Author Topic: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING - 99% DISPATCHED! :O )  (Read 248721 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline pexon

  • * Maker
  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 1121
  • Location: Shropshire, England
  • El Jefe of Sleeving
    • Pexon PCs
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1050 on: Sun, 03 August 2014, 16:01:13 »
Cables are being made, we've got most of them done this weekend and tested. Cable orders will be shipped together with your cases  ;)

Offline GeorgeK

  • Posts: 758
  • Location: Ashford, Kent, United Kingdom
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1051 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 06:04:21 »
Mine just arrived (well 20 minutes ago) so I thought I'd snap some piccys and do a few comparisons / mini write-up.  Overall I think it's a very nice case - there are no obvious manufacturing marks on the case itself and it feels nice and solid.  It has a slightly rough texture to it which is nice.  It is very low profile - even more so than my Pure CNC case, but I happen to like that - I think it gives boards a nice sleek look.  Anyway - on to the piccys

Texture on the side of the case


Pexon case (top), original plastic case (middle), pure cnc case (bottom)


Side comparison - this really illustrates well the low-profile nature of the case


Back of the case - it's a shame that it doesn't come with rubber feet as I can see it slipping a bit on my desk.  I will have to get something from somewhere I think


Dip switches line up perfectly (as did all 5 screw holes)


Poker in situ




The top of the plate is just above the top of the case here - this is probably as I didn't screw the board down that hard (the heads of my screws are starting to strip and I didn't want to chance them getting stuck


Finally I weighed the cases just to see the difference in the three (all without pcb etc)

Pure CNC - 397g
Pexon Case - 368g
Original Poker Case - 134g.

So you're adding over 200g of weight which adds a lot to the feel of a board, especially a PCB mounted one.

Overall, as I said before, I think this is a lovely little case - proper bargain for the price too!
Black Filco TKL - Stickered, Lubed Reds || Poker w/Plate, Alu Case -  Stickered, Lubed 65g Ergo-Clears || Cherry G80-3700 w/SS Plate - Lubed 65g Ergo-Clears

Offline pexon

  • * Maker
  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 1121
  • Location: Shropshire, England
  • El Jefe of Sleeving
    • Pexon PCs
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1052 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 06:07:03 »
AWESOME

Thanks for the photos dude, glad you are happy with it!  8)

Offline Fire Brand

  • Keeper of Rainbows
  • * Esteemed Elder
  • Posts: 2439
  • Location: West Yorkshire, United Kingdom
  • BISCUITS!
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1053 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 06:51:55 »
Indeed great review, really excited to get mine now looks amazing with it being that low I really like it.
My Youtube Channel ~
More
Keyboards owned
More
Poker II - MX Black, Poker II ISO - MX Blue :c QFR ISO - MX Black, HHKB Pro 2 Black, VA68M - Gat Blacks w/68g Gold springs
My classified thread :3
More

Offline Yslen

  • Posts: 237
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1054 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 06:55:03 »
Looks really nice. Just my luck being away all week and moving house soon... Might be weeks before I see mine!

Offline LechnerDE

  • * Esteemed Elder
  • Posts: 2631
  • Location: Germany
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1055 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 07:13:27 »
Some of the early orders (international) went out TODAY  8)

Did you get my PM?

If not it's probably fine anyway :)

Can you please check whether you got my PM from 01 August 2014, 08:31:37 or not?

Still waiting for an answer :)

Offline pexon

  • * Maker
  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 1121
  • Location: Shropshire, England
  • El Jefe of Sleeving
    • Pexon PCs
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1056 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 08:08:10 »
Can you send it again please brother  :thumb:

Offline swill

  • * Elevated Elder
  • Posts: 3365
  • Location: Canada eh
  • builder & enabler
    • swillkb.com
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1057 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 09:07:46 »
This case is going to look awesome with my blue IMSTO aluminium plate...  So purty to see the plate like that...

Offline LechnerDE

  • * Esteemed Elder
  • Posts: 2631
  • Location: Germany
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1058 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 09:34:46 »
Can you send it again please brother  :thumb:

Just sent it again.

