geekhack
geekhack Community => Off Topic => Topic started by: C5Allroad on Wed, 15 January 2014, 09:05:07
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This will be a sad decade, when car manufacturers stop building cars with a manual transmission. I don't care if a DCT will shift in 0.2 seconds. What matters is connecting with the car.
Manufactures are all worried about lap times, which is usually about a tenths faster than manual. I went to the dealer to look at the new all road. Mine has a 5spd and I love it. I was sadly mistaken about the new one. I asked the guy and he said oh you can shift manually, to which I replied ok, any cars in this lot that are manual? He said there are absolutely no cars that are manual and that I would need to order a car. And that car is an A4 if I still want manual. I guess I'll be buying a FR-S. Atleast Toyobaru still makes them with manual.
What do you guys think?
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What's an all road?
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You can afford a car at 16?
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What's an all road?
A Corrolla
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Up until now, automatic transmissions have largely been a US thing. There aren't many countries where you can even take a driver's license for just automatic as I believe you can in the US? Cars with automatic gearboxes are simply rare around here. I can honestly say that I haven't seen that many in my life.
Electric motors don't share the engines' need for a certain rpm and a transmission which ensures the engine runs in a certain interval. As electric vehicles become more common, so will fixed transmissions and the automatic/manual will become less of an issue.
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The 2015 S3 was a big contender for my next car, I've been following the press releases, etc, but its DSG only for the states. What a shame.
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You can afford a car at 16?
If he can't I bet his mom and dad can.....
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I don't care if a DCT will shift in 0.2 seconds. What matters is connecting with the car.
I completely agree with this.
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Unless it's Mazda or Honda I could care less.
Clutch weight and definition has gone from Cherry MX Clears to Cherry MX Reds. They have sacrificed pedal feel for muscle free legs.
Then you've got the shifter which is getting more vague and not smooth.
And of course the transmission which due to EPA regs has caused manufacturers to add rev hang to the mix.
I don't think the manual will completely die - but that it will be widely discontinued and all those sales will funnel down into 1 or 2 brands which will make it profitable enough to keep producing.
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Also, at least here in LA, manual trans is just not practical for day to day due to traffic. You'll never get the most out of a car because of it. And tickets. And cops. Which kill.
So that's why I'm getting a moto. Fast. Trans. No traffic.
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I live in Europe :)
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I only drive manual. Can't stand slushboxes. Some of the twin clutch jobbies are okay (VW's 7 speed comes to mind), but you don't get that feeling of pushing mechanical pieces around to engage the gears as you do with a "true" manual and I prefer engaging / disengaging the clutch myself, thank you very much.
There'll always be people wanting manuals and I reckon it's enough of a market that there'll always be someone making 'em.
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The real death will be with the coming of the electric car (that needs no transmission at all).
But it seems to be dying in NA already. Sad. And electric cars won't hit the market massively for a few years still.
But once the batteries get a 400-500 km autonomy at a fair price, then it's going to be interesting. And I saw a new about a silicon thing that could lower the production cost of electric car batteries to 1/3 of their actual price (supposed to be released in 2015). This kind of improvements, once in production, will have a dramatic impact on the car market. Until then, it will stay the same. But these technologies could see the light in the next 5 years. And once they are released, it will mean more electric car sold and more money invested in developing them and the wheel goes on.
Lot's of hopes for getting rid of a part of the dependence to fuel. Now to the dependence on the electricity produced by fuel and coal!
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Very sad, but with driverless cars an automatic is almost mandatory.
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What's an all road?
I attached a picture of it... You can afford a car at 16?
A family member gave the car to me, in which I fixed the tranny over a course of a year lol.
I only drive manual. Can't stand slushboxes. Some of the twin clutch jobbies are okay (VW's 7 speed comes to mind), but you don't get that feeling of pushing mechanical pieces around to engage the gears as you do with a "true" manual and I prefer engaging / disengaging the clutch myself, thank you very much.
There'll always be people wanting manuals and I reckon it's enough of a market that there'll always be someone making 'em.
I don't see them making them for too much longer...
BMW is a strong contender, also the BRZ/FRS....
I have seen electric converted S2000's with a manual tranny still.
My allroad had a automatic up until recently...
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I love the allroad and the A3, something about Audi wagons... I will ONLY drive stick, and fortunately, my next car will be old enough to still have one :)) With all the DCT's and CVT's nowadays, I feel people are disconnecting from their cars. Driving a car for most people is just commuting, while for others driving is, well, driving. I think more performance oriented models should offer a stick along side the other models. Hell, if they can throw paddles on the wheel, they sure as hell can take em back off.
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I thought the point of sports cars were to connect the driver with the car and road... I guess companies only care about "lap times" and the few nano seconds you save.
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crash at a high speed and you'll be really connected to both!
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If you get an A4 get manual Forsure! Both of my Audis were Auto and both of my VWs were manual. I had a way more enjoyable experience w the VW GTis! :)
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I'm thinking of selling this one and getting an FR-S... I have the budget to pay it off since I live with my parents lol.
Reason being is, I will go to a track in the FR-S and really learn to "tell the car when to oversteer, understeer, or flat out grip". I can't really this when the sidewalls on my care are already soooo soft...
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im curious to what you do that you can afford a 25k+ car at your age.
because ****, im doing something wrong.
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Well I buy and sell cars with my dad... Buy a Corolla, fix it, and sell it for more than what we bought it for.
I have an A6 at my dads garage that we're working on to fix after I sell my Allroad. Eventually I will be up at 20k.
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oh so your dad is buying the car. gotcha.
for what it's worth, i'd go with the brz. simply for the rally blue.
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Not really.... A client brought the car in... So I would sell my car and put the 5k in the bank...
And 2k to buy it...
THe Allroad was given to me by a relative, and we drove the car down. He helped a lot of the way lol.
But since I got my car, I've been job hunting.... I know a lot more than most teens at my age too....
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Say goodbye to manual.. say goodbye also to crash/hill/jumpstarts without batteries or having to charge up batteries.
Also say goodbye to an extra skill required to understand more about cars, for now we'll have more idiots on the road as a result.
People who think they can drive a car when all they have driven are cars with automatic gearboxes have lots of say about their own attitudes with cars.
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Say goodbye to manual.. say goodbye also to crash/hill/jumpstarts without batteries or having to charge up batteries.
Also say goodbye to an extra skill required to understand more about cars, for now we'll have more idiots on the road as a result.
People who think they can drive a car when all they have driven are cars with automatic gearboxes have lots of say about their own attitudes with cars.
Oh man.. I loved pushing my 92 Gti to get it started that was so fun :) such a light car!
