Adding extra keys to your Kinesis Advantage

[sordna]

What kind of switches are in your Seimitsu switches?

This kind:


Don't know much about them, looking at a spare on the top it says "4 - J" and on the bottom it says "1B" and also has a logo that says "<TKC>"

So, do the browns work well on your buttons?  That sounds like a great solution if it does!

[uberben]

The button top is kind of wobbly, but I'm sure that could be remedied. If someone has a 3D model of a cherry cap stem, I could print one out and graft it onto the arcade button.

I don't have this button installed in anything, so for all I know it might work well enough as is. I just haven't been able to bring myself to put any holes in my case yet. I tend to fear the lack of undo, but getting a replacement case to me here in Canada should be under $50, so I should just do it. Worst case, I have a top case to experiment with.

[sordna]

I understand, I had regrets after I drilled my case... REGRETS I DIDN'T DO IT SOONER !
Just make sure the placement is right, stick some quarters on your case or something, to get a feel of where you want the palm keys, before you start drilling.

[uberben]

I have had stacks of quarters taped to my case for about 3 months now. I moved them around a bit the first week, then they stayed put the rest of the time. I'll hunt around for a stepped drill bit and just do it.

[sordna]

Ok, post pictures when you are done please. And don't worry, it's a super easy and clean mod.

BTW if there's one thing I miss when using my ergodox, compared to the Advantage, it's the palm keys. It's going to be tricky to add them on the ergodox ... say have you tried buttons that could be attached to the surface?  I wonder how something like the Buddy button would work out, although it's rather huge and ridiculously expensive, PI Engineering sells one button for like $60 !

[kaltar]

Sordna, Where do you rest your palms when typing? since with the palm buttons use that area. Are you really never resting your arms while typing?

[sordna]

Sordna, Where do you rest your palms when typing? since with the palm buttons use that area. Are you really never resting your arms while typing?

When I actively type, I have my palms off the keyboard. It's the proper way to go to avoid RSI issues. But in the pauses between typing, I do put my hands down, and there's plenty of space for that. Besides, even if I rest of the palm keys themselves, they are both Shift buttons, so it doesn't cause an issue.

[kaltar]

I did tape 3 US quarters at the positions suggested, and I just keep resisting the urge of putting my hands down, even for lazy typing. I know it's bad. Right now I'm on recovery of Carpal Tunnel Syndrome. (So I have just a month with the Kinesis)

I actually thought of the palm buttons as an alternative of my current workflow, and surprise, you had done it, and shared even the switches that can fit inside... Thanks! (I already ordered and received mine)

My current workflow: Im very used to the inverted T of  regular keyboards, and is hard for me to really get used to the keys originally on the Kinesis. Also, using Command, Alt, control and Shift all the time for selecting and copying text, is not really friendly on the default Kinesis layout. So Right now Im using my trusty ControllerMate to do some extra layers, and pressing the key of DELETE to convert jkli in the arrow keys, and asdf as Shift Ctrl Alt Command, that way I can edit the text and move it around with all the modifiers without leaving the home position.

What I want to do is to make the palm buttons turn on this special layer (Maybe using the keypad layer all reprogramed).
But Im afraid of screwing my keyboard with the mod.  I found that resting my palms on top of the buttons does not hurt me, but resting them on the sides, with natural position (non pronation) it does hurt... weird.

[kaltar]

And Sordna, will you replace the ugly plastic Function keys??? The only downside I see is that it will raise the height of the keyboard a little more

[sordna]

And Sordna, will you replace the ugly plastic Function keys??? The only downside I see is that it will raise the height of the keyboard a little more

No, I very rarely use F keys, and besides I mapped my number row as F keys in the keypad layer. So while I would welcome proper F keys in a future Advantage keyboard, it's not worth the effort for me to make a custom mod.

[kaltar]

Well, I'll wait for the weekend and finally dremel the Kinesis on your footsteps. 

