By far the #1 benefit I get is the ability to install SA (and DSA) family spherical keycaps from Signature Plastics. Any keyboard that doesn't allow me to do that, regardless of its other qualities (*cough*Topre*cough*), is useless to me.You can put SA and DSA on Topre, you just need MX compatible sliders.
The #2 benefit is superior feel due to the quality of soft linear MX switches.(*)
The #3 benefit is superior build quality and durability.
(*) This would also apply to NovaTouch switches, but Cooler Master doesn't make an ANSI 104 board so the NovaTouch is a non-starter for me. They also only come in black...
That's like saying you can run Mac software on a Dell PC, you just need a Mac motherboard.
That's like saying you can run Mac software on a Dell PC, you just need a Mac motherboard.
I'm going to disagree with you there. That would be more like saying in order to use MX compatible caps you had to have an MX compatible PCB. Sliders are not what make Topre, Topre. At least not to me, perhaps you disagree?
No, I don't. My burst speed is about 1/8 slower on my preferred "mechanical" switches (medium-stiffness linear) than on good scissor switches, and much lower on the non-preferred switches.
- you write faster
No, I don't or the difference is negligible.
- you write more accurately,
That's relative. On one hand, I don't get fatigued from bottoming out, when typing on switches with the right force/travel. On the other hand, rolling over adjacent keys (as typical for Colemak) on a low-profile (typically scissor-switch) keyboard is much easier on tendons IME.
- is more comfortable
Well, I'm not aware of any split symmetrical non-mechanical keyboard with decent thumb-key placement. Perhaps TouchStream, but it has its own set of issues. Or microTron, depending on your definition of "mechanical".
- helps you in particular with a health problem (like carpal tunnel syndrome or repetitive strain injury)
That's like saying you can run Mac software on a Dell PC, you just need a Mac motherboard.
I'm going to disagree with you there. That would be more like saying in order to use MX compatible caps you had to have an MX compatible PCB. Sliders are not what make Topre, Topre. At least not to me, perhaps you disagree?
elitist attitude towards plebs+1
That's like saying you can run Mac software on a Dell PC, you just need a Mac motherboard.
I'm going to disagree with you there. That would be more like saying in order to use MX compatible caps you had to have an MX compatible PCB. Sliders are not what make Topre, Topre. At least not to me, perhaps you disagree?
Well, I meant it in the sense that Topre switches and MX caps are not at all compatible unless you take the switch completely apart and rebuild it with a different part (the slider). That's like taking your PC apart and rebuilding it with a new motherboard so it becomes "compatible" with the software you want to run. In either case it is way more effort than I would want to go to. Besides, I don't think there is a Topre switch that can properly take SA keycaps anyway. Even with MX sliders, I don't think either the regular RealForce nor the HiPro switches would really accomodate SA keycaps properly (for reasons other than the shape of the stem recepticle).
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Hello.
For those of you that use or have used a mechanical keyboard: What feature were you looking for when you purchased your keyboard, and in what aspects have you found that it performs better than a standard keyboard?. I am especially interested on whether using a mechanical keyboard:or whether you find it satisfactory different out of it. Likewise, apart form the added cost, what have been the downsides for you?
- you write faster
- you write more accurately,
- is more comfortable
- helps you in particular with a health problem (like carpal tunnel syndrome or repetitive strain injury)
Thanks.
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- you write faster
- you write more accurately,
- is more comfortable
- helps you in particular with a health problem (like carpal tunnel syndrome or repetitive strain injury)
Likewise, apart form the added cost, what have been the downsides for you?
If there's one benefit, it's the sheer amount of customization options with common discrete switches. Tuning switches, replacing keycaps… or building keyboards with custom layouts.
Keyfeel. Sound. The pleasure and interest of collecting a variety of them.I’m of the same opinion. It’s the enjoyment of both the feeling and sound. Which is the reason I like Blues, BS and Topre. They are all tactile and they give out distinct sound.
I thought that speed would be the most important factor, while it seems that the most important factor in general (based on all of your replies) seems to be the feel and comfort. I conclude that mechanical keyboard are more of a collection and luxury item than a tool that does better its job (I thought that they were the later).Typing speed is mostly irrelevant in this day.
I thought that speed would be the most important factor, while it seems that the most important factor in general (based on all of your replies) seems to be the feel and comfort. I conclude that mechanical keyboard are more of a collection and luxury item than a tool that does better its job (I thought that they were the later).Typing speed is mostly irrelevant in this day.
If a keyboard lasts longer or doesn't fatigue/injure the user as much, it *is* doing its job better. (Keep in mind, that I don't say "mechanical" keyboards satisfy that in general.)
I agree with the first part regarding the user's health. I disagree with the second part regarding durability: If it lasts 1.5 times a much as a typical keyboard but it costs 5 times as much, it's doing its job worser, because benefit is scaled sublinearly with cost; and from what I have read, this seems to be usually the case with mechanical keyboards.
