[Idea] 68 Percent Minimalist Keyboard

[JordiOrlando]

Disclaimer: this is an interest check for a keyboard idea of mine. Let me know what you think!

I got my first mechanical keyboard a few months ago and I love it. It's a CODE TKL, but it's starting
to feel unnecessarily big. I began looking at 60% keyboards, but couldn't justify getting rid of the
arrow keys. With these things in mind, I set out to design the "goldilocks" keyboard, one that has all
the keys I need and none I don't.


The 68 percent minimalist keyboard



This keyboard is exactly 16u wide and 5u tall. It has a 5.5u spacebar and full arrow keys.

As you can see, I've kept all the normal alpha keys. That means that you can still use the tilde for all
those weird smileys I know you use. Also, I've tried my best to make the mod keys symmetrical.
As for caps lock, Bahh. Who needs caps lock. I also put Insert on there because even though I've
never used it, I probably should learn to.

I really really want to try a DSA keyboard. I think they look simple and retro, and so I stuck them
on this keyboard. As for keycap sizes, I tried to keep as many standard size keys as possible. That said,
there are definitely a few weird ones, like the 5.5u spacebar. I've messed around with the layout a lot
to get it to this point, but I'm open for feedback and constructive criticism. I want this to be a keyboard
that people actually use, and maybe even enjoy using.

I also love MX Clears. Obviously if this gets made you can use whichever ones you want, but clears
definitely need to be an option. Sort of on the same tangent, I'm also planning on including [optional]
backlighting. The cool glow of white LEDs through SP keycaps is beautiful. I'm also toying with the idea
of using SIP sockets so that the LEDs can be easily replaceable.

I really want to see this through to an actual Open Source product. I'm an EE student and I
have a good deal of experience with designing PCBs as well as mechanical enclosures. If there's enough
interest, I'll design a board and then start brainstorming ideas for the case. I think aluminum plates
on top and bottom with wood or translucent acrylic sandwiched between them could be really cool, but
I'm not quite to that point yet.

Now let's talk about Key Combinations
The idea I have is that Fn is pretty important on this board. Here's a list of my proposed key-combos:

More

Fn + 1 : F1
Fn + 2 : F2
Fn + 3 : F3
Fn + 4 : F4
Fn + 5 : F5
Fn + 6 : F6
Fn + 7 : F7
Fn + 8 : F8
Fn + 9 : F9
Fn + 0 : F10
Fn + - : F11
Fn + = : F12
Fn + Shift : Menu
Fn + Up : PgUp
Fn + Down : PgDn
Fn + Left : Home
Fn + Right : END
Fn + ESC : Sleep (because hibernating is SO useful)
Fn + Fn : Funn? 
And plenty more that can be added in the future

I took a lot of inspiration from the HHKB, but also tried to minimize the amount
of keys in the function layer (or at least reduce it by 1 or 2). I'm aiming for this to be very much a
coding-oriented keyboard for people who need some extra desk space. My goal is for the keyboard
to be completely re-programmable so that you can use it however you want. I might use something
like a Teensy, but I'm leaning towards just including a uC on the PCB. Maybe an ATMega or similar.


I also put together some mockup keysets for your viewing pleasure. The following designs do not
belong to me, I just converted them to fit my keyboard layout.

1976 by Engicoder

Source

GreenTea by Numiru

Source

Granite by Matt3o

Source

And a completely blank keyset from me


All of the images in this thread can be found in an imgur album here


Most importantly, I want your feedback. Is this something you would like? If not, do you have any
ideas for how I can make it better? This is an ambitious project, but with enough interest and support
I'm confident it can become a reality. I'm really excited to hear what you have to say, and I'm excited
to finally be here on GH.

Thanks!

[hking0036]

It looks nice but for me at least I'd want there to be an option where the Left Ctrl and FN are flipped because I'm so set in my ways on where ctrl is.

That said, I do love the arrows without it being as big of a cluster**** as 75% keyboards are.

[CPTBadAss]

Does SP have a 5.5u spacebar mold? And that limits the keycap options to just SP right? Does anyone else do 5.5u spacebars in general? It might seem silly but people love using their favorite caps and I've seen perfectly good keyboards (FC700R) shunned because the caps aren't interchangable.

To the right of the up arrow, can you explain why that is insert? Is that commonly used in a program or in coding? I personally pretty much never use it so if it's set into the baselayer, I think I'm missing something.

