Mac-chanical keyboards?

[Chrontius]

For the reference, this is typed on a Cherry Black SMK-88.  

I'm trying to make a list of all mechanical mac keyboards produced to make a decision easier for those of us of the UNIX persuasion.

My problem stems from the fact that Apple keyboards often have functions on them that, on a PC, would be readily available some other way... eject, volume, mute, things of that nature.  (PCs tend to have eject keys on the drive, not the keyboard, and use external speakers rather more often, in my experience)  Bonus points to keyboards offering the modern shortcuts including display brightness, Exposee, Dashboard, and media keys.

Add to that the annoyance of the transposed meta/alt keys on Mac boards vs. commodity PC ones, and "just use whatever" gets old, fast.  Thus, I started looking, and found these:  

Mechanical Mac Keyboards:

• ***Kensington StudioBoard
• Matias Tactile Pro 3
• ***Matias Tactile Pro 2
• Das Keyboard
• DSI KB-MODMAC-U
• ***DSI SMK-88
• Happy Hacking Keyboard Pro
• ***Micro Connectors flavored keyboard

The triple-star tag means that the board, as best as I can tell, is discontinued.  Anybody else know something that I dont, please chime in.

[ch_123]

Some of the additional Mac specific keys on the HHKB require OS drivers to work. This means (at least on the PPC Macs I've used my HHKB Pro 1 with ) that eject doesn't work before the OS has booted, which makes any sort of pre-boot stuff somewhat problematic. However, I'm not entirely sure if this is still true when dealing with Intel Macs and/or the current version of the HHKB Pro.

[EastSide]

Good post.

Anyone know any Mac-centric Cherry MX brown backlit keyboards that could go on this list? or anything cherry mx brown backlit that works?

[Chrontius]

Good post.

Anyone know any Mac-centric Cherry MX brown backlit keyboards that could go on this list? or anything cherry mx brown backlit that works?

Quoted for truth.  No, quoted for "exactly what I want in a keyboard but was afraid to ask"

Das Keyboard is not particularly Mac friendly - especially since they only shipped with media keys for only one month and I don't think even those worked with OSX.

And this DealExtreme scissor HHKB Killer at least LOOKS Mac friendly (if you don't look for the St John's Arms).

Show Image

Only for one month?  Dah.

And what do you mean "HHKB Killer"?

[mkawa]

you can flip the opt/cmd mappings in the macos keyboard driver via gui. it's super simple: sysprefs -> keyboard -> modifier keys...

this is the only substantial difference between key layouts.

[Superfluous Parentheses]

Some of the additional Mac specific keys on the HHKB require OS drivers to work. This means (at least on the PPC Macs I've used my HHKB Pro 1 with ) that eject doesn't work before the OS has booted, which makes any sort of pre-boot stuff somewhat problematic. However, I'm not entirely sure if this is still true when dealing with Intel Macs and/or the current version of the HHKB Pro.

As a part-time Mac and fulltime HHKB Pro user, the OS-X drivers for the HHKB suck, as in: the installer is only available in Japanese and installing them doesn't seem to do anything. Basically that means the keyboard is fully working for everything you'd expect except that special-function-function-key stuff like "Eject" doesn't work. Brightness control does seem to work with F-p and F-o.

[theferenc]

I was just going to post what mkawa posted. It's trivial to make it match, so I don't see what the problem is. I've always just "used whatever" for my macs, and never run into a problem.

Admittedly, the Choc Mini doesn't work, but that's a driver issue more than anything else. And should be potentially easy to fix on a per system basis. The problem is getting it back into the mainline kernel branch. Apple seriously suffers from NIH on all code except what they steal.

I'm not sure what you're looking for exactly in a keyboard. I am currently using a Model M on mine with little problem. Just map caps to control, control to alt, and alt to command. That's all of the mac modifiers, in pretty close to their proper positions. Alt is a little outside, but easy to adjust to. And control is where god intended.

[theferenc]

I've written drivers for other hardware before. Mostly NICs, but also a gamepad, which was based on the HID drivers.

[pitashen]

DSI Modular Mac Keyboard is not bad. I am using one. Some have said that the layout is hard to get used to. I am fine with it and actually like it a lot. You could argue that the media keys are not well positions but other keys are smartly arranged in my opinion.  

You'll need a wrist pad to type comfortably though.

Otherwise, Matias is the best alternative for Mac keyboard.

Of course, if money is not your concern, and you are willing to learn new kb layout. HHKB is good.

[ricercar]

The Kinesis Contour/Advantage (non-backlit Cherry browns)  is the only Mac/Win keyboard on earth that correctly labels the command and option keys. The dual well/cup design isn't for everyone, but it's fantastic if you take the time to work on it. IM me or Input Nirvana if you want to ask specific questions about the Kinesis on MacOS X.