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Say goodbye to manual.. say goodbye also to crash/hill/jumpstarts without batteries or having to charge up batteries.
Also say goodbye to an extra skill required to understand more about cars, for now we'll have more idiots on the road as a result.
People who think they can drive a car when all they have driven are cars with automatic gearboxes have lots of say about their own attitudes with cars.
The problem with a lot of idiots driving cars with automatic gearboxes is that their brains are on automatic too.
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If you want manual you can still find them. There are a few models out there that are thriving off of catering to the manual-minded folk. There are quite a few, but the couple that come to mind from my shopping around are VW GTI/GLI and MINIs. And pretty much any other car out there that's similar in style/intention to those. Maybe they're not what you're looking for, but manuals are doing fine in the niche market they have in the US through a few limited models.
If you get an A4 get manual Forsure! Both of my Audis were Auto and both of my VWs were manual. I had a way more enjoyable experience w the VW GTis! :)
Nice, GTIs are so fun. :) I might end up getting one of those some day. Or maybe a GLI. Or maybe a TDI. I can't decide...
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Say goodbye to manual.. say goodbye also to crash/hill/jumpstarts without batteries or having to charge up batteries.
Also say goodbye to an extra skill required to understand more about cars, for now we'll have more idiots on the road as a result.
People who think they can drive a car when all they have driven are cars with automatic gearboxes have lots of say about their own attitudes with cars.
The problem with a lot of idiots driving cars with automatic gearboxes is that their brains are on automatic too.
riiiiiiiiight. because no idiot drives a car with manual transmission. no person thinks he's a race car driver because he can shift gears. nope, none.
also, knowing how to drive manual doesn't automatically make some some type of car guru.
man, you guys are quite dramatic.
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Say goodbye to manual.. say goodbye also to crash/hill/jumpstarts without batteries or having to charge up batteries.
Also say goodbye to an extra skill required to understand more about cars, for now we'll have more idiots on the road as a result.
People who think they can drive a car when all they have driven are cars with automatic gearboxes have lots of say about their own attitudes with cars.
The problem with a lot of idiots driving cars with automatic gearboxes is that their brains are on automatic too.
riiiiiiiiight. because no idiot drives a car with manual transmission. no person thinks he's a race car driver because he can shift gears. nope, none.
also, knowing how to drive manual doesn't automatically make some some type of car guru.
man, you guys are quite dramatic.
Just as you are dramatic with thinking race car drivers would drive only with manual gearbox. You basically extrapolated what I said and magnified my response to be some anti-automatic driver basher.
Driving manual is more than just shifting gears, driving manual is more than making one think they are automagically some sort of car guru (when they aren't necessarily the case). What driving manual about is knowing how well one can perform driving a car based on various circumstances rather than solely depending on technologies to do what they do best in. For instance, it would be appallingly ludicrous to see an 18 wheeler with automatic gearbox hauling some heavy item (and the said item is slightly more than what the vehicle itself is capable of hauling). I would love to see one going up on a hill, the truck in this case would struggle to climb because the automatic gearbox would probably not kick to a lower gear early enough.
The same could be said likewise for steep hills on a car that does necessarily seem to have enough torque to climb it combined with a gearbox that is geared with fairly low ratios.
There are also countries whom have specific driving laws. For instance passing a test with a car that was equipped with automatic gearbox restricts one to drive cars with only automatic gearbox, whereas those passing a test with a car that was equipped with a manual gearbox are allowed to drive either a car with a manual gearbox or automatic gearbox.
Driving a car with a manual gearbox may require more brain stimulus than automatic gearbox. You imagine half the time people answering their mobile phones whilst driving a car for instance maybe are caused by the fact that they may not have been focusing much on the roads but instead on their mobile phones. Try answering a mobile phone with a car that has manual gearbox for the first time, then tell me how much involvement does it require for one to be able to multitask both. Also no, I don't condone driving whilst answering mobile phones but it goes to show that it is possible such technologies may have paved way for people to be less focused with the task on hand.
Last but not least, there are some rewards given to those who drive cars with manual gearbox. Once one learns to shift properly with clutch at virtually all the time, they can basically try and attempt clutchless shifts. It'll prevent excessive wear and tear on clutches along with engine and other running gears. Automatic gearboxes doesn't necessarily give you that same benefit with a torque converter in place of clutch and you have to more or less keep automatic gearboxes in good condition or otherwise you can pray and hope the hydraulics will do their bid despite being treated poorly. There are lesser parts in manual transmissions than automatic, therefore less complications.
I also want to add that not all race car drivers would necessarily be driving only manual gearboxes, there are professional drag racers that would swear by automatic transmissions.
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Say goodbye to manual.. say goodbye also to crash/hill/jumpstarts without batteries or having to charge up batteries.
Also say goodbye to an extra skill required to understand more about cars, for now we'll have more idiots on the road as a result.
People who think they can drive a car when all they have driven are cars with automatic gearboxes have lots of say about their own attitudes with cars.
The problem with a lot of idiots driving cars with automatic gearboxes is that their brains are on automatic too.
riiiiiiiiight. because no idiot drives a car with manual transmission. no person thinks he's a race car driver because he can shift gears. nope, none.
also, knowing how to drive manual doesn't automatically make some some type of car guru.
man, you guys are quite dramatic.
Er, not quite.
Driving automatic gives less incentive to learn about how a gearbox works, as the car does everything for you.
In a manual car, you need to listen to the engine and/or watch the rev counter and change when the car needs you to change.
You need to understand a bit better how your car works, and how to get the most out of it in terms of power and fuel efficiency.
Automatic cars just change gear for you, so you don't have to think as much, and there is less incentive to learn how the engine or gearbox works.
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You know what we got these days..
INTERNET..
Cars can go DIAF.. and they often do....
I don't want to get into a metal death trap. drive for 20 mins and wait for another 20 mid traffic.
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In a manual car, you need to listen to the engine and/or watch the rev counter and change when the car needs you to change.
You need to understand a bit better how your car works, and how to get the most out of it in terms of power and fuel efficiency.
Some have been saying that when the electric cars finally come in then that's the death of the current vehicle as we know it.......bullsh!t. This talk about only getting automatic trans for all vehicles is about as daft when it was first talked about 30 years ago when I went for my traffic license. Rowdy's right, knowing a little about what you're driving lends itself in knowing what possible problems you could easily avoid in the future. I use to own a holden that always crapped itself because the tri-matic (auto) transmission was so fundamentally flawed. My current Landcruiser is 100% reliable floor-shift manual that has been abused a few times but still keeps on kicking.