But I guess it's too late now anyway :)

No problem though (I hope)

Offline pix3l_fodder

  • Posts: 264
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1059 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 11:11:37 »
for the pads on the underside, you can buy a SETA stick pads and cut it up which will really prevent it from moving anywhere so long as the surface is smooth enough.

http://setastand.com/products/nanosuction-pads


Offline Arcoril

  • Posts: 155
  • Location: Southern California
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1060 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 11:40:19 »
The case looks great! Can't wait for it to arrive. :)

Offline Fire Brand

  • Keeper of Rainbows
  • * Esteemed Elder
  • Posts: 2439
  • Location: West Yorkshire, United Kingdom
  • BISCUITS!
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1061 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 12:29:00 »
Just got mine about 20mins ago that's some fast post, will post a few pictures tomorrow, looks really nice though a LOT, LOT better quality than you made it seem I have to say.

Also thanks for the Sweets, I ate them almost right away ~ Nomnomnom :3
My Youtube Channel ~
More
Keyboards owned
More
Poker II - MX Black, Poker II ISO - MX Blue :c QFR ISO - MX Black, HHKB Pro 2 Black, VA68M - Gat Blacks w/68g Gold springs
My classified thread :3
More

Offline demsix

  • Posts: 35
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1062 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 12:51:46 »
Are there any spares going Pexon?

Offline Yslen

  • Posts: 237
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1063 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 12:55:12 »
Yes, I think Pexon did well to undersell these, as we didn't really know they'd turn out. Now that we know, is there going to be a round 2? Could probably offer colours if not directly then through a third party? Not to make more work for you or anything :P

Offline MrexD

  • Posts: 76
  • Location: Hertfordshire
  • aka mrwoodyxd
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1064 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 13:07:41 »
Wow. really wish i'd picked one up now. if i'd known they were that low on profile.

Gratz on the sale though Pexon. hope it didn't burn too much of a hole in your pocket
Pok3r MX CLears

Offline FreeCopy

  • * Destiny Supporter
  • Posts: 667
  • Location: AZ, US
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1065 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 14:38:15 »
Great pics, GeorgeK. Now I just wish I had more than stock poker II plate and switches to throw in it.
Keyboards
More
Poker II | Leopold fc500r | Bolt Modded M 1391401 x2 08NOV90 - 19NOV90 | FK-2001 White Alps Clones | Filco MJ2 104Bolt Modded SSK 1391472 27JUL87 | Winkeyless B.87 TKL | MiniVan GateReds 62g

Offline pexon

  • * Maker
  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 1121
  • Location: Shropshire, England
  • El Jefe of Sleeving
    • Pexon PCs
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1066 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 15:52:14 »
Just got mine about 20mins ago that's some fast post, will post a few pictures tomorrow, looks really nice though a LOT, LOT better quality than you made it seem I have to say.

Also thanks for the Sweets, I ate them almost right away ~ Nomnomnom :3

Fantastic, glad it turned up safe and sound. Be sure to post some pics up, me and Davina will love to see them!

Are there any spares going Pexon?

Yes sir, we ordered a few more. These will go up on our site only when all case orders have been completed and sent  :thumb:

Yes, I think Pexon did well to undersell these, as we didn't really know they'd turn out. Now that we know, is there going to be a round 2? Could probably offer colours if not directly then through a third party? Not to make more work for you or anything :p

Round 2 is definitely something we will look at doing. Now we are in with Vortex, we could ask them for different colours etc. I don't mind extra work, I'm a glutton for punishment  >:D :))

Wow. really wish i'd picked one up now. if i'd known they were that low on profile.

