Author Topic: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% O-Ring Mount (GB Preparation)  (Read 39813 times)

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Offline Windeh

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[IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% O-Ring Mount (GB Preparation)
« on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 09:58:18 »
_________________________________________________________________________________________
  • 24-Dec-2018
GROUP BUY THREAD IS UP!!!

Updates:
  • 23rd October 2018 - Interest Check Posted
  • 26th October 2018 - Placed order for Prototypes
  • 11th November 2018 - Prototype Received
  • 18th November 2018 - Design Finalized, Pre-GB IC Form Posted
  • 23rd November 2018 - Master Sample prototype ordered, Anodizing color samples ordered
  • 13th December 2018 - Received Reflex Master Sample prototype HERE.
  • 16th December 2018 - Reflex Typing Test Posted HERE.
  • 18th December 2018 - Received Paradox Master Sample prototype HERE.
  • 19th December 2018 - Removed Blue Grey color and copper plate option. Details in THIS post.
  • 20th December 2018 - Color Samples Posted HERE
  • 20th December 2018 - GB Pricing announced HERE
  • 24th December 2018 - GB Thread up!! HERE
__________________________________________________________________________________________


207387-0

Hi geekhack,

I'm Windeh, a relative new member of the community.
After a few frustrating attempts at sniper-submitting google forms & raffling GB spot from popular designers and failing, I asked myself, why not just design a keyboard myself? ;)

I thought about what would make MY perfect keyboard? With a few ideas in mind, I set about downloading Fusion 360.

.
.
.

A couple of YouTube Tutorials later, shapes resembling a rectangular block started to form…

First, let me highlight some of the more unique features of my design;


Mounting.

205997-1          206017-2

As per the title of this IC, the plate is Sandwiched between O-Rings, with no part of the plate in contact with either the casing or the screw, creating a true “Floating” design. I call this mounting method “O-ring-Sandwich-Floating mount”. You heard it here first.

Unlike traditional "Gasket" mount, where most contact between the gasket & the plate is desired together with high clamping force to dampen all vibrations, this mounting method more closely resembles a xylophone, with minimal contact surface and added isolation between the plate and the rest of the keyboard. The design when tightened, does not clamp directly onto the plate through the O-Ring, but stops when the O-Ring posts on the top & bottom of the case meet. Depending on the Durometer (hardness) of the O-Ring, the plate will experience a stronger or lighter clamping force, therefore change the way it is allowed to resonates (and to a smaller degree, feel). By simply changing the hardness of the O-Ring, you can easily tune the resonance & tone of the plate.


Why the O-Ring Cutout?

206585-3   206587-4   206589-5

Proper application of O-Rings requires that they are supported on both sides perpendicular to the force exerted. Without the support of the side wall created by the cutout, the O-Ring would be easily squashed, causing rapid deformation & deterioration of the material, while not providing enough pressure onto the plate. The O-Ring would start to harden & crack, altering the acoustics & feel of the keyboard with time, and possibly cause looseness of the plate.

There is, in my opinion, no alternative method to apply the O-Ring in this application.


Floating?

206591-6

There is a minimum of 0.5mm gap between the plate & any hard surface of the case.


Spacebar “MEME” cut.

207399-7

The first time finished building my TX60, I immediately noticed that with such a rigid sandwich mount, the spacebar makes a loud “KUNK” every time it bottoms out. I know there are mods out there that addresses this “feature”, however I wanted to try to address this from the keyboard design side, and tried to reduce the rigidity of the mounting post closest to the spacebar, to give it some “flex” where it is needed the most.


ANSI layout only.

207397-8

After having to deal with a wonky “\” key on an universal layout, I said “No more”.


Compatibility with existing PCBs on the market.

206003-9

Not gonna lie. I have no knowledge on PCB design and no friends with that skill set. I don't want to be tied to a proprietary PCB that you’re SOL when it dies down the road. I will not force RGB, Hot Swap Sockets, Bluetooth, or JigOn down your throat. You choose your poison.