Overall, I think this is a cool idea. It's kind of like the old Pure but with the arrow cluster.

Edit: I think the Noppoo Choc Mini has a 5.5x spacebar so *someone else* besides SP has a 5.5x spacebar mold.

[hking0036]

Does SP have a 5.5u spacebar mold? And that limits the keycap options to just SP right? Does anyone else do 5.5u spacebars in general? It might seem silly but people love using their favorite caps and I've seen perfectly good keyboards (FC700R) shunned because the caps aren't interchangable.

To the right of the up arrow, can you explain why that is insert? Is that commonly used in a program or in coding? I personally pretty much never use it so if it's set into the baselayer, I think I'm missing something.

Overall, I think this is a cool idea. It's kind of like the old Pure but with the arrow cluster.

Oh man I hadn't considered the 5.5u space first looking at it. That'd be a huge deal breaker, especially if SP doesn't already have the molds.

[Moralless]

I think the biggest problem with this set (and you should ask yourself this when trying to create your own layout) is where are you going to get your keycaps from? By the looks of it every key is standard sized except for the spacebar which is 5.5units. There are currently (to my knowledge) no 5.5 units that are readily available and as it stands it will be incredibly difficult trying to source one. Currently the readily found spacebars are from easiest to hardest: 6.25u, 7u, 6.5/6u.

Another thing to think about is the different Row profiles of each row (this should give you an idea of what I'm talking about). You're putting a 1.25 unit key (right control) in the third row. Since 1.25 unit keys are usually only found on the very bottom row (Row 4) putting it in a row predominantly filled with keys in Row 3 profile this can make it look unappealing and maybe also uncomfortable to use. Things like this further limit what sort of keysets you can put on it to only the uniform keysets (Row 3 SA, DSA etc.)

This layout is pretty similar to another keyboard: The Smart 68 you should take a look at it (sadly it has not been released yet).

[jacobolus]

Comments:

- Overall cute idea
- I’d recommend switching to a 2.25u enter and 1.5u backslash and making the keys on the right side 1u wide; it'll make sourcing those keycaps much easier.
- Right ctrl is pretty useless in that position IMO (too far a reach). I’d just put some other key there
- Does anyone really use the ins key very often? Maybe just replace that and ctrl with page up/down.
- Far away backspace might be a big problem for some people

For a smaller-than-normal spacebar, SP’s 4u SA spacebar is super cute. :-)

[hking0036]

I think the biggest problem with this set (and you should ask yourself this when trying to create your own layout) is where are you going to get your keycaps from? By the looks of it every key is standard sized except for the spacebar which is 5.5units. There are currently (to my knowledge) no 5.5 units that are readily available and as it stands it will be incredibly difficult trying to source one. Currently the readily found spacebars are from easiest to hardest: 6.25u, 7u, 6.5/6u.

Another thing to think about is the different Row profiles of each row (this should give you an idea of what I'm talking about). You're putting a 1.25 unit key (right control) in the third row. Since 1.25 unit keys are usually only found on the very bottom row (Row 4) putting it in a row predominantly filled with keys in Row 3 profile this can make it look unappealing and maybe also uncomfortable to use. Things like this further limit what sort of keysets you can put on it to only the uniform keysets (Row 3 SA, DSA etc.)

This layout is pretty similar to another keyboard: The Smart 68 you should take a look at it (sadly it has not been released yet).

Holy crap that 68 looks so cool.
Even an idiot like me could set it up if it doesn't need soldering, and the carbon fiber plate looks super cool.
Now you've made me sad it's not out yet. 

[inanis]

To people asking what the insert key may be used for:

When dealing with virtual machines, Ctrl, Alt, Insert takes the place of Crtl, Alt, Delete. If you are someone who works with Virtual machines this key is very useful. I'm not sure if there is another common use, but I know I probably hit insert 50 times a work day or more in my very VM heavy environment.

[jdcarpe]

I got my first mechanical keyboard a few months ago and I love it. It's a CODE TKL, but it's starting
to feel unnecessarily big. I began looking at 60% keyboards, but couldn't justify getting rid of the arrow keys.

Why can't you justify getting rid of the arrow keys? Have you tried a standard 60% keyboard yet? People always get hung up on having dedicated cursor arrow keys on their 60% and try and reinvent the wheel. If you try it, you may find that you really didn't need dedicated keys, and that having them assigned to a function layer works very well.

