Does SP have a 5.5u spacebar mold? And that limits the keycap options to just SP right? Does anyone else do 5.5u spacebars in general? It might seem silly but people love using their favorite caps and I've seen perfectly good keyboards (FC700R) shunned because the caps aren't interchangable.Oh man I hadn't considered the 5.5u space first looking at it. That'd be a huge deal breaker, especially if SP doesn't already have the molds.
To the right of the up arrow, can you explain why that is insert? Is that commonly used in a program or in coding? I personally pretty much never use it so if it's set into the baselayer, I think I'm missing something.
Overall, I think this is a cool idea. It's kind of like the old Pure but with the arrow cluster.
I think the biggest problem with this set (and you should ask yourself this when trying to create your own layout) is where are you going to get your keycaps from? By the looks of it every key is standard sized except for the spacebar which is 5.5units. There are currently (to my knowledge) no 5.5 units that are readily available and as it stands it will be incredibly difficult trying to source one. Currently the readily found spacebars are from easiest to hardest: 6.25u, 7u, 6.5/6u.Holy crap that 68 looks so cool.
Another thing to think about is the different Row profiles of each row (this should give you an idea (http://www.keycapsdirect.com/key-caps.php) of what I'm talking about). You're putting a 1.25 unit key (right control) in the third row. Since 1.25 unit keys are usually only found on the very bottom row (Row 4) putting it in a row predominantly filled with keys in Row 3 profile this can make it look unappealing and maybe also uncomfortable to use. Things like this further limit what sort of keysets you can put on it to only the uniform keysets (Row 3 SA, DSA etc.)
This layout is pretty similar to another keyboard: The Smart 68 (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=61714.0) you should take a look at it (sadly it has not been released yet).
I got my first mechanical keyboard a few months ago and I love it. It's a CODE TKL (http://codekeyboards.com/), but it's starting
to feel unnecessarily big. I began looking at 60% keyboards, but couldn't justify getting rid of the arrow keys.
It looks nice but for me at least I'd want there to be an option where the Left Ctrl and FN are flipped because I'm so set in my ways on where ctrl is.
That said, I do love the arrows without it being as big of a cluster**** as 75% keyboards are.
Does SP have a 5.5u spacebar mold? And that limits the keycap options to just SP right? Does anyone else do 5.5u spacebars in general? It might seem silly but people love using their favorite caps and I've seen perfectly good keyboards (FC700R) shunned because the caps aren't interchangable.Oh man I hadn't considered the 5.5u space first looking at it. That'd be a huge deal breaker, especially if SP doesn't already have the molds.
To the right of the up arrow, can you explain why that is insert? Is that commonly used in a program or in coding? I personally pretty much never use it so if it's set into the baselayer, I think I'm missing something.
Overall, I think this is a cool idea. It's kind of like the old Pure but with the arrow cluster.
I think the biggest problem with this set (and you should ask yourself this when trying to create your own layout) is where are you going to get your keycaps from? By the looks of it every key is standard sized except for the spacebar which is 5.5units. There are currently (to my knowledge) no 5.5 units that are readily available and as it stands it will be incredibly difficult trying to source one. Currently the readily found spacebars are from easiest to hardest: 6.25u, 7u, 6.5/6u.
Another thing to think about is the different Row profiles of each row (this should give you an idea (http://www.keycapsdirect.com/key-caps.php) of what I'm talking about). You're putting a 1.25 unit key (right control) in the third row. Since 1.25 unit keys are usually only found on the very bottom row (Row 4) putting it in a row predominantly filled with keys in Row 3 profile this can make it look unappealing and maybe also uncomfortable to use. Things like this further limit what sort of keysets you can put on it to only the uniform keysets (Row 3 SA, DSA etc.)
This layout is pretty similar to another keyboard: The Smart 68 (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=61714.0) you should take a look at it (sadly it has not been released yet).
I fixed it for you. :)Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/uPk8YXx.png)
Layout (http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/e1bb1605c10469d7f00535142200aa02)
Totally doable! The goal is for it to be 100% programmable. That means that the up arrow can be ESC, and ESC can be Fn. It's up to you!