Hate tall fronts?

206005-10

This one is under 20mm.


Two Very different chassis designs and focus, same plate & top.

206007-11

 Because choices.


I think I have gone on long enough… Let me introduce the Reflex and Paradox 60% Keyboards;

Reflex : The name refers to the reflex port on a speaker system. I heard people in the community are big on sounds, so I took a literal approach, and thought of the PCB & Plate as the diaphragm on a loudspeaker, then proceeded to designed a reflex port for all that juicy auditory goodness to escape out the bottom of the case. And the weight. You can't forget about the weight.

207389-12


207391-13


Next up, it’s the Paradox :

The MK Community is a hard place to be an enthusiast. You want to throw your money at something, but it is thrown back at your face in 41 seconds. ;)

Not gonna pretend that the Paradox didn’t take inspiration from other keyboards. But with the 60% layout, plate mounting method, weight quantity & design, material and all of the above, I believe there are enough uniqueness that there is a place for the Paradox to exist in the MK community.

207393-14


207395-15


Now, some details.

  • Case: Standard configuration in 6063 aluminium, optional upgrade to 7075-T6 aluminium
  • Weight: Sandblasted/Polished Brass finish options. Clear coating option for sandblasted only, as coating does not adhere well to polished brass
  • Screws: YFS Grade 12.9 Alloy Steel Hex Screw
  • O-Rings: Will include a few different hardness/material O-Rings
  • Colour: For 6063 Aluminium - Normal Anodizing in Black, Dark Grey, Deep Red, Royal Blue, Silver, Rose Gold (maybe). For 7075-T6 Aluminium - Hard Anodize in Black only. All anodizing in Matt finish only.
  • Plate: Standard kit with Brass plate, optional Aluminium & Brass Plate extras, Sandblasted
  • Layout: 60% ANSI WK/WKL with split right shift and optional split backspace & stepped caps lock
  • Quantity: 30 total spots
  • Timeline: Aiming at December / January GB
  • Design: Both Paradox & Reflex will be made, 15 sets of each
GB Pricing (All pricing in USD):
  • NO PCB INCLUDED IN THIS GB!
  • $490 for base kit includes 6063 Case Top (Standard or WKL) & Case Bottom in normal anodizing, Clear Coated / Raw Sandblasted Brass Weight and Raw Sandblasted Brass Plate
Optional extras:
  • $35 for upgrading to 7075-T6 Case Top & Bottom in Matt Black Hard Coat Anodizing.
  • $20 for Polished Brass Weight (Polished on exterior sides only, Raw).
  • Extra Plates in Raw Sandblasted Brass ($50) / Sandblasted Aluminium (Anodized Deep Red - $60)


As I said at the beginning of the GB, the keyboard is mainly designed to be MY endgame. If a group buy is happening, it will be a very small quantity to dip my toe in the water and have a feel of what I'm getting myself into.

Feel free to leave comments below, and I will reply when I can.

___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

206327-16
« Last Edit: Sun, 23 December 2018, 10:59:11 by Windeh »

Offline Windeh

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #1 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 09:58:34 »
Reserved.

Offline hayt

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #2 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 10:01:32 »
I like it

Offline dantambok

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #3 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 10:04:42 »
Awesome idea. Will be following this  :D goodluck on the proto!
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2x TGR Alice / TGR 910 RE / TGR 910 CE / TGR 910 VKC / 2x TGR Jane V2 / 2x Matrix 2.0 / Matrix 2.2 / Matrix 1.2OG / Lyn Whale v2 / Lyn EM7 v3 / DK Saver / 2x Keycult No. 1/60 / Hachi / Kyuu / Duck Orion V2 / 2x TGRxSinga Unikorn / QXP / TX1800 V1 /  JER80 / TMO50 / 2x 86u / ION i69 / LZ MP / 2x FMJ80 / TGR Jane V2 CE / Matrix Project F / IDB60 / is0  / MXSS / Atom TKL / Duck Viper v3 / HBCP / Noxary 280 / LZ Physix / FLX Virgo / Modern M0110 / Vista65 / Matrix 2.0 ADD

