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Author Topic: That elusive keyboard  (Read 6059 times)

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Offline Malerik

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  • Posts: 27
That elusive keyboard
« on: Tue, 01 February 2011, 18:54:42 »
Hi there, been lurking about geekhack for a month or so after discovering it via the Mechanical Keyboard Guide over at overclock.net Looking for that elusive keyboard that has all the tidbits I'm craving.

 I'm a fairly heavy MMO player ( WoW, EQ2, Warhammer ), not looking for bells and whistles like fancy lights or usb hubs. It seems every time I zero in on a potential candidate it either goes out of stock somewhere or is flat out discontinued (Topre 87UB Se1800 55g).

  The leader in my search right now is the Realforce 103UB 55g. I don't think I would appreciate the variable weighting (otherwise the 86u would be a contender).

Essentially these are the details that matter:

High end keys (no pad printing, the shiny grease mark galls me)
Plate Mounted (a shifty kyb is no good)
Tenkeyless (not a deal breaker though)
Matte finish (the smear gloss finish of the DAS is what stopped me from that option)
6KRO or better (not sure how much this will affect my playstyle, but it would be nice to have it anyway)

  Not really sure about switches to be honest. Never had a mechanical and I'd like to just buy the one for now. From what I have read Brown, Clear and Topre seem to be the friendliest keys for heavy MMO's. Blue and Buckling Spring are out as the GF will have none of that right quick.


Is there a keyboard out there for me? Sure hope so, but it is fun looking none the less.

(P.S.  If anyone has a Topre 87 UB SE1800 55g in decent condition they are looking to sell, I would be very interested to hear about it. )
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Offline Losttsol

  • Posts: 42
That elusive keyboard
« Reply #1 on: Tue, 01 February 2011, 20:11:49 »
Get a Deck Tactile which has the Cherry Clears, PS/2, and turn the illumination off if you don't need it.  That satisfies all of your requirements.
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Keyboards: Deck Legend ToXiC, Dell AT-101W
Mice: Mionix Naos 3200, Logitech MX620, Razer Diamondback 3G

Offline sLeezy

  • Posts: 16
That elusive keyboard
« Reply #2 on: Tue, 01 February 2011, 20:15:20 »
Welcome to Geekhack! I finally get to say that.

I don't think you will notice the variable weighting from the Realforce keys once you're in the game. I've been contemplating buy a Realforce 87UB and the Noppoo Choc Mini Browns. Both of those keyboard have what you're looking for and I think you would probably enjoy both of those keyboards but they both offer different feels.

As you've never had a mechanical keyboard before it's hard to say what the perfect keyboard is for you. Let me just tell you that you're in for a long journey, enjoy the ride!
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Input Devices
Keyboard - PFU HHKB Pro 2 Esc WASD | Filco Majestouch Tenkeyless Esc WASD
Pointing Device - Logitech Performance MX

Offline keyboardlover

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That elusive keyboard
« Reply #3 on: Tue, 01 February 2011, 20:18:22 »
Welcome to GeekHack Malerik! The tenkeyless Leopold with browns (coming soon at EK) may fit your requirements well. They should come in stock sometime this month. Hope that helps.

You definitely won't find anything tenkeyless with clears. Also, FWIW the variable weighting in the Topre really isn't as extreme as it's often made out to be. 87U 55g's are not easy to find used but I wish you luck if that is what you seek =)
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Offline sLeezy

  • Posts: 16
That elusive keyboard
« Reply #4 on: Tue, 01 February 2011, 20:27:59 »
Leopolds looks like a good option. Not many people are willing to give up their topres so buying a used Realforce in general will be hard. The Leopolds and Choc Minis are both quality boards for the price and are cheaper alternatives to the Realforce if you're good with browns.
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Input Devices
Keyboard - PFU HHKB Pro 2 Esc WASD | Filco Majestouch Tenkeyless Esc WASD
Pointing Device - Logitech Performance MX

Offline keyboardlover

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    • http://www.keyboardlover.com
That elusive keyboard
« Reply #5 on: Tue, 01 February 2011, 20:31:58 »
I still have my doubts about Choc Mini and I don't think they should be recommended to new members, especially those unfamiliar or uncomfortable with the buying process. Good luck returning one. Also there's been a flurry of poo-flinging in the classifieds lately.
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Offline sLeezy

