Author Topic: [IC] Domed Stickers  (Read 4506 times)

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Offline MKULTRA

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[IC] Domed Stickers
« on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 15:04:15 »
http://www.domelabels.com/ComputerLabels.aspx

How many of you guys would be interested in a domed sticker for something like this?




Offline Grim Fandango

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #1 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 15:07:10 »
The color on the Dolch sticker is awesome. I'd have to think of a use, but I am interested. Think about how cool it would look with a Dolch set.

Also, domed stickers are nice.
« Last Edit: Fri, 05 July 2013, 15:09:03 by Grim Fandango »
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Offline Photekq

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #2 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 15:08:52 »
Definitely be interested in a Dolch one.
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Offline MKULTRA

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #3 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 15:09:28 »
The color on the Dolch sticker is awesome. I'd have to think of a use, but I am interested. Think about how cool it would look with a Dolch set.
Yeah make it the same size as a keycap and stick it on top, would make a nice Esc, or just put it on your kb with Dolch caps.

Offline Dubsgalore

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #4 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 15:35:28 »
Didn't someone say in the other thread that black isn't the right color for that?

fix it and im in :3

Offline Photekq

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #5 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 15:42:43 »
Didn't someone say in the other thread that black isn't the right color for that?

fix it and im in :3
Nah it's the correct colour

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Offline MKULTRA

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #6 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 15:59:57 »
Think we'd have trademark issues?

Offline Latin00032

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #7 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 16:08:05 »
Mk. You read my mind. This is exactly what I wanted. A domed sticker.

You're my hero.

I hope we can pull something off and get a gb going.
« Last Edit: Fri, 05 July 2013, 16:18:35 by Latin00032 »

Offline Latin00032

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #8 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 16:09:20 »
The color on the Dolch sticker is awesome. I'd have to think of a use, but I am interested. Think about how cool it would look with a Dolch set.

Also, domed stickers are nice.

I also don't know exactly how our where I'd use it. But, I have some ideas.

Offline Latin00032

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #9 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 16:10:31 »
Didn't someone say in the other thread that black isn't the right color for that?

fix it and im in :3

Someone fixed it in the other thread even though it's still in the air on wether or not black is the right color.
« Last Edit: Fri, 05 July 2013, 16:21:23 by Latin00032 »

Offline kmacwannabe

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #10 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 16:21:08 »
Think we'd have trademark issues?

If you sell them, it is theoretically possible, yes. The company that currently owns the Dolch trademarks is Azonix after they were sold by Kontron IIRC. Do a risk-benefit analysis. Think about whether or not Azonix has people trolling the net for trademark infractions. I, for one, would not do it as it is illegal if you profit off of the registered trademark of another company without appropriate licensing. If you somehow do it for free though, I would love one ;) and then it is just considered non-contracted advertising. You might be able to make a parody argument in court, though I doubt that is possible unless you change a minute detail. Otherwise, you are making an exact unlicensed copy in violation of trade dress and trademark law, and you can be litigated for that.

Offline Hak Foo

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #11 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 18:04:47 »
One of the issues with trademarks though is that-- with the exception of a few brands so globally prominent as to be basically protected in every possible arena-- trademarks are good for only a specific market.  They can sell Dolch computers, but that doesn't prevent someone from selling Dolch blenders, as long as there's no attempt of consumer confusion.  There's definitely an interesting argument there.  "You mean this Quickfire Rapid covered in novelty caps is not a packet-analysis device?"

Also, it reminds me of how-- back in the day-- you could get all sorts of custom front-panel stickers for your PC to fit in that 1x1 inch logo opening old generic cases had.  Many of the most popular designs were questionable from a trademark mindset-- Star Wars logos, processor, mobo, and video card maker logos, etc.  Somehow people survived that era intact.  Maybe it works with the above restriction-- the stickers themselves are presented in a way that doesn't cause customer confusion-- "replacement for touch-up/restoration of original PAC-xxx devices"  -- and  if someone slaps it on a PC and tries to sell it as a Dolch packet analyzer, that's their problem.
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Offline Dubsgalore

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #12 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 18:41:06 »
Didn't someone say in the other thread that black isn't the right color for that?

fix it and im in :3
Nah it's the correct colour

Show Image


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Offline MKULTRA

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #13 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 19:11:02 »
Didn't someone say in the other thread that black isn't the right color for that?

fix it and im in :3
Nah it's the correct colour

Show Image


You right you right

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I'll get a quote from these guys tomorrowish.

