April '13 Geekhack key -- Cherry legends final push

[mkawa]

Folks,

I mentioned in passing last month that the polycarb orange on white keys were tests. What were they tests for? Well, they were tests for this key. For those who aren't familiar with it, the key is a classic geekhack legend; it made its first appearance in round 3 in the nostalgia orange on grey theme:


(courtesy reaper)

I wanted to remake it, but I also wanted to try 1st shot polycarb. We knew that 1st shot polycarb would need special attention to contrast and legend to key proportions to make the keys really pop, so we ran a few tests -- those ended up being the late march keys. Having deemed those a success, I had these made:


backlit


boringlit

They match the late march key (and techkeys' complementary keys), and are a prelude to something even cooler:

First, geekhack will be paying to finish cutting the cherry font legends with signature plastics. We will be doing so with cash on hand plus the proceeds of this sale.

Second, we will be making an entire set of polycarb keys. In standard configuration, the alphanumerics of this set will be 1st shot polycarb on white. The modifiers will be 1st shot white on polycarb. The legends, of course, will all be cherry font .

Because geekhack will be dirt poor after paying for the rest of the cherry legends, the group buy for this set will include a modest contribution to geekhack. As penance, the staff will probably be ganging up at Ron's office to sort and ship everything again .

The keys themselves will go up on techkeys.us forthwith! Pricing will be 12$ for one keycap with 100% of proceeds paying for cherry legend tooling.

[Tym]

[osxoep]

edit: I just bought a bunch of stuff from Techkeys too Shipping is a *****.

[infiniti]

Here we go! 

[Turbo Slaab]

edit: I just bought a bunch of stuff from Techkeys too Shipping is a *****.

Get used to it every month!

[Turkishrambo]

i bet its 420 related!

[leesofi]

notice by techkeys?

[Grim Fandango]

[AGmurdercore]

And now we wait

[mashby]

Hmmm... I thought we already had the April release of the GeekHack key. No?

[CPTBadAss]

Mashby, you know you're going to order a bunch of these caps anyways so why bother with semantics?! The real issue is how you're going to hide the caps from H and finding your wallet

[mkawa]

we're on a bit of an offset schedule right now

[Permeability]

Maybe it's a sign that the April key is related to 420 

[i3oilermaker]

No

[osxoep]

No

Thank god.

[IPT]

Maybe it's a sign that the April key is related to 420 

I doubt it. Gh doesn't promote drug use afterall. Which personally I have no argument with

[Lunartuna]

Will it be meant for an LED backlit switch?

[baldgye]

Would really like a beige shift key or something that still had the shift icon, but the words Geekhack or something... something other than another esc key with Geekhack on

[i3oilermaker]

something other than another esc key with Geekhack on

Yes

[elton5354]

A backspace or something

[Soarer]

I just bought a bunch of stuff from Techkeys too Shipping is a *****.

Yeah, me too...... I hope I don't like this key!  )

[mkawa]

details are up in the OP. i hope everyone finds this as exciting as i do.

* mr friday not included in any way shape or form. bug clickclack for that one

[esoomenona]

Mhm, mhm.

[Lunartuna]

A whole set is going to look amazing! 

[i3oilermaker]

Oh my glod!

[SmallFry]

Holy cool!

[i3oilermaker]

Did anyone else's email come with borked pictures?

[SmallFry]

Did anyone else's email come with borked pictures?

I never look at the pictures anymore due to how I notify myself of TechKeys newslettets, so mine was just a wall of text.

[Gupgup]

Ordered a keychain

[Glod]

Oh my glod!

glod damn it....

could do something like this


so you guys should consider offering some DSA profile stuff

[Toad1677]

Backspace Key looks amazing. Just order

Also couldn't resist the blue switch keychain

[Rare]

Gonna try to snag one of these! Missed my chance with the normal geekhack key. You guys should make a full set like these. I would have no hesitation to buy one.

[Turbo Slaab]

Gonna try to snag one of these! Missed my chance with the normal geekhack key. You guys should make a full set like these. I would have no hesitation to buy one.

They are.....

[mashby]

Gonna try to snag one of these! Missed my chance with the normal geekhack key. You guys should make a full set like these. I would have no hesitation to buy one.

I have extras. PM me and maybe we can work out a trade.

[Kabuks]

Just ordered 2 plus some other stuff.

[OddOne]

Ordered one. Interested to see the full set as well!

[Rare]

Gonna try to snag one of these! Missed my chance with the normal geekhack key. You guys should make a full set like these. I would have no hesitation to buy one.

They are.....

Didn't even see that! Is there gonna be/is there a public group buy for it yet? I see nothing in group buys atm. lol.

