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Author Topic: N-key rollover test.  (Read 202032 times)

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Offline cmr

  • Posts: 295
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #100 on: Wed, 14 January 2009, 21:40:46 »
Quote from: cmr;17944
apple extended keyboard ii
interface: griffin imate ADB to USB adapter
operating system: ubuntu 8.10
minimum keys accepted: 4
maximum keys accepted: 6


result is exactly the same using windows vista.
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Offline yetanothergeek

  • Posts: 7
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #101 on: Mon, 19 January 2009, 11:42:51 »
Keyboard: Kinesis Advantage Contoured USB
Connection: USB
Operating System: Linux 2.6.24
Layout: de_neo v1
N-Key: 6 Keys recognized, qvlcui works, qvlcuia fails
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Offline bhtooefr

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N-key rollover test.
« Reply #102 on: Tue, 20 January 2009, 14:41:20 »
Keyboard: Ione Scorpius M10
Connection: USB
Operating system: Windows XP Tablet PC Edition 2005 SP3
Layout: US English
Minimum rollover: 2 keys (used QWAS to test)
Other combos: WASD fails, SDFJKL succeeds
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Offline xyzzy

  • Posts: 155
  • Location: EU
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #103 on: Thu, 22 January 2009, 05:12:49 »
Keyboard: Cherry Ergoplus G80-5000HAMDE/03
Connection: PS/2 (via AT to PS/2 adapter)
Operating system: Windows XP Professional SP3
Layout: German
Tested rollover: 26 keys - used 1st row (1 to 0), 2nd (q to i) and 3rd (a to k) to test
Other combos: tried different combinations between 18 and 26 keys and couldn't get it to fail
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Offline MamiyaOtaru

  • Posts: 3
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #104 on: Mon, 26 January 2009, 02:12:02 »
KB: Deck Legend
Interface: PS/2
switches: black cherry linear
Keys accepted: 36

No combo I can try fails.  I don't doubt I could get more than 36 if I could position my hands right.
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Offline colinstu

  • Posts: 11
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #105 on: Mon, 26 January 2009, 07:33:57 »
IBM Model M 1391401 (White logo)
Interface: PS/2
Operating System: XP
Max keys accepted: 8

If I hold down more then 8 keys, it only gets 2.
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Offline bhtooefr

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N-key rollover test.
« Reply #106 on: Mon, 26 January 2009, 08:50:14 »
Maximum keys doesn't matter (except for situations such as greater than 6 keys on USB.) You want minimum.
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Offline Homeless

  • Posts: 9
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #107 on: Fri, 30 January 2009, 04:20:56 »
Quote from: Warm Woolly Sheep;3921
Logitech Classic Keyboard 200
Model: Y-UR83
Interface: USB
N-key-rollover: 6
keys used: qasdew

Bought it for $20 at office max while I wait for my endurapro to arrive.


I don't mean to judge your credibility, but can anyone else verify this?  I am specifically looking for "qweasd" and if this keyboard can do it for $20 then I'm sold
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Offline pex

  • Posts: 145
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #108 on: Sat, 31 January 2009, 01:41:28 »
Quote from: Homeless;20226
I don't mean to judge your credibility, but can anyone else verify this?  I am specifically looking for "qweasd" and if this keyboard can do it for $20 then I'm sold


Verifying qweasd is not going to help you know if the keyboard has n-key rollover.

We know it's a USB keyboard so someone needs to USB-to-PS/2 convert to see if the keyboard has native PS/2 support, for the appropriate testing of rollover, but even without we should still be able to effect a proper test of rollover.  One key combination is not a proper test.

What if I told you my keyboard did "jkl,mn" (over PS/2), would you want verification of just this to know rollover?  Let me then tell you this POS won't do "qsdb" or "erjk", or, what makes me even more mad because I use the numpad for FPS, "423".

The reason I like PS/2 as a native interface for a keyboard is that if you've got n-key rollover, you can really just put your fist down in the middle of the keyboard and get 12 characters with no gimmicks attached (although it's best to try both fists...one on the main keyboard area and one on the numpad, since I've sometimes read about some cherry keyboards being 'alpha n-key rollover' whatever that means).
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Destroying Sanctity: my Model M project. Status: Dead.

