Author Topic: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?  (Read 2635 times)

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Offline no, the other guy

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Re: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?
« Reply #50 on: Fri, 25 January 2019, 03:36:06 »
Heh, Tapatalk ruins your spoiler.
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Offline Kaorix

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Re: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?
« Reply #51 on: Fri, 25 January 2019, 08:48:05 »
Im a big fan personally of 97 key boards.
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Offline Lazylewis

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Re: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?
« Reply #52 on: Fri, 25 January 2019, 13:58:23 »
I’m a programmer who types 9-10 hours a day everyday. I find hhkb and 10keyless the best for speed and ergonomics.

Offline BundleOfJoysticks

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Re: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?
« Reply #53 on: Wed, 30 January 2019, 18:44:02 »
What I find really unneccesary is the nav cluster. It makes keyboards wider without a reason because it's much easier to use the numpad to browse a text or a webpage.

Funny how people with similar needs can make basically opposite choices.

I like a numpad but can live without it. But dedicated nav keys are a must. I don't even like having home/end/pgup/pdgn on a layer + arrow keys. It's funny because I did most of my formative typing on an XT keyboard with no nav and arrows on the numpad, and it was fine.


Offline abrahamstechnology

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Re: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?
« Reply #54 on: Wed, 30 January 2019, 20:56:45 »
I built a linear black Alps 60% so I don't have to use the god-awful Dell chiclet keyboards in my university's library.

Offline navy2x

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Re: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?
« Reply #55 on: Sat, 02 February 2019, 17:53:04 »
My first two boards were TKL, but lately I’ve been wanting a full 100% board. I just ordered a leopold R2SA from Korea. Can’t wait to get it!

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Offline ander

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Re: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?
« Reply #56 on: Sun, 03 February 2019, 05:21:11 »
I'd been absent from these boards for several years and just logged back on, and boy, I barely recognize myself? ... Whats up with all these TKL and 60% boards and other weirdo layouts?   How come people even like them?

Those teeny-tiny keebs not only have no number pad, but there aren't even any navigation keys (arrows, Home/End, PgUp/Dn) or function keys... There isn't even a Delete key.


212083-0


So to do what we normally do with those keys—even something as simple as moving your cursor—you have to use multi-key combinations, and typing becomes a process of anti-ergonomic hoop-jumping. To onlookers, it looks like you're playing a Chopin etude on a tiny piano.

Why would anyone go to so much extra trouble? As far as I can tell, it's because it makes the rest of one's life seem incredibly easy by comparison. Also, teeny keyboards are c-u-t-e, especially if they're also in tropical colours and make little happy noises like anime characters and so on. I think I'm somewhere in the ballpark on all this, at least.
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Offline jonowarren94

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Re: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?
« Reply #57 on: Sun, 03 February 2019, 06:55:34 »
I can fit more of them on my desk...

Online Sintpinty

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Re: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?
« Reply #58 on: Tue, 05 February 2019, 10:47:44 »
Most of the time, when doing basic tasks, the numpad is not needed for some people, so they switch to a smaller size. Some may like it due to the amount of space it saves on the desk, and how nice the feel is. I personally prefer a 60% as it does not require all the keys that i need and i can simply put a wrist rest if i'm having any pain.  :thumb:
Most 100% keyboards i believe are unneccesary due to data entry.
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Online appaboy

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Re: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?
« Reply #59 on: Tue, 05 February 2019, 11:20:23 »
Tkl with left hand seperate numpad is as low as I can go without being uncomfortable, I do use a 75 percent a lot but something about tkl and left hand 3700 is so comfy
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Offline incrocio

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Re: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?
« Reply #60 on: Tue, 05 February 2019, 16:49:35 »
Personally, I like small keyboards. Not because of aesthetics or space-saving, just because I don't have to move my hands as much. Move everything as close to home row as possible.

Granted, that's achievable with larger keyboards as well as long as they're programmable.

Offline Lucien Midnight

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Re: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?
« Reply #61 on: Tue, 05 February 2019, 20:31:08 »
Having tried everything down to 40% at the smallest (standard and ortho layouts), I can say that XD75 or preonic layouts are my fav so far. It took some getting used to, but I just map arrow keys to a layer under I,J,L and no need to move my right hand anywhere. I still have the number keys and quick shift access to the symbols that I use very often.


