Spongy S key on my brand new 86UB

[jaynoon]

Just unwrapped a brand new Realforce 86UB from EliteKeyboards.

On the whole I'm thrilled with it. I'm definitely inserting a few erroneous a strokes, but I pretty much expected that given my inexperience with variable force keyboards.

However, I'm noticing something a little more alarming, which is my S key. The only way I can describe it, is to say that it has a spongy feel at the bottom, it doesn't bottom out nearly as easily as the other keys.

Is this switch not "breathing" at the bottom of the stroke? That's the only thing I can think of.

If so, is it fixable by me? I took a glance at the return/repair policy on Realforce boards from EK and it sounds like there's a good chance that it gets sent back to Japan (uggh).

[majestouch]

Curious issue, haven't heard of a spongy key before; the spring might be off center. Does it sound different?

In any case, EK will replace it within the 30day DOA period. E-mail support@elitekeyboards.com.

[jaynoon]

I feel like I can hear sticky rubber un-sticking when the key lifts up if I bottom it out. It also doesn't "thock" as much as it's neighbors when depressed.

Figure I'll give it a day or so to see if it works itself out before I send it back. Thanks for the troubleshooting, didn't realize there is a DOA policy.

[keyboardlover]

How do we know that manufacturers' weights arent correct and the ripometer is off?

[ch_123]

How do we know that manufacturers' weights arent correct and the ripometer is off?

Any manufacturer spec for key resistance has a margin of error to it. The honest ones will even tell you how much you can expect...

[theferenc]

So do you use 5g for a nickel? That's the official weight, but I've yet to find one that masses to 5g. And I've measured a bunch. They seem to range from 4.6 up to 5.2, most likely due to wear and/or crud.

[theferenc]

I know the mint says it is 5g, officially. But I've checked a few dozen nickels on the scales in the chem department, and none of them were 5g, unless you rounded to 0 decimal places.

I'm just saying, it isn't exact. Some are heavier, some are lighter. It seems to take around 25 before the average even hits 5g, at least from the pile of nickels I've got. So either use a scale to measure things after the key depresses, or use certified, machined masses. Everything else is just an estimate.

Pennies, though technically exactly half the mass of a nickel, show even more variation in mass than nickels do. And it takes more for the average to hit the proper amount.

[panda-R]

this thread is awesome talking about gravity, mass, weights, keyboards, australia, and soccer balls.

[jaynoon]

Definitely aware of the Topre "fart" .. this one key just seems to be extra gassy

I read the wiki where you describe the W/S/X keys as being closer to 40g, but that's not really what I'm feeling here.

In comparison with it's neighboring W & X, the S is quieter, because it's not bottoming out as much.. Almost as if it's had the dental band mod done to it.

Anyway, for a switch that's rated for tens of millions of keystrokes, I'm going to give this one a chance for a while to see if it evens out, it has a lot of strokes to go. My only other Topre board is a used HHKB, so I've never broken one in before.

Other aspects of this board are pretty crazy. It's much heavier than I expected. When I was holding the box I thought Majestouch accidentally sent me 2. It makes me want to bolt my HHKB & Filco to some lead weights or something. I also love the option to swap ctrl & caps out of the box.

My only wish is that the Windows/Command & ALT key were the same size so I could swap their order, to make it more like a Mac keyboard.

[theferenc]

Interesting that the realforce doesn't have a dip switch for swapping windows and alt. The HHKB does, and I used it, as I prefer ALT next to my space bar. The labels on them are wrong, though, as they are different sizes and so can't be swapped. At least, that was my assumption. Now I'm curious...

But functionally, they are windows style. Labeled, they are mac style. Take that for what it's worth.

[ch_123]

They also have Sun meta logos on them.

[elbowglue]

This is the same ground webwit covered previously, albeit in a much more webwit manner.

IMHO nickles make sense because if you say your switch actuates at about 45 grams, well, it's probably 45 grams +/- some grams via ripometer.  It's a universal measurement with a known error.  And most of use don't have exact weights at home. Variability from switch to switch would make use of exact weights "YMMV" anyways.

So IMHO the ripometer is a fine way to check switch actuation.  

As ripster points out, in japan they use the yen-ometer however it results in great frustration as it takes superb precision to balance 45 of them on a single key to even get a reading

I know the mint says it is 5g, officially. But I've checked a few dozen nickels on the scales in the chem department, and none of them were 5g, unless you rounded to 0 decimal places.

I'm just saying, it isn't exact. Some are heavier, some are lighter. It seems to take around 25 before the average even hits 5g, at least from the pile of nickels I've got. So either use a scale to measure things after the key depresses, or use certified, machined masses. Everything else is just an estimate.

Pennies, though technically exactly half the mass of a nickel, show even more variation in mass than nickels do. And it takes more for the average to hit the proper amount.