Author Topic: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews  (Read 153279 times)

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Offline DrakeMegrim

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #50 on: Thu, 21 March 2013, 07:19:14 »
Let me know if you want to sell them!

Offline sordna

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #51 on: Thu, 21 March 2013, 09:37:24 »
I prefer dampeners. I find that o-rings limit the travel too much. I'm typing on blues right now and I bottom out most of the time. For o-rings, I recommend the red 40A ones from WASD. For dampeners, I'd get the black soft-landing pads from Elitekeyboards.com

For me it's not so much that they limit the travel, but all the o-rings I tried (I got a bunch with the WASD kit) ended up making the keys feel squishy.  If they made a rock hard o-ring in that size, it would probably be fine, but the current ones tend to ruin the feel for me as someone who bottoms out frequently.

So what do you need rock-hard o-rings for?  The only effect they would have would be: limit the key travel.
They would have minimal sound dampening and no shock absorption. My friend I think in your case you would be better off without any o-rings or dampeners.
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Offline deazncy

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #52 on: Fri, 22 March 2013, 00:58:21 »
I got the Buna o-rings off amazon (125 pack). Do they feel the same as o-rings that wasd sells?
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Offline sordna

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #53 on: Fri, 22 March 2013, 01:25:24 »
You probably got 70A durometer, so they would be harder than WASD's (they sell 40A and 50A durometer). I've tried all these durometers and my favorite is 40A since it has the most sound dampening and shock absorption while still allowing you to feel when you are bottoming out.
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Offline deazncy

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #54 on: Fri, 22 March 2013, 01:27:03 »
I wouldn't get a shock absorbing o-ring, it takes away from the mechanical feel IMO...
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Offline sordna

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #55 on: Fri, 22 March 2013, 01:34:58 »
It all depends on what you are looking for. I'm looking for maximum comfort, and 40A does it, without being squishy at all.  Whoever finds o-rings squishy probably hasn't installed them properly. You need to seat them all the way on the keycap stem, and also press down on each keycap HARD when you place it on the switch.
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Offline deazncy

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #56 on: Fri, 22 March 2013, 01:37:41 »
Ah, thanks for the advice.
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Offline nubbinator

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #57 on: Fri, 22 March 2013, 20:01:56 »
So what do you need rock-hard o-rings for?  The only effect they would have would be: limit the key travel.
They would have minimal sound dampening and no shock absorption. My friend I think in your case you would be better off without any o-rings or dampeners.

I shouldn't say rock hard, but harder ones than I've tried.

And limiting the travel would be perfectly fine.  A majority of the noise from bottoming out is the keys hitting the plate,  if there was a big enough gap to prevent that, that'd be good.

It all depends on what you are looking for. I'm looking for maximum comfort, and 40A does it, without being squishy at all.  Whoever finds o-rings squishy probably hasn't installed them properly. You need to seat them all the way on the keycap stem, and also press down on each keycap HARD when you place it on the switch.

I know for a fact that I pushed mine all the way to the top of the key cap stem and gave a good couple of hard presses.  Even with that, there was a noticeable squish that ruined the feel of the switch.

Offline sordna

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #58 on: Fri, 22 March 2013, 21:20:51 »
Keys do not hit the plate. The bottoming out occurs when the switch stem bottoms out inside the switch housing bottom, or most commonly when the keycap bottoms out on the switch housing top. Whether or not you have a plate doesn't really matter, because the keycap skirt never quite reaches it.
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Offline flizz

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #59 on: Mon, 25 March 2013, 20:32:01 »
which would you say is best for brown switches? I tried the red on browns but i just don't like what they do to them..

Offline CPTBadAss

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #60 on: Tue, 26 March 2013, 08:19:54 »
Flizz, I really liked the red o-rings and soft landing pads. I disliked the hard black o-rings so I wouldn't recommend those at all.
« Last Edit: Tue, 26 March 2013, 08:21:43 by CPTBadAss »

Offline drdoooom

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #61 on: Sun, 31 March 2013, 12:37:45 »
awesome detailed review!

Offline CPTBadAss

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #62 on: Sat, 06 April 2013, 22:11:31 »
awesome detailed review!

Thanks for reading :D. I'm glad it helped you out

Offline DrakeMegrim

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #63 on: Mon, 15 April 2013, 09:11:46 »
Just curious but how often are there group buys or people selling o-rings on here?

Offline CPTBadAss

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #64 on: Mon, 15 April 2013, 09:14:15 »
Just curious but how often are there group buys or people selling o-rings on here?

