Author Topic: Healthcare.  (Read 12577 times)

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Offline skcheng

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Healthcare.
« Reply #50 on: Sun, 02 May 2010, 08:13:27 »
Quote from: webwit;178032
It seems one problem is that people are fanboys of their man, turned of their brain, and make up excuses. Like it is an edition of Idols or whatever. Obama however is an evil man heading an evil group of people doing incredible evil things like waging wars, just like Bush. That Obama guy who would pull out of Afghanistan, he made the Dutch goverment fall for pulling out of Afghanistan. You know, that place where they kill civilians on a daily basis and what Americans are ignoring because they cannot handle the truth. That evil, murdering ***** will lie straight in your face.



I fully realize that much of the world currently views the US and our current administration in exactly the same light that you do.   I respect your viewpoints (even if I don't agree) and I appreciate you voicing your opinion But I also hope that the future brings positive change to sway your views.  Please remember that like any other country, there is the military and then there is the non-military.   One often has nothing to do with the other.  

Back to healthcare though......are you happy with the healthcare in the Netherlands??   I spent 4 days with a dear friend (who happens to be a dentist in the Netherlands) at a dental convention in Vegas and he not only loves dentistry, he also happens to be at the top of his profession.   So I have total admiration for him as a dentist and as a human being.   He has a 3 month backlog of patients and his fees are fixed since they are standardized.   But he makes a very comfortable living, races motorcycles in his free time and has an incredibly positive outlook in life, love and work.  

He tells me that the average person in the Netherlands uses 1/3 to 1/4 of the resources compared to the average American.   And that all eyes are on the US since we tend to stick our noses into everyone elses business.  We talked and shared a lot going back to as far as Bill Clinton and "Monicagate" LOL.   Interesting how someone from the Netherlands could know SO much about the US and US politics whereas I couldn't deliver ANY information about the Netherlands or Dutch politics???   Kinda sad actually......

My friend appears to be very happy with healthcare in the Netherlands.  Are you as satisfied?    I'd love your views if you'd care to share.  

thx,

skc

Offline hyperlinked

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Healthcare.
« Reply #51 on: Sun, 02 May 2010, 09:15:12 »
Quote from: clickclack;178034
I don't have medical insurance and can't get medical insurance. I am too big a risk for them apparently.... Oooo scary little ole me. I have worked for many companies and have had many employers but they have never offered insurance (I independant contract much of the time anyway). One of the jobs I currently have is at a local college but they will do everything in their power to not allow me enough hours to be eligible for benefits.


For some reason I seem to remember that you're in California. Are you? If so, have you heard about the Major Risk Medical Insurance Pool (MRMIP)? With changes to laws about recission I don't know how relevant the MRMIP program will still be to you though, but it's a program I got into a few years ago. The waiting list is really long and it took me around a year to get in.

I also could not get insurance either. I got rejected everywhere I went and my health problems are relatively minor ones that everyone in my family has and my family has a sparkling medical history. Three of my grandparents came close to their 100th birthday. Everyone has high blood pressure that is easily controlled through drugs and I had moderately bad asthma as a kid that I've since almost completely outgrown, but the second any insurer sees that on your chart, you're ****ed.

I was finally able to get in after being declared a "high risk" and after clearing the massive waiting list. It's good coverage, but it's no bargain by any means. The coverage you get through employers tends to be dampened by averaging the cost across the whole employer pool.

It's a painful check to write each month, but I can pay it and I'm happy to pay it and until recently I've had to live in fear that I could make a mistake and end up uninsured again despite having the means to buy in.
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Offline skcheng

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Healthcare.
« Reply #52 on: Sun, 02 May 2010, 09:45:40 »
Quote from: webwit;178105
You say nothing. Can you point out where I am wrong and say why it is right to wage these savage wars were many innocent civilians get killed, and why it is right to torture, which is the opposite viewpoint? It can't be because the military is not the non-military. Obama won't fight that fight. Look at his vice president, that RIAA puppet. Like him, this team represents a power structure of corporate and military interests.

Health care in the Netherlands suffers from many serious problems. If your friend didn't tell you about it, he's painting a pretty picture.