Gratz on the sale though Pexon. hope it didn't burn too much of a hole in your pocket

Thanks brother, the cases are great,

Offline demsix

  • Posts: 35
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1067 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 15:54:38 »
Quote
Yes sir, we ordered a few more. These will go up on our site only when all case orders have been completed and sent  :thumb:

f5f5f5f5f5f5f5f5f5f5

Offline pexon

  • * Maker
  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 1121
  • Location: Shropshire, England
  • El Jefe of Sleeving
    • Pexon PCs
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1068 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 16:17:15 »
Hahah, I will make an announcement when all the orders are dispatched and we get them live  :thumb:

Offline Aidenknives

  • Posts: 208
  • Location: U.S.
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1069 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 16:25:48 »
Hahah, I will make an announcement when all the orders are dispatched and we get them live  :thumb:
I hope you are close to shipping them all out!  ;D

Offline numiru

  • Posts: 137
  • Location: California, USA
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1070 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 16:27:40 »
Hahah, I will make an announcement when all the orders are dispatched and we get them live  :thumb:
I hope you are close to shipping them all out!  ;D
Don't rush him, he's shipping them out extremely quickly and overall running this GB very well.
KUL ES-87

Offline Aidenknives

  • Posts: 208
  • Location: U.S.
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1071 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 16:29:38 »
Hahah, I will make an announcement when all the orders are dispatched and we get them live  :thumb:
I hope you are close to shipping them all out!  ;D
Don't rush him, he's shipping them out extremely quickly and overall running this GB very well.
How is saying "I hope" rushing him? Also when did I say or insinuate that he isn't running this GB well? Better check your accusations son.

Offline numiru

  • Posts: 137
  • Location: California, USA
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1072 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 16:30:31 »
Hahah, I will make an announcement when all the orders are dispatched and we get them live  :thumb:
I hope you are close to shipping them all out!  ;D
Don't rush him, he's shipping them out extremely quickly and overall running this GB very well.
How is saying "I hope" rushing him? Also when did I say or insinuate that he isn't running this GB well? Better check your accusations son.
I guess I misunderstood. Sorry!
KUL ES-87

Offline Aidenknives

  • Posts: 208
  • Location: U.S.
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1073 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 16:32:40 »
Hahah, I will make an announcement when all the orders are dispatched and we get them live  :thumb:
I hope you are close to shipping them all out!  ;D
Don't rush him, he's shipping them out extremely quickly and overall running this GB very well.
How is saying "I hope" rushing him? Also when did I say or insinuate that he isn't running this GB well? Better check your accusations son.
I guess I misunderstood. Sorry!
Np. It's just a bonus when he finishes getting all the cases out cause not only do we get our cases, but people who missed out will then have the chance to order from his website. As Michael Scott would say, it's a win-win-win.

Offline pexon

  • * Maker
  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 1121
  • Location: Shropshire, England
  • El Jefe of Sleeving
    • Pexon PCs
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1074 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 16:44:00 »
Guys, I know you all want your cases, we are doing our best to get the cases out as fast as we can, you must bare in mind that people filled in the form a fair time ago and those at the top of list take priority.

Offline mashby

  • ** Moderator Emeritus
  • Posts: 2828
  • Location: Nashville, TN
  • What Up Shoney? (ツ)_/¯
    • Mashby
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1075 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 17:56:54 »
Thanks to everyone posting the pictures of the case. Now that I see it's a little bit different from the Pure CNC aluminum case, it makes me wish I had ordered one.  :confused:

Offline xlt0rqu3lx

  • Posts: 4
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1076 on: Mon, 04 August 2014, 20:25:44 »
So if I paid in March for cable + case to the US I should get it pretty quick like pexon?? I'm pretty excited.

Offline pix3l_fodder

  • Posts: 264
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1077 on: Tue, 05 August 2014, 10:37:04 »
My order was placed back in October i think, when the orders just opened; I live in the UK and I do not have mine yet, so i think you'll have to wait a little.
« Last Edit: Tue, 05 August 2014, 12:54:08 by pix3l_fodder »

Offline v4mp1

  • Posts: 34
  • Location: Bavaria, Germany
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1078 on: Tue, 05 August 2014, 11:58:12 »
Received my case today, very nice quality!

BUt the sad thing is I ordered and paid for two cases on march 29th and I only received one case ;(

Pexon?  :-[

Offline pexon

  • * Maker
  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 1121
  • Location: Shropshire, England
  • El Jefe of Sleeving
    • Pexon PCs
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1079 on: Tue, 05 August 2014, 12:58:38 »
Received my case today, very nice quality!

