Dox KB, Build your own!

[ishtob]

Why in the world did we not think of that.. mount it the same direction, but from the opposite side.. So the orientation stays the same in other words. USB on top.

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but mount it from the opposide side as in your example.

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Also in the DOX layout you will notice it will not be direction under any switch pins, so there is no worries about it shorting out a keyswitch.

I've considered this during my design, but it will need more space for you to be able to get the wires to the PCB because the USB would sit exactly 1mm away from the space bar stabilizer..... actually.. I might be able to make this work.... i'll work on it afte thanksgiving, going to be away, but i'll be on the forum through my phone

[ishtob]

on issue with flashing, theres way too, im going to use the idea I got from the numpad I'm making:
[ Attachment Invalid Or Does Not Exist ] 32726[/ATTACH]

so teensy is upside-down, and add a hole over the place of the button, then we drill a hole on the bottom of case to give easy access to the teensy

[Dox]

on issue with flashing, theres way too, im going to use the idea I got from the numpad I'm making:
(Attachment Link) 32726[/ATTACH]

so teensy is upside-down, and add a hole over the place of the button, then we drill a hole on the bottom of case to give easy access to the teensy

You can flash the teensy by jumping to the bootloader with a keyboard shortcut (both shift + B) in hasu's firmware. The reset button does not need to be accessible.

[ishtob]

well... for the numpad i'm making the hole is going to be ont eh topside, because i'm prob not going to run a case with it, just going to bolt it down to a wedge of wood so its inclined

[bloodygood]

I've considered this during my design, but it will need more space for you to be able to get the wires to the PCB because the USB would sit exactly 1mm away from the space bar stabilizer..... actually.. I might be able to make this work.... i'll work on it afte thanksgiving, going to be away, but i'll be on the forum through my phone

Wait, why would it be sitting close to the stabilizers? Aren't the stabilizers only there for PCB mounted, and plus Plate mounted stabilizers are attached to the plate not the PCB. So it should not be getting in the way at all.. should it?

[Soarer]

Soarer, any info on the thing you are building?

thing

[ishtob]

Wait, why would it be sitting close to the stabilizers? Aren't the stabilizers only there for PCB mounted, and plus Plate mounted stabilizers are attached to the plate not the PCB. So it should not be getting in the way at all.. should it?

if you look at the cherry datasheet, both will be in the same heigh and position, it only differs on the way it is attached. the plate mounted will still be sitting on top of the PCB in the same spot

[bloodygood]

if you look at the cherry datasheet, both will be in the same heigh and position, it only differs on the way it is attached. the plate mounted will still be sitting on top of the PCB in the same spot

And the Teensy will be sitting under the PCB away from the stabilizers.. Is there something I am missing here?

[TheProfosist]

You can flash the teensy by jumping to the bootloader with a keyboard shortcut (both shift + B) in hasu's firmware. The reset button does not need to be accessible.

Im saving this link this time

[Dox]

thing

Nice! I remember that I saw that back in September but I don't go on Deskthority too often. Maybe I should look more often.

[TheProfosist]

thing

Looks interesting though somethings seem hard to find.

[TheProfosist]

And the Teensy will be sitting under the PCB away from the stabilizers.. Is there something I am missing here?

Im in the thinking that the Teensy is still on the top of the PCB just upside down right now...

[Soarer]

Looks interesting though somethings seem hard to find.

As stated in the first post... where stuff is going on the Fn layer is still to be determined!

[TheProfosist]

As stated in the first post... where stuff is going on the Fn layer is still to be determined!

no sorry I meant key wise. well possibly only the spacebar.

[Soarer]

no sorry I meant key wise. well possibly only the spacebar.

Mostly easy to find, except the small spacebars. I've got two 3-unit wide ones from Access POS 'boards. The 6-unit wide, however, is the same as G8x-1800 / G8x-11900 etc, so fairly common.

[bloodygood]

I apologize for the crudeness of this photoshop but this is what we are talking about.
Before
After

[TheProfosist]

I apologize for the crudeness of this photoshop but this is what we are talking about.

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Before

Show Image

After

And I still dont think you will have enough clearance. Only measurements will settle that though.

[bloodygood]

And I still dont think you will have enough clearance. Only measurements will settle that though.

