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Author Topic: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?  (Read 5940 times)

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Offline manolo

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A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« on: Fri, 04 March 2016, 21:37:57 »
Hey guys,

I am fairly new to mechanical keyboards. About one year ago, I purchased a full size WASD Code with Cherry MX Clear. I like them very much, I love the very soft feeling of increasing resistance when reaching actuation point, then the spring pushing my finger back up. Kinda feels like a trampoline. But a full size takes space, and I don't have much on my desk (very little actually). So about a month ago I moved my Code to my workplace (and god it feels good to type on it all day) and I decided to make the big leap and go for 60% keyboard (KBP V60), trying a new switch in the process : the Matias Quiet Click.

The thing is, I found out I'm not exactly a big fan of those. The main culprit : the decreasing resistance after actuation point which causes me to bottom out all the time. Also, I tend to miss keys way too often with that one. Some people seem to love those switchs, but it seems like it's just not for me.

That said, I'm still curious to try some other switches. Are there other switches I might like, considering the above ? Or should I stick with Clears and go for either a V60 or Pok3r ? Or should I stick with my V60 a bit longer, see if my opinion changes over time ?

Thank you !

Edit : BTW, I don't like those switches but I do like the 60% form factor. Regarding switches, I would rather go for a non-clicky switch.
« Last Edit: Fri, 04 March 2016, 21:42:52 by manolo »
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WASD Code 104 keys (Cherry MX Clear)  -  KBP V60 Olivette (Matias Click)  -  KBP V60 Dolch (Matias Quiet Click)  -  Massdrop Infinity, bent metal plate, DSA Blank PBT (Zealio 78g) - Topre Realforce 87U (55g)

Offline nubbinator

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #1 on: Fri, 04 March 2016, 21:38:19 »
HHKB

Source, former Ergo Clear and Ghost Black proselyte.
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Offline rowdy

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #2 on: Sat, 05 March 2016, 04:26:15 »
MX clears are the ideal choice for a MX clear lover.

Why not get a CODE TKL?  Yes I know it's not a 60%, but you like the CODE, and TKL is not much bigger than 60% :p
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Offline Malenky

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #3 on: Sat, 05 March 2016, 04:33:39 »
HHKB if you want to try something new and are willing to adjust to the different layout etc. As well as willing to pay the price!

Otherwise, can't go far wrong with a POK3R with MX Clears. You also have the huge advantage of being able to change the keycaps very easily, since it's absolutely standard layout.
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Offline chyros

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #4 on: Sat, 05 March 2016, 04:47:55 »
I don't think I have found anything that feels like MX Clears. Probably your best bet is to stick with them.
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Offline axtran

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #5 on: Sat, 05 March 2016, 08:03:03 »
What's the wrongdoing in bottoming out? Weird keyboard rumors again...
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Offline ctm

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #6 on: Sat, 05 March 2016, 08:41:10 »
I think the OP might not enjoy HHKB. Topre is more similar to Matias quiet switch than to MX clear IMO. With Topre after the tactile bump, the force decreases until close to the bottom (so you are likely to bottom out with Topre). You can take a look at Topre force curve to have an idea.
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Offline manolo

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #7 on: Sat, 05 March 2016, 09:54:44 »
Thank you very much for your inputs.

Regarding Topre, I am indeed curious about this switch I've read so much good about, but considering the high price of Topre boards, I would prefer to give them a test drive beforehand. I could go for the cheaper Type Heaven, but as I said, size is important in my case, so it's either TKL or 60%. There's also what ctm said.

axtran : It's not that there is anything wrong with bottoming out. Some people love it, but I just don't like it. I find the landing to be too brutal for my fingers. My main concern also is that since I'm pressing keys deeper (or at least feel like I am) and the Quiet Click is less springy than my Clears, I feel like it takes more effort to take my fingers out. Maybe some kind of o-ring mod could help with the travel distance issue.
« Last Edit: Sat, 05 March 2016, 09:58:57 by manolo »
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WASD Code 104 keys (Cherry MX Clear)  -  KBP V60 Olivette (Matias Click)  -  KBP V60 Dolch (Matias Quiet Click)  -  Massdrop Infinity, bent metal plate, DSA Blank PBT (Zealio 78g) - Topre Realforce 87U (55g)

Offline chyros

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #8 on: Sat, 05 March 2016, 10:08:37 »
Topre is pretty snappy. After the tactile bump, they fire downward. Because they are not mushy either, the rubber doesn't cushion the impact as much as cheap rubber domes do, either.