Coming soon --   Lynx50 / Matrix 2.0 ADD / 2x GSKT-00 / Noxary Vulcan Pro / 350 mimi / TGR Police / Fuji 65 / Haus65


Offline PaultheSloth

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #4 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 10:10:01 »
Looks good, the new mount is interesting. Standard 60% layout with split backspace and R Shift will be  :thumb: :thumb:
Polaris|Leaf60|QXP|DC60|Planck|SKB60|Tokyo60|UT-47|AnnePro

Offline laserbeamspewpew

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #5 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 11:39:52 »
I’m going to be that guy...HHKB?

Offline Hako

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #6 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 12:38:03 »
Interesting, I feel like the option of a split backspace is pretty important for a 60% though

Offline mgsickler

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #7 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 12:50:32 »
I really like both of them.

Offline ChrisSwires

  • Posts: 151
Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #8 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 13:00:29 »
Love it, really well thought through and documented IC too. I'll likely be down either way and hope all goes well with the prototype!

Offline Acereconkeys

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #9 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 13:04:33 »
Cool idea! Hope the prototype goes well can't wait to see it.
TMO50 | Jane V2 CE Incoming | Realforce 87u 55g | Aergo

Aergo design and build log: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=103681.msg2840918#msg2840918

Offline HardcoreDesk

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #10 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 13:23:17 »
I really want the paradox board, it looks fantastic!

Offline hineybush

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #11 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 13:30:22 »
burger mount is best mount

Offline iNViSiBiLiTi

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #12 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 13:39:38 »
This design (sides and back weight) looks a lot like the TGR x SINGA Unikorn.
60%: Prophet, GSKT-00, Weaven

TKL: TGR Jane V2, Jane V2 CE, KFE, Noxary 280 S, Acrylic Unicorn, Mira SE, Igris V1

Bulgogi Board (VA104M)

Offline Etherealsound

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #13 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 13:47:15 »
These both seem amazing, The idea of using o-rings like this is certainly very unique. I'd love to participate if it came down to small gb

Offline Acereconkeys

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #14 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 13:51:18 »
Am I missing something here? For the protoype/jane weight design model, there are 3 screw holes on bottom that sandwich to plate, and then 4 that seem to mount the weight where are the other 3 sandwich screw positions for the top of the plate?
TMO50 | Jane V2 CE Incoming | Realforce 87u 55g | Aergo

Aergo design and build log: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=103681.msg2840918#msg2840918

Offline Windeh

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #15 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 14:23:43 »
Interest check poll for which design you prefer is up!! join the poll here: https://goo.gl/forms/zSIoUT1tlY7fELAW2

Thanks for the kind words people, really a moral boost  ;D

Am I missing something here? For the protoype/jane weight design model, there are 3 screw holes on bottom that sandwich to plate, and then 4 that seem to mount the weight where are the other 3 sandwich screw positions for the top of the plate?

Maybe this will help.

206036-0
« Last Edit: Tue, 23 October 2018, 14:27:22 by Windeh »

Offline hineybush

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #16 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 14:28:01 »
fwiw, i'm doing an extremely similar style mount (although reversible/removable) with my hbcp:



I've tested it with my prototypes and the o rings definitely provide a difference. Not necessarily in feel as I haven't tested two fully-built boards yet, but absolutely with sound (brass plate) so far.

Offline Windeh

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #17 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 14:40:04 »
I’m going to be that guy...HHKB?

Looks good, the new mount is interesting. Standard 60% layout with split backspace and R Shift will be  :thumb: :thumb:

Interesting, I feel like the option of a split backspace is pretty important for a 60% though

Most likely there will not be different top options for standard and HHKB layouts, however split backspace will probably be a sacrifice i'm willing to make.


fwiw, i'm doing an extremely similar style mount (although reversible/removable) with my hbcp:

Show Image


I've tested it with my prototypes and the o rings definitely provide a difference. Not necessarily in feel as I haven't tested two fully-built boards yet, but absolutely with sound (brass plate) so far.