Offline Homeless

  • Posts: 9
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #109 on: Sat, 31 January 2009, 03:35:05 »
I'm not as interested in full n key rollover as those 6 specific keys working together.  While it would be nice to have a keyboard with full n key rollover, it's only second priority to me
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Offline Viett

  • Posts: 224
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #110 on: Tue, 03 February 2009, 19:00:23 »
ABS M1 Heavy Duty Professional Gaming Mechanical Keyboard
Interface: USB
Operating System: XP / Linux
Minimum keys: 2 (WAS and CAPS+Shift+S fail)
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Offline bhtooefr

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N-key rollover test.
« Reply #111 on: Tue, 03 February 2009, 22:29:37 »
Why would you do caps+shift+s? :confused: Or, WAS, for that matter - that's forward, back, and left at the same time.

Anyway, what about QWA, QWD, QAS, QSD, EWA, EWD, ESA, and ESD? Those don't make it a 2-key rollover board, but if you can do those, it's probably fine for gaming.
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Offline Chloe

  • Posts: 679
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N-key rollover test.
« Reply #112 on: Tue, 03 February 2009, 22:40:32 »
I remap Caps Lock to Windows key, and I have an AutoHotkey script to turn wave volume up with Win+Shift+S.
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Offline pex

  • Posts: 145
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #113 on: Wed, 04 February 2009, 07:53:24 »
Quote from: Viett;20743
ABS M1 Heavy Duty Professional Gaming Mechanical Keyboard
Interface: USB
Operating System: XP / Linux
Minimum keys: 2 (WAS and CAPS+Shift+S fail)


You need to contact ABS for warranty service.  That sounds like a mfg issue from early models of the M1.
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Destroying Sanctity: my Model M project. Status: Dead.

Offline itlnstln

  • Posts: 7048
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #114 on: Wed, 04 February 2009, 07:57:17 »
Quote from: pex;20776
You need to contact ABS for warranty service.  That sounds like a mfg issue from early models of the M1.


Confirmed.  I can do this combination with both of my ABS 'boards.  Looking at the reviews on Newegg, it seems that a small number (2-3) of reviewers had an issue with this 'board.  It seems, though, Costar has resolves this and Newegg/ABS is making sure customers experiencing these issues are getting taken care of.
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Offline sargon

  • Posts: 8
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #115 on: Wed, 04 February 2009, 10:14:33 »
Hi guys.  I'm new here, but I took the liberty of changing the rollover test around.  I added support for keys such as shift, ctrl, alt, enter, etc, and I fixed the problem where it detects key autorepeats as new strokes.  My version is here:

http://random.xem.us/rollover.html

Let me know if there are any bugs in it and I'll be happy to fix them.
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Offline itlnstln

  • Posts: 7048
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #116 on: Wed, 04 February 2009, 10:26:32 »
Testing out a few combinations on my ABS, I noticed something odd.  While it does not fail on many tests, where is does fail, it fails on combinations that would require the use of the same hand during regular typing.  A combination that fails on the ABS is "WEXC."  While I could never think of a reason where I would ever hit this combination of keys at the same time (or evn type them in quick succession), it does fail.  I have no idea how keyboards are designed logic-wise, but it seems that they did "work" to ensure likely combinations would work but other, less likely combinations, might not.
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Offline pex

  • Posts: 145
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #117 on: Wed, 04 February 2009, 12:27:40 »
Quote from: itlnstln;20786
A combination that fails on the ABS is "WEXC."  [...]  I have no idea how keyboards are designed logic-wise, but it seems that they did "work" to ensure likely combinations would work but other, less likely combinations, might not.

ABS marketing says 6 key rollover.  That should absolutely not occur.