[Turbo Slaab]

Nobody knows. But I'm sure you'll hear about it.

[leesofi]

if bg was grey..

[elton5354]

if bg was grey..

+1 or a darker colour

[Turbo Slaab]

Black and Orange!!!!!! Og GH colors and sexy as a chocolate strawberry.

[mkawa]

polycarb 1st shots on dark second shots don't tend to give enough contrast. the reflectivity of the white 2nd shot is really the best case for contrast. it's going to take something really creative to get darker second shots with translucent first shots..

[Turbo Slaab]

polycarb 1st shots on dark second shots don't tend to give enough contrast. the reflectivity of the white 2nd shot is really the best case for contrast. it's going to take something really creative to get darker second shots with translucent first shots..

That's what we were told about poly shots. Now look where we are. I have faith!!!!!

[Glod]

February key still the best key/method but that's just my thought

[infiniti]

February key still the best key/method but that's just my thought

I like it too! Especially the way it glows on a backlight keyboard!

Regardless, I'm still excited for the entire set of polycarb keys!

[mkawa]

February key still the best key/method but that's just my thought

this is what the modifiers of the full set will look like

[tjcaustin]

Because I'm curious and have my own plans to start getting vaguely into motion, how much more is required on the project (pm if you'd rather)?

Also, should I assume that you want the polycarb set to be the first with cherry font, then?

[Soarer]

polycarb 1st shots on dark second shots don't tend to give enough contrast. the reflectivity of the white 2nd shot is really the best case for contrast.

Maybe, but subtlety can be good too!

Or for those determined to 'pop': remove stab, add orange LEDs.

[mkawa]

Oh my glod!

glod damn it....

could do something like this

Show Image

so you guys should consider offering some DSA profile stuff :D

:D

[Lunartuna]

I'm so confused. I was under the impression that the Toxic set organizers were finishing cherry legends with SP?

Will we be waiting for this set to be done before other have access to the cherry legends? I'm worried soon as the cherry legends are finished there will be too many group buys moving ahead all at once and make it harder for people on a budget to take part in all of them.

For this set will there be the option to have the whole set like the GeekHack backspace even the modifiers?

I have a white Choc Mini in the mail that this set would look amazing on, even with the stock space bar.

I really like how even when not backlit, the legends look like they have depth. I'm really impressed with how the April GH key and Roadcone legends look in person.

All in all, damn excited for this set.

[mkawa]

For this set will there be the option to have the whole set like the GeekHack backspace even the modifiers?

ideally, yes. if we can keep costs down, we want to include both a PC on ABS modifier set and an ABS on PC modifier set. tsangan kits will, of course be an option as well. We're still working on specifics, as we need to pay to cut and proto a metric crapload of legends first, and pricing is higher than standard ABS 2-shot, but we're going to do our best to make this the most epic set yet

[Psybin]

Ordered the backspace and keychain!

I'm in for a full set as well whenever that goes down.

Thanks!

[Lunartuna]

Do we have any idea on durability of polycarb compared to ABS? Will ABS on PC develop shine faster than PC on ABS or vise versa?

[mkawa]

polycarbonate is harder than abs, but less temperature resistant and more brittle. think compact disc (made of polycarb) vs GI Joe (mostly abs)

ignoring hardness, polycarb is probably less likely to develop shine due solely to the fact that we're using translucent polycarb. shine is necessarily reflected light, and our polycarb reflects much less light than non-translucent plastics. the flip side of this is that it may show more scratching (refraction through the material).

[Lunartuna]

Thanks for the answers.

Now more! 

I know this will be a Cherry legend set but I'm wondering if that lower case typewriter style is a special font used on the "geekhack" backspace? Is it something you had cut and proto or does SP have that font available? Might be neat to have a set of modifiers done in the same style although I'm sure people are much more interested in having the modifiers cherry legends as well.

Just curious I guess.

[mkawa]

that legend was cut as part of group buy "round 3", many moons ago. it's not an SP font. in fact, it was totally one-off. i'm not even sure we know what font it was anymore.

[mkawa]

polycarb 1st shots on dark second shots don't tend to give enough contrast. the reflectivity of the white 2nd shot is really the best case for contrast.

Maybe, but subtlety can be good too!

Or for those determined to 'pop': remove stab, add orange LEDs.

ah, but too dark a second shot and not even the LED can shine through the 2nd shot

[Soarer]

polycarb 1st shots on dark second shots don't tend to give enough contrast. the reflectivity of the white 2nd shot is really the best case for contrast.

Maybe, but subtlety can be good too!