You see, hbcp is one of the GBs I'm super looking forwards to joining, however with my luck I'll probably not get in... Sorry for jumping the gun on the mounting style though ;D ;D  what they say about great minds?

I may need to adjust for sandwich tightness once I get my proto, as I'm basically eyeing all the tolerances and hoping for the best ...
« Last Edit: Tue, 23 October 2018, 14:42:29 by Windeh »

Offline Mcnos

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #18 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 15:18:56 »
Guys, stop. I can't keep hurting my funds like this.

Edit: nevermind. Put split bs option and I'll be in on it.
« Last Edit: Tue, 23 October 2018, 15:31:13 by Mcnos »

Offline Sshimosawa

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #19 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 15:27:30 »
So thought out. Well done.

Offline pixelpusher

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #20 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 15:49:15 »
I like it a lot, too.  I'm guessing this will be in the ballpark of $600? 

Offline SixtyLife

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #21 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 16:27:21 »
this looks like a nice little sibling for my jane 2.0
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Offline Nigolski

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #22 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 16:48:34 »
100% in for the wkl!  :thumb:
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Offline Jkush463

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #23 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 16:50:04 »
i like where this ones going neat for sure.

Offline Acereconkeys

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #24 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 18:58:05 »
Interest check poll for which design you prefer is up!! join the poll here: https://goo.gl/forms/zSIoUT1tlY7fELAW2

Thanks for the kind words people, really a moral boost  ;D

--

Maybe this will help.

(Attachment Link)

Ahhh yes that answers my question. Cool thanks.
TMO50 | Jane V2 CE Incoming | Realforce 87u 55g | Aergo

Aergo design and build log: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=103681.msg2840918#msg2840918

Offline Windeh

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #25 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 19:31:54 »
Interesting, I feel like the option of a split backspace is pretty important for a 60% though

Most likely there will not be different top options for standard and HHKB layouts, however split backspace will probably be a sacrifice i'm willing to make.

Guys, stop. I can't keep hurting my funds like this.

Edit: nevermind. Put split bs option and I'll be in on it.

I've added an Interest check option for Split Backspace in the poll form. Go speak your mind! :thumb:
« Last Edit: Tue, 23 October 2018, 19:34:08 by Windeh »

Offline cucgach

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #26 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 19:59:23 »
Reflex will dusk magnet i think but i love the design!!
Current: Filco TKL Majestouch | TX60 antique brass | NIU40 silver | H360 burgundy | Rama M6-A | tr.mk wooden 60 | Imperial Hue 60 | Tofu 65 silver | Tofu WKL navy | TMO50 green/poly | HB85 black/gray | TX108se titan gray (unbuild)| Gergo Kit: black PCB (unbuild) | Space65 gray/silver | Typewriter68 ceramic white (unbuild) | Think6.5 frost poly (unbuild)
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Offline dantambok

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #27 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 20:20:09 »
It was really hard choosing between the two proposed designs! Also, I like your taste for the layout options  :p
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Offline Puddsy

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #28 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 21:43:11 »
Love it I'll take 3

I was gonna do this kind of mounting on my own board
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Offline bthezebra

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #29 on: Tue, 23 October 2018, 21:52:13 »
Nice job with your first design, very interested in seeing how your proto turns out!

Offline oh_chesteroni

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #30 on: Wed, 24 October 2018, 20:32:14 »
Wow, really impressed by both of these boards! Stoked on the reflex, and to see how it sounds.