There's apparently leftovers from WFD's last GB going on now. But I'm not 100% sure. Otherwise, I don't see o-rings for sale very often. WASDKeyboards seems to be the main place to get o-rings.

Edit: The GB is apparently over but there's interest in having another one opened. The o-rings WFD was offering had more variety versus the ones that are offered at WASD.
« Last Edit: Mon, 15 April 2013, 09:21:00 by CPTBadAss »

Offline DrakeMegrim

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #65 on: Mon, 15 April 2013, 09:21:31 »
Thanks!

Offline SpAmRaY

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #66 on: Tue, 07 May 2013, 08:57:03 »
Posting to say thanks for being thorough and having so much info, also good info in a lot of the other posts in this thread...

Offline CPTBadAss

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #67 on: Thu, 09 May 2013, 05:10:20 »
Posting to say thanks for being thorough and having so much info, also good info in a lot of the other posts in this thread...

Thanks! If you ever seen any other info you'd like added to this in regards to o-rings/dampeners, just let me know. I think I'm missing info on WFD's last buy and imsto's o-rings.

Offline Photoelectric

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #68 on: Fri, 07 June 2013, 11:15:36 »
Updated 6/8/13

To add my impressions to your wonderful write-up:

I received red silicone O-rings from IMSTO today in two sizes.  Prior to that, I had only tried black 50A O-rings from Amazon and OEM keycaps.

The large silicone red O-rings from IMSTO are surprisingly large in person, but I found they work very well for those keys that don't have a cross-bar support, and the stem goes all the way up to the top of the cap.  Keys such as zink keycaps and aluminum spacebar.  They are just a bit too large for Ducky Shine II keycaps and reduce key travel dramatically.  I can see these O-rings be very good for MX Black switches, where you don't need to push down much farther than the actuation point for any enhanced feel, resulting in less finger strain. (In my subjective opinion, I like the full travel distance for MX Browns, but MX Black with reduced travel distance is a benefit).

One thing to note about these O-rings is that they read their full thickness farther from their inner diameter, and thus farther from where they hit the switch bottom.  It means that in some cases, they can actually do nothing as far as dampening the bottoming out sound goes.  But they can be used in combination with a skinny O-ring following them, as substitutions for cross-bar support.

The skinny red silicone O-rings from IMSTO do close to nothing in terms of feel or sound for OEM keys that are not double-shots.  They are noticeably thinner than the 50A O-rings from Amazon.  Hitting a key with that O-ring hard still results in a harsh bottoming out sound, with a very slightly dampened tone.  Very slightly.  These O-rings may be best for Cherry-profile caps or DSA (I have a set of spherical DSA keycaps incoming and will test them soon).  But I'm still surprised just how little these O-rings do for the bottoming out sound.  ETA: just tried them on some double-shot keycaps with MX Blacks, and the dampening was better.  So it depends highly on what kind of keycaps you have for these thin O-rings.

The black rubber 50A O-rings from Amazon: are my favorite so far.  They don't result in a very significant travel reduction that impedes with my enjoyment of MX Browns, but they have VERY good bottom-out damping regardless of what kind of keycaps I tried.  And even without bottoming out (I don't bottom out much), they dampen the key sound overall.  I really like them for  MX Browns.

ETA:

« Last Edit: Sat, 08 June 2013, 10:53:25 by Photoelectric »
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Offline CPTBadAss

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #69 on: Fri, 07 June 2013, 12:50:07 »
Ooo, could you possibly take pics of the Imsto o-rings? I know people have asked about them but I never had any to play with. Thanks for the input on them ^-^.

Offline Photoelectric

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #70 on: Fri, 07 June 2013, 13:01:02 »
Sure :)  Added a photo to my review above.
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Offline CPTBadAss

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #71 on: Fri, 07 June 2013, 13:31:15 »
Thank you. And thanks for taking the time to read my review ^__^

Offline Sifo

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #72 on: Fri, 07 June 2013, 14:20:08 »
I wish I had o-rings.

Nah.
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Offline Photoelectric

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #73 on: Fri, 07 June 2013, 14:24:38 »
I wish I had o-rings.

Nah.