That said, as others have stated, the biggest problem with your design is the 5.5-unit spacebar. If there is no convenient option for replacement keycaps, people who buy your keyboard will hate it after the initial euphoria wears off, simply because they can't replace the keycaps with a standard set.

[JordiOrlando]

First, thanks for all the feedback!

It looks nice but for me at least I'd want there to be an option where the Left Ctrl and FN are flipped because I'm so set in my ways on where ctrl is.

That said, I do love the arrows without it being as big of a cluster**** as 75% keyboards are.

Totally doable! The goal is for it to be 100% programmable. That means that the up arrow can be ESC, and ESC can be Fn. It's up to you!

Does SP have a 5.5u spacebar mold? And that limits the keycap options to just SP right? Does anyone else do 5.5u spacebars in general? It might seem silly but people love using their favorite caps and I've seen perfectly good keyboards (FC700R) shunned because the caps aren't interchangable.

To the right of the up arrow, can you explain why that is insert? Is that commonly used in a program or in coding? I personally pretty much never use it so if it's set into the baselayer, I think I'm missing something.

Overall, I think this is a cool idea. It's kind of like the old Pure but with the arrow cluster.

Oh man I hadn't considered the 5.5u space first looking at it. That'd be a huge deal breaker, especially if SP doesn't already have the molds.

Yeah, I agree that this is a problem. I started shifting things around and there are definitely several ways to have either a 6 or 6.25u spacebar. I'll include a few to see which one y'all like the most.

I think the biggest problem with this set (and you should ask yourself this when trying to create your own layout) is where are you going to get your keycaps from? By the looks of it every key is standard sized except for the spacebar which is 5.5units. There are currently (to my knowledge) no 5.5 units that are readily available and as it stands it will be incredibly difficult trying to source one. Currently the readily found spacebars are from easiest to hardest: 6.25u, 7u, 6.5/6u.

Another thing to think about is the different Row profiles of each row (this should give you an idea of what I'm talking about). You're putting a 1.25 unit key (right control) in the third row. Since 1.25 unit keys are usually only found on the very bottom row (Row 4) putting it in a row predominantly filled with keys in Row 3 profile this can make it look unappealing and maybe also uncomfortable to use. Things like this further limit what sort of keysets you can put on it to only the uniform keysets (Row 3 SA, DSA etc.)

This layout is pretty similar to another keyboard: The Smart 68 you should take a look at it (sadly it has not been released yet).

Good point on the row profiles. I designed this to be used with uniform keycaps (DSA, G20, etc), but I hadn't even considered standard cylindrical caps. I took your advice and changed the 'right CTRL' to 1u, which also solves the problem of the 2u Enter.

I looked at the Smart 68 while designing this, and it's definitely very similar. The main difference is that I really want Fn keys because I do use the function layer occasionally. That has got me thinking, though, maybe they have a better idea with putting Fn on the side. I hadn't given that much thought, but it could be much better. Maybe I should leave it up to the professionals

This won't let me post any more quotes, so I'll just do this manually.

jacobolus:
- The thing about the backslash is that I have a grudge against it for being the only alpha key that isn't 1u (excluding the space bar). I don't think it deserves to be 1.5u. I know it makes sourcing hard, but this is mainly my idea for how modern keyboards *should* be (from my admittedly limited experience).
- As for right CTRL, I don't use it much, so could you describe to me how you often use it? My idea was to make it live in the same place no matter which side of the keyboard it's on. From a UX standpoint, it's more consistent.
- Ins is just there as an example, you can stick any 1u keycap on there and reprogram it as such.
- I can make backspace and tilde swappable, but again I think the tilde makes much more sense living with the rest of the alphas. This keyboard isn't going to appeal to everyone. It has a learning curve, but any new different layout will. My goal is not to make it the same as what currently exists, but rather to make it better in the long run.

jdcarpe:
I've tried my friends HHKB and while it is certainly usable, I'd much rather have discrete keys. As for the space bar, I've tried to fix that.

Some slight tweaks have been made based on your feedback

Layout

I changed the bar to 6u by shrinking each Fn to 1u. I also changed Enter to 2.25u and as a result changer RCTRL to 1u.