All I know is that the current technology has proven itself for more than 100 years and will still be readily available for some decades to come. The manual transmission has proven itself across all fields especially with all industry and distribution chains world-wide. The back-up in maintaining these vehicles is well re-sourced and understood in my field.
Not saying that some day electric vehicles will take over the world because they have somewhat in the Mining Sector already (all current Caterpillar Dump Trucks have electric motors fitted to each wheel housing). Hence we already know how it works but the power still comes from a large diesel motor only. The electric car relying on a power source ie, battery alone is still a pipe dream.
Until they finally develop a stable storage source able to power a vehicle for hundreds of kms without constant stops for charging, then the current system has no fear of disappearing anytime soon. Plus where is the back-up for electric cars, because when that baby doesn't start, who will be able to fix it before it's needed to be used? I've seen electricians fall over by the way-side trying to diagnose a problem with a simple circuit, so I have no problem choosing a traditional car to own and run because I can easily get it working in no time.
The key for the future is not so much the technology that's available but the ability to get it working in all conditions, anywhere and at any time, with little to no failures. Plus having competent people who can get these vehicles moving quickly if a problem occurs, that's what's actually important here.
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As far as I'm concerned, mainly in the US people drive auto-transmission cars (why's that really?). In Europe at least, you'd rarely see these kind of cars, and I think you need a special license to drive them.
Plus there's nothing more satisfying to rev up and hear the engine roar!
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As far as I'm concerned, mainly in the US people drive auto-transmission cars (why's that really?).
straight roads, big distances, cruise control.
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If you think manual will stop people from checking their phones, think again. Here in Miami people will put the car into 5th or 6th if the tranny has 6 gear and then they will check their phones, they don't know how to drive either. Driving an auto really means you have to do nothing. I saw a 4 car pile up last night leaving swim practice. Two cars went to turn at the same time, blocking Biscayne north bound and two more cars got involved. Driving a manual isn't about being some car guru. It's about connecting wth the car and really enjoying the drive. No one drives a car just to drive it, they really see it as a utility not a hobby. But some really love cars. Once manual gets to the point where you can't find the parts to fix it or make it better like shorter throw. I know you can buy them. But in another 20 years they don't be around and you will need to pay a premium. It's actually more expensive to blue cars with manual now than it was 20 years ago, reason why is they need to find a way to make the ECU "play nice" with the car.
In my all road I had to buy a new ECU and remove the transmission computer and the car now plays nicely with me.
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manual tranny
Is tranny actually a term for transmission?
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Yessir lol.
Just don't ever say that in public lol.
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Using a manual transmission doesn't require that much more effort; I regularly drive a manual while texting on my phone and smoking a cigarette without really thinking about it. It does give your car much greater utility though. I suspect (know) this is entirely a North American phenomenon though. Manual transmission will remain overwhelmingly dominant in the rest of the world (particularly Europe) until electric cars phase out transmissions completely.
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I regularly drive a manual while texting on my phone and smoking a cigarette without really thinking about it.
#swag
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Using a manual transmission doesn't require that much more effort; I regularly drive a manual while texting on my phone and smoking a cigarette without really thinking about it.
Jesus Christ you are cool!
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Using a manual transmission doesn't require that much more effort; I regularly drive a manual while texting on my phone and smoking a cigarette without really thinking about it.
Jesus Christ you are cool!
what, no cold beer in the other hand?
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Shut up.
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I was also wearing a leather biker jacket and styling my hair into a pompadour.
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Shut up.
YOLO
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Using a manual transmission doesn't require that much more effort; I regularly drive a manual while texting on my phone and smoking a cigarette without really thinking about it. It does give your car much greater utility though. I suspect (know) this is entirely a North American phenomenon though. Manual transmission will remain overwhelmingly dominant in the rest of the world (particularly Europe) until electric cars phase out transmissions completely.
Whats going to happen to enthusiasts on race tracks? Will we have to worry about overclocking our cars?
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Using a manual transmission doesn't require that much more effort; I regularly drive a manual while texting on my phone and smoking a cigarette without really thinking about it. It does give your car much greater utility though. I suspect (know) this is entirely a North American phenomenon though. Manual transmission will remain overwhelmingly dominant in the rest of the world (particularly Europe) until electric cars phase out transmissions completely.
Whats going to happen to enthusiasts on race tracks? Will we have to worry about overclocking our cars?
Probably the same thing that happened to *race car drivers* on race tracks.
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Using a manual transmission doesn't require that much more effort; I regularly drive a manual while texting on my phone and smoking a cigarette without really thinking about it. It does give your car much greater utility though. I suspect (know) this is entirely a North American phenomenon though. Manual transmission will remain overwhelmingly dominant in the rest of the world (particularly Europe) until electric cars phase out transmissions completely.
Whats going to happen to enthusiasts on race tracks? Will we have to worry about overclocking our cars?
I seriously doubt electric cars will completely phase out IC engines during your lifetime. Even if they do for the masses, you'd likely still be able to buy/build your own car. So the enthusiasts will continue to be enthusiasts, existing in a specialized, niche market.
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I don't like the idea of electric cars, but it's going to happen one day. Same way we will all die if we don't find technology to travel to different planets.
As long as I can have electric with a manual, I might be ok.
http://www.motorauthority.com/news/1084116_700-hp-electric-honda-s2000-built-by-high-schooler-video
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I don't like the idea of electric cars, but it's going to happen one day. Same way we will all die if we don't find technology to travel to different planets.
As long as I can have electric with a manual, I might be ok.
http://www.motorauthority.com/news/1084116_700-hp-electric-honda-s2000-built-by-high-schooler-video
I do. Electric cars are actually pretty cool. Having different gears for an electric motor can make sense depending on a lot of different things.
Firstly, the reason you need gears at all is because the optimal power RPM range is quite low. If your car produced the same power / torque across all RPMs (and could spin up to any RPM) then having gears makes little sense.
The reason lots of electric cars dont need gears is that they produce the max torque at 0 RPM, and have pretty high RPM caps. I read an article on electric dragsters a while back that was pretty cool. The concept of an electric dragster makes a lot of sense, due to that property.
But if the motor you have doesn't spin up high enough, or starts producing less-than-optimal power, then having gears in an electric makes a lot of sense.
I like a car with good handling. I like driving down winding country roads. I would be 100% okay with an electric car. That said, I really like my manual car, and I'm glad I learned to drive one. It's a lot of fun as well, though different than electric (I imagine)
Eventually, when I complete work on my hovercraft, I'll just drive that to work. 'cause if I'm going to build an electric vehicle, it's going to be awesome like that, even if it doesn't have gears.
