Freakin ripoff site

[ironcoder]

I just tried to order my first items on ebay. I selected 3 trackman mice which I was going to have to pay a high price for just to find somebody willing to ship them over here. That was bad enough, but ok.

I selected a quantity of 3 and waited while the little circle spun around and showed me a shipping price of 20 dollars. Ok, I can live with that.

I checked the prices and clicked the Buy button.

All of a sudden I am presented with my total for the mice 98 bucks and I get to choose between regular shipping for 69 bucks or expedited for 101 bucks. Now what in the hell happened to the 20 dollar shipping fee they talked about?

I just paid 75 bucks for Brian to ship me 2 Filcos, 2 keyboard roofs, a wrist rest, extension cords, and WASD keys. There is NO WAY IN HELL it costs 69 dollars to ship 3 mice. It is probably around 10 bucks at the most.

And it gets worse, when they sent me the invoice, it doesn't show a total. That's right, it shows only a subtotal, which only includes the mice. The shipping charges are not shown ANYWHERE ON THE INVOICE!

What kind of dirtbags are running ebay to miscalculate and then obfuscate shipping charges?

Ok, so I'll just cancel my order. No harm, no foul, 10 seconds after the so-called purchase nothing has happened, I haven't sent money and the store hasn't packed my order. But where is the cancel button? There isn't one. Where is the customer service contact? There isn't one on ebay.

I sent my request to cancel the order along with a request for total to the shop, that seems like the only way you can get a message to them.

I can't believe ebay is such a ripoff, so many people love using it. I think it's the most dishonest, misleading and frustrating ecommerce site I've ever used, and this was the 1st and last time.

/rant off

[timw4mail]

Funny, I've always seen shipping prices on the auctions.

Considering that eBay is a middleman of sorts between buyer and seller, I think you've misjudged that.

However, that shipping price is absurd.

[ironcoder]

Misjudged what? It wasn't an auction and I said it calculated the shipping price and showed it as 20 dollars.

I don't blame the seller, eBay is the one showing an incorrect total and then giving you no way to cancel.

Show me the friggin total before you expect me to agree. Do you expect me to sign blank checks?

[AndrewZorn]

tell the seller what the calculator gave you to start with, maybe he will edit it

[ironcoder]

Ripster, wait, what?

I know what the shipping costs are for different things/weights, I have been buying stuff online for years.

Brian has nothing to do with this, I'm just saying if it costs 75 bucks to ship all the stuff I got from Brian, it shows how absurd the 69 dollar shipping charge is for 3 mice.

But even the high charge is NOT the issue.

The issues are:

1. ebay calculated the wrong charge

2. I clicked Buy on the basis of what I saw on the screen and then was presented with a shipping charge more than 3x what was shown and no way of cancelling the order

3. The email invoice I received shows only a subtotal and not a total, does not include shipping charges, which makes it smell like a damn ripoff was planned from the beginning. First they show the wrong charges and then they don't even list them.

I call BULL****!

[ironcoder]

tell the seller what the calculator gave you to start with, maybe he will edit it

Yeah if he comes back with a square deal I'll go ahead and pay him. But ebay can stick it.

BTW I was using the so-called global site, maybe they don't try to pull stunts like that on Americans. But I can read English and I understand web commerce, so trying to bull**** me and rip me off isn't going to happen.

[lowpoly]

Auction link?

[AndrewZorn]

you WERE using the correct location when it calculated the shipping charge, right?

but yeah, what im saying is a reasonable person would either drop the cost (if he can) or simply call it off mutually.

EDIT and box size and insurance can be tough.  i spent over $50 shipping a power supply to south america, negating the money i was 'making' by flipping it on ebay.

[ironcoder]

You guys don't seem to understand what I'm objecting to, I don't know how I can be any more clear.

And but yeah I already agreed to your 2nd sentence.

[AndrewZorn]

^^^ yes, that's what i was saying.  if the seller leaves it up to ebay to calc it, then that IS the rate at checkout... it won't magically change.

[J888www]

Is there a "Confirm Payment" button ? No press button=no payment.
Maybe you should just press a RED ESCAPE key :tongue1:

Edited:    Just purchased my first REAL Keyboard, IBM Model M Space Saver, Seller had one a few days ago, was snapped-up while I asked Seller a Question. He later informed me that another would be put on eBay very soon. I purchased it (as soon as I login) less than 1 hour after it was posted for sale and everything seems to be ship-shape Bristol fashion so far.

