[IC] SA Row 3 White Relegendable

[berserkfan]

Hello folks

I am a big consumer of relegendables and I missed the last SA Row 3 (nuclear data) group buy. Just missed it. I simply don't look at Group Buys and Interest checks very much (something like once a month only.) They had gotten to 483. If I'd bought, we would have easily hit 500. So sorry. It would have been good for everyone!

Now I am conducting an interest check for SA Row 3 White relegendables (bottom and top). I am interested in buying quite a large quantity, at least 100. (I have matrix keyboards). This is probably going to be one of my largest ever keycaps purchase.

Melissa Petersen of SP quoted the pricing as

250, $1 each
500 relegendables is $0.83 each
750 sets                 $0.76 each
1000 sets               $0.73 each

Because the SA nuclear data Row 3 is just over I think demand has fallen. I'm willing to wait, because this is a large expense and because I can use other flat relegendables in the meantime. But I'm really keen on doing this buy in under 6 months. I'd like to shoot for the 500 mark at least, and will commit to 100 minimum and probably 125.
 
Please post your interest here, as well as the number of relegendables you hope to buy. When I have enough interest for 500 I will turn this into a group buy. Please be serious about your interest. There is of course no obligation, but don't be that kind of douchebag who gushes "I love white SA, put me down for 200!" then conveniently have no money when I run the group buy. If I think you're just a kid throwing in a big number for fun I won't include your number when I tally up.

If we can approach 750 that is even better. At the price indicated I will buy 200!

[FrostyToast]

I think that something like SA, especially when relegendable is begging for classic colours like black or beige.

[berserkfan]

I think that something like SA, especially when relegendable is begging for classic colours like black or beige.

In my case, I am not willing to buy 200 black or beige. Still, you have a point. I think people should post the number they want to buy if white, and the number they hope to buy if it's their ideal color.

If a bunch of people come forward and say they'll buy 400 florescent green or 650 brown, I will be more than happy to buy the remaining 100 to meet tipping point even though these colors are not my preferred.

[FrostyToast]

I would definitely buy 120 beige.
If Matt3o finds a way to make his BS Cherry stem affordable then I will totally duke out my 50 key M
After that I would still have 70 of these babies to play with on other boards. 

[pasph]

Have you found a "professional" way to print legends?

[FrostyToast]

Have you found a "professional" way to print legends?

Crayons and construction paper 4 lyfe

[01111000]

Do you have pics of finished caps?

[quantentunnel]

I would buy 50 black to complement my Pulse keyset. Any chance of 2x keys?

[berserkfan]

I would buy 50 black to complement my Pulse keyset. Any chance of 2x keys?

I wasn't going to get 2x keys since I don't need them. Another problem with 2x keys, apart from the small demand for them, is that stem placements are not the same between POS/matrix keyboards and regular keyboards, and that vertical are different from horizontal. So chances are that we'll get total demand for maybe 10 vertical, 10 horizontal, and SP will charge you $10 for each key. But I can always ask SP if some people want. Am I to assume that you want 2x for your backspace and numpad enter and numpad plus?

[Oobly]

Have you found a "professional" way to print legends?

Brother P-Touch label printers can do a good job. I think they look great on nomaded's Nuclear Data Green set and suit relegendables perfectly if you can find the right font: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=61198.msg1530420#msg1530420

[quantentunnel]

Do you have pics of finished caps?

There are some from the Nuclear Data set: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=61198.0

I wasn't going to get 2x keys since I don't need them. Another problem with 2x keys, apart from the small demand for them, is that stem placements are not the same between POS/matrix keyboards and regular keyboards, and that vertical are different from horizontal. So chances are that we'll get total demand for maybe 10 vertical, 10 horizontal, and SP will charge you $10 for each key. But I can always ask SP if some people want. Am I to assume that you want 2x for your backspace and numpad enter and numpad plus?

I want them on my ErgoDox for the thumb cluster

[quantentunnel]

Sry, double post...

[nomaded]

Have you found a "professional" way to print legends?

Brother P-Touch label printers can do a good job. I think they look great on nomaded's Nuclear Data Green set and suit relegendables perfectly if you can find the right font: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=61198.msg1530420#msg1530420

I can try to take some macro style photos of the relegendable keycaps, with and without the clear top.

[pasph]

Thanks, can you tell me what Brother P-Touch model and what tape you used?

[nomaded]

I used the Brother P-Touch PT-18R (amazon link) for the labels. It's an older model that I got a few years back. I used the Helvetica-like typeface, at the small font setting.

The tape is 1/2 Inch, White, on Clear (TZe135) (amazon link).

[berserkfan]

What if you have relegendables of different sizes? Can the tape printer handle different tapes or have you only tried printing for this SA Row 3?

[nomaded]

Comparison of P-Touch labeled cap with doubleshot cap:

This photo compares a doubleshot cap from SP with a P-Touch label on a relegendable cap. The label was made with a P-Touch PT-18R with a TZe135, 1/2-inch white-on-clear tape.

Better view of the SA-R3 relegendable labeled cap:

I trimmed the label on the sides but kept the full 1/2-inch height. The bottom part of the cap is just a tiny fraction smaller than the label.

Different angle of the SA-R3 relegendable cap:

You can see where the label overlaps the top ridge of the cap.

Side profile comparison of the relegendable:

It's not a great photo, but the caps look and feel the same.