Offline SynkRz

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #31 on: Thu, 25 October 2018, 05:04:09 »
Whoa this looks amazing

Offline xantiema

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #32 on: Thu, 25 October 2018, 06:25:12 »
this looks like a nice little sibling for my jane 2.0

Doubt it, that'd would also entirely kill it for me :p

Offline DJSwayde

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #33 on: Thu, 25 October 2018, 07:03:44 »
This looks interesting, I might be interested in joining for either one.
« Last Edit: Thu, 25 October 2018, 07:05:15 by DJSwayde »
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Offline R4WBIT

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #34 on: Thu, 25 October 2018, 09:11:54 »
Definitely interested if the final version supports ISO! :D

Offline JFKroflcopter

  • Posts: 91
Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #35 on: Thu, 25 October 2018, 10:07:25 »
This looks great! Very fond of the paradox design and your thoughts regarding layouts.

Offline Windeh

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #36 on: Thu, 25 October 2018, 11:19:48 »
Alright guys, quick update...

I have placed an order with one factory for prototypes of both designs, and currently in discussion with another factory that guarantees tolerance to ISO 2768 Grade F (Fine), with QC reports & HD finishing photos for approval and everything...

I think with my choice of material, complicated design & tight tolerance specs, cost for the GB would be insane...  :-X

Offline Mcnos

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #37 on: Thu, 25 October 2018, 11:20:59 »
Alright guys, quick update...

I have placed an order with one factory for prototypes of both designs, and currently in discussion with another factory that guarantees tolerance to ISO 2768 Grade F (Fine), with QC reports & HD finishing photos for approval and everything...

I think with my choice of material, complicated design & tight tolerance specs, cost for the GB would be insane...  :-X

 :( :( :( :(

Offline dantambok

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #38 on: Thu, 25 October 2018, 11:23:02 »
what would be the turnaround time for the proto? really excited to see them both!  :p
Stuff  I have
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2x TGR Alice / TGR 910 RE / TGR 910 CE / TGR 910 VKC / 2x TGR Jane V2 / 2x Matrix 2.0 / Matrix 2.2 / Matrix 1.2OG / Lyn Whale v2 / Lyn EM7 v3 / DK Saver / 2x Keycult No. 1/60 / Hachi / Kyuu / Duck Orion V2 / 2x TGRxSinga Unikorn / QXP / TX1800 V1 /  JER80 / TMO50 / 2x 86u / ION i69 / LZ MP / 2x FMJ80 / TGR Jane V2 CE / Matrix Project F / IDB60 / is0  / MXSS / Atom TKL / Duck Viper v3 / HBCP / Noxary 280 / LZ Physix / FLX Virgo / Modern M0110 / Vista65 / Matrix 2.0 ADD

Coming soon --   Lynx50 / Matrix 2.0 ADD / 2x GSKT-00 / Noxary Vulcan Pro / 350 mimi / TGR Police / Fuji 65 / Haus65


Offline slxdegrees

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #39 on: Thu, 25 October 2018, 11:27:52 »
If this is successful, will there be a r2?

Offline Windeh

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #40 on: Thu, 25 October 2018, 12:12:55 »
Alright, it's 1 am in Singapore, great time to do a /reply all

Love it, really well thought through and documented IC too. I'll likely be down either way and hope all goes well with the prototype!
Hey thanks for the support!! Great fan of your photo/typing videos.  :thumb:

Love it I'll take 3

I was gonna do this kind of mounting on my own board
Where do I send the invoice? The proto prices are killing me...

Wow, really impressed by both of these boards! Stoked on the reflex, and to see how it sounds.
So would I!! It should sound different depending on what material you place the Reflex on...  :D

This looks great! Very fond of the paradox design and your thoughts regarding layouts.
Thanks! Paradox seems to be a popular choice. Will see how the proto turns out.

So thought out. Well done.
Thanks! I do tend to overthink small details...  :(

These both seem amazing, The idea of using o-rings like this is certainly very unique. I'd love to participate if it came down to small gb
Thanks for the support! Seems that the O-Ring mount was the secret sauce for many private projects before I spilled the beans...  :p

I really like both of them.

I like it a lot, too.  I'm guessing this will be in the ballpark of $600? 
Thanks Guys!! Hopefully the cost drops substantially with quantity, cus $600 aint gonna cut it currently...