I fixed it for you. :)Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/uPk8YXx.png)
Layout (http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/e1bb1605c10469d7f00535142200aa02)
I fixed it for you. :)Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/uPk8YXx.png)
Layout (http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/e1bb1605c10469d7f00535142200aa02)
That's hot.Totally doable! The goal is for it to be 100% programmable. That means that the up arrow can be ESC, and ESC can be Fn. It's up to you!
If it is built using an ATmega32U, you could use my Easy AVR USB firmware for easy reprogrammability or TMK for 100% control.
I fixed it for you. :)Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/uPk8YXx.png)
Layout (http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/e1bb1605c10469d7f00535142200aa02)
Also, 16x5 is usually called 65% just for convenience. :)
What about Matt3o's Brown Fox layout which is also 16x5?:
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=45139.0
Or his Steel Beauty which is 15x5.
I've been toying with a similar 15x5, but it has a lot of nonstandard key sizes, although Granite would cover it. I'm also not sure how I'd feel about the top 2 rows being not being staggered.
http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/6d089e0ed949090dd4892fad198a59f1
(Attachment Link)
I fixed it for you. :)Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/uPk8YXx.png)
Layout (http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/e1bb1605c10469d7f00535142200aa02)
Also, 16x5 is usually called 65% just for convenience. :)
Now it's just a standard 65%.
FYI, if you are going to have two 1.25u mods and one 1u mod, I recommend putting that 1u in the middle of the modifier cluster.
(Attachment Link)Woo! Happy 10k jd!
Dude, 10000 posts!!
(Attachment Link)Woo! Happy 10k jd!
Dude, 10000 posts!!
I'm trying to somehow fit a 6.25u spacebar in there, but I think I'm stuck with 6u. Nothing lines up if I make it 6.25u.
Changed to PBT colors because you can buy blank PBT DSA sets from SP for pretty cheapShow Image(http://i.imgur.com/m3MTffg.png)
Layout (http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/17e4d8eb7e0a927ec1ac2a4118c280f8)
And with the CTRL keys in their *inferior* locationsShow Image(http://i.imgur.com/PVyotIc.png)
Any thoughts on the function layer?
EDIT: I put in a 6.25u spacebar, but now the mods on the right are all 1u while the ones on the left are 1.25u. Thoughts?Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/Bqn9Waw.png)
Layout (http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/825010aa42a05be09b415b975da0dbaa)
Break the paradigm of the inverted T arrow key block. The L shaped arrow set worked for a long time. The inverted T came when the full size keyboards include a center block, that makes the simmetry of the inverted T a necessity.
Cases for sixty percent keyboards are available, for other larger size but smaller than a TKL all would be custom jobs.
The 1u arrows in row 3 and 4 are included most of the time, as well as a couple of 1u keys for the bottom row.
Break the paradigm of the inverted T arrow key block. The L shaped arrow set worked for a long time. The inverted T came when the full size keyboards include a center block, that makes the simmetry of the inverted T a necessity.
Cases for sixty percent keyboards are available, for other larger size but smaller than a TKL all would be custom jobs.
The 1u arrows in row 3 and 4 are included most of the time, as well as a couple of 1u keys for the bottom row.
Break the paradigm of the inverted T arrow key block. The L shaped arrow set worked for a long time. The inverted T came when the full size keyboards include a center block, that makes the simmetry of the inverted T a necessity.
Cases for sixty percent keyboards are available, for other larger size but smaller than a TKL all would be custom jobs.
The 1u arrows in row 3 and 4 are included most of the time, as well as a couple of 1u keys for the bottom row.
It's hard to break the habit of more than 20 years of using inverted T (and using the arrow keys a LOT)... At least for me.
Break the paradigm of the inverted T arrow key block. The L shaped arrow set worked for a long time.By “worked for a long time” you mean “was used on a small number of keyboards, and was never very popular” right?