It's worthwhile to note that each CTRL can be swapped with each Fn if you prefer it that way instead. Also, INS and DEL are just there as examples, but they can be anything you want. Even macros.

EDIT: I don't know if double-posting is allowed, so I'll add this here.
If I make the keyboard .5u wider everywhere, I have space for two standard 2.25u Shift keys, a standard 1.5u backslash, and all three bottom modifiers (CTRL, Super, and Alt) can be 1.25u. It also means that Backspace and Delete can both be 2u and swappable. Hmm...

How I would arrange it
More standard layout

[jdcarpe]

I fixed it for you.


Layout


Also, 16x5 is usually called 65% just for convenience.

[metalliqaz]

I fixed it for you.

Show Image

Layout

That's hot.

Totally doable! The goal is for it to be 100% programmable. That means that the up arrow can be ESC, and ESC can be Fn. It's up to you!

If it is built using an ATmega32U, you could use my Easy AVR USB firmware for easy reprogrammability or TMK for 100% control.

[metalliqaz]

Dude, 10000 posts!!

[JordiOrlando]

I fixed it for you.

Show Image

Layout

Yeah, this might be something that only I end up wanting. Your layout is very similar to the Smart 68, which isn't a whole lot different from standard keyboards (in terms of backslash and tilde).

I fixed it for you. :)

Show Image

Layout

That's hot.

Totally doable! The goal is for it to be 100% programmable. That means that the up arrow can be ESC, and ESC can be Fn. It's up to you!

If it is built using an ATmega32U, you could use my Easy AVR USB firmware for easy reprogrammability or TMK for 100% control.

I was thinking of using something just like that. Thanks!

[abjr]

What about Matt3o's Brown Fox layout which is also 16x5?:

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=45139.0

Or his Steel Beauty which is 15x5.

I've been toying with a similar 15x5, but it has a lot of nonstandard key sizes, although Granite would cover it. I'm also not sure how I'd feel about the top 2 rows being not being staggered.

http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/6d089e0ed949090dd4892fad198a59f1

[vivalarevolución]

I fixed it for you.

Show Image

Layout


Also, 16x5 is usually called 65% just for convenience. :)

Now it's just a standard 65%.

FYI, if you are going to have two 1.25u mods and one 1u mod, I recommend putting that 1u in the middle of the modifier cluster.

[JordiOrlando]

What about Matt3o's Brown Fox layout which is also 16x5?:

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=45139.0

Or his Steel Beauty which is 15x5.

I've been toying with a similar 15x5, but it has a lot of nonstandard key sizes, although Granite would cover it. I'm also not sure how I'd feel about the top 2 rows being not being staggered.

http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/6d089e0ed949090dd4892fad198a59f1

(Attachment Link)

The Brown Fox is awesome, yeah. I also took a look at yours and I like it, but I agree that not having a staggered top row is a bit strange.

I fixed it for you.

Show Image

Layout


Also, 16x5 is usually called 65% just for convenience. :)

Now it's just a standard 65%.

FYI, if you are going to have two 1.25u mods and one 1u mod, I recommend putting that 1u in the middle of the modifier cluster.

Yeah, that was my impression. I'm going for something a little less standard :p
Good idea about the mods, it looks significantly better that way. I'm trying to somehow fit a 6.25u spacebar in there, but I think I'm stuck with 6u. Nothing lines up if I make it 6.25u.

Changed to PBT colors because you can buy blank PBT DSA sets from SP for pretty cheap

Layout

And with the CTRL keys in their *inferior* locations



Any thoughts on the function layer?

EDIT: I put in a 6.25u spacebar, but now the mods on the right are all 1u while the ones on the left are 1.25u. Thoughts?

Layout

[hking0036]

(Attachment Link)

Dude, 10000 posts!!

Woo! Happy 10k jd!

[JordiOrlando]

(Attachment Link)

Dude, 10000 posts!!

Woo! Happy 10k jd!

That's awesome, congrats!

[Oobly]

AFAIK, none of the sets in the OP come with 5.5x spacebars...

You're going to need to change it to either 6.25x or 7x. They're the most common sizes and all the aftermarket keycap makers I'm aware of can make both those sizes.