BUt the sad thing is I ordered and paid for two cases on march 29th and I only received one case ;(

Pexon?  :-[

Fo'real? Send me a PM with your paypal address and delivery address

Offline v4mp1

  • Posts: 34
  • Location: Bavaria, Germany
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1080 on: Tue, 05 August 2014, 13:45:26 »
Done  :thumb:

Offline WhiteRice

  • Posts: 850
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1081 on: Tue, 05 August 2014, 14:54:08 »
Is JDcarpe still doing US shipping?

Offline numiru

  • Posts: 137
  • Location: California, USA
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1082 on: Tue, 05 August 2014, 15:06:18 »
Is JDcarpe still doing US shipping?
I think Pexon is direct shipping the US orders.
KUL ES-87

Offline jdcarpe

  • * Curator
  • Posts: 8852
  • Location: Odessa, TX
  • Live long, and prosper.
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1083 on: Tue, 05 August 2014, 15:07:03 »
Is JDcarpe still doing US shipping?
I think Pexon is direct shipping the US orders.

I think so too.
KMAC :: LZ-GH :: WASD CODE :: WASD v2 :: GH60 :: Alps64 :: JD45 :: IBM Model M :: IBM 4704 "Pingmaster"

http://jd40.info :: http://jd45.info


in memoriam

"When I was a kid, I used to take things apart and never put them back together."

Offline pexon

  • * Maker
  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 1121
  • Location: Shropshire, England
  • El Jefe of Sleeving
    • Pexon PCs
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1084 on: Tue, 05 August 2014, 15:10:20 »
Is JDcarpe still doing US shipping?
I think Pexon is direct shipping the US orders.

I think so too.

Yup, for this GB we're doing this ourselves. We've waited a good while to get the cases in and its only fair we ship them out as soon as possible

Offline munch

  • Posts: 507
  • Location: Канада
  • !
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1085 on: Tue, 05 August 2014, 17:54:06 »
Hi! I sent you an e-mail this weekend, just wondering if you ever got it :)

Love the look of the case mounted, GeorgeK. makes me wish I had a nice coloured plate like that... :p

Offline madhias

  • Posts: 1192
  • Location: Wien, Austria
  • BS TORPE
    • Madhias' Flickr
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1086 on: Wed, 06 August 2014, 05:27:18 »
Mine just arrived (well 20 minutes ago) so I thought I'd snap some piccys and do a few comparisons / mini write-up.  Overall I think it's a very nice case - there are no obvious manufacturing marks on the case itself and it feels nice and solid.  It has a slightly rough texture to it which is nice.  It is very low profile - even more so than my Pure CNC case, but I happen to like that - I think it gives boards a nice sleek look.  Anyway - on to the piccys

[...]


Great pictures, thanks for your work! Mine will shipped this week. I don't have a PCB or plate yet, but a lot of future projects...
... ...

Offline pexon

  • * Maker
  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 1121
  • Location: Shropshire, England
  • El Jefe of Sleeving
    • Pexon PCs
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1087 on: Wed, 06 August 2014, 06:06:33 »
Hi! I sent you an e-mail this weekend, just wondering if you ever got it :)

Love the look of the case mounted, GeorgeK. makes me wish I had a nice coloured plate like that... :p

Can you resend it?  :thumb:

Offline v4mp1

  • Posts: 34
  • Location: Bavaria, Germany
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1088 on: Wed, 06 August 2014, 08:54:14 »
Pexon you got my pm?  :blank:

Offline pexon

  • * Maker
  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 1121
  • Location: Shropshire, England
  • El Jefe of Sleeving
    • Pexon PCs
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1089 on: Wed, 06 August 2014, 09:19:44 »
Yea, did you send the email to Davina?

Offline caligo

  • Posts: 26
  • Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1090 on: Wed, 06 August 2014, 11:19:15 »
Just got mine. Feels nice, great texture and with a satisfying heft to it. My keyboard feels sturdy like a tank now. :D

Offline pix3l_fodder

  • Posts: 264
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1091 on: Wed, 06 August 2014, 11:20:50 »
You sent out the UK ones Pexon?