You'd think Logitech would have it down by now, but no. I check them out occasionally just for laughs, and they still have command on the ALT key and OPT on the Win key. BZZZZT

[theferenc]

Except, looking at my keyboard, that's where those keys should physically be. Physically, command should be in the alt location of a "normal" keyboard, and windows is in the physical location of the mac keyboards opt key.

Sure, they send the wrong code on a mac, but a simple system pref takes care of that, and then the keys are labeled correctly in the correct locations.

I would actually argue this is MORE correct than the Kinesis, which puts everything in wonky spots to begin with. And yes, I own one -- at the moment. And at least with the MS keyboards, they come with little cards that tell you to do this on the mac. At least the wireless MS keyboard we bought my dad did.

[Chrontius]

I got a crazy idea, and I am now pining for Apple to release a special-edition keyboard, either Alps or Cherry, with backlit keys, a latching caps lock, and a row of hotkeys separate from (above) the F-keys, which in their formerly-typical fashion, continue to F15.

Yes, the extra F-keys would make awesome system-wide hotkeys, I think.

Should my hypothetical keyboard have a plastic housing, or unibody aluminum?  I think I've settled on black keys, but mil-spec type 3 hard anodizing on an aluminum frame may be just a tad spendy... but it's what I'd do given the choice.

(naturally, the illuminated Apple logo centered above the keys is the power switch!)

[pitashen]

I got a crazy idea, and I am now pining for Apple to release a special-edition keyboard, either Alps or Cherry, with backlit keys, a latching caps lock, and a row of hotkeys separate from (above) the F-keys, which in their formerly-typical fashion, continue to F15.

Yes, the extra F-keys would make awesome system-wide hotkeys, I think.

Should my hypothetical keyboard have a plastic housing, or unibody aluminum?  I think I've settled on black keys, but mil-spec type 3 hard anodizing on an aluminum frame may be just a tad spendy... but it's what I'd do given the choice.

(naturally, the illuminated Apple logo centered above the keys is the power switch!)

If this is your answer to our suggestions.

PLZ...

[shortround]

Das Keyboard is not particularly Mac friendly - especially since they only shipped with media keys for only one month and I don't think even those worked with OSX.  QUOTE]


I used the das 3 with my Mac for a while and it worked fine.  The OSX simply used the windows key as command, alt became option etc.

Currently I'm using a Filco with blank keys which I find to be great with the Mac.  I moved the (bubbly) key with the circle next to the spacebar to become command and told the OS to recognize it as such.  So my command keys are back to standard Mac layout, with no Windows logos.  :bounce:

[NamelessPFG]

Sure, you can switch the keys in System Preferences, but this will eventually lead to confusion if you need to hold down Cmd or Opt/Alt during bootup for whatever reason and find that you aren't getting what you wanted.

I actually have a DSI Modular Mac, and it's a respectable keyboard. However, I have yet to test it on that PowerBook G3 that's collecting dust, and it's my only Mac. (Yes, I'm actually using it on a Windows PC. I actually like having the Win/Cmd/Super/Meta key in between Alt and Space; makes the former more viable as a key for use in games with a ton of binds, whereas the Win/Cmd key is just a pain in the ass that sends you back to the desktop and sometimes screws up the game.)

What we need are more keyboards with a switch that changes the scancodes at the hardware level...

[pitashen]

Sure, you can switch the keys in System Preferences, but this will eventually lead to confusion if you need to hold down Cmd or Opt/Alt during bootup for whatever reason and find that you aren't getting what you wanted.

I actually have a DSI Modular Mac, and it's a respectable keyboard. However, I have yet to test it on that PowerBook G3 that's collecting dust, and it's my only Mac. (Yes, I'm actually using it on a Windows PC. I actually like having the Win/Cmd/Super/Meta key in between Alt and Space; makes the former more viable as a key for use in games with a ton of binds, whereas the Win/Cmd key is just a pain in the ass that sends you back to the desktop and sometimes screws up the game.)

What we need are more keyboards with a switch that changes the scancodes at the hardware level...

I dualboot my rig betwn hackintosh (Mac OSX snow leopard) and win7, DSI Mod Keyboard works wonderfully on both OS.

I personally think the layout is actually a pretty good alternative to HHKB layout, compact with minimal learning curve.

Just make sure get a wrist rest for it.

[Chrontius]

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=354709

These were made with blue switches?!

GAAAAAH!

So is it possible to transplant a Das' worth of blues into my SMK?

[shortround]

Oh yeah, I could see that being a pain.

[Chrontius]

So, just to bump this, I've purchased a first-gen Matias Tactile at the risk of bankrupting myself, and it was worth it.  Aside from the illuminated (caps, numlock) keys not clicking like the rest, and wishing the USB hub was 2.0, it's really quite excellent in every way that matters.  The complicated Alps switches have a stronger tactile response, somewhere between the AEK2 and the Model M, which is exactly what I'd have requested, had I known such a thing was possible.  

In the future, I hope they include the new enhanced Mac F-keys, but I can live without that for the most part.