One problem I have with both yours and jdcarpe's layouts is the way you usually find some of the keys on the right hand side, like backspace. Some people will index it by the left edge, so it should be next to =+, but others will index it from the right side, so it should be at the end of the row... problem. That said, I do prefer jd's layout somewhat. It has the advantage that most keycap sets can fit (if you buy one or two of the extra kits usually offered to get the 1.75x shift and 1x mods).

TBH, I consider the bottom row of pretty much all "normal" boards to be horrible. The only keys that are easy for me to use are Left Ctrl (left pinkie) and spacebar (right thumb). I much prefer a "split spacebar" layout, but it also makes keycaps a problem.

[Matias]

I'm trying to somehow fit a 6.25u spacebar in there, but I think I'm stuck with 6u. Nothing lines up if I make it 6.25u.

Changed to PBT colors because you can buy blank PBT DSA sets from SP for pretty cheap

Show Image

Layout

And with the CTRL keys in their *inferior* locations

Show Image

Any thoughts on the function layer?

EDIT: I put in a 6.25u spacebar, but now the mods on the right are all 1u while the ones on the left are 1.25u. Thoughts?

Show Image

Layout

Your original layout with the 5.5u spacbar was better.  You should go back to it.

We stock 5.5u ALPS spacebars and we can get Cherry ones.

See below for another layout suggestion...



Layout



Layout

[qwack]

Lots of great ideas in this thread. I have been considering to make my own 65% for quite some time with the ability to use only keycaps from any standard keyset, which gives me roughly this:



I lose two mods between the spacebar and the arrow keys, but that's an acceptable tradeoff to me since all keys except the right Shift (1.75) are standard. As seen in a post above, you can cram three 1u keys here if you want to. In the end, it all depends on which keys are crucial to you (I'd rather lose two mods and get arrow keys and a full size spacebar, but to each his own) and whether you can source caps easily for your layout.

[ideus]

Break the paradigm of the inverted T arrow key block. The L shaped arrow set worked for a long time. The inverted T came when the full size keyboards include a center block, that makes the simmetry of the inverted T a necessity.


Cases for sixty percent keyboards are available, for other larger size but smaller than a TKL all would be custom jobs.


The 1u arrows in row 3 and 4 are included most of the time, as well as a couple of 1u keys for the bottom row.

[jdcarpe]

Break the paradigm of the inverted T arrow key block. The L shaped arrow set worked for a long time. The inverted T came when the full size keyboards include a center block, that makes the simmetry of the inverted T a necessity.


Cases for sixty percent keyboards are available, for other larger size but smaller than a TKL all would be custom jobs.


The 1u arrows in row 3 and 4 are included most of the time, as well as a couple of 1u keys for the bottom row.

Yes, if you can live without an inverted T for the arrow cluster, I've always thought this layout works well.

[Oobly]

Break the paradigm of the inverted T arrow key block. The L shaped arrow set worked for a long time. The inverted T came when the full size keyboards include a center block, that makes the simmetry of the inverted T a necessity.


Cases for sixty percent keyboards are available, for other larger size but smaller than a TKL all would be custom jobs.


The 1u arrows in row 3 and 4 are included most of the time, as well as a couple of 1u keys for the bottom row.

It's hard to break the habit of more than 20 years of using inverted T (and using the arrow keys a LOT)... At least for me.

[ideus]

Break the paradigm of the inverted T arrow key block. The L shaped arrow set worked for a long time. The inverted T came when the full size keyboards include a center block, that makes the simmetry of the inverted T a necessity.


Cases for sixty percent keyboards are available, for other larger size but smaller than a TKL all would be custom jobs.


The 1u arrows in row 3 and 4 are included most of the time, as well as a couple of 1u keys for the bottom row.

It's hard to break the habit of more than 20 years of using inverted T (and using the arrow keys a LOT)... At least for me.

I know it, but inverted L arrows in the first layer will always work better than FN+something else in layouts that does not have dedicated arrows at all. Also is an small concession required to keep the 60% size and most of the other keys standard, particularly the space bar.

Sourcing cases or space bars in odd sizes is a nightmare.

[jacobolus]

Break the paradigm of the inverted T arrow key block. The L shaped arrow set worked for a long time.

By “worked for a long time” you mean “was used on a small number of keyboards, and was never very popular” right?

[jacobolus]

I know [it’s hard to break the inverted T habit], but inverted L arrows in the first layer will always work better than FN+something else in layouts that does not have dedicated arrows at all. Also is an small concession required to keep the 60% size and most of the other keys standard, particularly the space bar.