If I wan't using ortho, i'd probably opt for TKL tho.

Offline Peripheral Prophet

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Re: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?
« Reply #62 on: Tue, 05 February 2019, 21:18:08 »
Im a big fan personally of 97 key boards.

This^^^

Offline hieuuk

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Re: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?
« Reply #63 on: Wed, 06 February 2019, 00:11:23 »
Before I wouldn't think I'm able to use any less then TKL too, until I try and love it. The strong benefit of it is that you don't actually need to move your hand too much when you writing (for me is coding). I set the caplock to FN, then I'm mainly using WASD as nav buttons. E R = Home End, FN + BackSpace or FN + ESC = Delete. I also have a set of Nav bar at the bottom right of the keyboard for when I only need moving around while not fully typing mode. Check my screenshot for my set up.

I have an Leopold 980c in 1800 layout too which I think it is really good as it has full key and small size, but as I can't programming it to WASD and FN functions. I might build my next keyboard 1800 layout with full programable keyboard. Do anyone know a way to programming on the Leopold 980c by any chance please?

Offline Entropia

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Re: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?
« Reply #64 on: Wed, 06 February 2019, 03:38:56 »
Before I wouldn't think I'm able to use any less then TKL too, until I try and love it. The strong benefit of it is that you don't actually need to move your hand too much when you writing (for me is coding). I set the caplock to FN, then I'm mainly using WASD as nav buttons. E R = Home End, FN + BackSpace or FN + ESC = Delete. I also have a set of Nav bar at the bottom right of the keyboard for when I only need moving around while not fully typing mode. Check my screenshot for my set up.

I have an Leopold 980c in 1800 layout too which I think it is really good as it has full key and small size, but as I can't programming it to WASD and FN functions. I might build my next keyboard 1800 layout with full programable keyboard. Do anyone know a way to programming on the Leopold 980c by any chance please?

I think I read somewhere something about a controller mod which involves replacing some of the electronics of the FC980C to make it programmable. Anyway, I'm not really interested in that, since I use AutoHotkey to do whatever I want with my keyboard.

Online _GMK_

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Re: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?
« Reply #65 on: Wed, 06 February 2019, 04:17:41 »
I love a keyboard when I do not have to make long move to reach the keys, that’s why I love compact boards.
I love to use all my hand and use my palm on modificator like Fn, Super or Ctrl.
I want to use all my fingers with a symetric frequency so that’s why I use a Dvorak based layout (Bépo). It’s also not normal for me to have the pinky who need to move and twist for reaching Enter or del, that why I love to have enter and del / backspace on the middle of the board.
I love to have an integrated numpad directly on the right hand, but I hate to have to reach it by moving the hand. So I can accept to use modificator for getting access to the numpad.

So we can play a game.
Can you tell me what keyboard I have ? An ergo one for sure…

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In reality most of this is bull****. You don't actually have to move your hands that often, because in most of the cases when you use a section of the keyboard (alphas, pgup pgdown etc), you keep using that section of the keyboard for a number of operations. Having an original layout, most of the times has something to do with the novelty fact, and with the pride of an original and intelligent decision, but nothing beside that. I write most of my text in vim, and then export it into graphical text editors, so you actually need to have keys that you can reach blindly, without masochists and ridicules fingers contortions.

Offline RabRhee

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Re: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?
« Reply #66 on: Wed, 06 February 2019, 06:52:58 »
I remember the hardships I faced when in about 1985 I had to move from an XT layout keyboard with the function keys on the left, to an AT type with the function keys along the top. The primary work software I used required constant use of function keys and having to reach over the board to hit them was a great hindrance. Eventually of course it became the norm.

I always found that typists would use the numbers at the top of a keyboard and only accountants and other main number crunchers ever used a numpad. For most of the programmers I worked with, the number pad was just extra arrow keys with a bit of padding, so it seemed very sensible to remove the unused numpad, reduce keyboard footprint. The supposed benefits or not to a shorter distance to move the right hand are apparently debatable but it certainly does no harm. The only time I miss it is if some games have them hardcoded or I run out of bonus keys to assign macros to.
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Offline csmertx