  • Posts: 16
That elusive keyboard
« Reply #6 on: Tue, 01 February 2011, 20:47:29 »
I haven't seen too many Chocs  being sold in the classifieds but I've seen a bunch looking for them though. I definitely agree that the buying process is a pain but I've typed on the Choc Mini browns and I personally think they feel great. The only problem I have about them is the cord is not detachable and seems a little flimsy.
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Input Devices
Keyboard - PFU HHKB Pro 2 Esc WASD | Filco Majestouch Tenkeyless Esc WASD
Pointing Device - Logitech Performance MX

Offline steeef

  • Posts: 156
That elusive keyboard
« Reply #7 on: Tue, 01 February 2011, 22:17:28 »
Quote from: sLeezy;288617
I haven't seen too many Chocs  being sold in the classifieds but I've seen a bunch looking for them though. I definitely agree that the buying process is a pain but I've typed on the Choc Mini browns and I personally think they feel great. The only problem I have about them is the cord is not detachable and seems a little flimsy.

As long as you're willing to pay for decent (i.e. EMS/DHL) shipping, it's not a pain at all, it's just a different experience. Obook was very helpful and informative, and it took less than a week to receive mine.

Flimsy cord? It's the thickest USB keyboard cable I've ever seen! If it was detachable, I'd be worried about it detaching from constant plugging/unplugging.
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Cherry MX Blue: Filco Majestouch Tenkeyless. Cherry MX Black: TG3 KBA-BLTD-5RBUVS (Police Cruiser keyboard). Cherry MX Clear: KBC Poker (modded with Ergo Clears) Cherry MX Brown: Goldtouch GTC-077 USB numpad. Buckling Spring: IBM Model M 1391401 (1989-01-03 and 1991-11-21).

Offline theferenc

  • Posts: 1327
That elusive keyboard
« Reply #8 on: Tue, 01 February 2011, 23:56:18 »
kalrykh, they don't. Clears have a significantly more pronounced tactile point, whereas the browns feel practically linear -- at least to my Model M weilding hands, they do.

I would be interested in another opinion on the comparison between 45g topres and clears, though.
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HHKB Pro 2 -- Custom UNIX layout Unicomp Customizer 101 -- IBM Model M 1391401 (modded to UNIX layout) -- IBM 1397000 (also UNIX layout) -- SSK in UNIX layout -- Model F 122 key in UNIX layout (Soarer USB "native")
 
CST L-TracX trackball -- Kensington Expert Mouse trackball

Offline keyboardlover

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That elusive keyboard
« Reply #9 on: Wed, 02 February 2011, 07:20:47 »
Noppoo is a fad, like P90X or Pogs. It's hot now but it'll probably fade fast.

Then in a couple years, it'll hit Canada.
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Offline Malerik

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 27
That elusive keyboard
« Reply #10 on: Wed, 02 February 2011, 11:01:54 »
Quote from: kalrykh;288647
Apparently I have a keyboard problem.  Malerik, I just ordered a deck legend with clears.  If you can wait a few days for it to arrive, I can try to give you a side by side comparison, with clears, 45g topres and 55g topres.  I haven't used browns, but aside from the weight, they should feel about the same as clears anyway.



  I would be very interested in seeing this comparison. Waiting is not a problem for me. Currently I am typing gaming on a Lenovo KB1021 (cheap rubber dome ). It was slightly stiffer than my G110, which I have given to my girlfriend. However the WASD cluster is really worn down and starting to make a funny noise (an almost metallic resonance noise, hard to describe I guess) and I think I'm on borrowed time.

  That said I would prefer to wait and read reviews and listen to folks experiences to get the best idea of what I should be looking at. I live in BC, Canada so while Deck wont ship to me direct, think I can ship it to a shipping company in Point Roberts, WA so that would be an option as well.
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Offline Malerik

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  • Posts: 27
That elusive keyboard
« Reply #11 on: Fri, 04 February 2011, 14:42:59 »
In my search I have begun to realize that the feel and construction of the keys has become quite important to me. The Topre keys are raved about by many, and if I'm not mistaken are dye sublimated PBT. How do the Deck keys stack up against the Topre? I realize they are double shot molding with dye sub but can you feel the edges like I have heard some say?  I would think that subtle crease would be annoying.