I just got 10 keys (not on an ABS M1) on the new rollover test but the fact of the matter is that my keyboard is 3-key rollover.
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Offline itlnstln

  • Posts: 7048
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #118 on: Wed, 04 February 2009, 12:44:14 »
You're right, but I don't realy care as I am not a gamer, and I don't really button mash.  Also, the combinations that it fails on are very odd combos, anyway, so I doubt any gamers would even come across as problem either.  I am interested to know if this occurs on Filco versions of the Costar 'boards as well.  I would think that it would; can anyone here with a Filco (USB-based, of course, not the N-key rollover version) check it out?
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Offline xsphat

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N-key rollover test.
« Reply #119 on: Wed, 04 February 2009, 13:08:51 »
Quote from: itlnstln;20796
You're right, but I don't realy care as I am not a gamer, and I don't really button mash.

Do you even notice it when you're using a full n-key rollover keyboard? This Topre 86 feels like the most accurate keyboard I've ever used, and part of that is because I get less things like "jsut," and "adn," but it also seems like it registers better when I write frantically. So you think that's n-key rollover or am I on crack?

PS: I have had other n-key rollover keyboard in the past (DataLux, HHKB Pro 2, Northgate, maybe three others I forgot) and didn't notice anything.
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Offline itlnstln

  • Posts: 7048
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #120 on: Wed, 04 February 2009, 13:42:18 »
I have had both, and I really don't notice the difference.  From the Model Ms to the Dells to the Northgate, I type equally bad on all of them. ;)  All jokes aside, unless it were something like the Das, I don't think it really makes a difference.  What I notice more than anything is key resistance.  The lighter the keys, the more accurately I type.  That, and when I am not thinking about typing, the better I type regardless of the keyboard.  I have to get out of my own head when I type.  When sh*t is crazy at work, and writing queries, e-mail, etc. at the speed of light, I can type without looking at the keys 150 WPM with no errors.  When I am just typing for whatever, like now, I can't type to save my life.  Again, it doesn't matter what 'board I use.  I am a little more accurate with split layout 'boards since I can't cross-type, thus, preventing more errors.
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Offline Viett

  • Posts: 224
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #121 on: Wed, 04 February 2009, 18:43:07 »
Quote
Confirmed. I can do this combination with both of my ABS 'boards. Looking at the reviews on Newegg, it seems that a small number (2-3) of reviewers had an issue with this 'board. It seems, though, Costar has resolves this and Newegg/ABS is making sure customers experiencing these issues are getting taken care of.


I'll definitely do this. I called ABS and they were very rude / unhelpful. Now that I know it's an issue with my unit, I can probably go through Newegg's exchange policy.
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Offline itlnstln

  • Posts: 7048
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #122 on: Thu, 05 February 2009, 07:56:49 »
That is a shame that ABS treated you like that.  I hope I don't have an issue with any of mine.
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Offline bhtooefr

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N-key rollover test.
« Reply #123 on: Tue, 10 February 2009, 15:01:54 »
Fujitsu FKB4725
Tested on both a Dell Dimension 2100 via PS/2 and a ThinkPad X61t via a Belkin F5U119vE1 USB adaptor

2-key rollover - fails on ASQ

Passes on SDFJKL
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Offline xsphat

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N-key rollover test.
« Reply #124 on: Tue, 10 February 2009, 16:29:54 »
On my new HHKB Pro 2 connected via USB to my MacBook, I get 7 keys all day, no matter what the combination.
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Offline lam47

  • Posts: 688
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #125 on: Sat, 21 February 2009, 14:13:24 »
HHKB 6
Marquardt 47! My guess is you can press all of them, my hands are only so big though.
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Offline wheel83

  • Posts: 189
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #126 on: Sun, 22 February 2009, 01:47:12 »
lol 47 that thing is a beast
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Offline zwmalone

  • Posts: 369
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #127 on: Mon, 02 March 2009, 14:48:56 »
Anybody know the rollover capabilities (or lack of) for the Omnikey Evolution?
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Offline itlnstln

  • Posts: 7048
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #128 on: Tue, 03 March 2009, 06:46:56 »
Quote from: zwmalone;23239
Anybody know the rollover capabilities (or lack of) for the Omnikey Evolution?