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Re: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?
« Reply #67 on: Wed, 06 February 2019, 07:26:07 »
For certain 'tasks' I can get by with a 65%.  I can get by a little better when I remap caps as a fn modifier and use hjkl for arrows key, and ui nm for pgup pgdown home end.  For me, not needing to leave the home row for navigation is at times kinda helpful.  For other things (workflows I guess) a full sized ansi 104 (perhaps 104+) keyboard seems to make life a bit easier.  I'm not sure I could effectively use a < 60% keyboard.  Switching tmux windows or just random mundane daily things like password entry would be such a pain for me if I was without a number row.  I guess some people are accustom to AltGr, so the extra function layers might seem like a natural extension of an already useful feature.  Portability seems to be another push for sub 60%--they're easier to sleeve, easier to carry, easier to find space for in between all those bottles of Mountain Dew, and empty Cheetos bags.  I guess they're also super cute for some people.  Why not both?
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Offline Wood_Cables

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Re: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?
« Reply #68 on: Wed, 06 February 2019, 09:45:30 »
Hey I have been using a Planck exclusively for months now, and I don't see myself ever going back to anything bigger. I'm able to do CAD work on it no problem, so the minimal layout didn't hinder any performance.

Offline ideus

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Re: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?
« Reply #69 on: Wed, 06 February 2019, 10:50:18 »
There is nothing people may say to convince an individual to like a particular keyboard layout. Some facts stand though.


Ergonomics: A full size keyboard plus a mouse caused me wrist pain and pre-carpian-syndrome. I found keyboard boards in look for help to release the pain, and a sixty mechanical keyboard was the solution. I have been happily typing since then.


Programability is another feature most full size keyboard do not have, because they do not need it in the first place. I found that a programmable keyboard could be very fun plus make the keyboard fits your particular needs. With a programmable sixty I turned a very boring typing machine into a fun item that can fits my particular needs, likes and dislikes. What else we may ask for in a device that is always on our face.


Aesthetics: A full size keyboard is by definition set in stone, ugly and boring. Mainly off the rack ones. Mechanical full size and TKLs could take advantage of different sets, but still they follow a fixed design and are as expensive or even more than custom sixty or similar options.


Conclusion: Smaller than full size KB's are not for everyone, but for those of us that have particular preferences are the best thing we can be typing on.

Offline hieuuk

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Re: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?
« Reply #70 on: Wed, 06 February 2019, 12:17:58 »
I think I read somewhere something about a controller mod which involves replacing some of the electronics of the FC980C to make it programmable. Anyway, I'm not really interested in that, since I use AutoHotkey to do whatever I want with my keyboard.

I'm also using AutoHotKey but to map CTRL + Q = ALT + F4. I'm using Windows but I like the way MAC short cut do. I'm not expert on AutoHotKey though, but once you said you can do it with AHK, I did try to Google and I might able to get Caplock working well with some of the function I need with WASD. I will try with my 1800 to create more fun. Thanks for suggestion.

I'm not trying to convinced people to go 60%, this is more of my personal opinion. I tried 65% and I don't like it.  I found 1800 = amazing, but 60% is fun to play with :).

Offline JWahl

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Re: What's with all These Weird and Small Keyboard Layouts Lately?
« Reply #71 on: Fri, 08 February 2019, 20:49:59 »
First post outside of the new member forum.  I've historically preferred full-size layouts but I've used a TKL for a few years with the Novatouch.  Like others, I like that I can keep the keyboard closer to center aligned when touch-typing without having to reach as far to the mouse.  A few weeks back, I ended up buying a mechanical numpad off of Amazon for data entry, but having it on the right made me miss the ergonomics of the TKL. 

More recently, I planned to buy an 1800 layout in the form of the Leopold FC980M, but I instead opted for the FC660M which I received today.  It's probably as small as I'm willing to go though, I can't give up the arrow cluster.  I'm also trying my numpad out on the left side, which while very awkward at first, has some theoretical advantages in certain applications.  For example, number entry in spreadsheets would allow me to keep the left hand on the numpad while my right hand can stay on the mouse or arrow keys.  I also like the inherent modularity of being able to move the numpad out of the way when I don't need it.

The one thing for me that really exaggerated the annoyance of mouse-reaching was getting used to the trackpoint on my thinkpads.  I ended up buying an external thinkpad keyboard a few months back just for that reason, but I ended up missing having mechanical keys.  The Tex Yoda might be nice for me if it had arrow keys and was a little less expensive.  The Tex Kodachi is just too rich for my blood right now.  For now, the smaller Leopold is ideal for my needs and budget.
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