Are you talking about enough clearance in the Poker case or in general? I believe in the Poker case.. we will need measurements, but as far as clearing for the USB connector and such, I believe that will be fine as we saw from Soarers insight.

[TheProfosist]

Are you talking about enough clearance in the Poker case or in general? I believe in the Poker case.. we will need measurements, but as far as clearing for the USB connector and such, I believe that will be fine as we saw from Soarers insight.

yes clearance in the poker case I see being a problem.

[ishtob]

yea.. it need to be on the top side to fit in that case, but if you guys are plannign your own then it would work

[TheProfosist]

yea.. it need to be on the top side to fit in that case, but if you guys are plannign your own then it would work

Nope I have 2 poker cases waiting. As soon as people get their aluminum ones their going to sell me theirs for $26 each. I think flipping the teensy over might be a good idea though its possible to help wit clearance.

[ishtob]

actually if you guys want it in that "Flipped" orientation, nothing needs to be changed, all the pins will still be in the right places... we just need to move the holes for connecting the USB farther away

[TheProfosist]

actually if you guys want it in that "Flipped" orientation, nothing needs to be changed, all the pins will still be in the right places... we just need to move the holes for connecting the USB farther away

Sounds goot to me as there will be more clearance for the spacebar.

O and Sorry ishtob but I need got a chance to look at my PCB and I dont think I would be very good at checking but I can try later today if needed I guess.

[ishtob]

I still dont understand this clearance of spacebar thing, I've been using my DOX for over a week now with this setup and never had i touched the teensy the way it is setup, seems like a lot of trouble fixing something that is working already

my other reasons for it to be on top is because I will be using that aluminum case that i ordered so there won't be any space under the PCB for my to mount the teensy. and you might need to cut some of the plastic bracing inside to allow the teensy to sit under the normal case. I ended up putting it on the topside to avoid these issues.

[TheProfosist]

I still dont understand this clearance of spacebar thing, I've been using my DOX for over a week now with this setup and never had i touched the teensy the way it is setup, seems like a lot of trouble fixing something that is working already

my other reasons for it to be on top is because I will be using that aluminum case that i ordered so there won't be any space under the PCB for my to mount the teensy. and you might need to cut some of the plastic bracing inside to allow the teensy to sit under the normal case. I ended up putting it on the topside to avoid these issues.

A little extra clearance isnt a bad thing.

Yea I dont want it in the bottom of the PCB just flipped over on the top. I dont want to have to mod my poker case if I dont have to.

[ishtob]

the only thing I can think of for the teensy to be flipped topside is to be able to use the filco/Leo universal space bar... other than that there isn't really a need for that much clearance... but if you want it like that I can get it done for you

[TheProfosist]

the only thing I can think of for the teensy to be flipped topside is to be able to use the filco/Leo universal space bar... other than that there isn't really a need for that much clearance... but if you want it like that I can get it done for you

Yes I would really appreciate it.

Also will you be able to get Dox some measurements of the inside of a poker case somewhat soon?

[ishtob]

im hoping to get a CAD file made by this weekend, im visiting my sister whose studying architecture, and she's got friends in product designing who might be able to help.

[bloodygood]

I believe if we had the measurements for the case that would clear up the issue of will it or will it not fit in the poker case without modification from the underside of the PCB. But also do we think the plate will be able to mount right on top of the Teensy without shorting it out or having enough clearance? That is the main reason to move the Teensy under, even if it means not being able to use a Poker case, plate mounting is very important.

[TheProfosist]

im hoping to get a CAD file made by this weekend, im visiting my sister whose studying architecture, and she's got friends in product designing who might be able to help.

Otherwise Dox said he sould do it pertaining her had measurements.

[TheProfosist]

I believe if we had the measurements for the case that would clear up the issue of will it or will it not fit in the poker case without modification from the underside of the PCB. But also do we think the plate will be able to mount right on top of the Teensy without shorting it out or having enough clearance? That is the main reason to move the Teensy under, even if it means not being able to use a Poker case, plate mounting is very important.

There will be a hole in the plate so there wont be any issues shortind out or anything this was an original planned design. That I have mentioned many times.