Or for those determined to 'pop': remove stab, add orange LEDs.

ah, but too dark a second shot and not even the LED can shine through the 2nd shot

Eh? Unless we're misunderstanding one another, that's the point of having a dark second shot - light shines through the polycarb legend but not the rest, giving max contrast. Even though there would perhaps be more shadow from the lattice pattern of second shot behind the legend, I think the effect would still be good.

[mkawa]

light has to reflect for you to see anything. consider a truly black 2nd shot (like 0K black) and transparent PC first shot (no index of refraction, 0 reflectivity). light shines through the PC first shot and is absorbed by the 2nd shot. you see nothing, no contrast. now fix reflectivity of the polycarb at say 50% (ie, p=1/2 of reflection) at a given wavelength. you get increasing amount of contrast as reflectivity of the 2nd shot increases. at pure white, it is at its maximum across all wavelengths and ta-da, that's where we are right now.

[Soarer]

Sounds like crap to me Light is way more complex than that...

Essentially, there are plenty of paths, are there not, for light from LEDs to travel (and spread slightly) through the polycarb first shot, lighting it up, and therefore max contrast is with a dark second shot.

Without LEDs, it would be a much more subtle key, but one where the first shot catches light (e.g. from your monitor). Sure, it wouldn't be 'in-yer-face', so maybe the masses wouldn't appreciate its sophistication, but I think it could be one of the classiest effects ever seen on novelty keys!

[Lunartuna]

So the modifiers will be the reflective orange with white legends and vice versa if costs allow, sweet!

I wonder if a single LED will uniformally light up the whole modifier keycap being this reflective orange colour.

I'm guessing the legends will be top centered to line up with LEDs like on a Ducky board?

The more I think about this the more I want!

So when is this GB going down?

[Soarer]

I don't think the reverse modifiers (polycarb second shot) would work well backlit, because the first shot would block too much light (whatever its colour).

[Lunartuna]

I don't think the reverse modifiers (polycarb second shot) would work well backlit, because the first shot would block too much light (whatever its colour).

GH Jan pack looks great LED backlit, I'm wondering if the orange will hold the light better. It's going to be very unique looking regardless

[Soarer]

I don't think the reverse modifiers (polycarb second shot) would work well backlit, because the first shot would block too much light (whatever its colour).

GH Jan pack looks great LED backlit, I'm wondering if the orange will hold the light better. It's going to be very unique looking regardless

I'm not convinced I'd like that look... but the polycarb would probably look better than the Jan pack, at a guess

[i3oilermaker]

IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENT

We just made margin on these keys.  That means every backspace sold from here on out will go entirely to the Cherry Replica Legend fund.

If you were planning on pledging money to get legends cut NOW IS YOUR CHANCE.

4 Backspace keys buys us a legend!

[Lunartuna]

Any name for this set yet? Orange Creamsicle? 

[tjcaustin]

Any name for this set yet? Orange Creamsicle? 

I'll stab a *****...

[Lunartuna]

Here's a nice pic. This is on the lowest brightness setting on my Ducky. A whole set.... no words

[mkawa]

Sounds like crap to me Light is way more complex than that...

light is simple (hah!). materials are complicated!

Essentially, there are plenty of paths, are there not, for light from LEDs to travel (and spread slightly) through the polycarb first shot, lighting it up, and therefore max contrast is with a dark second shot.

Without LEDs, it would be a much more subtle key, but one where the first shot catches light (e.g. from your monitor). Sure, it wouldn't be 'in-yer-face', so maybe the masses wouldn't appreciate its sophistication, but I think it could be one of the classiest effects ever seen on novelty keys!

you might very well be right. i gave the worst-case example, but we can run more experiments once the fund has the money to spare. right now high value (and cost) target number one is cherry legends.

[Soarer]

Bah... I meant "Light's interaction with stuff..." then, I guess

Just don't rule it out... I mean, you can spot a diamond even when set in silver, and there's not much 'contrast' there

[i3oilermaker]

I apologize if this sounds repetitive from my previous post, but I've heard some confusion and want to clarify:

If you pledged money in the "adopt a key" thread some time ago, that program has been abandoned.  You will not be asked to donate that money, and are kindly asked to BUY GeekHack April Backspace keys instead!  At this point the cost of the keys has been covered and every dollar of a purchased GH April Backspace key will be dropped into SP's pocket for cutting us a new set of legends.

[mkawa]

Bah... I meant "Light's interaction with stuff..." then, I guess

Just don't rule it out... I mean, you can spot a diamond even when set in silver, and there's not much 'contrast' there

good point. so now it's just a simple matter of making diamonds and silver out of plastic....