  I was looking for any up close pictures (a geekhack specialty I have come to appreciate very much) of the Topre and Deck keycaps side by side, but have had no luck so far. Is anyone able to post a hi res side by side closeup?
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Offline Malerik

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  • Posts: 27
That elusive keyboard
« Reply #12 on: Fri, 04 February 2011, 15:03:57 »
Quote from: ripster;289884
You really don't feel the Deck keys edge but it is visible. Look at the Key Reference Wiki for details.


Bangs head on desk. Of course I don't look in the best and most obvious place to look. Too bad about that extra key cap set being discontinued for Deck, pretty awesome looking. Thanks!
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Offline stuiees

  • Posts: 140
That elusive keyboard
« Reply #13 on: Wed, 09 February 2011, 18:30:22 »
Quote from: kalrykh;292553
Ok...after getting the deck tactile in...I'm gonna have to say go with clears.  I think this is the closest you're going to get to a topre feel from a cherry switch.  The switches are a bit stiff, but because the force required to depress them goes up dramatically after hitting the actuation point, I find them almost impossible to bottom out.  It gives it a kind of soft landing with no bottoming out.  I wish it were tenkeyless, but I don't think anyone makes a tenkeyless board with clears.  Clears seriously feel great.  I'll give it a few weeks to wear in and get used to, but I'm strongly considering making this my daily driver and offloading my topres.  It's a bit soon to jump the gun though.  

The tactile point is crisp, and it seems to be as prominent as the one on my filco with blues.  I'm not impressed with the quality of the housing on the deck, but damn these keys feel nice :P



With that being said, do you prefer your all 55g RF or the all 45g UBY?  Stricktly keystroke feel, not 1337ness factor etc.
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I like Topre!

Offline Malerik

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  • Posts: 27
That elusive keyboard
« Reply #14 on: Thu, 10 February 2011, 01:33:37 »
Thanks for the heads up. The Deck has become my front runner in this. Cleaning out an old section at work, I found an interesting toy. It's an IBM SK--8835. Looks and feels like the keyboard from the T60 laptop, complete with nav stick, track pad, num pad, media keys, the whole works. Keys are a bit stiff but otherwise in perfect condition.

 Typing on it right now. The keys are a bit close for my liking but it is unique enough that it has its own appeal. I think it will hold my attention for a bit, but I will eventually be getting the Deck. I'm intrigued by the MX Clear switch, and other than a single Cherry board, I can't find another board that uses them.
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Offline pitashen

  • Posts: 1200
That elusive keyboard
« Reply #15 on: Thu, 10 February 2011, 02:12:27 »
Quote from: Malerik;289883
In my search I have begun to realize that the feel and construction of the keys has become quite important to me.

Chances are, once you get one mech board, you will get another one. I wouldn't be THAT picky about the key cap yet plus you can always upgrade to better ones. I would put more focus on the switches, which is what I did. I do now wish my board has better cap instead of ABC, but I do not regret my initial choice of the board mainly because my liking of the switch. Planning to get another board with different switch just to be adventurous.  

If money is not an issue, Topre.
If it is, start I would start with Brown. >
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\\\\ DSI Mac Modular Keyboard (Brown) w/ Leo  Blank Keycaps //
\\\\ Leopold 87keys Keyboard (Brown) w/ Black CherryCorp + SP DoubleShots //
\\\\ Filco Majestouch 2 NINJA (Black) w/ White CherryCorp + SP DoublsShots //

Offline Garry

  • Posts: 23
That elusive keyboard
« Reply #16 on: Mon, 21 February 2011, 07:06:59 »
I've used most switch types while playing MMOs and I have to say that mx blacks are my preferred.

I'm currently using a Steelseries 7g for playing MMOs. I have a bunch of other keyboards for other jobs like my mx browns for SC2 and blues or HHKB for typing/work. The blacks just feel right for MMOs and I can't put my finger on a reason. Also the rest on the 7g is awesome for long play sessions.

I would love a similar slip over palm rest for my Filco tenkeyless browns. Anyone?
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