[ishtob]

the teensy will be exactly (or a bit lower) than the height of the plates, so we would need a cutout in the area occupied by the teensy

[TheProfosist]

the teensy will be exactly (or a bit lower) than the height of the plates, so we would need a cutout in the area occupied by the teensy

Fine with me

[bloodygood]

On a different note has anyone read this thread or thought about whether they would like it or not
http://geekhack.org/showthread.php?24151-Would-It-Be-Possible-To
In short.
When keys are pressed the LED comes on, de-pressed they are off? Since there has been more interest in the Dox keyboard I thought it would be good to ask. I remember trying to bring it up before but other things were going on in the thread at the time, we are at a bit of a lull right now so why not.

Otherwise still related, I was still planning on going with purple LEDs if it is possible. I hope that the space in the metal plate for the Teensy won't cause any problems for that stabilizer on the left side of the spacebar.

[TheProfosist]

ishtob your not going to like this but I might be swapping it so that left shift is on the outside and left fn is on the inside so that its more standard like a ISO layout. This is based on whether or not I can do that with the Phantom layout though

[bloodygood]

Since that is not a big change and that smaller shift will not require stabilizers I do not think you have to worry about it being a problem. If you all of a sudden wanted to move a key with stabilizers into the middle of the keyboard or something, they you might have a problem lol. Small changes other than adding an extra key are rather easy to rearrange for. I have spent a lot of time this past week re-arranging and testing things in the PCB designer program and I can see why ishtob enjoys this custom keyboard idea.

[TheProfosist]

Still trying to get a straight answer from the Phantom guys. I dont see why it wouldnt work since they say ISO layout works with their PCB and that row is layer out the same as ISO.

[litster]

Still trying to get a straight answer from the Phantom guys. I dont see why it wouldnt work since they say ISO layout works with their PCB and that row is layer out the same as ISO.

It is not the PCB.  The PCB can do all kinds of layouts.  Take a look at the PCB picture on the first post of the thread.  If there are holes for where you want your switches then you can put a switch there.  BUT, Phantom is a plate-mounted design just like Filco.  So you need a plate that fits your switch layout.  If one of the 5 plates we have don't fit your design, then it won't work.

[TheProfosist]

It is not the PCB.  The PCB can do all kinds of layouts.  Take a look at the PCB picture on the first post of the thread.  If there are holes for where you want your switches then you can put a switch there.  BUT, Phantom is a plate-mounted design just like Filco.  So you need a plate that fits your switch layout.  If one of the 5 plates we have don't fit your design, then it won't work.

I might have to order a plate myself then. Once you have it designed would you be willing to share the files so I can find someone to modify it for me or modify a plate for me?

[litster]

Possibly.  I will have to consult with the other team members.  PrinsValium does all the design work.  He doesn't seem to mind giving out his PCB design (says so on the silk screen of the PCB).

[litster]

PrinsValium gave me permission to post the plate DXF files.  So I will do that.

Separately, if you have a Teensy 2.0, can you tell me the thickness of it?  In your application, do you use the one with pins or do you just solder wires directly on to the Teensy PCB?  Thanks.

[TheProfosist]

PrinsValium gave me permission to post the plate DXF files.  So I will do that.

Separately, if you have a Teensy 2.0, can you tell me the thickness of it?  In your application, do you use the one with pins or do you just solder wires directly on to the Teensy PCB?  Thanks.

I currently dont have one bgut we plan on soldering the one with pins directly to the PCB.

[ishtob]

sorry all my teensy are soldered to a board at the moment, planning to buy another when my layout for the numpad is done

[litster]

Is your Teensy a Teensy with pins and solder onto your keyboard's PCB?

[ishtob]

yes, i bought the pins seperately though

but it should be the same as the one with pins soldered already

[litster]

are your pins the same kind as Teensy_Pins from pjrc.com?  If it is not too much trouble, could you measure the distance between the surface of the keyboard PCB to the top of the USB connector?  I need to the height to know how much room I need to make for the case.  Thanks.

[ishtob]

Mine measures to about 8mm from top of the USB to the surface of the pcb

this is the pin i am using:http://www.pjrc.com/store/header_12x1.html

[litster]

Perfect!  Thank you very much!

[TheProfosist]

ishtob I have finally confirmed that my change to the Phantom is possible and will be updateing both layout once done I would like to get started on egtting everything together for my DOX the first big piece would be the PCB. Also did you ever end up getting the plate worked out? Otherwise DOX did offer his help we just need to get him the measurements.

[ishtob]

i couldnt get my hands on solidworks, so we prob would need his help to make the plate