Offline kmacwannabe

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #14 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 20:28:38 »
One of the issues with trademarks though is that-- with the exception of a few brands so globally prominent as to be basically protected in every possible arena-- trademarks are good for only a specific market.  They can sell Dolch computers, but that doesn't prevent someone from selling Dolch blenders, as long as there's no attempt of consumer confusion.  There's definitely an interesting argument there.  "You mean this Quickfire Rapid covered in novelty caps is not a packet-analysis device?"

Also, it reminds me of how-- back in the day-- you could get all sorts of custom front-panel stickers for your PC to fit in that 1x1 inch logo opening old generic cases had.  Many of the most popular designs were questionable from a trademark mindset-- Star Wars logos, processor, mobo, and video card maker logos, etc.  Somehow people survived that era intact.  Maybe it works with the above restriction-- the stickers themselves are presented in a way that doesn't cause customer confusion-- "replacement for touch-up/restoration of original PAC-xxx devices"  -- and  if someone slaps it on a PC and tries to sell it as a Dolch packet analyzer, that's their problem.

But what you are referring to refers only to name confusion. If there was a company called Dolch that also made non-mobile computers, they could have been sued for name confusion trademark infringement. If, however, there was a company called Dolch that made iced tea, they could not be sued because there is no possibility of confusion.

I know they survived that era intact. I mentioned the fact that the chance is very unlikely that you will get caught. If a tree falls in the forest and no one is there to hear it, regardless of whether or not it made a sound it has still fallen. The point is if you do get caught, you CAN and WILL be litigated. The problem is not name confusion. The problem is that you are profiting off of someone's logo. If it just said "Dolch." on a white background, there would be no issue. The fact that it is a direct and extremely accurate representational mimic of Dolch's logo in every respect except possibly size is an issue because regardless of whether you put it on a toaster or a packet analyzer, you are still profiting off of a logo that is protected by trademark and is not licensed by Dolch themselves or Azonix. If you made it say "Polch." or did a color swap, you would be on the edge of legality and could probably make a parody argument. In this case though, you are blatantly crossing the line by selling an unlicensed copy of a trademarked logo. If I were to sell a sticker with a Microsoft logo on it without asking them or obtaining a license, they would sue me.

As a final thought, I think I need to re-emphasize my stance. I would not do it, because it is illegal. However, I can almost say for sure that you will not be caught. If you do get caught though, (because this IS illegal) you will be punished. You can liken it to pirating music and decide whether or not the risk is too much for you and whether or not you want to do illegal things if you don't think you would get caught. Would you kill, lie to congress, or steal if you could be assured that you would not be caught? I wouldn't. This is the decision you have to make. I'm not going to stop you, though I hope you can see the point I am making. What I will suggest is that you change it in some way, i.e. a color swap, letter change or simply give them away. If you give them away, there is no problem. Then it's just free advertising for Azonix.

The problem is not the name. It is the entire logo which is protected by trademark/trade dress.
« Last Edit: Fri, 05 July 2013, 20:30:24 by kmacwannabe »

Offline n0rvig

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #15 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 22:43:24 »
Think we'd have trademark issues?

Nobody seems to be actively using the trademark.

Both companies listed on computing history don't have products with that brand.
http://www.computinghistory.org.uk/sec/1175/dolch-computer-systems/

Offline MKULTRA

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #16 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 23:02:03 »
Think we'd have trademark issues?

Nobody seems to be actively using the trademark.

Both companies listed on computing history don't have products with that brand.
http://www.computinghistory.org.uk/sec/1175/dolch-computer-systems/
How long do the trademarks last

Offline Photoelectric

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #17 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 23:05:27 »
Wouldn't it be better to contact whoever the trademark is registered to / who owns it now and just ask if they wouldn't mind its use for this small hobbyist project?  Perhaps they would want some cut from the sales.
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Offline Hak Foo

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #18 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 23:18:16 »
Think we'd have trademark issues?

Nobody seems to be actively using the trademark.

Both companies listed on computing history don't have products with that brand.
http://www.computinghistory.org.uk/sec/1175/dolch-computer-systems/
How long do the trademarks last

Trademarks don't have a set expiration date; they can be formally abandoned, or they can be lost by non-usage.