Offline Aidenknives

  • Posts: 208
  • Location: U.S.
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1092 on: Wed, 06 August 2014, 11:51:34 »
Just got mine. Feels nice, great texture and with a satisfying heft to it. My keyboard feels sturdy like a tank now. :D
Interesting that you got it in Sweden before people in the UK. I'm guessing you were one of the first orders.

Offline pexon

  • * Maker
  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 1121
  • Location: Shropshire, England
  • El Jefe of Sleeving
    • Pexon PCs
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1093 on: Wed, 06 August 2014, 12:39:39 »
Just got mine. Feels nice, great texture and with a satisfying heft to it. My keyboard feels sturdy like a tank now. :D


Got there super fast!  :thumb: Glad you are happy with it. I love the texture of the cases too, its different, different but nice

You sent out the UK ones Pexon?


The majority of them yes. We sent about 10 more with Royal Mail tonight with the rest (about another 10 or so) to follow tomorrow, this includes ones with cables ordered.

Just got mine. Feels nice, great texture and with a satisfying heft to it. My keyboard feels sturdy like a tank now. :D
Interesting that you got it in Sweden before people in the UK. I'm guessing you were one of the first orders.

No need to keep posting now aidenknives, yours has been posted too. I know you really want yours, you're posting in this thread all the time!  :o :p :))

Offline LechnerDE

  • * Esteemed Elder
  • Posts: 2631
  • Location: Germany
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING - 80% DISPATCHED )
« Reply #1094 on: Wed, 06 August 2014, 12:57:30 »
My neighbour received mine today.

Unfortunately it will be 2 more months until I am back home and can place my Poker in its new home :(

Offline Aidenknives

  • Posts: 208
  • Location: U.S.
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1095 on: Wed, 06 August 2014, 13:10:10 »
Just got mine. Feels nice, great texture and with a satisfying heft to it. My keyboard feels sturdy like a tank now. :D
Interesting that you got it in Sweden before people in the UK. I'm guessing you were one of the first orders.

No need to keep posting now aidenknives, yours has been posted too. I know you really want yours, you're posting in this thread all the time!  :o :p :))
[/quote]
Wait you mean mine have been shipped?! And SORRY IM JUST TOO EXCITED!  :p

Offline pexon

  • * Maker
  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 1121
  • Location: Shropshire, England
  • El Jefe of Sleeving
    • Pexon PCs
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING - 80% DISPATCHED )
« Reply #1096 on: Wed, 06 August 2014, 13:10:43 »
 :( It will be worth it dude man

Offline pexon

  • * Maker
  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 1121
  • Location: Shropshire, England
  • El Jefe of Sleeving
    • Pexon PCs
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1097 on: Wed, 06 August 2014, 13:11:50 »
Just got mine. Feels nice, great texture and with a satisfying heft to it. My keyboard feels sturdy like a tank now. :D
Interesting that you got it in Sweden before people in the UK. I'm guessing you were one of the first orders.

No need to keep posting now aidenknives, yours has been posted too. I know you really want yours, you're posting in this thread all the time!  :o :p :))
Wait you mean mine have been shipped?! And SORRY IM JUST TOO EXCITED!  :p


YES! Your cases are on their way as we speak, first to Frankfurt @ DHL European HQ/ distro centre, then on a plane to da US

Offline v4mp1

  • Posts: 34
  • Location: Bavaria, Germany
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING)
« Reply #1098 on: Wed, 06 August 2014, 13:18:37 »
Yea, did you send the email to Davina?

Which e-mail?

Offline pexon

  • * Maker
  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 1121
  • Location: Shropshire, England
  • El Jefe of Sleeving
    • Pexon PCs
Re: [GB] $60 60% case (Aluminium) (SHIPPING - 80% DISPATCHED )
« Reply #1099 on: Wed, 06 August 2014, 13:21:00 »
I thought I asked you to email Davina? I will PM you the address, just let her know that you are one short and we will get another out for you tomorrow (as well as a FOC cable as a sorry)