Okay, let me rephrase and speak for myself.   I'm a health care provider and for the most part a moderate.  And I am not pro war, torture etc.  I listen to liberals who claim that war solves nothing and conservatives who claim that war solves everything.   The truth is usually somewhere in the middle.  I will say that there has been war since the beginning of man and there probably always will be.  

I've read your views on war, torture, and the US and there is little I can say to change your opinion.  I will say that I hope our involvment in the Iraq war ends soon and that our troops can come home safely.  They sacrifice their lives for us and only time will tell whether the Iraq war was justified.  Or maybe it won't......

So.....can you please elaborate on the issues with healthcare in the Netherlands??   I LOVE living in the US.   There isn't anyplace that I'd rather live.   I was born here (my parents weren't) and I know little else other than my short travels abroad.   Health care works just fine for me, but I'm fully aware that it doesn't for a large number of Americans.    

skc

Offline hyperlinked

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Healthcare.
« Reply #53 on: Sun, 02 May 2010, 10:53:22 »
Quote from: webwit;178126
Health-care is ultra accessible. So accessible many people don't pay insurance because they'll help you regardless. Quality and cost problems. They often produce the wrong diagnosis. And one time you're talking to one doctor, the next time to another. Waiting lists. Rapidly increasing costs. An increasing threshold were you pay yourself. Managers who get paid tripple what the PM gets. Lack of competition. Lack of transparency. In general German health care is of a higher level.


We have all of those problems here too, and the benefit of accessiblity doesn't even come with it. My Aunt, who's the assistant chief of a hospital told me last night that in the US, healthcare works if you're ultra rich or ultra poor. The ultra rich enjoy some of the most technologically advanced healthcare in the world. The poor go to emergency rooms and by law they have to be treated. They end up owing lots of money, but they own nothing and so there is nothing to take.

People in the middle live in total discomfort of what a medical emergency can do to them and their family. Even if they do end up going to the emergency room, they run the risk of losing property and everything they worked hard for when debt collectors come calling.
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Offline EverythingIBM

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Healthcare.
« Reply #54 on: Sun, 02 May 2010, 14:55:39 »
Quote from: webwit;178035
To catch the Saudis who bombed your building? Nah, it's about energy. You have been lied to and manipulated. Hey, do you know why Americans bomb and kill innocent men, women and children each and every day in Afghanistan? This is because they are too chicken to go in. Do you know why this is? This is not only because they are afraid to get killed. It is also because they are afraid not to get killed but get captured. Do you know why they are afraid of this? This is because they will get savagely tortured. Do you know why? As a revenge for the savage torture by the Americans, which went unpunished and was totally pardoned by your President.

So there you have it. You kill civilians because you really like to torture. Judging from people singing the national anthem, you are proud of it too.

It is exactly like the British Empire went into decline. In denial, violently kicking about like savages, belittling the new Emperor. All things which will increase the speed of the decline. In the end, evil and dumb. The corporate greed and  catch what you can kind of corruption are also signs of the end game coming near.


I don't even live in the states... you're a bit rash to conclusions I see.

I'm not going to post my response, it'll be too offensive.
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Offline kishy

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Healthcare.
« Reply #55 on: Sun, 02 May 2010, 15:10:57 »
Unfortunately, recent (and current) Canadian government is equally as bad as Republican Americans. I'm honestly ashamed to be Canadian with our present government in place (despite the greatness of Canada minus the ugly that the Conservatives bring). It's disgusting. Conservatives of the world, move to a small island and exercise your nonsense away from the rest of the world.
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Offline EverythingIBM

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Healthcare.
« Reply #56 on: Sun, 02 May 2010, 15:11:47 »
Quote from: webwit;178202
Don't let that stop you. Being Canadian doesn't change much. At least as ugly, going into Afghanistan for someone like George Bush. Just like the Dutch did.


So.... did the lexmark M15 arrive yet?
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Offline EverythingIBM

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Healthcare.
« Reply #57 on: Sun, 02 May 2010, 15:13:09 »
Quote from: kishy;178206
Unfortunately, recent (and current) Canadian government is equally as bad as Republican Americans. I'm honestly ashamed to be Canadian with our present government in place (despite the greatness of Canada minus the ugly that the Conservatives bring). It's disgusting. Conservatives of the world, move to a small island and exercise your nonsense away from the rest of the world.


