall reading your review and the rather pointed comments regarding the port. That review convinced me not to get a GMMK because of the need to clip the switches. Still more acceptable on a $70 case than a $190 (Drop) or $300+ product.

Magnetic USB connectors- I've only become aware of these recently via comments on Geekhack. Sounds intriguing, but whenever I search for them, they are called "magnetic charging" adaptors, and the photos that pop up only show 6 connections (whereas USB C has 24 pins).

Are these cables fully capable of carry data or do they operate at some reduced level of functionality/performance?

Secondly, and more importantly, are these things considered safe for higher power USB applications? Laptops will charge at 60+W using USB PD, which would make me slightly wary of randomly bought adaptors for the cable.


Offline Maledicted

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #57 on: Sun, 21 June 2020, 23:48:47 »
But really, not having strain relief for a USB connector coming out a right angles from a bulky desk mounted case is a... stupidly compromised design decision from the start.

This was one of the first things I pointed out in my review of the GMMK keyboard, and worse, they didn't use mini or type-C, they used a micro-B in this fashion.
The only good part of this is that you can get a magnetic USB connector, which I installed right away, they don't make those for mini-B. Still, type-C would have been far better.

Ah, yes, I recall reading your review and the rather pointed comments regarding the port. That review convinced me not to get a GMMK because of the need to clip the switches. Still more acceptable on a $70 case than a $190 (Drop) or $300+ product.

Magnetic USB connectors- I've only become aware of these recently via comments on Geekhack. Sounds intriguing, but whenever I search for them, they are called "magnetic charging" adaptors, and the photos that pop up only show 6 connections (whereas USB C has 24 pins).

Are these cables fully capable of carry data or do they operate at some reduced level of functionality/performance?

Secondly, and more importantly, are these things considered safe for higher power USB applications? Laptops will charge at 60+W using USB PD, which would make me slightly wary of randomly bought adaptors for the cable.

I think some are only meant for charging and some also work for data. Determining which one it is seems to be the trick sometimes. I'm no expert on specific type C specifications, but it looks like the 60 watt chargers are only pulling 3 amps? I would hope they would all be capable of that, but who knows with Chinese mystery products.

Offline Leslieann

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #58 on: Mon, 22 June 2020, 00:18:11 »
Ironically, I seem to see a lot of the most bizarre/abusive damage on devices that were very expensive when new myself. That sucks to hear. How did you manage to fix it? I have fixed some similarly-abused female type a sockets as well by fiddling around with some bent paperclips and skinny flathead screwdrivers to bend the pins back into shape. I imagine some dental picks would have really helped. In some extreme cases I have bent the whole housing open to get things in place again.


I do a bit of that myself. I have in my desk at home:
I like how it does triple duty as a desk cable grommet, powered USB 3.0 hub, and 3.5mm audio passthrough. The cover is a nice touch too.

I have thought about getting some of those, especially for my Oculus Quest.

I tried multiple picks and things, but regardless, even if this stopped it from shorting or something it couldn't fix the port. The only good thing was that on this model Mac there is only a single daughter board, and this port happened to be on it. Apple wanted $200 plus parts to replace it, I found it on Ebay for $20 and got a pentalobe screwdriver and did it myself. However, it was one of the most stressful repairs I've ever done. Older Airs are built like cell phones, super thin/small cable and connectors so it was difficult to even figure out how to release some of the connections. That board also contained the power connector so I couldn't just go without and if I damaged a connector on the board it would require a specialist like Louis Rossman or buying a refurbished board, this being the rare I7/8gb 11in model, that meant it was hard to find and very expensive, at the time it was about $500.


I think some are only meant for charging and some also work for data. Determining which one it is seems to be the trick sometimes. I'm no expert on specific type C specifications, but it looks like the 60 watt chargers are only pulling 3 amps? I would hope they would all be capable of that, but who knows with Chinese mystery products.
Yep, they vary a lot and rarely say in what ways.
Most are usb 2.0, some carry more amps, but rarely are they usb 3 and high power. Many are also one sided for data.

Still nice to have, just have to read the reviews first. If you have a wireless mouse, they're FANTASTIC for charging especially since the rest doesn't really matter. I'd say they are better than charging docs since you can replace the contacts which always wear out and it saves the sub port. If you do a mouse, make sure you get an oval shaped one, the circular/barrel style can lift the mouse.
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Offline Maledicted

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #59 on: Mon, 22 June 2020, 01:17:04 »
Ironically, I seem to see a lot of the most bizarre/abusive damage on devices that were very expensive when new myself. That sucks to hear. How did you manage to fix it? I have fixed some similarly-abused female type a sockets as well by fiddling around with some bent paperclips and skinny flathead screwdrivers to bend the pins back into shape. I imagine some dental picks would have really helped. In some extreme cases I have bent the whole housing open to get things in place again.