Will always work better for who? Personally I find separate arrows that I have to reach for (regardless of arrangement) much less pleasant than arrows directly on the home row on a layer.

[ideus]

I know [it�s hard to break the inverted T habit], but inverted L arrows in the first layer will always work better than FN+something else in layouts that does not have dedicated arrows at all. Also is an small concession required to keep the 60% size and most of the other keys standard, particularly the space bar.

Will always work better for who? Personally I find separate arrows that I have to reach for (regardless of arrangement) much less pleasant than arrows directly on the home row on a layer.

As long as you do not need chords. To mark a block on excel or select some code using three or more fingers at once is counterproductive. But yeah, FN+arrows allow cute layouts with no arrows.

[jacobolus]

You just need one modifier key for movement, another for deleting in various different directions, another for adjusting the selection, another for manipulating the undo/redo stack, another for scrolling the active window, etc.

[JordiOrlando]

Wow, some great ideas guys! Sorry I didn't check back, I have midterms coming up so my schedule is pretty packed. I'm going to bounce off of some of Matias' ideas like the vertical CTRL.

BRB, gonna keep iterating

[Eugene]

Really looking for the smallest layout with a dedicated inverted-T. I'm loving some of these layouts. The Matias 60 is something I've put in for, but I'm really not sure how I like the 1.5u height bottom row...

[hwood34]

I think the biggest problem with this set (and you should ask yourself this when trying to create your own layout) is where are you going to get your keycaps from? By the looks of it every key is standard sized except for the spacebar which is 5.5units. There are currently (to my knowledge) no 5.5 units that are readily available and as it stands it will be incredibly difficult trying to source one. Currently the readily found spacebars are from easiest to hardest: 6.25u, 7u, 6.5/6u.

Another thing to think about is the different Row profiles of each row (this should give you an idea of what I'm talking about). You're putting a 1.25 unit key (right control) in the third row. Since 1.25 unit keys are usually only found on the very bottom row (Row 4) putting it in a row predominantly filled with keys in Row 3 profile this can make it look unappealing and maybe also uncomfortable to use. Things like this further limit what sort of keysets you can put on it to only the uniform keysets (Row 3 SA, DSA etc.)

This layout is pretty similar to another keyboard: The Smart 68 you should take a look at it (sadly it has not been released yet).

Well, with layouts like this you pretty much have to use DSA,  but with this layout, like you said, you'd still have trouble finding a spacebar of that length.

[jacobolus]

I have a couple 5.5u Alps spacebars, I think. (Not 100% sure; they might be 5.25 or 5.75.)

Edit: I now see that Matias also stocks 5.5u spacebars. So use Alps switches for the board and you’re all set! (Getting the other caps with printed legends is going to be tricky though; there are a number of non-standard things there.) :-)

[JordiOrlando]

After a few more changes I've settled on my final layout. It's probably pretty polarizing, but it's what I'm gonna build. It's a 70% split-spacebar build with symmetrical mods. Here's the layout.

And here's a sneak peek of the case design:

[TacticalCoder]

Disclaimer: this is an interest check for a keyboard idea of mine. Let me know what you think!

It's not totally unlike my HHKB Pro JP (and I'm not japanese at all)... Did you consider making the spacebar even narrower than 5.5u?  HHKB Pro JP's spacebar has to be 3u or maybe 2.5u and that is the nuts: I've got Hyper and Super in addition to Ctrl, Shift and Meta / Alt and modifiers left and right of the spacebars are super easy to access...

[jacobolus]

Did you consider making the spacebar even narrower than 5.5u?

I think you somehow missed the post right before yours.

[ideus]

Two cents of salt: It seems that keep the caps and case standard is not a priority of your project. It may work if it is just for you, but if you want it to enter the market it makes more sense to keep it as standard as possible.

[JordiOrlando]

Two cents of salt: It seems that keep the caps and case standard is not a priority of your project. It may work if it is just for you, but if you want it to enter the market it makes more sense to keep it as standard as possible.

You're completely correct on that one . As long as I can get DSA blanks for all the keys, form and function are going to stay the priority.

[swill]

I like what you guys are doing in this thread.  I have also put a bunch of thought into a similar layout, so I figured I would share it.

