Keycaps

[Matias]

I think you have already answered this, but I just wanted to double check.

Will you guys be selling these new PBT key caps separately also?

Yes, we'll be selling the PBT caps as well.  You can see attached photos of the two we've done so far... a 1.5x2.5 spacebar and an R4 1x1.25:

[CommonCurt]

I think you have already answered this, but I just wanted to double check.

Will you guys be selling these new PBT key caps separately also?

Yes, we'll be selling the PBT caps as well.  You can see attached photos of the two we've done so far... a 1.5x2.5 spacebar and an R4 1x1.25:


(Attachment Link)

(Attachment Link)

(Attachment Link)

Nice.  Do you think you will of white key caps with black legends also?

[Matias]

I think you have already answered this, but I just wanted to double check.

Will you guys be selling these new PBT key caps separately also?

Yes, we'll be selling the PBT caps as well.  You can see attached photos of the two we've done so far... a 1.5x2.5 spacebar and an R4 1x1.25:


(Attachment Link)

(Attachment Link)

(Attachment Link)

Nice.  Do you think you will of white key caps with black legends also?

Yes, we plan to offer both Black and White caps.

[CommonCurt]

I think you have already answered this, but I just wanted to double check.

Will you guys be selling these new PBT key caps separately also?

Yes, we'll be selling the PBT caps as well.  You can see attached photos of the two we've done so far... a 1.5x2.5 spacebar and an R4 1x1.25:


(Attachment Link)

(Attachment Link)

(Attachment Link)

Nice.  Do you think you will of white key caps with black legends also?

Yes, we plan to offer both Black and White caps.

Great.   I'm planning on getting the KBParadise V60 MTS with matias switches. Do you think your new caps will fit that key board?

[Matias]

Great.   I'm planning on getting the KBParadise V60 MTS with matias switches. Do you think your new caps will fit that key board?

The 1x1, 1x1.25, 1x1.5, and 1x1.75 keys should fit easily.  For bigger keys with balance bars, I'm not sure.

[jacobolus]

The 1x1, 1x1.25, 1x1.5, and 1x1.75 keys should fit easily.  For bigger keys with balance bars, I'm not sure.

Are you planning to make PBT caps for your other keyboards as well sometime (and ideally offer those keycap shapes to other folks), or just the ErgoPro?

[Elrick]

The keycaps will be available for sale as soon as we have the tooling done.  They will fit any ALPS-compatible switches.

Just out of curiosity, is there any publicly mentionable ETA on the tooling? I guess we know it should at least be “before august”. :-)

Short answer...  before August for keys needed for the Ergo Pro.

Longer answer...  We're doing the tooling in stages.  We've never done PBT injection before, and it's a little tricky for longer keys like the spacebar, so we're tooling those first.

Extra keys for the ALPs switch how brilliant is that  .  Good to have a variety of switches now to support, got to get me some matias keyboards......

[Matias]

Extra keys for the ALPs switch how brilliant is that  .  Good to have a variety of switches now to support, got to get me some matias keyboards......

Yeah, basically, there are things you can do with ALPS switches and caps that are impossible to with Cherry.

Are you planning to make PBT caps for your other keyboards as well sometime (and ideally offer those keycap shapes to other folks), or just the ErgoPro?

The new PBT caps will be made available for sale as soon as they are completed.

We'll also use them on models that need them -- the Ergo Pro for example, needs the bigger and smaller caps that didn't exist before.  For other models, we plan to make them available as an upgrade.

[Matias]

Here are some more photos I just took of the PBT 1.5x2.5 spacebar...

[OverKill]

Those sure do look nice. Glad my next board are gonna be matias switches and there will be caps available for them

[mkawa]

man, those are extremely geometrically clean for thick PBT tooling. nice job. commendations to your toolmakers 

[Elrick]

The new PBT caps will be made available for sale as soon as they are completed.

We'll also use them on models that need them -- the Ergo Pro for example, needs the bigger and smaller caps that didn't exist before.  For other models, we plan to make them available as an upgrade.

Dear Sir,

How will the font be applied to the key-cap?  Will you be using dye-sub or will you be burning the letters/numbers into the PBT?

I'm completely in the dark with how you will make these caps other than knowing they will be made out of PBT.  Please remember also you are speaking to someone with a very low IQ, so I would appreciate an easy explanation that won't strain what little brain cells are left inside my skull  .