The liberals are worse: trudeau destroyed the economy. Chretien stole billions etc.
Harper isn't the BEST, but he's the best out of the bunch.
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Offline ch_123

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Healthcare.
« Reply #58 on: Sun, 02 May 2010, 15:15:52 »
Quote from: EverythingIBM;178201
I don't even live in the states... you're a bit rash to conclusions I see.

I'm not going to post my response, it'll be too offensive.


Please, go for it.

Offline kishy

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Healthcare.
« Reply #59 on: Sun, 02 May 2010, 15:19:56 »
Quote from: EverythingIBM;178209
The liberals are worse: trudeau destroyed the economy. Chretien stole billions etc.
Harper isn't the BEST, but he's the best out of the bunch.


You're probably the type of person who thinks Tommy Douglas was a commie, based on that statement.
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Offline ch_123

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Healthcare.
« Reply #60 on: Sun, 02 May 2010, 15:24:40 »
What is is with IBM fanboys and far right politics? I should burn my F and switch back to my Filco in disgust.

Offline secularzarathustra

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Healthcare.
« Reply #61 on: Sun, 02 May 2010, 15:28:11 »
I agree with the tea partiers; there should only be private solutions to the healthcare debate. Government should stay out of it. I mean in Canada my family paid a $50 per mensem premium for exceptional coverage. Helped by the nanny state. In the U.S. I pay almost $5000 per annum and the coverage doesn't kick in until after I've also paid $4000 in deductible. Of course "the best health care in the world" is quite expensive. And come to think of it, not near as good as the Canadian system, but that was socialism, which is...uh...unamerican...and...uh...bad.
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Offline EverythingIBM

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Healthcare.
« Reply #62 on: Sun, 02 May 2010, 15:32:12 »
Quote from: kishy;178212
You're probably the type of person who thinks Tommy Douglas was a commie, based on that statement.


Tommy Douglas was a baptist minister: that's as anti-liberal as you can get. Liberals are extremely humanist. They were pulling off crosses from military monuments because it was "too offending", so much for free speech. I think it was jean the crooked mouth who did that.


And I don't disagree with Douglas, he had a very nice viewpoint on things (ironically my model M was made the same year he died).
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Offline ch_123

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Healthcare.
« Reply #63 on: Sun, 02 May 2010, 15:39:02 »
Quote from: webwit;178220
I'm going for the godwin!


Of course, if it wasn't for that crafty bastard Thomas J Watson, the Nazis would have left all those people alone and those 6 million Jews would probably still be alive!

Offline HaaTa

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Re: Healthcare.
« Reply #64 on: Sun, 02 May 2010, 15:39:03 »
Any democratic leader who has "free speech" zones, needs to get out.
I couldn't give a **** if Mr. Harper gets embarrased by comments people make. If he can't take the heat, just leave.

Unfortunately all the other leader options from all of the parties are **** atm.

The escort thing is also a bunch of crap. Stopping traffic for a good 3-4  minutes. I saw it relatively often when I lived in Ottawa.
Who the hell is going to go after him anyways? I know of only one political assasination in Canada (well over 100  years ago). Even Trudea was fine during that bull**** with the separatists (kidnapped a politician).

Oh and that "extended" break he did for the Olympics, we pay you taxes, do your damn job.

I still hold resentment of Harper for destroying Paul Martin with their attack ad campaigns.

Damn, typed enough from a phone.
But, still if Harper wasn't so secretive/playing the game with everything I probably would be content at least.
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Offline EverythingIBM

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Healthcare.
« Reply #65 on: Sun, 02 May 2010, 15:47:07 »
Quote from: HaaTa;178223
Any democratic leader who has "free speech" zones, needs to get out.
I couldn't give a **** if Mr. Harper gets embarrased by comments people make. If he can't take the heat, just leave.

Unfortunately all the other leader options from all of the parties are **** atm.

The escort thing is also a bunch of crap. Stopping traffic for a good 3-4  minutes. I saw it relatively often when I lived in Ottawa.
Who the hell is going to go after him anyways? I know of only one political assasination in Canada (well over 100  years ago). Even Trudea was fine during that bull**** with the separatists (kidnapped a politician).

Oh and that "extended" break he did for the Olympics, we pay you taxes, do your damn job.

I still hold resentment of Harper for destroying Paul Martin with their attack ad campaigns.