I know [it’s hard to break the inverted T habit], but inverted L arrows in the first layer will always work better than FN+something else in layouts that does not have dedicated arrows at all. Also is an small concession required to keep the 60% size and most of the other keys standard, particularly the space bar.Will always work better for who? Personally I find separate arrows that I have to reach for (regardless of arrangement) much less pleasant than arrows directly on the home row on a layer.
I know [it�s hard to break the inverted T habit], but inverted L arrows in the first layer will always work better than FN+something else in layouts that does not have dedicated arrows at all. Also is an small concession required to keep the 60% size and most of the other keys standard, particularly the space bar.Will always work better for who? Personally I find separate arrows that I have to reach for (regardless of arrangement) much less pleasant than arrows directly on the home row on a layer.
I think the biggest problem with this set (and you should ask yourself this when trying to create your own layout) is where are you going to get your keycaps from? By the looks of it every key is standard sized except for the spacebar which is 5.5units. There are currently (to my knowledge) no 5.5 units that are readily available and as it stands it will be incredibly difficult trying to source one. Currently the readily found spacebars are from easiest to hardest: 6.25u, 7u, 6.5/6u.Well, with layouts like this you pretty much have to use DSA, but with this layout, like you said, you'd still have trouble finding a spacebar of that length.
Another thing to think about is the different Row profiles of each row (this should give you an idea (http://www.keycapsdirect.com/key-caps.php) of what I'm talking about). You're putting a 1.25 unit key (right control) in the third row. Since 1.25 unit keys are usually only found on the very bottom row (Row 4) putting it in a row predominantly filled with keys in Row 3 profile this can make it look unappealing and maybe also uncomfortable to use. Things like this further limit what sort of keysets you can put on it to only the uniform keysets (Row 3 SA, DSA etc.)
This layout is pretty similar to another keyboard: The Smart 68 (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=61714.0) you should take a look at it (sadly it has not been released yet).
Disclaimer: this is an interest check for a keyboard idea of mine. Let me know what you think!
Did you consider making the spacebar even narrower than 5.5u?I think you somehow missed the post right before yours.
Two cents of salt: It seems that keep the caps and case standard is not a priority of your project. It may work if it is just for you, but if you want it to enter the market it makes more sense to keep it as standard as possible.
I like what you guys are doing in this thread. I have also put a bunch of thought into a similar layout, so I figured I would share it.
I am a developer, so I need my dedicated arrow keys, Esc and `~ keys. Basically, all the rest of the keys I don't mind putting in a Fn layer.
Here is what it looks like...
(Attachment Link)
Here is the layout: http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/c2a2a76df8848ae2bdba84d606fa1635 (http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/c2a2a76df8848ae2bdba84d606fa1635)
I am currently getting the plate and case cut for this keyboard and I will be hand wiring it with the Enabler PCBs.
Most of the keys for this layout come with the base kit. The shift keys are relatively common in many of the GBs by getting an optional kit.
PS - I am a Mac user, so Alt maps to my Command key...
I like what you guys are doing in this thread. I have also put a bunch of thought into a similar layout, so I figured I would share it. [...] Here is what it looks like...The shift key that far out to the right is totally useless as a shift. You might as well just leave it off entirely and put something else in that spot.Show Image(https://geekhack.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=68595.0;attach=92560;image)
I like what you guys are doing in this thread. I have also put a bunch of thought into a similar layout, so I figured I would share it.
I am a developer, so I need my dedicated arrow keys, Esc and `~ keys. Basically, all the rest of the keys I don't mind putting in a Fn layer.
Here is what it looks like...
(Attachment Link)
Here is the layout: http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/c2a2a76df8848ae2bdba84d606fa1635 (http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/c2a2a76df8848ae2bdba84d606fa1635)
I am currently getting the plate and case cut for this keyboard and I will be hand wiring it with the Enabler PCBs.
Most of the keys for this layout come with the base kit. The shift keys are relatively common in many of the GBs by getting an optional kit.
PS - I am a Mac user, so Alt maps to my Command key...
This is brilliant, and it looks nice also. If you ever consider to get a PCB built let us know.
I like what you guys are doing in this thread. I have also put a bunch of thought into a similar layout, so I figured I would share it.