The US Patent and Trademark office has a registered-trademark search facility.  It's a ***** to use because you can't just link to results; you have to do the search yourself to see them.

It shows six registrations for 'Dolch': Two are brand new and pertain to a restaurant called 'Dolch'eh'.   One is for computer software.    One is for educational materials.  The other two are dead.  Of the dead ones, one was cancelled in 1989, and pertained to electronic testing equipment.  I suspect that's the one we're interested in.

The results for a "word and logo" trademark search were similar; the result list expands to ten.

I am not a lawyer, just someone with an obsessive interest in intellectual property concepts.  But you might want to bounce the concept off someone who's more familiar with the relevant regulations than I am.

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Offline MKULTRA

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #19 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 23:23:44 »
I'll contact the company that presumably holds the trademark.

Offline bazemk1979

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #20 on: Sat, 06 July 2013, 02:14:09 »
interested
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Offline megaxpop

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #21 on: Sat, 06 July 2013, 06:04:46 »
My english's very bad so i'm waiting more info clearly! :D

Offline kmacwannabe

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #22 on: Sat, 06 July 2013, 07:20:27 »
Think we'd have trademark issues?

Nobody seems to be actively using the trademark.

Both companies listed on computing history don't have products with that brand.
http://www.computinghistory.org.uk/sec/1175/dolch-computer-systems/
How long do the trademarks last

Trademarks don't have a set expiration date; they can be formally abandoned, or they can be lost by non-usage.

The US Patent and Trademark office has a registered-trademark search facility.  It's a ***** to use because you can't just link to results; you have to do the search yourself to see them.

It shows six registrations for 'Dolch': Two are brand new and pertain to a restaurant called 'Dolch'eh'.   One is for computer software.    One is for educational materials.  The other two are dead.  Of the dead ones, one was cancelled in 1989, and pertained to electronic testing equipment.  I suspect that's the one we're interested in.

The results for a "word and logo" trademark search were similar; the result list expands to ten.

I am not a lawyer, just someone with an obsessive interest in intellectual property concepts.  But you might want to bounce the concept off someone who's more familiar with the relevant regulations than I am.

Does Google Patents do trademarks? If not, I know full well that it is hopeless. Dolch made rugged portable computers

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Dolch Computer Systems is the worldwide leader of the rugged portable computer market. Ranked number one in 1999 and 2002 by Venture Development Corporation, Dolch has delivered rugged, high quality, top performing portable platforms to engineers around the world for over 27 years. In addition to portable computer platforms, Dolch offers display products designed with rugged touch screen technology, protected against shock and vibration and sealed to survive the harshest environments or situations.
 

In 2005, Kontron AG acquired Dolch and then sold its rugged mobile platform to Azonix in 2007. "

computinghistory.org.uk

Azonix could still hold the trademark, whether or not they are still selling the products. Trademarks last forever if they are not cancelled by the applicant. I strongly suggest you contact Azonix. I could even mail them something, seeing as I live about two or three towns away from their headquarters. The thing is is that if they catch you, the consequences COULD be bad.

I'm beginning to also lose faith that this is an active trademark, although knowing the way the PTO search works, you can never be sure.

Offline Latin00032

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #23 on: Sat, 06 July 2013, 09:27:01 »
Calling them could be a good idea.

It could also start a fire where there wasn't one.

Offline kmacwannabe

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #24 on: Sat, 06 July 2013, 18:57:05 »
Or you could start a thermonuclear litigation war if you weren't actually allowed to and decided not to ask for fear of starting a fire where there wasn't one if you catch my drift.

Offline Photoelectric

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #25 on: Sat, 06 July 2013, 19:01:52 »
Calling them could be a good idea.

It could also start a fire where there wasn't one.

Will these stickers be worth legal trouble and monetary consequences?  I doubt it.  Better to be safe, in my opinion and be as informed and prepared as possible.
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Offline n0rvig

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #26 on: Sat, 06 July 2013, 21:44:30 »
"It's easier to ask forgiveness than it is to get permission." - Grace Hopper

Offline Photoelectric

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #27 on: Sat, 06 July 2013, 21:49:34 »
Is forgiveness applicable in the world of money and lawyers? :)
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Offline Latin00032

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Re: [IC] Domed Stickers
« Reply #28 on: Sun, 07 July 2013, 00:01:41 »
I'd still love a way to make this happen.