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Using a manual transmission doesn't require that much more effort; I regularly drive a manual while texting on my phone and smoking a cigarette without really thinking about it. It does give your car much greater utility though. I suspect (know) this is entirely a North American phenomenon though. Manual transmission will remain overwhelmingly dominant in the rest of the world (particularly Europe) until electric cars phase out transmissions completely.
Whats going to happen to enthusiasts on race tracks? Will we have to worry about overclocking our cars?
everything is 2 speed power glides these days- 1/4 mile, 1/8 mile
i had a 4 sp in a '65 corvette, etc. is a blast to drive, but the technology out these days as far as going fast is far better with an automatic
most cars running a clutch, etc. these days are routinely seen more at the nostalgic races than a normal track
been there done that :cool:
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here's some eye candy for you guys
keyboards and hot rods-- yikes!
tucked inside for the winter :thumb:
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Using a manual transmission doesn't require that much more effort; I regularly drive a manual while texting on my phone and smoking a cigarette without really thinking about it. It does give your car much greater utility though. I suspect (know) this is entirely a North American phenomenon though. Manual transmission will remain overwhelmingly dominant in the rest of the world (particularly Europe) until electric cars phase out transmissions completely.
Whats going to happen to enthusiasts on race tracks? Will we have to worry about overclocking our cars?
I seriously doubt electric cars will completely phase out IC engines during your lifetime. Even if they do for the masses, you'd likely still be able to buy/build your own car. So the enthusiasts will continue to be enthusiasts, existing in a specialized, niche market.
Exactly. You can still go out and drive a Ford Model T if that's what floats your boat, it's just a niche hobby rather than mainstream. The same thing will happen with combustion engine vehicles once electric cars are the norm.
I don't like the idea of electric cars, but it's going to happen one day. Same way we will all die if we don't find technology to travel to different planets.
As long as I can have electric with a manual, I might be ok.
http://www.motorauthority.com/news/1084116_700-hp-electric-honda-s2000-built-by-high-schooler-video
Most people who dislike the idea of electric cars don't know enough about them to make a rational decision, or are being overly sentimental about trivial things like the engine noise, or the smell of fumes (which are positive through association, rather than inherently desirable features). Other than battery issues, electric cars are excellent. Ignorant people associate electric motors with consumer hardware, things like RC cars, pumps, hairdryers, etc., and think combustion engines are more powerful. They're wrong. High speed trains are electric, aircraft carriers and nuclear submarines use electric motors.
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electric cars with direct drive motors can have very simple, almost unbreakable construction. not sure how this fits well into today's consumerist economy.
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electric cars with direct drive motors can have very simple, almost unbreakable construction. not sure how this fits well into today's consumerist economy.
The batteries don't last. The higher energy and power capacity Lithium based batteries can last as few as 200 cycles before they need replacing. More conservative ones can last a few thousand.
So you replace batteries every few years in lieu of other mechanical or electrical parts. Of course they are not very ecological or economical besides the poor power to weight ratio. Electric cars are not more environmentally friendly or even lower carbon footprint when you take battery manufacture and transport into account.
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electric cars with direct drive motors can have very simple, almost unbreakable construction. not sure how this fits well into today's consumerist economy.
The batteries don't last.
neither does petrol.
or fuel cells.
Electric cars are not more environmentally friendly or even lower carbon footprint when you take battery manufacture and transport into account.
it is possible to manufacture and utilize batteries in less environmentally conscious places.
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I'm very interested in cars powered by electricity. Cleaner and quieter to run and of course less pollution.
LiPo batteries last longer though more expensive. I'm into RC cars for years. I'm thinking if they use the same principles and approach to electric cars.
Anyway, you're making my day. Very entertaining conversations.
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The model S is a great example... Amazing car. I took a ride in one... It was absolutely amazing. Still, I need my manual. But I guess it will die out like the floppy died.
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The model S is a great example... Amazing car. I took a ride in one... It was absolutely amazing. Still, I need my manual. But I guess it will die out like the floppy died.
Bah humbug... Floppies aren't dead. I use one for flashing ROMs to my graphics cards....
I like the IDEA of electric cars, but I'm afraid there some practical limitations which rule them out for me right now.
IF the manufacture of batteries were completely environmentally friendly, they lasted a long time (say 10,000 cycles or more), were recycled properly, stored more energy per kg and the electricity used to charge them comes from renewable sources, then I would reconsider.
However:
Batteries are expensive to make, expensive to purchase, heavy, don't store enough energy, hard to dispose of and don't last long enough.
The manufacture and disposal are big factors for me. The processes used in manufacturing Lithium Ion batteries of the type used by Tesla have quite bad negative impact on the environment: http://www.greenfleetmagazine.com/news/51536/study-identifies-environmental-and-health-impacts-of-lithium-ion-batteries-for-evs
"The environmental impacts include resource depletion, global warming, and ecological toxicity — primarily resulting from the production, processing, and use of cobalt and nickel metal compounds"
Most Lithium batteries are not recycled, largely since mining costs less than recycling.
The type of battery used in the Tesla Model S lasts roughly 500 cycles if treated well....
Not to mention the electricity used needs to come from some renewable source that doesn't pollute.
I'd rather drive a small, light, fuel efficient car with a manual gearbox, thank you.
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Rocking a manual in my 2013 GTI. Manual in US = theft prevention, any more.
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Rocking a manual in my 2013 GTI. Manual in US = theft prevention, any more.
Also = hassle at the valet, frequently. :(
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oh so your dad is buying the car. gotcha.
for what it's worth, i'd go with the brz. simply for the rally blue.
5k more for a different paint job and leather interior isn't really worth it. I just test drove the 2014 sti hatch and I think I'm in love, just need to find out the trade in value for my 06 wrx wagon :thumb:
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Rocking a manual in my 2013 GTI. Manual in US = theft prevention, any more.
Also = hassle at the valet, frequently. :(
HEY EVERYONE, HOFFMANMYSTER HAS FANCY PARTIES THAT REQUIRE VALETS!
Actually, I'm sure they're more common in larger metro areas. Just not around my area.
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Rocking a manual in my 2013 GTI. Manual in US = theft prevention, any more.
Also = hassle at the valet, frequently. :(
HEY EVERYONE, HOFFMANMYSTER HAS FANCY PARTIES THAT REQUIRE VALETS!
Actually, I'm sure they're more common in larger metro areas. Just not around my area.
Bahahaha, I have simply gone to a couple restaurants with mandatory valets. In the city, of course. And not very often. Don't judge me!