I do a bit of that myself. I have in my desk at home:
I like how it does triple duty as a desk cable grommet, powered USB 3.0 hub, and 3.5mm audio passthrough. The cover is a nice touch too.

I have thought about getting some of those, especially for my Oculus Quest.

I tried multiple picks and things, but regardless, even if this stopped it from shorting or something it couldn't fix the port. The only good thing was that on this model Mac there is only a single daughter board, and this port happened to be on it. Apple wanted $200 plus parts to replace it, I found it on Ebay for $20 and got a pentalobe screwdriver and did it myself. However, it was one of the most stressful repairs I've ever done. Older Airs are built like cell phones, super thin/small cable and connectors so it was difficult to even figure out how to release some of the connections. That board also contained the power connector so I couldn't just go without and if I damaged a connector on the board it would require a specialist like Louis Rossman or buying a refurbished board, this being the rare I7/8gb 11in model, that meant it was hard to find and very expensive, at the time it was about $500.

$200 just in labor to replace a daughterboard? How much was the part? lol

I have worked on an Air that's probably of that vintage, and a Pro. I can't say I have worked on anything made by Apple other than the old G5 and Mac Pro towers that was actually convenient. Everything they make seems to be designed to be as torturous to work on as possible. The iPhone 4s I replaced a screen on ... twice, since my friend stepped on the new screen within a day, never again. Even the old core 2 Macbooks are irritating.

I think some are only meant for charging and some also work for data. Determining which one it is seems to be the trick sometimes. I'm no expert on specific type C specifications, but it looks like the 60 watt chargers are only pulling 3 amps? I would hope they would all be capable of that, but who knows with Chinese mystery products.
Yep, they vary a lot and rarely say in what ways.
Most are usb 2.0, some carry more amps, but rarely are they usb 3 and high power. Many are also one sided for data.

Still nice to have, just have to read the reviews first. If you have a wireless mouse, they're FANTASTIC for charging especially since the rest doesn't really matter. I'd say they are better than charging docs since you can replace the contacts which always wear out and it saves the sub port. If you do a mouse, make sure you get an oval shaped one, the circular/barrel style can lift the mouse.

I don't usually use wireless peripherals unless it is with a HTPC, which probably makes owning an Oculus Quest somewhat ironic. That's all good to know though, thank you.

Offline Leslieann

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #60 on: Mon, 22 June 2020, 05:15:14 »
$200 just in labor to replace a daughterboard? How much was the part? lol

I have worked on an Air that's probably of that vintage, and a Pro. I can't say I have worked on anything made by Apple other than the old G5 and Mac Pro towers that was actually convenient. Everything they make seems to be designed to be as torturous to work on as possible. The iPhone 4s I replaced a screen on ... twice, since my friend stepped on the new screen within a day, never again. Even the old core 2 Macbooks are irritating.

That was the starting price, I didn't need to investigate any further. For that much, I'd go without it.

The 11.6in airs really only had two models, pre 2013 and post 2012, the only changes were processor and chipset for each generation. The 2013 and newer 11in Air however is one of the best laptops Apple ever made and still work great other than a few things due to the age (low res screen, thick trim). There is a new 11.6in 1080p screen out on the market, I may see about installing it if possible. There was a guy offering this a couple years ago but it was really an in depth and expensive job due to how older screens were made and how Apple built the Air screen. 

Apple does make it hard, that's why they sue for showing circuit designs, it's why they confiscate legally refurbished batteries and it's why they invented their own screw head which destroys itself and the tool after just one or two uses. I can usually get two uses from half the screws and even a Wiha branded screwdriver only lasts a few uses before it gets damaged.
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Offline suicidal_orange

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #61 on: Mon, 22 June 2020, 06:04:41 »
I haven't heard of a broken USB A female port.

I have one on a motherboard, not sure how but I snapped the plastic that holds the pins then the pins got mangled :-[
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Offline Maledicted

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #62 on: Mon, 22 June 2020, 09:54:53 »
$200 just in labor to replace a daughterboard? How much was the part? lol

I have worked on an Air that's probably of that vintage, and a Pro. I can't say I have worked on anything made by Apple other than the old G5 and Mac Pro towers that was actually convenient. Everything they make seems to be designed to be as torturous to work on as possible. The iPhone 4s I replaced a screen on ... twice, since my friend stepped on the new screen within a day, never again. Even the old core 2 Macbooks are irritating.