[sordna]

Well, I'll wait for the weekend and finally dremel the Kinesis on your footsteps. 

I have had stacks of quarters taped to my case for about 3 months now. I moved them around a bit the first week, then they stayed put the rest of the time. I'll hunt around for a stepped drill bit and just do it.

Ok, folks, just go ahead and do this. Extra keys are somewhat tricky (some more so than others), but adding palm keys is ridiculously easy. Not even soldering is necessary! Anyway, whatever part of the mods you do, please post photos of the results along with your impressions!

[kaltar]

I will. Im just waiting for the weekend to do it (and the step drill bit I got on amazon).

[kaltar]

Sordna, I finally got to do it! I followed the instructions and got no problem at all!

[kaltar]

Exactly what I did:

Made a mark on 71mm from the sides, 21mm from the bottom. Then made a guideline for the drill (done with a dremel)



Then used the step drilled, and soon came to see a plastic support was in the way! So I just kept drilling and completely removed it.


Re-assembled the keyboard and push in the buttons. There was no need to twist the terminals, since it fitted perfectly.


Added cables to the buttons, by soldering them.


Crammed in the keyboard cables: each button one cable to Ground, the other to FS2.



Close the keyboard and Done!

[kaltar]

Since I'm using the palm buttons as foot switch, this is the layout I'm using. There are some keys without a function in the keyboard layer, so I map them to the ones not used, so I do not press any other key by mistake. So the blank keys in the images do absolutely nothing when pressed.



The multimedia keys are handled with ControllerMate. Those keys are mapped to 3 keys I never use: PrintScr, Scroll Lock and Pause/Break.
Then the default driver assigns no function to them, and finally, a programming layer that assigns the wanted value.

Look that Play/Pause is done via SHIFT+Print Screen

[sordna]

Nice ! Congratulations and thanks for posting excellent photos!
How does it feel having those palm keys ? Also, do you think you would make one of them be regular shift, or will you keep them both as a layer shifter? One one of my keyboards I have it like that, on the other they are both shifts!

[kaltar]

Well, I do not know If I want to set it as shift. I know my pinkies will thank me, but I find the asymmetry of different functions not very Ergonomic... But I will think about it.

The only thing I can say is: I love them!

Next steps: make it USB only, add 1/4" mono phone jacks to accept conventional midi keyboards sustain pedals (have so many of those) and thinking in making it bluetooth...

[uberben]

Next steps: make it USB only, add 1/4" mono phone jacks to accept conventional midi keyboards sustain pedals (have so many of those) and thinking in making it bluetooth...

I've been thinking of the bluetooth mod for a while now. I've got some parts kicking around, but haven't really had a chance to plow through and do it. I've started with hasu's tmk_keyboard firmware (https://github.com/tmk/tmk_keyboard). It at least had support for a bluetooth module in addition to USB (using a Bluegiga WT-12, I think). I have suspicions that it might need some efficiency improvements to get a usable battery life, but the keyboard is big enough that a large battery can be added in the mean time.

[kaltar]

the problem is to be able to remove the battery without having to open the keyboard, or just to have it recharge via usb. I know it's a bit more tricky than it sounds... That's why is not my next thing to do  Actually, splitting the Kinesis to be able to give more angle is more a priority than bluetooth.

[uberben]

Ya, I've got a lithium battery and charger breakout board in my parts bin for this. but if the power consumption is too high, I'll need to have it plugged in most of the time to charge anyway. Making it rechargeable shouldn't be the hard part. It will be making the code power efficient.

Anyway, I finally put some buttons in my board.



I was impressed with how clean a hole the step drill bit makes, even my super cheap aliexpress.com ones.




I drilled at about 75mm from the sides, 21mm from the bottom to avoid drilling out the support, but as you can see, the support is super short compared to the buttons. I think the support is just vestigial plastic from the original Kinesis that had the controller board integrated with the thumb switches.