That said I consider Topre to be an excellent switch, and very pleasant to use, if overpriced.
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Offline rowdy

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #9 on: Sat, 05 March 2016, 23:35:50 »
Quote from: chyros on Sat, 05 March 2016, 04:47:55
I don't think I have found anything that feels like MX Clears. Probably your best bet is to stick with them.

I have not tried 55g Topre, but I get the feeling it would be lighter than clears.  Different force curve, yes, but probably closer than most other switches.  Maybe.
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Offline robbles

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #10 on: Tue, 08 March 2016, 14:53:03 »
If you're willing to go custom, Zealios are supposed to be comparable to Clears, with most people liking them more. You can checkout the review on keychatter.com
https://www.keychatter.com/2015/08/19/review-project-zealio-switches/
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Offline rxc92

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #11 on: Tue, 08 March 2016, 21:15:30 »
I used to be a big Topre fan, but found that Clears are even more to my preference (love that sound). Still love Topre but it's my #1.5; good keyboard is a CODE TKL (if you can find one) or most any Clear board out there, many are available in smaller forms.
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Offline rowdy

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #12 on: Wed, 09 March 2016, 04:02:48 »
Massdrop recently finished drops for TKL and full size CODE, with options of clears.
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"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

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Offline Magna224

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #13 on: Wed, 09 March 2016, 04:55:52 »
Topre, zealios, ergoclear, ALPS. Clears are my favorite stock cherry switch.
« Last Edit: Wed, 09 March 2016, 16:10:53 by Magna224 »
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Offline G-Dubs

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #14 on: Wed, 09 March 2016, 11:51:34 »
You might want to look into a v60 with Matias switches, which are a variant of ALPS switch.
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Offline nubbinator

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #15 on: Wed, 09 March 2016, 12:28:59 »
Quote from: robbles on Tue, 08 March 2016, 14:53:03
If you're willing to go custom, Zealios are supposed to be comparable to Clears, with most people liking them more. You can checkout the review on keychatter.com
https://www.keychatter.com/2015/08/19/review-project-zealio-switches/

By the time you buy the switches, stabilizers, PCB, plate, case, USB cable, and caps, you've already paid adid much as an HHKB.
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Offline spanyam

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #16 on: Wed, 09 March 2016, 12:38:47 »
Quote from: nubbinator on Wed, 09 March 2016, 12:28:59
By the time you buy the switches, stabilizers, PCB, plate, case, USB cable, and caps, you've already paid adid much as an HHKB.

Most likely more than an HHKB, depending on keycap set and case, both of which can easily go over $70 each ($100+ for some).
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Offline klennkellon

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #17 on: Wed, 09 March 2016, 14:36:38 »
From my own speculation, MX Clears and Buckling Springs both seem to promote not bottoming out, that being said, the switches feel nothing alike.

BS is extremely tactile, very clicky, quite stiff, MX Clear are moderately stiff, only slightly tactile, and not clicky.
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Offline manolo

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #18 on: Thu, 10 March 2016, 20:52:25 »
Thank you guys for your inputs !

G-Dubs : It's already what I have :)
robbles : Interesting article. I had never heard of those switch before, but they definitely seem interesting. A custom keyboard seems to be quite an expensive option, but I'll definitely try one day, just for the fun of the build itself as well as having MY keyboard :)

Since last time, I decided to give myself some time to think about it. I decided to stop comparing my Matias switches to the Clears and just start to think of it as a different experience. While I do love the soft bump and springiness on my Clears, I'm starting to find enjoyment in the snappiness of the Matias. I did some serious typing in the past few days, and I am getting back to my old speed. I guess I must have been going through my "what the f***"-phase, since it's only my second experience with a MK and the tactility of Matias switches is nothing like the Clear's.
I also went for a towel "mod" (actually T-shirt "mod", I don't have any spare towel :p). Quite the upgrade to me. It feels great, it seems to make bottoming out softer, and it also makes the keyboard delightfully silent ! The resonating desk was seriously annoying, strangely it did not bother nearly as much with the Clears (which were much more noisy). Must have been the more metallic sound.