That was the starting price, I didn't need to investigate any further. For that much, I'd go without it.

The 11.6in airs really only had two models, pre 2013 and post 2012, the only changes were processor and chipset for each generation. The 2013 and newer 11in Air however is one of the best laptops Apple ever made and still work great other than a few things due to the age (low res screen, thick trim). There is a new 11.6in 1080p screen out on the market, I may see about installing it if possible. There was a guy offering this a couple years ago but it was really an in depth and expensive job due to how older screens were made and how Apple built the Air screen. 

Apple does make it hard, that's why they sue for showing circuit designs, it's why they confiscate legally refurbished batteries and it's why they invented their own screw head which destroys itself and the tool after just one or two uses. I can usually get two uses from half the screws and even a Wiha branded screwdriver only lasts a few uses before it gets damaged.

I like to use these, at work and home, although I don't know that I have used this particular set for pentalobe screws. I know I have used the random cheap drivers that came with screens and I hadn't run into problems, but that was just on that 4s. They come in various colors and configurations, but I think the important thing is to find one with that particular casing design with the maroon-colored bits. They're hardened. I think I broke a single, very thin, flathead just because I used it to try to crack open a GM key fob that got wet that the previous owner must have superglued shut. Otherwise I have used some of those smaller Philips bits for literally thousands of laptop repairs each and haven't worn a single one out. They're cheap, they're small, they have just about every tiny bit you'll ever need for a small electronic or laptop computer, there's space for a small flash drive and/or guitar picks (spudgers suck, including the included garbage), and I toss some bent paperclips in mine too, they come with a flexible adapter for tight spots, an extension, nut drivers, a rotatable knob on the end of the driver (I imagine you're familiar with how useful that can be), and there's even a hole in the end of the driver to stick the extension in for extra leverage when necessary. I appreciate the tough metal clasps, and the folding bit holders. Best of all, they're cheap.

The one gripe I have is those stupid o-rings as a gripping surface. I think some of the kits come with more substantial drivers, but I don't know that I have seen many that also have the hardened bits. I have just thrown some heat-shrink on a few of mine and that's worked pretty well.

Offline ddrfraser1

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Offline Leslieann

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #64 on: Mon, 22 June 2020, 20:50:08 »
I like to use these, at work and home, although I don't know that I have used this particular set for pentalobe screws.
The Wiha is also hardenned, it's just a bad screw design (on purpose).
As soon as the driver starts showing damage you have to toss it or it will just start destroying more and more screws.

Getting a stuck screw out of the end of an Iphone is pretty easy, I have no desire to get a recessed one out of the bottom of a laptop.
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Offline Maledicted

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #65 on: Mon, 22 June 2020, 21:52:49 »
I like to use these, at work and home, although I don't know that I have used this particular set for pentalobe screws.
The Wiha is also hardenned, it's just a bad screw design (on purpose).
As soon as the driver starts showing damage you have to toss it or it will just start destroying more and more screws.

Getting a stuck screw out of the end of an Iphone is pretty easy, I have no desire to get a recessed one out of the bottom of a laptop.

I haven't seen damage to anything other than the finish on my hardened bits, besides the one I snapped opening that fob. I suppose I should experience the wonders of pentalobe more often though.

Joking of course, I'll definitely pass on that.

Offline HungerMechanic

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #66 on: Thu, 15 October 2020, 21:58:53 »
So is it possible to just chuck any USB-C to USB-C (or A) 'phone charging cable' / 'quick charging cable' into a mechanical keyboard?

I've got to deal with these new USB-C boards coming out, so being able to use an Amazon Basics 'charging' cable or something would be fine with me.

Online yui

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #67 on: Fri, 16 October 2020, 00:44:48 »
So is it possible to just chuck any USB-C to USB-C (or A) 'phone charging cable' / 'quick charging cable' into a mechanical keyboard?

I've got to deal with these new USB-C boards coming out, so being able to use an Amazon Basics 'charging' cable or something would be fine with me.
i would not say any, any compliant cable should work but sometimes very cheap ones do not have the data wires in the cable, only power and seller often fail to mention that they cheaped out on half the wires.
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Offline HungerMechanic

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #68 on: Fri, 16 October 2020, 10:34:12 »
Thanks. I'll have to put some thought into what I select.

Offline Leslieann

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #69 on: Fri, 16 October 2020, 21:04:55 »
So is it possible to just chuck any USB-C to USB-C (or A) 'phone charging cable' / 'quick charging cable' into a mechanical keyboard?
No.