If I remember correctly, I think it's N-Key.  I think I tested it one time, and had no trouble whatsoever with rollover.  If I am not mistaken, all Northgate keyboards are N-Key.
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Offline MANISH7

  • Posts: 155
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #129 on: Tue, 03 March 2009, 14:59:06 »
Quote from: zillidot;2586
I think keyboard designs are similar enough to have a standardised test. I suggest the following:
1. Q-W-A-S
2. Q-W-E-A-S-D
3. Q-W-E-R-A-S-D-F
(and so on...)
When a failure is encountered (i.e. not all the keys register), try to reduce the number of keys to find the minimum at which the failure occurs.

Most non n-key capable keyboards would fail on 1. My guess is that keyboards limited by the USB protocol would pass 1 and 2 but fail on 3 (but I don't have one with me to test right now).

We can transpose these tests to different locations on the keyboard, eg a few keys to the right, or up or down a row. But I suspect that wouldn't make a difference, unless it's an unusual keyboard design. If we encounter those we can always add more tests to the list. :)

I am thoroughly confused but here's some tests anyway. The tests below are done on the Unicomp Customizer 101 (manufactured Sept. 2008). PS2 cable connected to my PC via PS2-USB adapter (purchased from clickykeyboards). Windows Vista.

qwas: sometimes 0, 1 or 2 keys register for a given trial.
qwa: sometimes 0, 1, or 2 keys register for a given trial.

asz: all 3 keys register every trial
sdx: all 3 keys register every trial

3edc space: all 5 keys register every trial
qwer: all 4 keys register every trial


Referring to the first two tests where I get different results per trial...Perhaps I'm a klutz who can't press all keys at same time consistently if the keys are not on the same row or column.

What I really wanted to say in this thread is that that I play COD4 all the time with my Unicomp Model M and the 139401 (1988). I score high and both keyboards serve me well. They never let me down. Every key or move executes beautifully. Furthermore, I'd imagine when Wolfenstein or Quake were paving the way for FPS in the early 90s..people were using Model Ms. I'm not sure if anyone complained back then? I'm certainly not complaining right now.
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Offline zwmalone

  • Posts: 369
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #130 on: Tue, 03 March 2009, 15:00:46 »
Quote from: itlnstln;23290
If I remember correctly, I think it's N-Key.  I think I tested it one time, and had no trouble whatsoever with rollover.  If I am not mistaken, all Northgate keyboards are N-Key.


Thanks itlnstln!
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Offline itlnstln

  • Posts: 7048
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #131 on: Tue, 03 March 2009, 15:19:26 »
The thing that will piss you off about the Evolution, though, is that it will spazz out on you from time to time due to a buggy programming chip.  It seemed to happen when I would press (or maybe hold Shift) quite a bit; it would happen most often when I was using the Shift key (normally the left Shift) while I would permanently delete mail items in Outlook.  It might put into a programming state or something (these were programmable keyboards).  The only fix, other than removing the programming chip, is to shut down (yes, shut down, not restart) your PC and hold the Esc key as it reboots.  You should be able to let it go after the beep during POST.  Other than that, it is a fantastic keyboard.
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Offline zwmalone

  • Posts: 369
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #132 on: Tue, 03 March 2009, 15:33:03 »
Quote from: itlnstln;23370
The thing that will piss you off about the Evolution, though, is that it will spazz out on you from time to time due to a buggy programming chip.  It seemed to happen when I would press (or maybe hold Shift) quite a bit; it would happen most often when I was using the Shift key (normally the left Shift) while I would permanently delete mail items in Outlook.  It might put into a programming state or something (these were programmable keyboards).  The only fix, other than removing the programming chip, is to shut down (yes, shut down, not restart) your PC and hold the Esc key as it reboots.  You should be able to let it go after the beep during POST.  Other than that, it is a fantastic keyboard.


Doesn't that happen with a lot of the northgates?  I may just end up removing the programming chip if it becomes an issue.
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Offline itlnstln

  • Posts: 7048
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #133 on: Tue, 03 March 2009, 16:37:55 »
Quote from: zwmalone;23371
Doesn't that happen with a lot of the northgates?  I may just end up removing the programming chip if it becomes an issue.