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Here in Holland (and most other places in Europe I imagine) manual transmissions are still kind of the standard, though there is indeed a trend towards auto-transmission. I have some friends from the US and Canada, and they can not even drive manual transmission, which surprised me at first. I assumed (incorrectly) that they also learned how to drive with manual transmission.
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Here in Holland (and most other places in Europe I imagine) manual transmissions are still kind of the standard, though there is indeed a trend towards auto-transmission. I have some friends from the US and Canada, and they can not even drive manual transmission, which surprised me at first. I assumed (incorrectly) that they also learned how to drive with manual transmission.
Nah. And where I'm from if you learn on a manual transmission, you're considered a weirdo. Most people that end up learning manual learn auto first and then "advance" to manual. That's what I did myself.
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Rocking a manual in my 2013 GTI. Manual in US = theft prevention, any more.
Also = hassle at the valet, frequently. :(
(http://cs311118.vk.me/v311118416/5fcd/cP5XEAoCGbs.jpg)
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'91 Mk2 Golf checking in.
5 speed manual and no power steering. Living in the dark ages FTW
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'91 Mk2 Golf checking in.
5 speed manual and no power steering. Living in the dark ages FTW
Nice car! I've been after one of those for awhile now, just haven't pulled the trigger on anything.
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oh so your dad is buying the car. gotcha.
for what it's worth, i'd go with the brz. simply for the rally blue.
5k more for a different paint job and leather interior isn't really worth it. I just test drove the 2014 sti hatch and I think I'm in love, just need to find out the trade in value for my 06 wrx wagon :thumb:
I also applied to 3 different best buys lol. My parents aren't really buying things for I sell and buy.
FR-S is so sexy don't really like that plastic on the front of the BRZ. '91 Mk2 Golf checking in.
5 speed manual and no power steering. Living in the dark ages FTW
Nice car! I've been after one of those for awhile now, just haven't pulled the trigger on anything.
I drove my buddies TC, and he remove the power-steering and A/C. That car is a death yep here in Miami when it's hot.
If manual dies out, I will cry. The only cars in Audis line up that have manual as of now are the A4/S4. That's it. I'm assuming the B9 body will have no manual.
I love how in every other country manual is standard and plentiful. In Brazil that's all we drive.
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The model S is a great example... Amazing car. I took a ride in one... It was absolutely amazing. Still, I need my manual. But I guess it will die out like the floppy died.
You don't need a manual in an electric. It would offer no advantage whatsoever and would most likely be a hindrance. That's just wanting a manual so you can play around with a stick and feel more important or something somehow.
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What exactly do you mean feel more important?
Why would some one feel more important just because they can drive stick?
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In places where manual transmission isn't the norm (i.e. North America), people who choose to use a manual may feel a modicum of elitism as a result. I'm just postulating though (which is why I said "or something") because I don't get why someone would say they "need" a manual in a vehicle where it offers no benefit whatsoever other than irrational reasons like that.
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valuable skill... you may need it to operate a particular car... but it's just an artifact of how engines work and it's irrelevant to whether or not you understand vehicle dynamics if you're talking about actually extracting performance out of a car.
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Well no, it actually is beneficial to extracting performance out of a combustion engine car, versus a standard automatic transmission. Not just performance, but also saving wear and tear on brakes, being able to drive safely on icy roads, etc.
However on an electric car all those benefits go out the window, and I can't see any reason for insisting you need a manual in an electric other than silly, vainglorious reasons. I don't buy the "valuable skill" argument - once you've learned how to use gears you don't unlearn it by driving an automatic. Plus if you can already drive an automatic it takes about five minutes to learn how to use a manual anyway, it's hardly rocket science.
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Well no, it actually is beneficial to extracting performance out of a combustion engine car, versus a standard automatic transmission. Not just performance, but also saving wear and tear on brakes, being able to drive safely on icy roads, etc.
However on an electric car all those benefits go out the window, and I can't see any reason for insisting you need a manual in an electric other than silly, vainglorious reasons. I don't buy the "valuable skill" argument - once you've learned how to use gears you don't unlearn it by driving an automatic. Plus if you can already drive an automatic it takes about five minutes to learn how to use a manual anyway, it's hardly rocket science.
That wasn't really my point—my point is that understanding vehicle dynamics is say 99% of driving on icy roads, or on a racetrack, or avoiding a collision. If you want to go to a track day, it's not gonna matter if you've got an automatic sedan or a manual sportscar or a PDK Porsche. Talking about anything else is just armchair racing.
And no it's not rocket science but you better be able to do it all second-nature if your attention is going to be otherwise occupied.
The reason it's a useful skill is because you may get into a manual car and need to operate it properly without thinking about it. And no, I don't mean the level of capability from learning it in five minutes. :)
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Anyway, back to the original question, I don't lament it because the reason I'll end up with one is because the car's old and that's what it came with—the new car can come with PDK or whatever and I'll think about it for about ten seconds before I move on permanently. The people who do lament it, though, fall into two categories: real enthusiasts who just happen to care about this topic (and have my empathy despite my apathy), and armchair racers (who don't). :)
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That wasn't really my point—my point is that understanding vehicle dynamics is say 99% of driving on icy roads, or on a racetrack, or avoiding a collision. If you want to go to a track day, it's not gonna matter if you've got an automatic sedan or a manual sportscar or a PDK Porsche. Talking about anything else is just armchair racing.
Well, you're wrong unfortunately. Standard automatic transmissions take away a great deal of control which doesn't matter in day to day driving but is necessary in certain conditions. On North American roads it's not such a big deal, but elsewhere it matters which is why automatic never really took off in Europe and other places, where it's impractical.
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In places where manual transmission isn't the norm (i.e. North America), people who choose to use a manual may feel a modicum of elitism as a result. I'm just postulating though (which is why I said "or something") because I don't get why someone would say they "need" a manual in a vehicle where it offers no benefit whatsoever other than irrational reasons like that.
It isn't really HEY LOOK AT ME I CAN DRIVE A STICK! It's the fact that I really do enjoy driving manual. No matter what kind of car. I drove a 91 stealth and had more fun in it than I do in my allroad, despite it having a bad syncrho in 2nd gear.
Well no, it actually is beneficial to extracting performance out of a combustion engine car, versus a standard automatic transmission. Not just performance, but also saving wear and tear on brakes, being able to drive safely on icy roads, etc.
However on an electric car all those benefits go out the window, and I can't see any reason for insisting you need a manual in an electric other than silly, vainglorious reasons. I don't buy the "valuable skill" argument - once you've learned how to use gears you don't unlearn it by driving an automatic. Plus if you can already drive an automatic it takes about five minutes to learn how to use a manual anyway, it's hardly rocket science.