I decided to install one button with the stock switch and one with a Cherry MX. So far the wobble in the modded button isn't very noticeable, but I'll update once I've actually used them for a bit.

Also, note to self (and future modders): make sure your drill  is charged before disassembling your keyboard.

[kaltar]

Looks nice in white!!!

So you modded the button to a cherry?
I don't know if it's even worth for a palm button, but I'll wait to see what you report.

[uberben]

I suspect it would be better with something stiffer/more clicky than a brown, but I'll give it some time. I have a bunch of spare buttons so figured I might as well try it.

[kaltar]

Please keep us updated... And the step drill is nice, isn't it? I didn't know about it until sordna posted it in the instructions.

[sordna]

Wow, the palm buttons on the white look like it came from the factory !
So how is the palm key experience uberben as you use the keyboard ?

[kaltar]

I just made my PS2 Kinesis a USB only one http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=49256.0. I think I can put 3 Phone Jacks http://www.switchcraft.com/productsummary.aspx?Parent=68 under the usb connector to add a keyboard to the function I wish, without opening the keyboard. And since 1/4" phone jack is the standard of electronic music keyboards, I can use 3 of the many pedals that I have as pedals (and new ones are cheaper and more resistant than the ones from Kinesis).

But, maybe leave that space for a small USB Hub? What do you guys think?

[uberben]

Nicely done. I didn't realize that boards that new even came as PS/2.

But, maybe leave that space for a small USB Hub? What do you guys think?

If you are thinking that you want to do a bluetooth conversion down the road, just keep in mind the USB hub will really only be useful when you have the board plugged in. You can't do USB over bluetooth. Having said that, I can see the hub being useful if you will be semi-regularly plugging in your board, and if you have a massive battery in there you could potentially use it to charge your phone when not acting as a true hub.

Also, I think hasu's tmk firmware is getting support for USB devices as inputs, so you might be able to plug a generic USB mouse in and get that to show up over bluetooth. Again, since USB devices aren't designed to be power efficient, it will probably kill your bluetooth battery time, but I'm just thinking out loud here.

[kaltar]

I got an idea of something useful for this palm mod:

What about adding a 3 way switch to the back of the Kinesis, (actually, 2 of this switches) so we can choose the function of each palm button (FS1, FS2 or FS3). This way, we can change modes without opening the keyboard!  What do you guys think?

[kaltar]

Nicely done. I didn't realize that boards that new even came as PS/2.

Sorry, I made a mistake. It was 2002, not 2012  I fixed it already.

[uberben]

That would definitely work, but it might be simpler to just use the programmable functions of the keyboard to remap the keys. The only unique key I'm aware of on the foot switches is the keypad shift, and I think it is remappable to any footswitch, so as long as one of the palm keys is connected to that FS wire, you should be able to remap any foot switch (or other) action to either palm key.

Some nice big toggle switches would look pretty sweet on a Kinesis, though.

[kaltar]

So each palm button should go to a different switch and they should be set by remap?

Is that how you have it? I currently have them both in the same FS, but your idea seems better!

[uberben]

I currently have them on the same switch too, but will probably set them to different ones and map them to the same if I want them to stay the same. I think Sordna talks about this a bit near the beginning of his original post.

[kaltar]

I can't seem to be able to remap the FS to other buttons 

[uberben]

Huh. I thought this was doable, but it has been a long time since I used my actual foot switches, and I haven't used my palm keys in different positions yet. Perhaps your toggle switch idea is the better solution.

[kaltar]

Huh. I thought this was doable, but it has been a long time since I used my actual foot switches, and I haven't used my palm keys in different positions yet. Perhaps your toggle switch idea is the better solution.

Yes, you can remap them, BUT, I just tried mapping FS1 to FS2. and it does activate the keypad, BUT stays on! That's a major problem. I can remap to any other keys, but the keypad only while pressed is only working on FS2. I think the toggle idea may be worth explore just for that.