Maybe you were just unfortunate to encounter a devious seller, there are some who are quite helpful (maybe not many, but the genuine traders do exists).

[JBert]

I wonder though... Is this a "Buy it now" auction? If so, I believe the deal is not complete until you pay the sum through Ebay/Paypal. I thought that closing the window and opening it again (or logout/login) will reset the "bought" state in such a case.

[J888www]

Yes Bert, sos I was at PayPal confirmation site.

If you don't pay , you don't buy. So the final result is that if you purchased an item, it's all your own fault, there is no one else to blame for your own misjudgement.

[Rajagra]

It is about time ebay sorted out the international issues. If I load the US page instead of my usual UK page it still knows who I am - it offers me the chance to log out if I'm not me! Yet it shows shipping to the US, etc.

Paypal (owned by ebay) is even worse. Every time I log in I seem to be yoyoing between the UK and US sites as I work on a transaction.

For God's sake ebay sort it out. Either treat them as competely separate sites or integrate them properly!

[AndrewZorn]

other than looking at things for other people, i dont see the need to log in to another nation's ebay.

if the seller ships to your country, it will show the items at the bottom under "international offers" or something.

[ironcoder]

It seems there may be a bit of a misunderstanding here...

There certainly is, on your part.

Ebay has little-to-nothing to do with the cost of shipping or price of items or fairness of transactions. In some (admittedly common, but specialized) situations, a seller won't tell ebay what the shipping rate is and ebay automatically estimates it.

That is not the issue as I have clearly stated at least twice already.

Let's try again, read slowly and carefully for best effect:

0) I am signed in to my ebay account and my location is known in the system

1) eBay calculates a shipping price for the items (20 dollars) and asks me to confirm by clicking Buy

2) I click the Buy button and now I am presented with a screen with two shipping options, one for 69 dollars and one for 101 dollars. There is no cancel button

3) I close the tab and my account shows that I have an item I must pay for. It shows only the item subtotal and no shipping charges

4) the email invoice I receive shows only the item subtotals and no shipping charges.

Get it now? First they calculate a ridiculous charge and then they show it nowhere, not on their site and not in the email invoice.

This has nothing to do with the seller, it's what ebay is doing.

For the times when it estimates it, it is ABSOLUTELY CRITICAL YOU ARE USING THE "LOCAL" EBAY SITE - for example in Canada it is ebay.ca. Otherwise, it gives you a shipping estimate to the United States when you're using .com!

Horse****. There is no local site for the majority of the world's countries. And it calculated the shipping charges based on my address which is shown on the screen the whole time.

It's always unfortunate to read that these technicalities cost someone money, but to be fair they aren't exactly "ebays" fault. I've had it happen where a seller set the shipping rate to "Free" instead of "Contact seller"...there are human mistakes at play here.

They didn't cost me any money, I have no intention of paying it.

[ironcoder]

Is there a "Confirm Payment" button ? No press button=no payment.
Maybe you should just press a RED ESCAPE key :tongue1:

Like I said, there is only the item total and shipping charges, which looked ok. When I clicked Buy, the deal was changed and there was no option to cancel the order. So I sent an email to the store to cancel the order.

Maybe you were just unfortunate to encounter a devious seller, there are some who are quite helpful (maybe not many, but the genuine traders do exists).

No, this is a 100% ebay ****up. The seller got back to me with a reasonable shipping charge. I don't believe he knew anything about the transaction until I sent him the complaint email thru ebay. I have no issues with the seller.

[ironcoder]

^^^ yes, that's what i was saying.  if the seller leaves it up to ebay to calc it, then that IS the rate at checkout... it won't magically change.

What other option is there?

[ironcoder]

I wonder though... Is this a "Buy it now" auction? If so, I believe the deal is not complete until you pay the sum through Ebay/Paypal. I thought that closing the window and opening it again (or logout/login) will reset the "bought" state in such a case.

Yes, it was buy it now. I thought there would be a way to cancel but there wasn't. I did close out and come back in but it showed up on my account as "you bought it, now pay for it" again with no shipping charges shown.