Damn, typed enough from a phone.
But, still if Harper wasn't so secretive/playing the game with everything I probably would be content at least.


I could never take chretien seriously
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Offline microsoft windows

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Healthcare.
« Reply #66 on: Thu, 06 May 2010, 19:44:47 »
The United States government, which can't even switch over TV without going broke thinks it can fix health care just like they "fixed" the economy by prolonging disaster through the bailouts. First off, what they mean by "fix" is make some intrusive program that costs billions more than they say, and my children end off paying it off in 50 years.\

The government is facing the worst fiscal crisis in its history. You all might say that "Oh, WWII debt was more" but it isn't. We have the roughly the same amount of debt as of now, plus budgets with deficits in the hundreds of billions for the forseeable future, along with over $100 trillion in unfunded liabilities. This fiscal crisis may very well cause the next Great Depression around 2030, when the last of the baby boomers reach retirement in 2027. By then, federal debt will be so severe, drastic cuts will not be enough to prevent financial collapse in the government. It'll end off selling off its stakes in the companies it bailed out such as GM (They'll keep a large stake in all those companies in order to control them), resulting in a massive stock market crash, potentially the worst in U. S. history. Like what happened in the Depression, people'll lose trust in many "super-banks" such as Citi with their plunging stock values, and will withdraw much of their money, resulting in widespread bank failure. The FDIC's supposed to cover that, but it will only worsen the federal debt crisis, further decreasing the peoples' trust. With the bank failures, and nobody to bail them out, an unprecedented foreclosure crisis is likely to occur.

I think you all are starting to get the picture of what could happen if this uncontrolled federal spending continues without significant reform. Act now!
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Offline EverythingIBM

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Healthcare.
« Reply #67 on: Fri, 07 May 2010, 01:00:37 »
Quote from: microsoft windows;179657
The United States government, which can't even switch over TV without going broke thinks it can fix health care just like they "fixed" the economy by prolonging disaster through the bailouts. First off, what they mean by "fix" is make some intrusive program that costs billions more than they say, and my children end off paying it off in 50 years.\

The government is facing the worst fiscal crisis in its history. You all might say that "Oh, WWII debt was more" but it isn't. We have the roughly the same amount of debt as of now, plus budgets with deficits in the hundreds of billions for the forseeable future, along with over $100 trillion in unfunded liabilities. This fiscal crisis may very well cause the next Great Depression around 2030, when the last of the baby boomers reach retirement in 2027. By then, federal debt will be so severe, drastic cuts will not be enough to prevent financial collapse in the government. It'll end off selling off its stakes in the companies it bailed out such as GM (They'll keep a large stake in all those companies in order to control them), resulting in a massive stock market crash, potentially the worst in U. S. history. Like what happened in the Depression, people'll lose trust in many "super-banks" such as Citi with their plunging stock values, and will withdraw much of their money, resulting in widespread bank failure. The FDIC's supposed to cover that, but it will only worsen the federal debt crisis, further decreasing the peoples' trust. With the bank failures, and nobody to bail them out, an unprecedented foreclosure crisis is likely to occur.

I think you all are starting to get the picture of what could happen if this uncontrolled federal spending continues without significant reform. Act now!


Better tell oprah to stop making people to vote for obama then.
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Offline wellington1869

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Healthcare.
« Reply #68 on: Thu, 20 May 2010, 23:39:55 »
Quote from: ripster;185078
Obama pushes Financial Reform bill through the Senate.  Two HISTORIC bills in a little over a year.

George Bush passed "No Child Left Behind" because Teddy Kennedy let him take the credit.


so the finance bill just needs to be reconciled with the houe bill that passed in december; WH says it'll be signed into law by july 4th.

So whats next on the list? Environmental/Energy overhaul in the wake of BP?

Change feels good.

(Meanwhile, the repubs want to bring back segregation. In the name of freedom of course).
« Last Edit: Thu, 20 May 2010, 23:44:35 by wellington1869 »

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Offline EverythingIBM

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Healthcare.
« Reply #69 on: Fri, 21 May 2010, 00:01:20 »
Quote from: microsoft windows;179657
and my children end off paying it off in 50 years.

Wait... you have children? Oh yeah, your windows 95 computers :lol:

Better tell IBM junior to keep his hands out of the cookie jar.
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