I'm using my Ducky with Browns without O-rings :) Something about how the switches are mounted and these particular Browns makes them sound and feel very pleasant without any O-rings :)  I only put thick O-rings under a aluminum / zinc keys, of which there are 6 on this keyboard.
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Offline Input Nirvana

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #74 on: Fri, 07 June 2013, 16:40:11 »
Thank you. And thanks for taking the time to read my review ^__^

Thanks for the review...very helpful to give peeps a relative idea of what they will/won't do.
Back in the day, when we first started the O-ring idea, I got the 50A black nitril Buno rings (that's what we all started with, some kept them, some changed), which I still have on my Kinesis(es). I'm so used to it and like it so much, I typed on another Kinesis a couple months ago and was bummed it didn't have the o-rings. So spoiled!!!!

I'd like to get my hand on a couple 40A to try them out someday. Of course it depends on the key caps you are using as well.
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Offline CPTBadAss

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #75 on: Fri, 07 June 2013, 16:49:18 »
Yeah I had to rewrite the review after realizing the caps mattered so much. Learned first hand that the cross-bars underneath matter a lot! What switches do you have on your Kinesis by the way Input Nirvana?

Offline ImperfectLink

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #76 on: Fri, 14 June 2013, 04:09:40 »
I'm new to the mechanical scene and wanted to get a better idea how the O rings will feel and found this interesting reference on a site:

Duro 20A = Rubber Band
Duro 40A = Pencil Eraser
Duro 60A = Car Tire Tread
Duro 70A* = Running Shoe Sole
Duro 80A = Leather Belt
Duro 100A = Shopping Cart Wheel

Edit: Better yet, here's a chart:

http://www.allsealsinc.com/durometer.gif
« Last Edit: Fri, 14 June 2013, 04:21:09 by ImperfectLink »

Offline CPTBadAss

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #77 on: Fri, 14 June 2013, 08:17:37 »
THAT'S a cool comparison. Thanks for adding that :D. And welcome to Geekhack! Great first post :P

Offline TimIsABat

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #78 on: Wed, 26 June 2013, 00:21:52 »
Still waiting on my red o-rings from IMSTO. Gonna see how they fair with MX reds.

Might buy me some black 50 from amazon though since I tried the ones from WASD and liked them...
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Offline Input Nirvana

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #79 on: Wed, 26 June 2013, 00:25:03 »
I'm new to the mechanical scene and wanted to get a better idea how the O rings will feel and found this interesting reference on a site:

Duro 20A = Rubber Band
Duro 40A = Pencil Eraser
Duro 60A = Car Tire Tread
Duro 70A* = Running Shoe Sole
Duro 80A = Leather Belt
Duro 100A = Shopping Cart Wheel

Edit: Better yet, here's a chart:

http://www.allsealsinc.com/durometer.gif

Let me help you with that:

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Offline TimIsABat

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #80 on: Wed, 26 June 2013, 01:01:56 »
So I just tried out the o-ring sampler with my poker which has mx reds and pbt caps...

CPTbadass's review is quite accurate IMO...

I'm trying to get an o-ring set that reduces the amount of key travel and provides cushion as I have bad wrists and even though I switched from membrane to mechanical, the key travel on reds still hurts my hand.

The black ones weren't hard but more so made my keys feel kinda stuck. Almost like a RD board. The blue 40a-r were nice band reduced the travel but still felt stuck. The 40a-l rings were quite nice. They had a good cushion feel and travel, but the travel might not be far enough.
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Offline Input Nirvana

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #81 on: Sat, 29 June 2013, 17:10:06 »
Yeah I had to rewrite the review after realizing the caps mattered so much. Learned first hand that the cross-bars underneath matter a lot! What switches do you have on your Kinesis by the way Input Nirvana?

I have brown switches and red switches. I like them both, but I have not typed on the red switches for a year (I'm settling down and will start using that board again). I may decide one day on one of the switches over the other, but I don't know. O-rings definitely change the game with reds (makes the reds better for me because of bottoming out without tactile feel). I don't have RSI. Keycaps will change the feel/performance, but I don't think keycaps would change how I like browns or reds.

I've seen a couple Kinesis that had blues installed. And Lanx retrofitted ergo clears into his. I would like to type on blues and ergo clears for a day to see how it is, but I like the light touch of the browns and reds. Someone spoke of putting blacks in their Kinesis, but I don't remember who and I don't believe they actually did it.