Different label placement:

Since the SA-R3 relegendable caps are not deep dish, I labeled the front of one of the blank deep dish caps, to use as a homing key. This was before I realized the NDG-SA-R3 base kit came with deep dish F and J caps. This is using the same helvetica-a-like typeface, with the large font size.

Different angle of label placement:

For this label, I trimmed all 4 sides of the label, around the letter. I placed it close to the top edge of the cap to make it more visible. Most other labeled blank caps have the label mounted low, closer to the bottom edge. In the past, I have put P-Touch labels on the top surface of keys, and they hold up well over time, and can be removed cleanly.

[nomaded]

What if you have relegendables of different sizes? Can the tape printer handle different tapes or have you only tried printing for this SA Row 3?

Looking at the spec sheet for the PT-18R, it can use tapes of 6mm, 9mm, 12mm (what I used), or 18mm in height. Other model label makers will have different sized tapes that it can handle, and also different typefaces. I have only tried adding labels to these SA-R3 relegendable caps. I have some other Cherry profile relegendable caps, but I have not tried adding these labels to them.

Brother USA's list of currently available tapes shows they only have white-on-clear in 12mm and 18mm. Black-on-clear come in a larger variety of sizes.

For this usage, I found that the labels worked better (for me) if I adhered them directly to the bottom part of the relegendable cap. I did try without adhering the label (by sticking a printed label to a non-printed scrap), but I ended up cutting it down too much so it slid around when the relegendable cap was closed up. Also, the 12mm tape allow me to easily center the label on the cap.

[berserkfan]

Nomaded I really appreciate your photos and your information. I think most people have never considered using these label printers before, and now you have opened up a new avenue of possibilities.

The quality is superb. I think most people's needs are really met by a label printer.

Correct me if I am wrong, but to get the label in your photos, you used a 'white on clear' tape, right? Then if someone wants a different color, he can, although this is basically limited by whatever tape brother sells?

That said, I am not going to use a label maker. Looking around, I will require a high end (expensive) label maker for the full panoply of symbols I use (which includes Chinese characters and Greek letters). But this is really a superb solution for the vast majority of geekhackers. May I suggest you prepare a standard tape with all the commonly used symbols? You could churn out all the symbols people need at the touch of a button, sell them for 4x your cost, and still make friends from all the people who benefit!

Anyone who knows how to use standard Brother laser printer to achieve a high degree of professional labelling standard, do speak up! Right now the best that I can do is black on clear (transparency) and it's really not so great.

What if you have relegendables of different sizes? Can the tape printer handle different tapes or have you only tried printing for this SA Row 3?

Looking at the spec sheet for the PT-18R, it can use tapes of 6mm, 9mm, 12mm (what I used), or 18mm in height. Other model label makers will have different sized tapes that it can handle, and also different typefaces. I have only tried adding labels to these SA-R3 relegendable caps. I have some other Cherry profile relegendable caps, but I have not tried adding these labels to them.

Brother USA's list of currently available tapes shows they only have white-on-clear in 12mm and 18mm. Black-on-clear come in a larger variety of sizes.

For this usage, I found that the labels worked better (for me) if I adhered them directly to the bottom part of the relegendable cap. I did try without adhering the label (by sticking a printed label to a non-printed scrap), but I ended up cutting it down too much so it slid around when the relegendable cap was closed up. Also, the 12mm tape allow me to easily center the label on the cap.

[pasph]

PC Connectable P-touch Labeling Systems:
Use your keyboard and PC monitor to create labels - Print exactly what you see on screen!
Prints multiple lines of text and graphics
Use any of your PC’s installed TrueType® fonts. Import graphics like logos and symbols from your PC. 

Not bad for $50

[berserkfan]

PC Connectable P-touch Labeling Systems:
Use your keyboard and PC monitor to create labels - Print exactly what you see on screen!
Prints multiple lines of text and graphics
Use any of your PC’s installed TrueType® fonts. Import graphics like logos and symbols from your PC.

Not bad for $50

$50 happens to be my budget, but to buy that I'll need to set up Amazon account and stuff like that. Will have to talk to my friends. Thanks for the info, pasph, this is looking very good because I have bemoaned my ugly relegendable labels for a while by now!

[pasph]

There's also the similar Dymo LabelManager PnP for $33, but don't know if it is good or not

[abandoner]

I use a Brother P-Touch H100 a lot at work and the biggest issue is it burns through batteries very quickly. I only have it on while I'm typing and printing and then it gets turned off. They're good printers otherwise, just something to consider if anyone I looking into the battery powered models.

I may be down for 10-20 of these in white just for fun. 

[berserkfan]

I think the thread should be changed to a google poll where everyone gets to enter their favorite color and the number they intend to order. If anyone knows how to do this, please do as it will help us gauge the demand better.

[berserkfan]

Irony of ironies, my own interest in this interest check is now in check. AKA I have just ordered a Brother PT-2030 and a white on clear tape TZe-135, and expect to get them in... 3-4 weeks.

If the tape option goes well, I would recommend that geekhackers buy blanks and use tapes on them instead of buying relegendables. For one, relegendables are expensive, whereas most of us already have blanks or keycaps that we don't use that can be covered by labels. For another, the polycarbonate covering on relegendables will yellow with time and I don't like that at all. Labelling will also allow us to customize.

That said, I've read pasph's little blurb, as well as the instruction manual for the PT-2030, and I don't think the PT-2030 can accept input directly from the computer. IE not likely that I can print an image from a graphic. PT-2030 is the only choice that is within my budget though. If I only have to manually print a few custom labels I think that is an acceptable trade off.