I don't really need a manual on an electric car, just really thinking that it would be really cool. Seeing as how the engine for the Tesla Model S is the size of a water melon.....
Well no, it actually is beneficial to extracting performance out of a combustion engine car, versus a standard automatic transmission. Not just performance, but also saving wear and tear on brakes, being able to drive safely on icy roads, etc.
However on an electric car all those benefits go out the window, and I can't see any reason for insisting you need a manual in an electric other than silly, vainglorious reasons. I don't buy the "valuable skill" argument - once you've learned how to use gears you don't unlearn it by driving an automatic. Plus if you can already drive an automatic it takes about five minutes to learn how to use a manual anyway, it's hardly rocket science.
That wasn't really my point—my point is that understanding vehicle dynamics is say 99% of driving on icy roads, or on a racetrack, or avoiding a collision. If you want to go to a track day, it's not gonna matter if you've got an automatic sedan or a manual sportscar or a PDK Porsche. Talking about anything else is just armchair racing.
And no it's not rocket science but you better be able to do it all second-nature if your attention is going to be otherwise occupied.
The reason it's a useful skill is because you may get into a manual car and need to operate it properly without thinking about it. And no, I don't mean the level of capability from learning it in five minutes. :)
It's only useful if you travel to other countries really... Here in the U.S. there are at most 4 cars that have a manual transmission on any given day....
However in Brazil there are no automatic transmissions, since they are still really expensive.
That wasn't really my point—my point is that understanding vehicle dynamics is say 99% of driving on icy roads, or on a racetrack, or avoiding a collision. If you want to go to a track day, it's not gonna matter if you've got an automatic sedan or a manual sportscar or a PDK Porsche. Talking about anything else is just armchair racing.
Well, you're wrong unfortunately. Standard automatic transmissions take away a great deal of control which doesn't matter in day to day driving but is necessary in certain conditions. On North American roads it's not such a big deal, but elsewhere it matters which is why automatic never really took off in Europe and other places, where it's impractical.
There is almost no control unless it's a S-tronic from BMW or Tip-tronic from audi. Nowadays so many cars have that whole deal of being able to chose what gear your car stays in. The thing is that if you need to dump the clutch to get the car to launch, then hold the brakes and gas and let go of brakes in an automatic car. Going up a hill some autos have trouble staying in a gear, thus they up shift and lose all the torque.
Also, another thing is that here in America people say 'oh it looks hard so I'll just buy an auto.'
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Here in Finland, the driving school I went to only use manuals for teaching. We also have a madatory slippery conditions section of the training (which you use your own car for) where you learn how to control a car on different surfaces and when you lose traction. It's expensive (around 2000euro for the full course), but mandatory for getting a license and very, very much worth it.
Winter conditions here can get very tricky and everyone who has a license can handle it well enough. It also brings out some interesting discussions of rear wheel drive vs front vs 4, etc. Lots of Subarus here :) Front wheel drive is certainly easier than rear wheel in slippery conditions, but 4 is best, especially with Torsen type limited slip diffs.
That said, I'm very happy with my Golf. Even happier when driving my old Mini, though :D You don't need a lot of power to have a lot of fun.
Finns love to drive, in general.
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Here in Finland, the driving school I went to only use manuals for teaching. We also have a madatory slippery conditions section of the training (which you use your own car for) where you learn how to control a car on different surfaces and when you lose traction. It's expensive (around 2000euro for the full course), but mandatory for getting a license and very, very much worth it.
Winter conditions here can get very tricky and everyone who has a license can handle it well enough. It also brings out some interesting discussions of rear wheel drive vs front vs 4, etc. Lots of Subarus here :) Front wheel drive is certainly easier than rear wheel in slippery conditions, but 4 is best, especially with Torsen type limited slip diffs.
That said, I'm very happy with my Golf. Even happier when driving my old Mini, though :D You don't need a lot of power to have a lot of fun.
Finns love to drive, in general.
That sounds like a great idea! If you want to drive, then you have to put in the money and time to learn properly, in all conditions. Makes sense :)
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I was going to avoid this thread, but I felt the need to chime in. As a die hard fan of manual transmission I think that they are not only fun, but really necessary for greater control. (in a standard internal combustion engine, I realize that they are unnecessary in electric cars, even in my prius I got the feeling of what it might be like to drive an electric car, and it was cool, despite the lack of my precious manual).
This winter has been rough here in Minisnowta, but with my manual I have been able to avoid incident. That is not to say that I wouldn't have had an issue, but I was able to use the greater control and feel that I have with a manual to my advantage. For comparison my dad drives a car very similar to mine except his is automatic. I was driving it for the first time this winter, and I nearly immediately had an accident, it was at an intersection near my house that I get through all the time just fine using engine braking, but on that auto, even being super cautious I couldn't hold it at all.
This isn't always the case, the car I drive is very simplistic, an 02 Saturn SL2, no traction control, anti-lock brakes, anything of the sort, my dad's car also lacks these features, in the snow his is nearly undrivable, mine is somewhat difficult but still very easy to control if you pay attention and know what you are doing (and yes, he agrees with me on this). Driving a car with an auto that has Anti-lock brakes and traction control and all of those newfangled things in the snow is easier than either of them in my opinion, but that's not really relevant to my comparison, as I haven't had the pleasure of driving a car with modern features and a manual transmission.
The bottom line is that in my life a manual transmission isn't just something that I kind of enjoy, it serves a tangible purpose, whether it be control in the snow, or push starting the car when I left the lights on, or simply the better control and understanding of the conditions of the road that I get as a result, having a manual transmission is definitely an important thing to me.
TL;DR Manual best, you're all fools, I am a driving god. (not really on that last part)
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Here in Finland, the driving school I went to only use manuals for teaching. We also have a madatory slippery conditions section of the training (which you use your own car for) where you learn how to control a car on different surfaces and when you lose traction. It's expensive (around 2000euro for the full course), but mandatory for getting a license and very, very much worth it.
Winter conditions here can get very tricky and everyone who has a license can handle it well enough. It also brings out some interesting discussions of rear wheel drive vs front vs 4, etc. Lots of Subarus here :) Front wheel drive is certainly easier than rear wheel in slippery conditions, but 4 is best, especially with Torsen type limited slip diffs.
That said, I'm very happy with my Golf. Even happier when driving my old Mini, though :D You don't need a lot of power to have a lot of fun.
Finns love to drive, in general.
Ah I've seen those courses. Looks fun when they hook up a doodad on your car that lifts it up a bit so you lose traction and you have to counter steer. I was going to avoid this thread, but I felt the need to chime in. As a die hard fan of manual transmission I think that they are not only fun, but really necessary for greater control. (in a standard internal combustion engine, I realize that they are unnecessary in electric cars, even in my prius I got the feeling of what it might be like to drive an electric car, and it was cool, despite the lack of my precious manual).