[AndrewZorn]

severe ebay error or user error.  i have never seen this, and the calculated charges have always been the same as what i see at checkout.

i wont say i have never had a problem with the system, though:
the NIB at101 i got from here, i had my APO selected as the calculated address when i purchased.  so it wanted to charge USPS to the APO instead of free shipping to my house.  so i change my address to my house, but it still wont show the free UPS option, it was stuck on the rate calculated when i was on the item page.

so this was strange, i dont think i nor ebay did things 100% right in this situation... but either way, it agrees with the all-important shipping calculation step (which isn't even actually required???).  i cant see the price going UP for no reason.

[ironcoder]

Yes Bert, sos I was at PayPal confirmation site.

If you don't pay , you don't buy. So the final result is that if you purchased an item, it's all your own fault, there is no one else to blame for your own misjudgement.

Well there's no way of clearing the deal off your account. They make it look like you owe people money. So what are you supposed to do? It's a messed up system to say the least.

I don't understand your last sentence but maybe if I misread everything in the thread I would.

[ironcoder]

There are many countries in the world and very few ebay sites. Unless you've tried to deal with the global site from a 3rd world country you probably don't know how messed up it is.

[AndrewZorn]

global.ebay.com

EDIT that actually looked like a pretty mean post,
i guess what i am getting at is YES, i had the same trouble before, but i really do not think ebay calculated, then RE calculated your shipping... there is some misunderstanding there.  so contact the seller, i am sure it can be dropped.

[J888www]

[/other than looking at things for other people, i don't see the need to log in to another nation's ebay.]

US site offers far greater variety and availability than UK site. Although International Shipping might create obstacles. If not for these obstacles, I would of gotten myself a CH DT225 Trackball before you greedy people snapped them all up.

[ironcoder]

severe ebay error or user error.  i have never seen this, and the calculated charges have always been the same as what i see at checkout.

Yeah but like I said I was using the so-called global ebay site. There isn't any reason to believe it works the same (or at all) as the site you use.

The fact that they don't show the shipping charges in the account summary or invoice strongly suggests this is an intentional practice of ripping people off, which they can't get away with in America.

I am saying again, show me a bottom line so when I click Buy I know exactly how much I am spending. Don't try to change the deal after I agree to it. That's exactly what they did. So no deal.

The seller sent me an invoice with a normal shipping charge and I paid him. That's the last time I use ebay.

[Rajagra]

Don't know if this is relevant, but you can check postage for multiple items in advance by going to the shipping tab and entering the quantity. This can be important because tipping the weight over a certain amount can completely change the choice of shipping service and/or change the rate drastically.


Might be differently done in your country's ebay format though?

Also you can sometimes wait for a shipping invoice from the seller. It should contain a link for paying the right amount.

[AndrewZorn]

all messed up

right, but i am saying if the seller has MARKED that the item will ship to canada and japan, does it no show up on ebay.ca and ebay.co.jp?

if you are going to the site and then asking buyers to ship to your country despite their initial decision, i mind as well go to ebay.co.jp and start asking sellers there if they will ship to the US...

EDIT and Rajagra posted the only way I knew to calculate shipping... so I don't know of the 'other' way.

[ironcoder]

The shipping charges on the global site are calculated based on what you're purchasing at time of checkout.

It showed me the quantity of items and how much they cost, then there was a spinning circle saying "calculating shipping charges" while my location is shown on the screen. Then 20 dollars showed up in that spot.

Click Buy to complete this transaction. Something like that.

[Shawn Stanford]

1) eBay calculates a shipping price for the items (20 dollars) and asks me to confirm by clicking Buy

eBay doesn't calculate shipping. Shipping calculations are provided by the seller, usually through a link to a third-party engine.

You will often seen lowball item prices linked to high shipping costs because eBay fees are calculated based on item cost; shipping costs are not figured in. Watches are a good example of this, and you will often see an item worth $100 listed with a $25 price and $75 shipping fee.

[ironcoder]

right, but i am saying if the seller has MARKED that the item will ship to canada and japan, does it no show up on ebay.ca and ebay.co.jp?

I don't know but I wouldn't be surprised if it doesn't.

On the American site you can find that they ship just to America, or just to America and Canada, or internationally. Rarely do they list specific countries. They do, but rarely.

On the global site, they have sellers who apparently agree to sell internationally or maybe that is where they can specify countries they will or won't ship to. I tried the American site first, because it's cheaper, but the 3 stores I found wouldn't ship here.

Then I went to the global site (answered yes when I logged on and it asked me) and then I saw that it filtered items I could see based on where I was. It appears if you want to specify countries to sell to, you do that on the global site.

if you are going to the site and then asking buyers to ship to your country despite their initial decision, i mind as well go to ebay.co.jp and start asking sellers there if they will ship to the US...