I am a developer, so I need my dedicated arrow keys, Esc and `~ keys. Basically, all the rest of the keys I don't mind putting in a Fn layer.
Here is what it looks like...
(Attachment Link)
Here is the layout: http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/c2a2a76df8848ae2bdba84d606fa1635 (http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/c2a2a76df8848ae2bdba84d606fa1635)
I am currently getting the plate and case cut for this keyboard and I will be hand wiring it with the Enabler PCBs.
Most of the keys for this layout come with the base kit. The shift keys are relatively common in many of the GBs by getting an optional kit.
PS - I am a Mac user, so Alt maps to my Command key...
This is brilliant, and it looks nice also. If you ever consider to get a PCB built let us know.
I am going to try it and make sure I like it first. :)
I like what you guys are doing in this thread. I have also put a bunch of thought into a similar layout, so I figured I would share it. [...] Here is what it looks like...The shift key that far out to the right is totally useless as a shift. You might as well just leave it off entirely and put something else in that spot.Show Image(https://geekhack.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=68595.0;attach=92560;image)
I am going to try it and make sure I like it first. :)
Of course, post your findings. I'd split the backspace, and drop it on top of the enter key.
Well, with layouts like this you pretty much have to use DSA, but with this layout, like you said, you'd still have trouble finding a spacebar of that length.
I like what you guys are doing in this thread. I have also put a bunch of thought into a similar layout, so I figured I would share it.
I am a developer, so I need my dedicated arrow keys, Esc and `~ keys. Basically, all the rest of the keys I don't mind putting in a Fn layer.
Here is what it looks like...
(Attachment Link)
Here is the layout: http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/c2a2a76df8848ae2bdba84d606fa1635
I am currently getting the plate and case cut for this keyboard and I will be hand wiring it with the Enabler PCBs.
Most of the keys for this layout come with the base kit. The shift keys are relatively common in many of the GBs by getting an optional kit.
PS - I am a Mac user, so Alt maps to my Command key...
First of all, thank you so much for your plate layout tool, it made designing the case Soooo much easier.
I like your layout, it reminds me alot of the HHKB. It's also nice that yours is fairly standard, meaning you'll actually be able to source non-blanks. Definitely post a build log once you're done, I'd love to see the final product. Good luck!
First of all, thank you so much for your plate layout tool, it made designing the case Soooo much easier.
I like your layout, it reminds me alot of the HHKB. It's also nice that yours is fairly standard, meaning you'll actually be able to source non-blanks. Definitely post a build log once you're done, I'd love to see the final product. Good luck!
Glad the tool is being helpful. :) I am really happy that people are enjoying it. Its was a lot of work, so I am glad it is being used.
Ya, one of my goals was to use as many standard keys as possible (along with the other stuff I already mentioned).
I think it is going to be a sexy board. Brass top and bottom plate with cherry wood as the middle layers. :P I will definitely do a build log and take lots of pictures.
The shift key that far out to the right is totally useless as a shift. You might as well just leave it off entirely and put something else in that spot.
Not really. How often do you use the right shift anyway.People in general, or me personally? I personally use the right shift almost exclusively, reserving the left shift for the symbols on the right hand number row and keys typed with the right hand pinky and sometimes ring finger (so among letters, that’s usually P, and sometimes L or O).
The shift key that far out to the right is totally useless as a shift. You might as well just leave it off entirely and put something else in that spot.Not really. How often do you use the right shift anyway.People in general, or me personally? I personally use the right shift almost exclusively, reserving the left shift for the symbols on the right hand number row and keys typed with the right hand pinky and sometimes ring finger (so among letters, that’s usually P, and sometimes L or O).
Your keyboard would be totally unusable for me.
But hey, if you don’t use the right shift, that’s no problem, go ahead and get rid of it. There’s just not much point IMO in making it so far away that you couldn’t use it if you wanted. I think you’d be much better off dropping the right shift entirely and shifting the arrows a slight bit more to the right.