This winter has been rough here in Minisnowta, but with my manual I have been able to avoid incident. That is not to say that I wouldn't have had an issue, but I was able to use the greater control and feel that I have with a manual to my advantage. For comparison my dad drives a car very similar to mine except his is automatic. I was driving it for the first time this winter, and I nearly immediately had an accident, it was at an intersection near my house that I get through all the time just fine using engine braking, but on that auto, even being super cautious I couldn't hold it at all.
This isn't always the case, the car I drive is very simplistic, an 02 Saturn SL2, no traction control, anti-lock brakes, anything of the sort, my dad's car also lacks these features, in the snow his is nearly undrivable, mine is somewhat difficult but still very easy to control if you pay attention and know what you are doing (and yes, he agrees with me on this). Driving a car with an auto that has Anti-lock brakes and traction control and all of those newfangled things in the snow is easier than either of them in my opinion, but that's not really relevant to my comparison, as I haven't had the pleasure of driving a car with modern features and a manual transmission.
The bottom line is that in my life a manual transmission isn't just something that I kind of enjoy, it serves a tangible purpose, whether it be control in the snow, or push starting the car when I left the lights on, or simply the better control and understanding of the conditions of the road that I get as a result, having a manual transmission is definitely an important thing to me.
TL;DR Manual best, you're all fools, I am a driving god. (not really on that last part)
Very well said.
Here in Miami it's more of a fun factor until traffic starts slowing down.
When it rains that's really when it's necessary. No one can drive here.
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In places where manual transmission isn't the norm (i.e. North America), people who choose to use a manual may feel a modicum of elitism as a result.
Here in Oz one of the 3rd year apprentices just bought a 2014 HSV GTS for a cheap price. He got the 6-speed manual because how could you do a burn out with an automatic?
Of course the auto trans here would cost an extra $2500.00AUD, so why would you even bother?
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In places where manual transmission isn't the norm (i.e. North America), people who choose to use a manual may feel a modicum of elitism as a result.
Here in Oz one of the 3rd year apprentices just bought a 2014 HSV GTS for a cheap price. He got the 6-speed manual because how could you do a burn out with an automatic?
Of course the auto trans here would cost an extra $2500.00AUD, so why would you even bother?
LOL wouldn't be an apprentice without a hotted up commie!
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Here in Finland, the driving school I went to only use manuals for teaching. We also have a madatory slippery conditions section of the training (which you use your own car for) where you learn how to control a car on different surfaces and when you lose traction. It's expensive (around 2000euro for the full course), but mandatory for getting a license and very, very much worth it.
so, to get a license in finland you have to own a car and pay 2000 euro?
Finns love to drive, in general.
also sometimes finns love giving other drivers an eyeful in the night.
also sometimes finns love not giving a **** about speed cams.
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'91 Mk2 Golf checking in.
5 speed manual and no power steering. Living in the dark ages FTW
Nice car! I've been after one of those for awhile now, just haven't pulled the trigger on anything.
Thanks :) I've had her for about three months so far, and I'm looking into things to do with her. Going to change the old manky carpets, get the seats cleaned up and change the boot liner while adding a pair of amps and a pair of subs. Then I'm looking into dropping a VR6 engine in there, not sure how new I can go and how far my budget will stretch but I would love to get a 3.2l one out of a Porsche Cayenne :cool:
Then put her on bags and get some nice wheels :D
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Here in Finland, the driving school I went to only use manuals for teaching. We also have a madatory slippery conditions section of the training (which you use your own car for) where you learn how to control a car on different surfaces and when you lose traction. It's expensive (around 2000euro for the full course), but mandatory for getting a license and very, very much worth it.
Winter conditions here can get very tricky and everyone who has a license can handle it well enough. It also brings out some interesting discussions of rear wheel drive vs front vs 4, etc. Lots of Subarus here :) Front wheel drive is certainly easier than rear wheel in slippery conditions, but 4 is best, especially with Torsen type limited slip diffs.
That said, I'm very happy with my Golf. Even happier when driving my old Mini, though :D You don't need a lot of power to have a lot of fun.
Finns love to drive, in general.
That sounds like a great idea! If you want to drive, then you have to put in the money and time to learn properly, in all conditions. Makes sense :)
Top Gear did a pretty awesome segment about Finnish license requirements. If even half of it is true, it's still amazing and is something that we should have in the US.
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Here in Finland, the driving school I went to only use manuals for teaching. We also have a madatory slippery conditions section of the training (which you use your own car for) where you learn how to control a car on different surfaces and when you lose traction. It's expensive (around 2000euro for the full course), but mandatory for getting a license and very, very much worth it.
Winter conditions here can get very tricky and everyone who has a license can handle it well enough. It also brings out some interesting discussions of rear wheel drive vs front vs 4, etc. Lots of Subarus here :) Front wheel drive is certainly easier than rear wheel in slippery conditions, but 4 is best, especially with Torsen type limited slip diffs.
That said, I'm very happy with my Golf. Even happier when driving my old Mini, though :D You don't need a lot of power to have a lot of fun.
Finns love to drive, in general.
That sounds like a great idea! If you want to drive, then you have to put in the money and time to learn properly, in all conditions. Makes sense :)
Top Gear did a pretty awesome segment about Finnish license requirements. If even half of it is true, it's still amazing and is something that we should have in the US.
It's probably mostly true. I am not from Finland, but we had some Finnish people come to my high school for a year (they had family members that had been attending the school for many years) both to get some cross-cultural experience and to get their drivers licenses. Apparently if you get the license in the US while living there, it's much more reasonable and affordable to transfer it back to Finland than to just do it in Finland.
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That top gear episode was amazing.
Finnies can drift and really control a car.
Makes me jealous lol.
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Well you don't need to have your own car, but they encourage you to use the car you will be driving afterwards to do that part of the course with. And you may be able to find a cheaper school, but you still have to go through essentially the same training. It includes a bunch of lectures, at least 18 hours of driving with an instructor, slippery conditions, car control and night driving along with a written test. You get a provisional license which is valid for 2 years and have to come back and do an evaluation after at least 6 months. Then you get your permanent license.
One of my favourite parts of the training was taking the car around a slippery bend at 40km/h. The first time you invariably spin out. Then you try at 30 and slowly build back up to 40 and eventually you go round at 40 without sliding. Great feeling! I discovered I really don't like the feeling of ABS kicking in strongly on the Golf (Mk5).