These silicone 40A-R I'm typing on are very pimp, I like them a lot.Depending how I'm typing, it varies from no difference to a noticeable and pleasant difference.
« Last Edit: Sat, 29 June 2013, 17:16:02 by Input Nirvana »
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Offline Galaxy

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #82 on: Wed, 03 July 2013, 11:42:48 »
I recently ordered the red 40A-L O rings from WASD for my work keyboard; this is my first experience with O-rings. Here are my thoughts:

A little background:
I recently purchased a Ducky Zero DK2108 (w/ browns) as a work keyboard. I have been using a Filco MJ2 (w/ browns) at home for over a year and after acquiring the Ducky Zero I noticed that it was louder than my Filco despite having the same switches. Although it seems like all the keys on my Ducky Zero are slightly louder than my Filco, the stabilized keys in particular (spacebar, enter, shift, etc) seem to be twice as loud as what I am used to hearing from my MJ2.

It seems that the Cherry stabilizers on the Ducky Zero are significantly louder than the Costar stabilizers that come with the Filco MJ2. I don't know if Cherry stabilizers are inherently louder than Costar, or if this is specific to the Ducky Zero's implementation of them. I can hear the wire rattle softly when I hit the spacebar on my Filco but the spacebar on my Ducky Zero made a loud THUNK every time I pressed it. It was really annoying me.

My impression:
So I purchased a set of 40A-L O-rings from WASD. Initially I put them on every key because I loved how much they dampened the sound. They really do seem to cut the decibels by a third to half. However throughout the day I became uncomfortable with the (admittedly very slight) reduced travel distance and the (again, very slight) squish when bottoming out. Bottoming out keys felt too similar to the membrane keyboard I had just upgraded from, and with the reduced travel distance I found myself bottoming out more than normal.

So I ended up removing the O-rings from all but the Cherry stabilized keys, this has successfully eliminated the loud THUNK sound that I was getting every time I hit the spacebar or enter. The slight change in travel distance and squishyness is almost imperceptible on the stabilized keys but the O-rings eliminate the THUNK sound and bring the decibels down to the same level as the rest of the keys.

To sum up:
I loved the difference that they made in sound, but I was unhappy with the change in feeling. However my biggest problem with sound was from the Cherry stabilized keys and the O-rings didn't change the feeling hardly at all on these keys while significantly quieting them.
« Last Edit: Wed, 03 July 2013, 11:55:09 by Galaxy »
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Offline CPTBadAss

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #83 on: Wed, 03 July 2013, 11:55:55 »
Do your Ducky caps have the same crossbarring as the caps in my review? The cross-bars will greatly affect how the o-rings feel. The space-bar probably doesn't have as much support underneath so it feels different.

I also didn't think the o-rings quieted my board that much. And I think that costars are louder than the cherry stabilizers.

Offline Galaxy

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #84 on: Wed, 03 July 2013, 12:16:04 »
Do your Ducky caps have the same crossbarring as the caps in my review? The cross-bars will greatly affect how the o-rings feel. The space-bar probably doesn't have as much support underneath so it feels different.

I also didn't think the o-rings quieted my board that much. And I think that costars are louder than the cherry stabilizers.

Here's a couple photos:




That would be interesting if Costars are generally louder than Cherry, because my Filco's spacebar is a whisper compared to the "KERTHUNK" sound my Ducky was making.

It's occurred to me that the Cherry stabilizers may not be the cause of the THUNK sound I was getting from the stabilized keys, it could have something to do with the Zero's design or the materials they use, or the mounting plate, or a defect in my specific board, god knows. All I know is the 40A-L's fixed the issue for me.
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Offline CPTBadAss

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #85 on: Wed, 03 July 2013, 12:34:59 »
Hm. Well I don't have a Ducky so I have no idea. Thanks for the pictures.

Offline Photoelectric

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #86 on: Wed, 03 July 2013, 12:44:08 »
I found that both of my Filcos' Costar stabilized spacebars are definitely louder than my Ducky Shine's Cherry stabilized spacebar.  Tried multiple spacebars: ABS and aluminum.  Cherry is more muted.  No problems with grinding spacebars, only if placed incorrectly.
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Offline Galaxy

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #87 on: Wed, 03 July 2013, 13:28:05 »
I found that both of my Filcos' Costar stabilized spacebars are definitely louder than my Ducky Shine's Cherry stabilized spacebar.  Tried multiple spacebars: ABS and aluminum.  Cherry is more muted.  No problems with grinding spacebars, only if placed incorrectly.