I am a developer, so I need my dedicated arrow keys, Esc and `~ keys.  Basically, all the rest of the keys I don't mind putting in a Fn layer.

Here is what it looks like...



Here is the layout: http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/c2a2a76df8848ae2bdba84d606fa1635

I am currently getting the plate and case cut for this keyboard and I will be hand wiring it with the Enabler PCBs. 

Most of the keys for this layout come with the base kit.  The shift keys are relatively common in many of the GBs by getting an optional kit.

PS - I am a Mac user, so Alt maps to my Command key...

[ideus]

I like what you guys are doing in this thread.  I have also put a bunch of thought into a similar layout, so I figured I would share it.

I am a developer, so I need my dedicated arrow keys, Esc and `~ keys.  Basically, all the rest of the keys I don't mind putting in a Fn layer.

Here is what it looks like...

(Attachment Link)

Here is the layout: http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/c2a2a76df8848ae2bdba84d606fa1635

I am currently getting the plate and case cut for this keyboard and I will be hand wiring it with the Enabler PCBs. 

Most of the keys for this layout come with the base kit.  The shift keys are relatively common in many of the GBs by getting an optional kit.

PS - I am a Mac user, so Alt maps to my Command key...

This is brilliant, and it looks nice also. If you ever consider to get a PCB built let us know.

[jacobolus]

I like what you guys are doing in this thread.  I have also put a bunch of thought into a similar layout, so I figured I would share it. [...] Here is what it looks like...

Show Image

The shift key that far out to the right is totally useless as a shift. You might as well just leave it off entirely and put something else in that spot.

[swill]

I like what you guys are doing in this thread.  I have also put a bunch of thought into a similar layout, so I figured I would share it.

I am a developer, so I need my dedicated arrow keys, Esc and `~ keys.  Basically, all the rest of the keys I don't mind putting in a Fn layer.

Here is what it looks like...

(Attachment Link)

Here is the layout: http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/c2a2a76df8848ae2bdba84d606fa1635

I am currently getting the plate and case cut for this keyboard and I will be hand wiring it with the Enabler PCBs. 

Most of the keys for this layout come with the base kit.  The shift keys are relatively common in many of the GBs by getting an optional kit.

PS - I am a Mac user, so Alt maps to my Command key...

This is brilliant, and it looks nice also. If you ever consider to get a PCB built let us know.

I am going to try it and make sure I like it first. 

[ideus]

I like what you guys are doing in this thread.  I have also put a bunch of thought into a similar layout, so I figured I would share it.

I am a developer, so I need my dedicated arrow keys, Esc and `~ keys.  Basically, all the rest of the keys I don't mind putting in a Fn layer.

Here is what it looks like...

(Attachment Link)

Here is the layout: http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/c2a2a76df8848ae2bdba84d606fa1635

I am currently getting the plate and case cut for this keyboard and I will be hand wiring it with the Enabler PCBs. 

Most of the keys for this layout come with the base kit.  The shift keys are relatively common in many of the GBs by getting an optional kit.

PS - I am a Mac user, so Alt maps to my Command key...

This is brilliant, and it looks nice also. If you ever consider to get a PCB built let us know.

I am going to try it and make sure I like it first. 

Of course, post your findings. I'd split the backspace, and drop it on top of the enter key.

[swill]

I like what you guys are doing in this thread.  I have also put a bunch of thought into a similar layout, so I figured I would share it. [...] Here is what it looks like...

Show Image

The shift key that far out to the right is totally useless as a shift. You might as well just leave it off entirely and put something else in that spot.

Not really.  How often do you use the right shift anyway.  I use the left shift WAY more often than the right shift.  Also, its not way out to the right, it is just one unit farther than normal.  I doubt it will be that noticeable once I start using it.

The most important part of the right side of the layout for me is the arrow keys.  I need to be able to find them without looking down at the board.  Having the little gap there on the right of the right arrow will make it very easy to find.  On my 75% board, which has the same arrow cluster as most of the other layouts in this thread, it was hard for me to easily hit the arrow keys because all the keys down there felt the same.  I often found myself reaching for my arrow keys and missing.

Don't get me wrong.  I love the 75% layout and I think the layout that is being thrown around in this thread is going to be pretty awesome.  I just wanted to share the layout I am working on because it is focusing on similar things and is a bit different.

[swill]

I am going to try it and make sure I like it first. 