Depending on what you want to buy, that may not be a bad idea. Not everythin is available in every country, although most things are available in America. Sometimes you can convince a store to sell to you (I have done this, of course not through ebay) even though they may have a stated policy of not selling to your country. When they hear you on the phone or get a reasonable email they can tell you are not some criminal trying to buy stuff with a stolen paypal account or credit card.

[ironcoder]

eBay doesn't calculate shipping. Shipping calculations are provided by the seller, usually through a link to a third-party engine.

That doesn't make any sense because if that was how it worked you would expect to see the same price all through the transaction. The fact that before you click buy it's one price and after you click buy it's another price, suggests at least 2 parties are getting involved in pricing the shipping.

If it was like you said, why is there such a radical difference between the prices before you click buy and after?

When I contacted the seller, he offered me two shipping options, neither of which was remotely close to the insane prices ebay was listing, ostensibly on behalf of that seller.

[Rajagra]

One more thing. I recently bought a few items from one seller. I paid right away and the ebay status changed to reflect that. Later the seller refunded some of the postage because he combined shipping. Ebay changed the status to unpaid!

Everything worked out OK, though I had to jump through a few hoops to leave feedback.

The point being the ebay system isn't perfect, but if you don't panic things can get resolved.

[ironcoder]

Anyway I'm done with this thread, thanks for all the support.

[FourOhFour]

right, but i am saying if the seller has MARKED that the item will ship to canada and japan, does it no show up on ebay.ca and ebay.co.jp?

When listing, sellers can opt for visibility on other ebay sites, for an added fee.

[AndrewZorn]

When listing, sellers can opt for visibility on other ebay sites, for an added fee.

you sure you aren't thinking of different sections?

what would be the point of listing worldwide shipping if only US users will see it?  i have sent many things overseas, but have never paid extra to list... so all those people just happen to check the US site, too?

i find this hard to believe.

[microsoft windows]

I bet that seller's gonna have some negative feedback...

[TheSoulhunter]

Heh, I feel with you... >_<

Just lost 270 bucks there because some crook hacked the account of another member!

[TheSoulhunter]

Dormant (didn't sell something) for ~3 months. But then again, he only sold like 3 items per year on average, so it wasn't that suspicious.
Well, lawsuit is in process... Let's see if I'll get my money back! :/

[nowsharing]

Sorry to jump in here (admittedly, I only read the first half of this thread until you started throwing insults at everyone who responded), but the problem isn't ebay, it's the fact that some people are impossible to please and incapable of admitting guilt for their own stupidity.

I would hate to be the seller dealing with you, because you sound to be the type of person who can't accept that THEY made the mistake. You bought-it-now, and clicked through TWO (!) buy-it-now confirmation dialogs. Now you are almost definitely *****ing to the seller that he "owes" you $20 shipping.
There's a page directly after hitting buy it now that shows your purchase, with all charges, taxes, whatever, included. You then have to again hit buy-it-now, after reviewing the charges.

Believe me, believe every other geekhacker, believe google, you screwed up Ironcoder! Ebay is designed for computer illiterate techno-idiots...

The worst part is that to clear everything up, you can just tell your problem to Brian and I guarantee you he'll just cancel your order. No one wants to deal with the scenario you're creating.

"Click on the "Buy It Now" link once you have made your decision. This will bring up a new screen that asks you whether you're sure you want to buy the item at the "Buy It Now" price. Click to confirm that you do want to continue with the purchase. This will take you to a final screen that confirms your purchase and asks you to pay. You can pay immediately using the PayPal link provided on this screen, or you can go back to the auction listing and pay through that screen. If you want the seller to send an invoice, use the Request Total link that will be on the listing screen once you've made the purchase."
From http://www.ehow.com/how_4827882_use-buy-now-ebay.html

[chimera15]

I've sold a lot on ebay, and bought as well.  The problem is from the seller side.  The seller sets the shipping, and what discount they give for multiple items.  It has nothing to do with ebay "being a rip off site".  This is purely a problem of the seller you're buying from.

Down at the bottom of the page in multiple item auctions it will state what the discount is, if it doesn't assume it's the full tripling of shipping for the 3 items.  You'll have to negotiate with the seller before you buy to see if you can get a refund or for them to change the auction,  if not you're sol.