Cool idea! Hope the prototype goes well can't wait to see it.
Makes 2 of us.  ;)

I like it

i like where this ones going neat for sure.
Thanks for the support!

burger mount is best mount
Now Burger mount is way awesomer then what I came up with...  :(

Awesome idea. Will be following this  :D goodluck on the proto!
Thanks, hope I don't disappoint!

100% in for the wkl!  :thumb:
Thanks for the support! I also want a WKL as I actually don't own one...

I really want the paradox board, it looks fantastic!
Thanks! Wanted something more subdued to contrast with the loud Reflex design.  ;D

Definitely interested if the final version supports ISO! :D
They will definitely support the I, S & O keys...  ;)

Reflex will dusk magnet i think but i love the design!!
I don't think dust will be of any concern... try sliding your finger across the underside of your monitor, compared to the top side...  :D

This looks interesting, I might be interested in joining for either one.
Thanks! The first buy will be small so I don't embarrass myself if I cant make MOQ...  :-X

It was really hard choosing between the two proposed designs! Also, I like your taste for the layout options  :p
WKL Best KL

what would be the turnaround time for the proto? really excited to see them both!  :p
They quoted ex-factory date early Nov...  :eek:

Nice job with your first design, very interested in seeing how your proto turns out!
Thanks! Nothing a bit of frustration cant achieve...  ;)

Alright guys, quick update...

I have placed an order with one factory for prototypes of both designs, and currently in discussion with another factory that guarantees tolerance to ISO 2768 Grade F (Fine), with QC reports & HD finishing photos for approval and everything...

I think with my choice of material, complicated design & tight tolerance specs, cost for the GB would be insane...  :-X

 :( :( :( :(

If this is successful, will there be a r2?
The real question is, will there be a R1?  :-X


All caught up. Have a great day/night guys!  :D

Offline dubious

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Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #41 on: Thu, 25 October 2018, 12:47:47 »
I like the design. My vote is for the Paradox. Really interested in seeing a prototype  :thumb:

The Reflex 'sound ports' seem counter productive if you are trying to reduce sound with gaskets and flexy spacebar cutouts.

Offline Windeh

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 301
  • a no name
Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #42 on: Thu, 25 October 2018, 19:19:16 »
I like the design. My vote is for the Paradox. Really interested in seeing a prototype  :thumb:

The Reflex 'sound ports' seem counter productive if you are trying to reduce sound with gaskets and flexy spacebar cutouts.

Thanks for the kind words.  :thumb:

I don't think the mounting method used here can really be compared to the traditional "Gasket" mount, where the most contact between the gasket & the plate is desired with high clamping force to dampen all vibrations. In fact this mounting method more closely resembles a xylophone, with minimal contact surface and added isolation between the plate and the rest of the keyboard. Different O-Ring hardness can both have an effect on the typing feel, as well as control the amount of allowed resonance & tone of the plate. Hope that makes sense..

The spacebar cutout is my attempt at trying to bring the bottoming sound of the spacebar inline with the rest of the keys, and not really to reduce overall sound.

This is all in theory anyway, we will find out how it actually performs soon enough.  ;D
« Last Edit: Wed, 31 October 2018, 04:32:18 by Windeh »

Offline duckboi

  • Posts: 167
  • Location: FL - US
Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #43 on: Thu, 25 October 2018, 20:04:20 »
Alright, it's 1 am in Singapore, great time to do a /reply all

Love it, really well thought through and documented IC too. I'll likely be down either way and hope all goes well with the prototype!
Hey thanks for the support!! Great fan of your photo/typing videos.  :thumb:

Love it I'll take 3

I was gonna do this kind of mounting on my own board
Where do I send the invoice? The proto prices are killing me...

Wow, really impressed by both of these boards! Stoked on the reflex, and to see how it sounds.
So would I!! It should sound different depending on what material you place the Reflex on...  :D

This looks great! Very fond of the paradox design and your thoughts regarding layouts.
Thanks! Paradox seems to be a popular choice. Will see how the proto turns out.