Aside from how great it feels, I also love using something that's mine at work. If I'm going to be working 40+ hours a week sitting in front of a computer its comforting to use my own keyboard :D
Speech recognition combined with text expansion, or stenography can absolutely destroy the fastest typists.I thought that speed would be the most important factor, while it seems that the most important factor in general (based on all of your replies) seems to be the feel and comfort. I conclude that mechanical keyboard are more of a collection and luxury item than a tool that does better its job (I thought that they were the later).Typing speed is mostly irrelevant in this day.
I disagree. For the most intellectually trivial tasks, like writing forum posts in geekhack or a normal chat, typing speed is the limiting factor. If you type faster, you can do more in the same time, the same in less time, or something in between. Common wisdom is that life is "nowdays" more busy that it "used to be"; presumably referring to the scale of decades; I am slightly skeptical of that claim. If that is true, then it is a factor that contributes to making typing speed more important.
Better yet, many members are typing on keyboards made in early 90's or 80's.If a keyboard lasts longer or doesn't fatigue/injure the user as much, it *is* doing its job better. (Keep in mind, that I don't say "mechanical" keyboards satisfy that in general.)
I agree with the first part regarding the user's health. I disagree with the second part regarding durability: If it lasts 1.5 times a much as a typical keyboard but it costs 5 times as much, it's doing its job worser, because benefit is scaled sublinearly with cost; and from what I have read, this seems to be usually the case with mechanical keyboards.
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Gr8 b8 m8 I r8 8/8
Speech recognition combined with text expansion, or stenography can absolutely destroy the fastest typists.The point here is whether typing speed is relevant. I gave an argument for why it is.
Meanwhile, *typist* as an occupation is scarce nowadays, precisely because we have copypasta, speech recognition, OCR etc.Indeed, meaning that almost everybody does his own typing himself, instead of having somebody else do that for him. That is an obstacle for specialization and a further reason of why stenographs are unlikely to become widespread (It pays better for a specialized typist to go though the hassle of learning to use a stenotype and purchase the required hardware than to somebody that just types as part of his activities).
Better yet, many members are typing on keyboards made in early 90's or 80's.That is right, and those environmental and social consequences are worth examining. I can not comment much in that regard, but I can note that the environmental friendliness that a more durable keyboard may have is countered or possibly reversed if its user constantly consumes more goods and services just for the sake of customization (like custom keycaps). Remember that the environmental cost is not only the materials that compose the final goods, but also intermediate consumption, packaging, transport, and the environmental consequences of the extraction and processing of the raw materials.
Also, durability or the possibility of repairs isn't about price per se; it has environmental and social consequences as well.
Developers do very little typing in actuality, esp. compared to interaction with the interface, and the dumb work is slowly being replaced by automation.I agree. I do not work as a programmer, but I sometimes write computer programs. I notice that I spend more time only thinking than typing (and thinking), and bear in mind that I think while I type. I conjecture that this is the rule rather than the exception except for intellectualy trivial tasks (see what I wrote above) (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=76788.msg1926976#msg1926976). If you really type that much, to the point where typing speed is your limiting factor, then you must be writing something trivial in a very inefficient way (maybe manually unrolling loops without using copy and paste or kill and yank). Also see http://xahlee.info/kbd/how_many_keystrokes_programers_type_a_day.html (http://xahlee.info/kbd/how_many_keystrokes_programers_type_a_day.html).
The only time I use a mouse while coding is if I'm googling something I'm too stupid to figure out on my own. I navigate with the keyboard, I look up documentation in Dash with my keyboard, I move through the filesystem with my keyboard, I run tests with my keyboard, I restart servers with my keyboard, and most of the time I'm coding with my keyboard.
If you can't type and think at the same time you're not a programmer, you're a typist. If you can't program without a mouse you're not programming, you're using a wizard.
I thought that speed would be the most important factorNot at all. On most I actually type slower. I'm typing my PhD thesis on one of the slowest ones of all (my NMB).
You NEED to try out Alps. They make a fantastic sound (the Dell AT101W not as much though). Check the myriad of Alps video reviews I have for a few examples :) .Keyfeel. Sound. The pleasure and interest of collecting a variety of them.I’m of the same opinion. It’s the enjoyment of both the feeling and sound. Which is the reason I like Blues, BS and Topre. They are all tactile and they give out distinct sound.
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I thought that speed would be the most important factorNot at all. On most I actually type slower. I'm typing my PhD thesis on one of the slowest ones of all (my NMB).
No, it's not less comfortable, it's much more comfortable. It just has rather heavy switches, which slow me down. I simply enjoy the typing feel, the clicky sound, and even just the look of the keyboard (I don't touch type properly so I get to see more of my keyboards than most people here). There are keyboards I enjoy using even more, but they are too loud to use in my (open) office, I'd have torches and pitchforks at my desk soon.I thought that speed would be the most important factorNot at all. On most I actually type slower. I'm typing my PhD thesis on one of the slowest ones of all (my NMB).