[Glod]

February key still the best key/method but that's just my thought

this is what the modifiers of the full set will look like

sweet

[strafe]

February key still the best key/method but that's just my thought

Agreed.  I'd really like a Dolch replica set in White on PC

[Megaweapon]

You ever remove a computer bezel and notice how the power/HDD activity LED's are fed?  Depending on the case design there is frequently a clear piece of plastic that runs between the LED and the bezel.  Sometimes the actual LED is nowhere near the hole on the bezel where the light is delivered, so this clear piece of plastic has a couple of right angles in it.

I wonder if keycaps could use a similar technique to get a more precise and even delivery of light (as well as allow for legends to be placed anywhere on the cap, for keys like shift and enter).

[whiteduck]

got one for the cause!

[mkawa]

those are called light pipes and are generally made out of translucent colored polycarbonate just as our caps are. however, it's not really possible to make keycaps that also double as light pipes for the MX1a switch given the datasheet LED placement. basically, such a keycap would have to be solid around the cruciform. MX caps can't be sold around the cruciform for obvious reasons (actuation!).

that said, there's a little room to play around with. if someone can find an O-ring material that is translucent (finding one shouldn't be hard, but i'm going to take a guess that any material that has this property will make for a very hard o-ring), this would at least distribute the LED light more uniformly around the switch and hence the cap. similarly, a translucent "landing pad" would do the job as well. with a perfectly clear landing pad light guide, the light will be more distributed around the cap. with a slightly more opaque landing pad guide, the keys will pop a little more when you actuate them. it could definitely be quite cool.

pretty much any other solution would require a redesign of the MX switch itself.

[leesofi]

here is solution if you have time to do that.

http://www.kbdmania.net/xe/photo/6236514

[esoomenona]

^Those are actually interesting. Were those something that that person invented? Or were they available beforehand and he just found them and they happened to work out perfectly?

[leesofi]

it was peronal work. making pcb , soldering smd chip and so on.

[esoomenona]

Is he planning on possibly starting a GB to have those made?

[Batmann]

Set goals guys,
every time you ask for donations we don't know what's already been raised and what is still needed.

[i3oilermaker]

Set goals guys,
every time you ask for donations we don't know what's already been raised and what is still needed.

Coming soon at: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=42659.0

[SmallFry]

^Those are actually interesting. Were those something that that person invented? Or were they available beforehand and he just found them and they happened to work out perfectly?

Agreed. Quite an interesting gizmo.

[Batmann]

Set goals guys,
every time you ask for donations we don't know what's already been raised and what is still needed.

Coming soon at: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=42659.0

Nice, thanks i3oiler

[leesofi]

Is he planning on possibly starting a GB to have those made?

No, he mentioned it takes so many time.
if factory make that automatic, someone can start GB, i think.

[zenuty]

I wanted to remake it

Geek Hack !!

[Lunartuna]

Picked up a Backspace. Could only afford one, hope it helps!

[AGmurdercore]

Sorry if this has been reported already but how much will be the estimate cost of a whole set of the new caps?

[mkawa]

we don't have solid numbers yet. we'll release details as we work them out

[AGmurdercore]

we don't have solid numbers yet. we'll release details as we work them out

Ok great, will keep an eye on the thread

[badcop]

i bought half a legend! 

[mkawa]

Folks,

We only have 50 more of these keys, and won't be producing them again. If you want one, now might be the time.

[SmallFry]

Pertaining to legends, does each profile require a whole new payment for legends? Or now that we have the Cherry legends can we use them between profiles such as DSA and DSC (I'm a bit flaky today, I think that's the profile we usually use)

[mashby]

Folks,

We only have 50 more of these keys, and won't be producing them again. If you want one, now might be the time.

I was hoping to hold out until the May GH keys came out to try and save on shipping, but couldn't risk it. 

Ordered 2.

[mkawa]

Pertaining to legends, does each profile require a whole new payment for legends? Or now that we have the Cherry legends can we use them between profiles such as DSA and DSC (I'm a bit flaky today, I think that's the profile we usually use)

each key profile family requires a new legend to be cut. ie DCS legends cannot be used to make DSA keys.

[SmallFry]

Pertaining to legends, does each profile require a whole new payment for legends? Or now that we have the Cherry legends can we use them between profiles such as DSA and DSC (I'm a bit flaky today, I think that's the profile we usually use)

each key profile family requires a new legend to be cut. ie DCS legends cannot be used to make DSA keys.

Poo. Alrighty, so next fund raiser.... DSA CHERRY!

[Lunartuna]

[mashby]

I ordered two and they arrived this week. None of the boards at my office currently have LED backlighting, so I used a small flashlight instead. 


Aziz, Light! by Michael Ashby, on Flickr

[IPT]

got mine, but obviously no backlit so its just boring =(

[Thechemist]

got mine, but obviously no backlit so its just boring =(

Show Image

will you be modding your GG button?