Is this the clip you mean?
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That is exactly the video that I was talking about.
Anyone know of any of those course in good ol' Murica?
And when they rally in that merc is exactly what I was talking about, dump clutch and flick the car.
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Some Finnish driving:
Too bad we didn't practice this on that course.
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'91 Mk2 Golf checking in.
5 speed manual and no power steering. Living in the dark ages FTW
Nice car! I've been after one of those for awhile now, just haven't pulled the trigger on anything.
I know, I know...this might be a dead thread but it's a great subject and I just ran across it, so...
I recently sold my MKIII super-charged, short-shifter Golf GL. It was probably my most fun-driving car I've ever had and it was my main vehicle for 12 years. Then the breakdowns became more and more frequent until I could no longer rely on it as a primary transport :(
I had to get something else quickly and under budget so now I'm in a 2011 2.5L Golf. Not the same fun-factor but at least it's manual, which, by the way, was very difficult to find in a decent, used car. I saw plenty of GTIs, which I was mainly looking for, but almost all were automatics! That makes no sense!
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I want an electric Golf. It does 0-60 faster than a GTi...
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Thoroughly enjoying the DSG on my R32. Would prefer completely manual, but considering I deal with a lot of stop and go traffic, this is the best of both worlds IMO.
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I have control issues! Gimme manual!
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Just read through this whole thread, prepared some responses and then realised this was a necro.
****.
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I have no idea how to use a manual, and probably never will.
Nothing good ever came of my efforts to figure out how to work the transmission on my bike as a kid-- actually nothing good ever came of my efforts to figure out how to ride a bike in general, but the transmission was a particularly expeditious source of injury. If the one in a car is anything like that, I think it's probably best if I leave it alone.
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Just read through this whole thread, prepared some responses and then realised this was a necro.
****.
Well we posted. Is it still necro now?
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Just read through this whole thread, prepared some responses and then realised this was a necro.
****.
Well we posted. Is it still necro now?
Yeah,
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automatics suck
long live stickshift
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I have no idea how to use a manual, and probably never will.
Nothing good ever came of my efforts to figure out how to work the transmission on my bike as a kid-- actually nothing good ever came of my efforts to figure out how to ride a bike in general, but the transmission was a particularly expeditious source of injury. If the one in a car is anything like that, I think it's probably best if I leave it alone.
No, it's more difficult to use.
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I have a 5-speed '09 Golf MKV, really love it. Before that was a 5-speed '97 e36 328is with Bilstein sport suspension that just became too much of a hassle for me to maintain. Love em both to death, German cars handle so fiiiiiiine, and that German industrial design, dayum. The turning signal stalks on the e36 were some of the nicest things ever, so crisp. ****ing great seats too. The MKV comes with a short-shifter, really nice compromise between an economy car and something with some nice torque and fun gearbox. Wish it wasn't drive-by-wire though, complete trash compared to the e36 (which also had a better gearbox, but it was a bit beat-up so only marginally).
Learned a **** ton working on my e36, really fun car to work on. 90's cars are just the best.
Some day I'd love to get back into it and have an e30 to tinker with and drive during the nice months. Need a house with a garage first though :p
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Economies in development are full of manual transmission cars, because they are cheaper. Just move across the border and you will find pretty much any car you want with a manual transmission option.
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Wow, so many Americans who drive manual cars! I am positively impressed!
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Economies in development are full of manual transmission cars, because they are cheaper. Just move across the border and you will find pretty much any car you want with a manual transmission option.
/me looks over to Canada
Checks out.
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Wow, so many Americans who drive manual cars! I am positively impressed!
I thought Americans were the only people who used them xD .
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Wow, so many Americans who drive manual cars! I am positively impressed!
I thought Americans were the only people who used them xD .
top banter m8
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Wow, so many Americans who drive manual cars! I am positively impressed!
I thought Americans were the only people who used them xD .
top banter m8
:p
Tbh I haven't used a manual in ages because the only times I've been driving is on holidays and my parents have an automatic. I can't afford to own a car of my own here, my own car was $6000 a year to insure over here.
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Over here means NL I guess?
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Over here means NL I guess?
Here in the Netherlands (all of countries here... Belgium, Germany, France, etc.) people mostly drive manuals.
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Over here means NL I guess?
No I'm in the UK.
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I have a 5-speed '09 Golf MKV, really love it. Before that was a 5-speed '97 e36 328is with Bilstein sport suspension that just became too much of a hassle for me to maintain. Love em both to death, German cars handle so fiiiiiiine, and that German industrial design, dayum. The turning signal stalks on the e36 were some of the nicest things ever, so crisp. ****ing great seats too. The MKV comes with a short-shifter, really nice compromise between an economy car and something with some nice torque and fun gearbox. Wish it wasn't drive-by-wire though, complete trash compared to the e36 (which also had a better gearbox, but it was a bit beat-up so only marginally).
Learned a **** ton working on my e36, really fun car to work on. 90's cars are just the best.
Some day I'd love to get back into it and have an e30 to tinker with and drive during the nice months. Need a house with a garage first though :p
When I test-drove cars before I settled on a 2011 Golf MKVI they all felt flimsy and cheap compared to the VW. The same happened when I test-drove cars for my gf when she got a 2010 Jetta. Something about German engineering :cool:
Here's me with my dearly departed '96 MKIII on the day I said goodbye:
[attach=1]
Here's the new and old together:
[attach=2]
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I have a 5-speed '09 Golf MKV, really love it. Before that was a 5-speed '97 e36 328is with Bilstein sport suspension that just became too much of a hassle for me to maintain. Love em both to death, German cars handle so fiiiiiiine, and that German industrial design, dayum. The turning signal stalks on the e36 were some of the nicest things ever, so crisp. ****ing great seats too. The MKV comes with a short-shifter, really nice compromise between an economy car and something with some nice torque and fun gearbox. Wish it wasn't drive-by-wire though, complete trash compared to the e36 (which also had a better gearbox, but it was a bit beat-up so only marginally).
Learned a **** ton working on my e36, really fun car to work on. 90's cars are just the best.
Some day I'd love to get back into it and have an e30 to tinker with and drive during the nice months. Need a house with a garage first though :p
When I test-drove cars before I settled on a 2011 Golf MKVI they all felt flimsy and cheap compared to the VW. The same happened when I test-drove cars for my gf when she got a 2010 Jetta. Something about German engineering :cool:
Here's me with my dearly departed '96 MKIII on the day I said goodbye:
(Attachment Link)
Here's the new and old together:
(Attachment Link)
That looks like a well-loved vehicle. :) I am still hoping to pick up a standard VW at some point...