So thought out. Well done.
Thanks! I do tend to overthink small details...  :(

These both seem amazing, The idea of using o-rings like this is certainly very unique. I'd love to participate if it came down to small gb
Thanks for the support! Seems that the O-Ring mount was the secret sauce for many private projects before I spilled the beans...  :p

I really like both of them.

I like it a lot, too.  I'm guessing this will be in the ballpark of $600? 
Thanks Guys!! Hopefully the cost drops substantially with quantity, cus $600 aint gonna cut it currently...

Cool idea! Hope the prototype goes well can't wait to see it.
Makes 2 of us.  ;)

I like it

i like where this ones going neat for sure.
Thanks for the support!

burger mount is best mount
Now Burger mount is way awesomer then what I came up with...  :(

Awesome idea. Will be following this  :D goodluck on the proto!
Thanks, hope I don't disappoint!

100% in for the wkl!  :thumb:
Thanks for the support! I also want a WKL as I actually don't own one...

I really want the paradox board, it looks fantastic!
Thanks! Wanted something more subdued to contrast with the loud Reflex design.  ;D

Definitely interested if the final version supports ISO! :D
They will definitely support the I, S & O keys...  ;)

Reflex will dusk magnet i think but i love the design!!
I don't think dust will be of any concern... try sliding your finger across the underside of your monitor, compared to the top side...  :D

This looks interesting, I might be interested in joining for either one.
Thanks! The first buy will be small so I don't embarrass myself if I cant make MOQ...  :-X

It was really hard choosing between the two proposed designs! Also, I like your taste for the layout options  :p
WKL Best KL

what would be the turnaround time for the proto? really excited to see them both!  :p
They quoted ex-factory date early Nov...  :eek:

Nice job with your first design, very interested in seeing how your proto turns out!
Thanks! Nothing a bit of frustration cant achieve...  ;)

Alright guys, quick update...

I have placed an order with one factory for prototypes of both designs, and currently in discussion with another factory that guarantees tolerance to ISO 2768 Grade F (Fine), with QC reports & HD finishing photos for approval and everything...

I think with my choice of material, complicated design & tight tolerance specs, cost for the GB would be insane...  :-X

 :( :( :( :(

If this is successful, will there be a r2?
The real question is, will there be a R1?  :-X


All caught up. Have a great day/night guys!  :D

nice
The m0ar empty you feel,  the m0ar space for Keycaps..

Offline Zilleon

  • Posts: 82
Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #44 on: Thu, 25 October 2018, 21:06:35 »
It looks so good, wish there was a non WKL option though :(

Offline ilouis_07

  • Posts: 651
  • Location: Singapore, China
  • Never Forget Your Origin
    • ILUMKB
Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #45 on: Thu, 25 October 2018, 21:19:08 »
wow good idea man, but what kind of o ring you gonna use(i meant the material)?

Offline CrazyNun

  • Posts: 88
Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #46 on: Fri, 26 October 2018, 01:59:49 »
Keeping an eye on this

Offline Windeh

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 301
  • a no name
Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #47 on: Fri, 26 October 2018, 08:11:46 »
wow good idea man, but what kind of o ring you gonna use(i meant the material)?

Thanks! I'm actually not sure on the O-Ring material yet, probably gonna walk into an gasket store and ask for 12 of every type and hardness of 5 ID, 8 OD O-rings they have, and get to work!!  ;D

Offline Windeh

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  • Posts: 301
  • a no name
Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #48 on: Fri, 26 October 2018, 09:13:25 »
Split backspace support.

206246-0

Offline zekkin

  • Posts: 462
  • Location: New York
  • my entire life was unlimited zekk works
Re: [IC] Reflex & Paradox - 60% WKL O-Ring Sandwich Floating plate mount
« Reply #49 on: Fri, 26 October 2018, 09:23:57 »
Split backspace support.

(Attachment Link)



These spots are looking quite (perhaps too) thin.
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