[Matias]

man, those are extremely geometrically clean for thick PBT tooling. nice job. commendations to your toolmakers 

Thanks!

I probably should've cross-posted to the keycaps forum, but didn't think of it.  Actually, I'm not sure that the board software supports it.

[Matias]

How will the font be applied to the key-cap?  Will you be using dye-sub or will you be burning the letters/numbers into the PBT?

Most likely we'll use a process called UV printing.  Legends will be printed using paint infused with UV coating material, and then run through a UV machine.

This allows us to print white on black caps, which is not possible using dye-sub.

[Elrick]

Most likely we'll use a process called UV printing.  Legends will be printed using paint infused with UV coating material, and then run through a UV machine.

This allows us to print white on black caps, which is not possible using dye-sub.

Will you also be using GREY coloured PBT, because I would buy the White and Grey Key-sets giving your Matias Keyboard an old style layout similar to a Cherry/IBM.

[jacobolus]

I wonder how the UV machine affects later applications of dye. If it’s possible to dye (e.g. with RIT dye) the white caps and not harm the black legends, then making gray (or whatever other color) should be plenty achievable for the DIY crowd.

[Matias]

I wonder how the UV machine affects later applications of dye. If it’s possible to dye (e.g. with RIT dye) the white caps and not harm the black legends, then making gray (or whatever other color) should be plenty achievable for the DIY crowd.

Yes, you can run them through the UV machine more than once.  The UV light just hardens the paint while it's wet.

Will you also be using GREY coloured PBT, because I would buy the White and Grey Key-sets giving your Matias Keyboard an old style layout similar to a Cherry/IBM.

Not sure if we'll keep grey caps in general inventory, but we can certainly do group buys for them.

[mkawa]

man, those are extremely geometrically clean for thick PBT tooling. nice job. commendations to your toolmakers 

Thanks!

I probably should've cross-posted to the keycaps forum, but didn't think of it.  Actually, I'm not sure that the board software supports it.

yah, we don't have a cross-posting mechanism yet. i'm sure someone will catch on eventually and link this

[CPTBadAss]

Cross posted here

[Matias]

Cross posted here

Awesome, thanks!

[intelli78]

Can you speak to the durability of UV printing vs. dyesub?

[Matias]

Can you speak to the durability of UV printing vs. dyesub?

I don't have much experience with dyesub (beyond using them).

However, on the keyboards we've used UV printing, we haven't had any reports of the printing wearing off.

[Belfong]

Hi there Matias, what about the 60% or it will be the Ergo Pro first at this moment seeing that the availability of Ergo Pro is 3 more months to go.

[Matias]

Hi there Matias, what about the 60% or it will be the Ergo Pro first at this moment seeing that the availability of Ergo Pro is 3 more months to go.

Thanks for asking...

The 60% keyboard shares a lot of keycaps with the Ergo Pro, so it's going to have to come after.  It also needs 3 more keycaps which the Ergo Pro doesn't have, so there will be some additional keycap tooling required.

I've been trying to decide how soon to do the IC for it.  I figured it would be better if the IC were closer to the eventual release date.  As always, I'm open to suggestions.

[Belfong]

Back in the other thread, I remember around 10, including myself, who are interested. Probably more. At that time you said that it will be in Jan. I think we all can wait. Take your time to fine time the ultimate 60% board!

[CommonCurt]

Hi there Matias, what about the 60% or it will be the Ergo Pro first at this moment seeing that the availability of Ergo Pro is 3 more months to go.

Thanks for asking...

The 60% keyboard shares a lot of keycaps with the Ergo Pro, so it's going to have to come after.  It also needs 3 more keycaps which the Ergo Pro doesn't have, so there will be some additional keycap tooling required.

I've been trying to decide how soon to do the IC for it.  I figured it would be better if the IC were closer to the eventual release date.  As always, I'm open to suggestions.

What will the layout & case look like on the upcoming 60%?

[riotonthebay]

Hi there Matias, what about the 60% or it will be the Ergo Pro first at this moment seeing that the availability of Ergo Pro is 3 more months to go.

Thanks for asking...

The 60% keyboard shares a lot of keycaps with the Ergo Pro, so it's going to have to come after.  It also needs 3 more keycaps which the Ergo Pro doesn't have, so there will be some additional keycap tooling required.

I've been trying to decide how soon to do the IC for it.  I figured it would be better if the IC were closer to the eventual release date.  As always, I'm open to suggestions.