Of course, post your findings. I'd split the backspace, and drop it on top of the enter key.

I have not used a layout like that (aka - the HHKB), so I don't know if that is something I would enjoy.  I wanted to try to stick to the standard layout as much as possible so I don't have to relearn everything when I switch between boards.  I use an FC660C at work, so this layout will be pretty easy for me to switch between. 

I actually learned some stuff about the location of the Fn key and such by having the FC660C.  I really don't like my Fn key on the right side (at least not on the bottom row) because almost all the keys I use in the Fn layer are up near the backspace.  It is hard to hit those Fn keys with one hand, so I moved it to the left so I could more easily use my Fn keys by using both hands.

[JordiOrlando]

Well, with layouts like this you pretty much have to use DSA,  but with this layout, like you said, you'd still have trouble finding a spacebar of that length.

I already know I'm gonna spend too much on this project. BTW, huge thanks for running the Gateron GB , I'm about to put in an order for around 100 of each. I'm going to roll one keyboard with each type. SeeedStudio has a MOQ of 5 for their PCB service, so I don't yet know what I'll do with the fifth. Maybe something wild like trying to get my hands on some MX RGBs 

The PCB layout is coming along nicely. I'll be including the uC from the Teensy 3.1 on the board, as well as some other pretty awesome goodies that are still in planning ;p.

I like what you guys are doing in this thread.  I have also put a bunch of thought into a similar layout, so I figured I would share it.

I am a developer, so I need my dedicated arrow keys, Esc and `~ keys.  Basically, all the rest of the keys I don't mind putting in a Fn layer.

Here is what it looks like...

(Attachment Link)

Here is the layout: http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/c2a2a76df8848ae2bdba84d606fa1635

I am currently getting the plate and case cut for this keyboard and I will be hand wiring it with the Enabler PCBs. 

Most of the keys for this layout come with the base kit.  The shift keys are relatively common in many of the GBs by getting an optional kit.

PS - I am a Mac user, so Alt maps to my Command key...

First of all, thank you so much for your plate layout tool, it made designing the case Soooo much easier.

I like your layout, it reminds me alot of the HHKB. It's also nice that yours is fairly standard, meaning you'll actually be able to source non-blanks. Definitely post a build log once you're done, I'd love to see the final product. Good luck!

[swill]

First of all, thank you so much for your plate layout tool, it made designing the case Soooo much easier.

I like your layout, it reminds me alot of the HHKB. It's also nice that yours is fairly standard, meaning you'll actually be able to source non-blanks. Definitely post a build log once you're done, I'd love to see the final product. Good luck!

Glad the tool is being helpful.    I am really happy that people are enjoying it.  Its was a lot of work, so I am glad it is being used.

Ya, one of my goals was to use as many standard keys as possible (along with the other stuff I already mentioned).

I think it is going to be a sexy board.  Brass top and bottom plate with cherry wood as the middle layers.    I will definitely do a build log and take lots of pictures.

[JordiOrlando]

First of all, thank you so much for your plate layout tool, it made designing the case Soooo much easier.

I like your layout, it reminds me alot of the HHKB. It's also nice that yours is fairly standard, meaning you'll actually be able to source non-blanks. Definitely post a build log once you're done, I'd love to see the final product. Good luck!

Glad the tool is being helpful.    I am really happy that people are enjoying it.  Its was a lot of work, so I am glad it is being used.

Ya, one of my goals was to use as many standard keys as possible (along with the other stuff I already mentioned).

I think it is going to be a sexy board.  Brass top and bottom plate with cherry wood as the middle layers.    I will definitely do a build log and take lots of pictures.

Now that is a Fancy board . I look forward to it.

[jacobolus]

The shift key that far out to the right is totally useless as a shift. You might as well just leave it off entirely and put something else in that spot.

Not really.  How often do you use the right shift anyway.

People in general, or me personally? I personally use the right shift almost exclusively, reserving the left shift for the symbols on the right hand number row and keys typed with the right hand pinky and sometimes ring finger (so among letters, that’s usually P, and sometimes L or O).

Your keyboard would be totally unusable for me.

But hey, if you don’t use the right shift, that’s no problem, go ahead and get rid of it. There’s just not much point IMO in making it so far away that you couldn’t use it if you wanted. I think you’d be much better off dropping the right shift entirely and shifting the arrows a slight bit more to the right.