[sordna]

The only key function that cannot be remapped is momentary keypad shift (FS). However the FS "button" itself can be mapped to do other things.
If you hookup your palm key to FS, you can remap it to do anything else, but no other key can be remapped to do the FS momentary keypad shift function. (if you try, it will work as a toggle instead of momentary).

So, always use FS at least for one of the palm keys. I currently have both my palm keys mapped to work as SHIFTS, but one of them is wired to FS so at any time I can remap it to do momentary keypad shift.

[kaltar]

Well, mine are both wired to keypad. I think I will leave them like that for now, until I put a toggle switch

[kaltar]

Hey Sordna,
Have you tried adding palm keys to your ErgoDox?

[sordna]

Hey Sordna,
Have you tried adding palm keys to your ErgoDox?

No, although I have thought about it many times. If you do it let me know!

[kaltar]

Hey Sordna,
Have you tried adding palm keys to your ErgoDox?

No, although I have thought about it many times. If you do it let me know!

Well, the issue may be finding a fitting Button!

[Legorandir]

sad thing is that those HBFS-30 switches are not on sale anywhere

Seems to be availlable here:
http://www.gamerfinger.com/

[kaltar]

sad thing is that those HBFS-30 switches are not on sale anywhere

Seems to be availlable here:
http://www.gamerfinger.com/

Damn! I just order a bunch of SEIMITSU PS-15 for some mods...
But thanks for the notice!

[Squeaky Wheel]

Adding palm buttons is badass! I'd love to add a couple to an Ergodox (there's room for two more keys on each PCB). The Ergodox already has custom firmware for NKRO (stenography!!!) and adding palm buttons would allow us to incorporate ideas from Velotype.

[Input Nirvana]

Adding palm buttons is badass! I'd love to add a couple to an Ergodox (there's room for two more keys on each PCB). The Ergodox already has custom firmware for NKRO (stenography!!!) and adding palm buttons would allow us to incorporate ideas from Velotype.

Yes, it's really innovative and a unique method of input. I toyed with incorporating them into a "flatboard" but not much reason for me to do that. Lol

[Squeaky Wheel]

Plus I'm using the full hand case for the ergodox, so it really shouldn't be too hard, give or take some diodes and extra wiring...if anyone manages to do this mod, I'd love to know.

[Input Nirvana]

Plus I'm using the full hand case for the ergodox, so it really shouldn't be too hard, give or take some diodes and extra wiring...if anyone manages to do this mod, I'd love to know.

At Keycon there may be something like that being shown, but I'm not sure as of yet.

Do you still use ControllerMate?

[Squeaky Wheel]

Plus I'm using the full hand case for the ergodox, so it really shouldn't be too hard, give or take some diodes and extra wiring...if anyone manages to do this mod, I'd love to know.

At Keycon there may be something like that being shown, but I'm not sure as of yet.

Do you still use ControllerMate?

ControllerMate? Huh?

[kaltar]

Plus I'm using the full hand case for the ergodox, so it really shouldn't be too hard, give or take some diodes and extra wiring...if anyone manages to do this mod, I'd love to know.

At Keycon there may be something like that being shown, but I'm not sure as of yet.

Do you still use ControllerMate?

ControllerMate? Huh?

I use ControllerMate for the Kinesis to assign combos for special keys (audio keys mostly). I havent seen a reason to use it with the ergodox. I have additional palm keys that I got for my Kinesis mod and thought of putting it in the ergodox. They do not fit, they need to be even less depth.

[Squeaky Wheel]

So is casing the only barrier to adding palm keys to the ergodox? The electronics is sound?

[kaltar]

So is casing the only barrier to adding palm keys to the ergodox? The electronics is sound?

Yes. Actually, you must have received an extra Diodes with you ergodox kit from Massdrop, so you must have all you need.
You can even assign it to a key that already exist on the keyboard, so you can still use the Massdrop Ergodox Configurator.

it's just thing of finding the right buttons, and modding your case.