Curiouser and curiouser..... I wonder why my Ducky Zero spacebar is so damn loud
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Offline Photoelectric

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #88 on: Wed, 03 July 2013, 13:41:24 »
Possibly case design + plate (material, thickness, etc)+ distribution of empty space.   Could be greater resonance.  Some setups are more "solid" and less prone to vibration (effectively dampened).  That's my best guess. 
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Offline Galaxy

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #89 on: Wed, 03 July 2013, 14:05:14 »
Yeah that must be it. My Filco has the same switches but is far far quieter. I guess it has little to do with the stabilizers and everything to do with the things you mention.

These 2 keyboards are proving to be excellent examples of the difference build quality makes. Same switches and size, but my MJ2 is superior to my Zero in every way. Even if Cherry stabilizers are generally superior to Costar it clearly makes little difference compared to what board the stabilizers are going into.

In other words: I will never buy/judge a board based on whether it has Cherry or Costar stabilizers because apparently this point is moot compared to the overall design and build quality of the board.
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Offline Photoelectric

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #90 on: Wed, 03 July 2013, 14:12:22 »
My Ducky Shine II TKL is every bit as good as my Filcos as far as I can tell, down to nice and neat PCB.  I believe Zero is the budget line, but I don't know if there are any significant differences.
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Offline CPTBadAss

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #91 on: Wed, 03 July 2013, 14:13:40 »
Can we migrate this discussion on stabilizers elsewhere? Thank you!

Offline Grim Fandango

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #92 on: Wed, 03 July 2013, 14:25:09 »
40A-L Red O-Rings
These still feel really nice. There’s now less cushion-y-ness but still feel squishy. The travel reduction really feels different now. These o-rings now really feel like they stop actuation sooner. It seems like they stop the travel right after the click. I still really like these.


These are the ones I ended up going with on my browns. I had to adjust at first, and was convinced that I did not like them. But now that I am used to them, I actually appreciate the slightly smaller travel of the keys.  One thing to take into account when you just put them on , is that they still move a little and are not yet in the right position unless you hit the key few times.

I actually like them a lot better than I had anticipated, since they reduce a little of the noise, they shorten the travel, and they give a softer impact but without feeling "mushy". Some people warned me that o-rings would destroy the feel of a mechanical switch, but I kind of disagree. Or at least, it does not for me. I still get the same tactile feedback when pressin the key, and it all generally feels the same. The only real difference is the feel when bottoming out.
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Offline Mainian

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #93 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 01:13:44 »
40A-L Red O-Rings
These still feel really nice. There’s now less cushion-y-ness but still feel squishy. The travel reduction really feels different now. These o-rings now really feel like they stop actuation sooner. It seems like they stop the travel right after the click. I still really like these.


These are the ones I ended up going with on my browns. I had to adjust at first, and was convinced that I did not like them. But now that I am used to them, I actually appreciate the slightly smaller travel of the keys.  One thing to take into account when you just put them on , is that they still move a little and are not yet in the right position unless you hit the key few times.

I actually like them a lot better than I had anticipated, since they reduce a little of the noise, they shorten the travel, and they give a softer impact but without feeling "mushy". Some people warned me that o-rings would destroy the feel of a mechanical switch, but I kind of disagree. Or at least, it does not for me. I still get the same tactile feedback when pressin the key, and it all generally feels the same. The only real difference is the feel when bottoming out.

Sweet, I was just about to ask about these. I actually LOVE the way the black o-rings feel or reds and blacks, but they honestly make me want to destroy my keyboard when they are on my blues.

Going to order these NOW.


Offline UniClown

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #94 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 01:21:35 »
I got the WASD sampler kit, and I agree with CPT and some others here that my favorite are the red o-rings.

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #95 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 21:12:42 »
they honestly make me want to destroy my keyboard when they are on my blues.

Landing pads are best for blues.
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Offline CPTBadAss

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #96 on: Fri, 05 July 2013, 21:15:40 »
Yup, I had landing pads on my Blues as well

Offline SpAmRaY

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #97 on: Thu, 22 August 2013, 13:28:59 »
Yup, I had landing pads on my Blues as well

Have you done any experimenting with any sound dampening on your green switches?

Offline CPTBadAss

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #98 on: Thu, 22 August 2013, 13:33:06 »
No. I never thought of it since I didn't want to dampen the sound anymore. I also don't have o-rings anymore so the only experiment I could do is with soft landing pads.

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Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
« Reply #99 on: Thu, 22 August 2013, 13:37:53 »
No. I never thought of it since I didn't want to dampen the sound anymore. I also don't have o-rings anymore so the only experiment I could do is with soft landing pads.

Ok just curious! I just received a board with greens now so maybe I just need to do my own experimenting!