You make it seem like I have banished that key to the ends of the earth, never to be seen again. Haha. It in the same spot as it always was, its just one unit shorter.The shift key that far out to the right is totally useless as a shift. You might as well just leave it off entirely and put something else in that spot.Not really. How often do you use the right shift anyway.People in general, or me personally? I personally use the right shift almost exclusively, reserving the left shift for the symbols on the right hand number row and keys typed with the right hand pinky and sometimes ring finger (so among letters, that’s usually P, and sometimes L or O).
Your keyboard would be totally unusable for me.
But hey, if you don’t use the right shift, that’s no problem, go ahead and get rid of it. There’s just not much point IMO in making it so far away that you couldn’t use it if you wanted. I think you’d be much better off dropping the right shift entirely and shifting the arrows a slight bit more to the right.
You make it seem like I have banished that key to the ends of the earth, never to be seen again. Haha. It in the same spot as it always was, its just one unit shorter.The shift key that far out to the right is totally useless as a shift. You might as well just leave it off entirely and put something else in that spot.Not really. How often do you use the right shift anyway.People in general, or me personally? I personally use the right shift almost exclusively, reserving the left shift for the symbols on the right hand number row and keys typed with the right hand pinky and sometimes ring finger (so among letters, that’s usually P, and sometimes L or O).
Your keyboard would be totally unusable for me.
But hey, if you don’t use the right shift, that’s no problem, go ahead and get rid of it. There’s just not much point IMO in making it so far away that you couldn’t use it if you wanted. I think you’d be much better off dropping the right shift entirely and shifting the arrows a slight bit more to the right.
I am not trying to get anyone to use this layout, I just mentioned it in this thread because I thought some people would be interested in my build/layout. I understand that people who depend heavily on the right shift will find this layout strange. I'm not one of those people, so we will see how I adapt. :)
I wanted a Fn key on my left hand and that was a good place for it. I didn't have enough keys otherwise.You make it seem like I have banished that key to the ends of the earth, never to be seen again. Haha. It in the same spot as it always was, its just one unit shorter.The shift key that far out to the right is totally useless as a shift. You might as well just leave it off entirely and put something else in that spot.Not really. How often do you use the right shift anyway.People in general, or me personally? I personally use the right shift almost exclusively, reserving the left shift for the symbols on the right hand number row and keys typed with the right hand pinky and sometimes ring finger (so among letters, that’s usually P, and sometimes L or O).
Your keyboard would be totally unusable for me.
But hey, if you don’t use the right shift, that’s no problem, go ahead and get rid of it. There’s just not much point IMO in making it so far away that you couldn’t use it if you wanted. I think you’d be much better off dropping the right shift entirely and shifting the arrows a slight bit more to the right.
I am not trying to get anyone to use this layout, I just mentioned it in this thread because I thought some people would be interested in my build/layout. I understand that people who depend heavily on the right shift will find this layout strange. I'm not one of those people, so we will see how I adapt. :)
Why you decided to split the left shift? Changing both shifts at once seems unnecessary.
I wanted a Fn key on my left hand and that was a good place for it. I didn't have enough keys otherwise.You make it seem like I have banished that key to the ends of the earth, never to be seen again. Haha. It in the same spot as it always was, its just one unit shorter.The shift key that far out to the right is totally useless as a shift. You might as well just leave it off entirely and put something else in that spot.Not really. How often do you use the right shift anyway.People in general, or me personally? I personally use the right shift almost exclusively, reserving the left shift for the symbols on the right hand number row and keys typed with the right hand pinky and sometimes ring finger (so among letters, that’s usually P, and sometimes L or O).
Your keyboard would be totally unusable for me.
But hey, if you don’t use the right shift, that’s no problem, go ahead and get rid of it. There’s just not much point IMO in making it so far away that you couldn’t use it if you wanted. I think you’d be much better off dropping the right shift entirely and shifting the arrows a slight bit more to the right.
I am not trying to get anyone to use this layout, I just mentioned it in this thread because I thought some people would be interested in my build/layout. I understand that people who depend heavily on the right shift will find this layout strange. I'm not one of those people, so we will see how I adapt. :)
Why you decided to split the left shift? Changing both shifts at once seems unnecessary.