What will the layout & case look like on the upcoming 60%?

[daerid]

If it's a programmable ANSI 60% board manufactured by Matias, I am ALL OVER IT.

[luisbg]

Nice! Very promising

[Matias]

What will the layout & case look like on the upcoming 60%?

The case would be minimalist -- as small as we can make it.  The layout would be something like this...





This gives you all the most important keys, without having to go through an Fn layer.  It's essentially a Tenkeyless without the function keys.

[luisbg]

What will the layout & case look like on the upcoming 60%?

The case would be minimalist -- as small as we can make it.  The layout would be something like this...


(Attachment Link)


This gives you all the most important keys, without having to go through an Fn layer.  It's essentially a Tenkeyless without the function keys.

The page up/down and home/end placing is interesting. I would remap it to have the backspace one key down.

What size is that space bar?

[Matias]

What size is that space bar?

1.5x4.5 units.

[daerid]

The page up/down and home/end placing is interesting. I would remap it to have the backspace one key down.

What size is that space bar?

HHKB backspace placement would be a deal breaker for me. That layout makes my right hand hurt in like 5 minutes

Easy solution: programmability!

[CPTBadAss]

I've been trying to decide how soon to do the IC for it.  I figured it would be better if the IC were closer to the eventual release date.  As always, I'm open to suggestions.

It'd be cool to see the interest check closer to the release date. Just a personal peeve but I don't like long IC waiting periods.

What will the layout & case look like on the upcoming 60%?

The case would be minimalist -- as small as we can make it.  The layout would be something like this...


(Attachment Link)


This gives you all the most important keys, without having to go through an Fn layer.  It's essentially a Tenkeyless without the function keys.

Hm, interesting layout. I like how you're trying to save the nav pad but I'm not sure about the half sized keys. Still extremely interested though .

[luisbg]

The page up/down and home/end placing is interesting. I would remap it to have the backspace one key down.

What size is that space bar?

HHKB backspace placement would be a deal breaker for me. That layout makes my right hand hurt in like 5 minutes

Easy solution: programmability!

Having your pinkie travel all the way to the corner is more comfortable for you?

[jacobolus]

Having your pinkie travel all the way to the corner is more comfortable for you?

I’m pretty sure most people use their ring finger to hit the backward delete key.

But anyway, Matias: have you considered just using the same width spacebars as on the ErgoPro, and having 2 of them? (Then one can be used as backspace, which is better than using anything in the top right corner.)

[daerid]

Having your pinkie travel all the way to the corner is more comfortable for you?

I’m pretty sure most people use their ring finger to hit the backward delete key.

But anyway, Matias: have you considered just using the same width spacebars as on the ErgoPro, and having 2 of them? (Then one can be used as backspace, which is better than using anything in the top right corner.)

This. My hands have gotten used to the ANSI layout for so long that hitting the BS key with my ring finger is super relaxed and doesn't require moving my wrists. Swapping that position over to where the \ key is makes my wrists hurt because of how often I have to hit it.

[luisbg]

Having your pinkie travel all the way to the corner is more comfortable for you?

I’m pretty sure most people use their ring finger to hit the backward delete key.

But anyway, Matias: have you considered just using the same width spacebars as on the ErgoPro, and having 2 of them? (Then one can be used as backspace, which is better than using anything in the top right corner.)

This. My hands have gotten used to the ANSI layout for so long that hitting the BS key with my ring finger is super relaxed and doesn't require moving my wrists. Swapping that position over to where the \ key is makes my wrists hurt because of how often I have to hit it.

I secretly have my backspace remapped to the capslock key at the left pinkie.
Evil genius, I know.

[Shayde]

This gives you all the most important keys, without having to go through an Fn layer.  It's essentially a Tenkeyless without the function keys.

Mmm, that's an interesting layout.  I wasn't sure about the 60% but I could get used to this.  Any chance this can be offered with the clicky switches?  I guess that's a question for the IC.

[Matias]

This gives you all the most important keys, without having to go through an Fn layer.  It's essentially a Tenkeyless without the function keys.

Mmm, that's an interesting layout.  I wasn't sure about the 60% but I could get used to this.  Any chance this can be offered with the clicky switches?  I guess that's a question for the IC.

Yes, we'd offer both quiet and clicky switch types, and perhaps include support for Cherry switches where possible.

We're also considering offering an aluminum case option.