For now, I think I'll be sticking with my Matias, see how much I enjoy it in the long run, but your inputs are definitely invaluable !
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WASD Code 104 keys (Cherry MX Clear)  -  KBP V60 Olivette (Matias Click)  -  KBP V60 Dolch (Matias Quiet Click)  -  Massdrop Infinity, bent metal plate, DSA Blank PBT (Zealio 78g) - Topre Realforce 87U (55g)

Offline Zorox

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #19 on: Fri, 11 March 2016, 06:39:47 »
I think you wanna try Zealios or ergo clears, and dont forget MX White too, although it is clicky, but kinda soft-click it has :D Pok3r is great when you want a programmable, and a V60 would do great if you dont need that feature.
« Last Edit: Fri, 11 March 2016, 06:41:26 by Zorox »
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Offline bmilcs

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #20 on: Sat, 12 March 2016, 17:00:03 »
Quote from: manolo on Sat, 05 March 2016, 09:54:44
Thank you very much for your inputs.

Regarding Topre, I am indeed curious about this switch I've read so much good about, but considering the high price of Topre boards, I would prefer to give them a test drive beforehand. I could go for the cheaper Type Heaven, but as I said, size is important in my case, so it's either TKL or 60%. There's also what ctm said.

axtran : It's not that there is anything wrong with bottoming out. Some people love it, but I just don't like it. I find the landing to be too brutal for my fingers. My main concern also is that since I'm pressing keys deeper (or at least feel like I am) and the Quiet Click is less springy than my Clears, I feel like it takes more effort to take my fingers out. Maybe some kind of o-ring mod could help with the travel distance issue.

Same here. Bottoming out wrecks my wrists and finger tips. Feels horrendous and can't be good on your hands. I can't use anything lighter than MX Clear... and even still, I'm thinking about modding them even heavier. My Pok3r w/ MX Clears is definitively lighter than my KUL was stock and the springs look and feel entirely different. Keep this in mind.
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Offline LiquidEvilGaming

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #21 on: Sun, 13 March 2016, 19:49:51 »
I loved my pok3r with Clears for a long long time, however i find much of what i loved about Clears without the fatigue using 55G realforce.
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Offline Magna224

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #22 on: Mon, 14 March 2016, 07:39:38 »
I love the tactile switches..

Buckling springs are tactile and heavy like others have said but very different.
« Last Edit: Mon, 14 March 2016, 07:41:48 by Magna224 »
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Offline jerue

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #23 on: Mon, 14 March 2016, 08:34:17 »
Best solution for an mx clear lover is to find some older clears! vintage, with some 62g 24k springs, and a very light coat of lube. Skidata clears are also nice if you can get one of those boards.

tbh, vintage clears like the ones I described above are my favorite switch besides 55g Topre; some days I prefer those clears.
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Offline bmilcs

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #24 on: Tue, 15 March 2016, 06:22:10 »
Quote from: jerue on Mon, 14 March 2016, 08:34:17
Best solution for an mx clear lover is to find some older clears! vintage, with some 62g 24k springs, and a very light coat of lube. Skidata clears are also nice if you can get one of those boards.

tbh, vintage clears like the ones I described above are my favorite switch besides 55g Topre; some days I prefer those clears.

Shipping estimates say that I will finally be able to test out my lubed / clipped / 78g ogre-cleared KUL ES-87. I broke the #*@*(@& wire when unplugging it and just went ahead and modded it anyway. It's been almost 2 months since I started lol. Can't wait to see how it is.
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Offline steelcity

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #25 on: Fri, 18 March 2016, 10:22:50 »
I couldn't find a board I wanted in clears (wanted fullsize, pbt, context menu key, non-backlit), so I ordered a bunch of Zealio purples in 65 G and 67 G weights and am planning on doing swapping the switches on some of my FC900 boards so I can see which weight I like best.
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Offline chyros

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Re: A good switch for a MX Clear lover ?
« Reply #26 on: Fri, 18 March 2016, 11:26:16 »
How about Alps integrated dome? They get fairly resistive near the end of the keystroke.
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