Think of it this way...
Type-C is just a connector, it works with old USB and new USB, you can use it for anything really, just depends how many wires they put in.
If they use 5 wires it can work as a 2.0 device, data and power, however it may not work on all type-C laptops.
If they put a different 5 it can work as a fast charger but no data.
If they do 7 wires it will do 2.0 data and fast charge, however it may not work on all type-C laptops.
If they do all but 2 wires it will work as 3.0 data but no fast charge.

Also, they can wire it so it has power on both sides, but data only works on one side.

Awesome, right? 
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Offline HungerMechanic

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #70 on: Sat, 17 October 2020, 17:52:59 »
Sounds versatile ... although it means for the consumer that they have to know what kind of 'USB-C' cable they are getting. As some will only power a device, others are good for data transfer but not charging.

I see people using Amazon Basics USB-C cables with KBD67, so I guess they will work with keyboards.

Offline Leslieann

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #71 on: Sat, 17 October 2020, 21:09:42 »
Sounds versatile ... although it means for the consumer that they have to know what kind of 'USB-C' cable they are getting. As some will only power a device, others are good for data transfer but not charging.
It's not versatile, it's a mess, and sellers are not saying what a cable supports, check reviews.

Cables are only part of the problem, the devices and support is just as much of a mess. Does that output support display? Double speed? High speed charging? Charging only? 2.0 data speeds only? You have no idea and it may be different from not just ports on one side vs the other but even the port right next to it may be different. 

USB 4.0 is supposed to unify everything and from a manufacturers perspective I get that they wanted to move into type-C slow otherwise it would have failed) this mess was to benefit them not you) but from a consumer's perspective they royally f*cked this up bad, most people just aren't aware of it until they try to use the more advanced features. Most people don't look and see if data is flowing faster or hook up a Thunderbolt display, they might notice slower data or think a cable isn't working but that's as far as most dive into this stuff, for now. Hopefully by the time that stuff does become mainstream it will be fixed but for now it's an absolute mess.
Filco MJ2 L.E. w/hand milled Vortex case, custom feet/paint/winkey blockoff plate, HID Liberator, stainless steel universal plate, 3d printed adapters, Type C, sound dampened,  Thick PBT caps (o-ringed), Cherry Jailhouse Blues w/lubed/clipped Cherry light springs | GMMK TKL | Magicforce 68 | YMDK75 | KBT Race S L.E. | Das Pro (Costar model) | GH60 | IBM Model M (x2)

Offline HungerMechanic

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #72 on: Sat, 17 October 2020, 21:56:48 »
I wanted to be diplomatic about USB-C, but yes, that is very messy for the purchaser.

It kind of reminds me of Blu-Ray. I mean, you can buy a Blu-Ray player, and find out it is not updated enough to play your Blu-Rays, or it needs a new version x.x cable that your firmware does not support, or it doesn't have the processing power to play certain advanced features. Then you throw 4K and HDR into the mix. You can buy a player than won't play your Blu-Rays. A mess that doesn't help the consumer.

As far as USB, I was happy with USB-A 2.0 and 3.0. Sure, the plug needs to be aligned properly. But 1.0 to 2.0 to 3.0 was a painless upgrade for me, and cables generally did what they were supposed to. I would have been happy with a simple more to a more capable 4.0. The ecosystem was generally backwards and forwards compatible, for me.

Online yui

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Re: What's so great about USB C
« Reply #73 on: Mon, 19 October 2020, 02:33:47 »
I wanted to be diplomatic about USB-C, but yes, that is very messy for the purchaser.

It kind of reminds me of Blu-Ray. I mean, you can buy a Blu-Ray player, and find out it is not updated enough to play your Blu-Rays, or it needs a new version x.x cable that your firmware does not support, or it doesn't have the processing power to play certain advanced features. Then you throw 4K and HDR into the mix. You can buy a player than won't play your Blu-Rays. A mess that doesn't help the consumer.

As far as USB, I was happy with USB-A 2.0 and 3.0. Sure, the plug needs to be aligned properly. But 1.0 to 2.0 to 3.0 was a painless upgrade for me, and cables generally did what they were supposed to. I would have been happy with a simple more to a more capable 4.0. The ecosystem was generally backwards and forwards compatible, for me.
i do agree that keeping the physical retrocompatibility would have been nice but you could not have increased speeds much more with such a simple connector while usb-C having much many more optimized contacts allows it to have more and faster datalines, it was pretty much a necessary evil. and usb 1.0 datelines are still present in the connector just need a fairly simple adapter to use them.
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