But anyway, Matias: have you considered just using the same width spacebars as on the ErgoPro, and having 2 of them? (Then one can be used as backspace, which is better than using anything in the top right corner.)

I hadn't considered that, though it wouldn't fit.  We only have room for a 4.5u spacebar -- doubling 2.5u spacebars would add up to 5u.

In any case, I suspect most people would prefer a normal spacebar.

[CPTBadAss]

Yes, we'd offer both quiet and clicky switch types, and perhaps include support for Cherry switches where possible.

We're also considering offering an aluminum case option.

In any case, I suspect most people would prefer a normal spacebar.

I say YES PLEASE, to all of these things .

[Shayde]

Yes, we'd offer both quiet and clicky switch types, and perhaps include support for Cherry switches where possible.

We're also considering offering an aluminum case option.

Very cool!  I'm looking forward to it.

[blackbox]

This is great news(just discovered this thread)! Cant wait to get hold on those keycaps! I have an dell at102w that I want to use it on(with matias standard clicky).

[jacobolus]

If you’re finished figuring out the 2.5x1.5 spacebars, is there any way I could buy like 10 of them, in whatever color?

Also, I’m very interested if/when you can handle 2.75x1 spacebars, 1x.75 caps of whatever profile, or bottom row 1x1.5 caps.

Other shapes I can pretty much experiment with using various existing sets of keycaps, but all of those would be quite interesting to play around with.

[zxz]

Hi Matias,

All very exciting stuff! But as an ISO layout user please tell me you'll release the PBT caps in ISO too...

I've got a mini quite pro and really like the layout but find that the noise is slightly louder than my o-ringed mx browns.

I had a bit of a tinker to see how the keys were being silenced and saw that there is a rubber insert on either side of the slider to reduce the noise on bottoming out and recoil of the switch, this is when I realised most of the noise that I hear is from the stem moving inside the housing. This also leads to the well known key wobble, is there any particular reason the tolerances on the stem and the house can't be increased to reduce the wobble and noise?

I added some dental bands to the tops of the stem where it meets the housing and this definitely did reduce key wobble and acted in reducing the noise. But this also had two other side effects, one was that it made the keys feel stiffer and some times you can feel the dental band passing the leaf spring.

It'll be good to hear your thoughts.

[Matias]

If you’re finished figuring out the 2.5x1.5 spacebars, is there any way I could buy like 10 of them, in whatever color?

Sorry, but all I have is a few samples from the T1 tooling.  They're not even textured yet.  We are still a little ways off being able to sell caps.

Also, I’m very interested if/when you can handle 2.75x1 spacebars, 1x.75 caps of whatever profile, or bottom row 1x1.5 caps.

Probably around August for the PBT caps.  For ABS caps, we expect to be up and running soon.

[CPTBadAss]

Probably around August for the PBT caps.  For ABS caps, we expect to be up and running soon.

There are ABS caps and coming soon???!!! YES!

[Matias]

All very exciting stuff! But as an ISO layout user please tell me you'll release the PBT caps in ISO too...

Thanks for asking...

Eventually, we expect to have the entire gamut of keycaps for all layouts in PBT.  The ones needed for the Ergo Pro will be first, likely followed by the ones for the 60% keyboard.

I hope to have the complete tooling for all caps done by the end of the year.  The ones needed for the Ergo Pro should be available around August.  The ones needed for the 60% board will depend on how soon we do the IC (interest check).

[barihunk]

All very exciting stuff! But as an ISO layout user please tell me you'll release the PBT caps in ISO too...

Thanks for asking...

Eventually, we expect to have the entire gamut of keycaps for all layouts in PBT.  The ones needed for the Ergo Pro will be first, likely followed by the ones for the 60% keyboard.

I hope to have the complete tooling for all caps done by the end of the year.  The ones needed for the Ergo Pro should be available around August.  The ones needed for the 60% board will depend on how soon we do the IC (interest check).

Don't forget folks who have the tactile pro/mini pro/quiet pro/laptop pro! Would love some nice PBT caps for my Laptop Pro & Tactile Pro

[Matias]

There are ABS caps and coming soon???!!! YES!

Yes, they're already in production.  We'll list them as soon as they arrive.

Don't forget folks who have the tactile pro/mini pro/quiet pro/laptop pro! Would love some nice PBT caps for my Laptop Pro & Tactile Pro

Rest assured, we didn't forget.  Like I said, we hope to have all layouts covered by the end of the year.