Ok. So do you sacrifice typing speed for comfort and to use something that you emotionally like more?.
I am especially interested on whether using a mechanical keyboard:I have been able to write faster, and more accurately because my hands are more comfortable and because of that I have much, much less strain and have prevented any type of rsi.or whether you find it satisfactory because of something different. Likewise, apart form the added cost, what have been the downsides for you?
- you write faster
- you write more accurately,
- is more comfortable
- helps you in particular with a health problem (like carpal tunnel syndrome or repetitive strain injury)
* Yes
- you write faster
- you write more accurately,
- is more comfortable
- helps you in particular with a health problem (like carpal tunnel syndrome or repetitive strain injury)
So you guys are saying linkbane was wrong when he said we didn't deserve to own mechanical keyboards if we couldn't type really super fast? :mindblown:
So you guys are saying linkbane was wrong when he said we didn't deserve to own mechanical keyboards if we couldn't type really super fast? :mindblown:
What do you get from using a mechanical keyboard (speed, comfort, health)?
QuoteWhat do you get from using a mechanical keyboard (speed, comfort, health)?
A feel of superiority.
Once i convince myself that one switch is the best for my needs I convince myself otherwise and try a new switch XDI'm in that process now thanks to GH, haha
For me, it was a matter of economy. I was going through $50 Logitech membrane keyboards every 3 - 6 months. (The keys would begin to stick if not struck dead center.) My first mech board was a Dos Ultimate that I worked on every day for 3+ years. The keycaps were shiny, but the switches worked like the day I bought it. I actually saved money by moving to mech keyboards.
For me, it was a matter of economy. I was going through $50 Logitech membrane keyboards every 3 - 6 months. (The keys would begin to stick if not struck dead center.) My first mech board was a Dos Ultimate that I worked on every day for 3+ years. The keycaps were shiny, but the switches worked like the day I bought it. I actually saved money by moving to mech keyboards.
I have a similar story. I was burning through even nice membrane keyboards (since I always believed and still do that you should invest in your own work equipment - it will pay for itself) every 6-9 months (even refreshing the membrane by cleaning it). I tried a bunch of different mech keyboards that they had at MicroCenter and Frys and got the Razor BWU 2013 when it first came out (almost 3 years ago)since at the time it had more going for it than the DasKeyboard, matched my Razor Mouse at the time, and I couldn't justify the money for the Ducky.
That opened up the door to Model M's and discovering a love of the Alps switch.
Now, I pretty much only use 60% custom keyboards. That BWU served me a long time at work with those macro keys for bringing up stack overflow, IDE shortcuts, etc.
Buy yeah, he hasn't been used at all in the last 7-8 months. and the resale on those is not high enough to be worth reselling it. The Keycaps are worth as much as the board.
Downsides? My wallet hates me.
Benefits? As a tool it doesn't really get the job done any different. I like the way they feel, its comfortable. I like to customise and I like the keyboard/keycap aesthetics. It's my hobby and I don't really know what makes it so appealing to me. I just like them.
As far as health goes, if you are going to use emacs you are going to get RSI no matter what keyboard you are using. I myself have never seen a professionally published paper on the health benefits of using mechanical keyboards so I wouldn't use that as an argument before I go to buy one.
Writing faster and more accurately? Most definitely. Different weights of switches could either make it easier to press down and thus move your fingers quicker and lighter across the keyboard. Alternatively you could have heavy switches and stop yourself mid press if you realise you are hitting the wrong key (IMO 2mm to actuation is more than enough to stop yourself mid button press), and also avoid accidentally pressing the key that you don't want when moving your fingers etc.. (this is common with lighter switches, they are very easy to depress). Also if you want to learn how to touch type if you don't know how to already, use blank keycaps.
At the end of the day you are getting a higher quality tool and you can make it yours however you want, whether it is simply the aesthetic or the feel. Welcome to the forums! ^:)
Nothing, except wasted **** ton of money.I've been able to appreciate a good rubber dome more because of using a mech, but the first time my hands start hurting or i have to repeat key presses due to non-registration, i realize that i still need my mech.
Seriously, the longer I use my "mechanical keyboard", the least different I can tell between a "mechanical keyboard" and a dell rubberdome. Sometimes I even think a dell rubberdome is better.
But somehow, I can't stop using and buying more mechanical keyboard.
Nothing, except wasted **** ton of money.
Seriously, the longer I use my "mechanical keyboard", the least different I can tell between a "mechanical keyboard" and a dell rubberdome. Sometimes I even think a dell rubberdome is better.
But somehow, I can't stop using and buying more mechanical keyboard.
Nothing, except wasted **** ton of money.
Seriously, the longer I use my "mechanical keyboard", the least different I can tell between a "mechanical keyboard" and a dell rubberdome. Sometimes I even think a dell rubberdome is better.
But somehow, I can't stop using and buying more mechanical keyboard.