I don't know about the other Northgates.  The guy (Jim?) from Northgate keyboard repair said that it was a "known issue" with the Evolution, but he didn't say anything about other models.  It wouldn't suprise me either way.
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Offline zwmalone

  • Posts: 369
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #134 on: Tue, 03 March 2009, 17:35:50 »
I thought the 101P?  (I think its the 101 anyway) uses the same programming chip and also has the problem...
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Offline itlnstln

  • Posts: 7048
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #135 on: Wed, 04 March 2009, 06:59:56 »
It might.  Either way, it's a PITA, but it doesn't seem to happen very often, so it's not too bad.
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Offline zwmalone

  • Posts: 369
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #136 on: Fri, 06 March 2009, 15:01:34 »
The Omnikey Evolution is NOT NKRO for future reference (I'm loving the board, thanks Wheels!  It's practically NIB, I've even got the box :D)
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Offline itlnstln

  • Posts: 7048
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #137 on: Sun, 08 March 2009, 09:41:35 »
How many keys is it?  I can't remember if I gave it a good test or not.
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Offline zwmalone

  • Posts: 369
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #138 on: Sun, 08 March 2009, 15:30:14 »
minimum 2 keys just like my M was...
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Offline cmr

  • Posts: 295
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #139 on: Sun, 08 March 2009, 15:56:57 »
Key Tronic KB101 Plus
interface: AT to PS/2 adapter plugged into PS/2 port
minimum keys accepted: 41

on USB it does 6-key rollover without issue.

caveat: that's the most keys i could press at once. i'm sure it will do more if i can only figure out how to press them. i am only human, after all, and i only have two hands.
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Offline bhtooefr

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N-key rollover test.
« Reply #140 on: Sun, 08 March 2009, 16:10:28 »
Rub bum on keyboard, then you'll get more keys.
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Offline cmr

  • Posts: 295
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #141 on: Sun, 08 March 2009, 16:12:58 »
Quote from: iMav;2634
Maybe we should have a contest.  Who can post a screen capture from the rollover test page with the most keys recognized?  



:)

attached is full bum-on-keyboard mash of the KB101 Plus.
so... what do i win?

i saw the marquardt claimed to do 47 but i didn't see a screenshot

(also the keytronic is now for sale. full n-key rollover, in like-new condition except for some slight ... errr ... browning on the keycaps)
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Offline lam47

  • Posts: 688
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #142 on: Tue, 17 March 2009, 08:34:57 »
If there is a contest I will get it out the box and give it a shot!
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Offline wheel83

  • Posts: 189
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #143 on: Tue, 17 March 2009, 14:06:58 »
remember the warning:  "don't sit on keyboard !"
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Offline sargon

  • Posts: 8
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #144 on: Sat, 28 March 2009, 15:44:18 »
Filco FKBN104M/EB... I'm sure I could get more if I tried more.  Is using the other n-key test script cheating since it supports f-keys and stuff?
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Offline bhtooefr

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N-key rollover test.
« Reply #145 on: Sat, 28 March 2009, 23:21:31 »
Graymark F-21

2-key rollover

Passes on SDFJKL
Fails on QWAS
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Offline ozar

  • Posts: 352
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #146 on: Tue, 31 March 2009, 22:24:59 »
I got 48 keys to register with my Filco Tenkeyless.  I feel certain more keys would register but I couldn't press any more keys than that.  All key combinations seemed to work without any problems, and it didn't matter the number of keys pressed.
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Offline wheel83

  • Posts: 189
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #147 on: Wed, 01 April 2009, 03:11:10 »
I have an 1987 ibm space saver.  from extensive button pressing,  i've concluded i get 4 VERY consistently with most any combination. no adapter, straight ps2.   if i try more it's inconsistent.  i'll take 4 any day though.

ie asdf, jkl;
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Offline Ysaquerai

  • Posts: 14
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #148 on: Wed, 01 April 2009, 08:29:17 »
@wheels83
Can you try it with your 1987 ibm space saver
http://random.xem.us/rollover.html
WEXC or RTYU
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Offline wheel83

  • Posts: 189
N-key rollover test.
« Reply #149 on: Wed, 01 April 2009, 12:48:18 »
i only get 1-2 with that combo.  everything else works about the same as the original test though, which is like 4 for asdf
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