  A lot of shippers charge as much as they do for multiple items because the items are already boxed and ready to be shipped as individual items, and they're still going to use packaging which may still cost a lot, especially if packed well.

[ironcoder]

You guys just don't get it. I already said the price changed before I clicked buy and after.

When I contacted the seller he gave me two choices, neither one was even close to the gouging job ebay tried to pull on me. The seller has nothing to do with this ripoff scheme.

Why do you keep blaming the seller? Go try to buy something on global ebay if you don't live in America, Canada, or the UK and then come back with new found knowledge.

[ironcoder]

How do you know? I'm sure a lot of people are foolish enough to pay the "new" prices. In most countries what they're doing is illegal as hell, lousy programming or not. If they can't do ecommerce honestly they need to get out of the business.

I know how much I'm going to pay, which is what was displayed before I clicked Buy. That's why I clicked Buy, because the terms displayed were acceptable. Still with me so far? Then the prices suddenly went up after you click the Buy button? Got it?

After the Buy button gets clicked they tried to change the terms of the deal. After I contacted the seller, he quoted me pretty much the original price which was reasonable. Why are you trying to imply I didn't want to pay fair shipping charges? What do you have in this and why are you trying to dry hump me?

Don't keep trying to make fools of yourselves justifying crooked trading practices, bad programmers, or anything else. or making idiotic comments like USPS, DHL etc don't work for free. Read the thread or get a new hobby.

[ironcoder]

Did the price of the product change, or the price of shipping?

Read the thread, already answered in the opening post.

Hey, if I login on ebay USA, switch to my USA address, buy something, and before I pay switch to my Dutch address, it just refuses to pick it up - that is, it will charge me US shipping for shipping to my Dutch address.

Nice data point, but I already said I signed into the global site and my address was displayed through the whole transaction.

Alternatively, I could have payed and whined endlessly about the injustice of the correction later

I did none of the above, read the thread. I contacted the seller and got basically the original shipping price (didn't I just say this numerous times already and repeat it just one post ago?)

You're the ones milking this and making the thread endless. Just let it die. But no, you like to stir ****. This isn't about you, so just let it go.

and how it violates my rights, and post about this injustice

I wanted to point this out in case anybody used the global site and cared about the principle. I notice some people have a hard time with that idea. I don't like the idea that people change prices before and after the deal is done. That's called a freakin' ripoff. If that doesn't apply to you, or you like being ripped off, just don't post a reply.

and attack anyone who replies.

That's funny. Most of the responses were to say "you're stupid, you don't know how to use the site, ebay isn't for you, etc." You're accusing me of attacking people? You just accused me of not wanting to pay postage. Don't try to turn the tables, you're just stirring **** and you have nothing to add.

If you wanna jerk off, just don't expect us to watch you.

Any alternatives? Although playing with lego seems a nice hobby.

That's already taken. What you should do is talk about what you know. I reported what I saw during the transaction, you weren't there. Stick with what you know and you'll avoid embarrassing yourself too much.

[nowsharing]

I'm in Brazil and never had a problem with a price changing, and there are always two submissions required to play a buy-it-now.

[FourOhFour]

Yawn, another Writer of Text Walls with fantasies I actually read that crap.

I'd read long posts with content over an overly long way of saying "tl;dr" any day.

[ironcoder]

Well, in a situation like you've described (REGARDLESS of whose fault it may have been), you should have contacted the seller before paying and said "Hey, you quoted me for ___ cost to ship to ___, but the checkout system isn't giving me that as an option. Could you please look into this or cancel the transaction? Thanks!"

Sellers usually enjoy the prospect of free positive feedback, which is something I always offer in a situation like that as a point to convince them to help.

What an excellent suggestion! Check the opening post where I wrote:

"I sent my request to cancel the order along with a request for total to the shop, that seems like the only way you can get a message to them."

You guys seem to be answering each others questions and assertions and imagining all sorts of things I never said that somebody else did.

Please for the love of everything decent, let this thread DIE! :amen:

[ironcoder]

No, like I said I never had any issue with the seller, he got right back to me with two reasonable offers on shipping (also stated this several times already!) one was about the same as the price shown originally the other ten bucks more...both less than half the cheapest of the two options after I clicked buy. The seller was responsive and the deal is done, the mice are on the plane. I told him I was cancelling my ebay account but thanked him for his fast reply and a good transaction. By the time I tried to give him a good rating my account closure request was already in progress and I couldn't do any ratings or contact any sellers.