Unmistify the IBM M model "mechanic" keyboard

[kilogeek]

Hi all geeks 

I just create this post to give you my opinion about this ergonomic IBM keyboard I used a while...

First of all, I agree that the typing quality and the curved host makes it very good for fast typing.

But I had to dismount it after a humidity issue and can tell you 2 things that are IMO very important :

1. This is NOT a fully mechanical keyboard, althought there is a mechanical part with a patented spring and hammer system, the plastic hammer has to hit a 3 films connectors sandwiched between 2 curverd metal plates pressed by plastic fixations, making it hard to dismount and almost impossible to mount it correctly with nuts and bolts, as the pressure must be perfectly the same on all fixation points !

2. Once you know all about the first point, you must know that this keyboard final contacts use the same system as cheap dome keyboards, which can easily get broken in a humid environment (there are no silicon joins around the "sandwich" to ensure films are kept dry.

Now you know that, I own a truly vintage full mechanical keyboard which wheight 2 Kgs, all components made in Japan, all the keys lettering is made of plastic injection, so that letters will never disappear even if you use aceton on them ! Alghough mine has a not-curved inox plate under the ALPS pcb, all components have the ALPS brand, made in Japan. Switch are complicated black ALPS, this is a true vintage mechanical keyboard, very close to the DELL AT 101 mechanical keyboard which are often made in Thaïland or Mexico, but only available currently on used market in QWERTY configuration. Mine has great value because it's currently the only model available for sale in the world, under the Bull Micral french brand. These keyboards were sold with Bull PC in the 80ies that were very expensive and mainly sold to government administrations (education and others).

I customized it a bet (desert storm camouflage with trenslucide epoxy layer), which maybe was a bad idea, but past is past and you cannot change it 

Mine is currently for sale on french e-Bay for 300€ and will surely find a buyer. I promised myself to keep it for life, but need cash for a  professional project. But it's an AZERTY french configuration so I dubt one of you will like that, or only if one french member is searching for hardware on this forum, who knows ?

Have a nice W-E, and don't feel nervous if I say that "I hate Halloween which has nothing to do in my country" 

B.P. - France.

[fohat.digs]

The debate about whether or not IBM Model Ms are mechanical switch keyboards has been going on for quite a while.

[depletedvespene]

Sure, but it's an artificial, pointless, asinine "debate". Model M keyboards ARE mechanical keyboards, period.

In another news, water is wet and ice IX ain't the same as ice 9.

[kilogeek]

You can say they are mechanical, and it's half the truth, there is indeed a mechanism, but as a polytechnics senior engineer, I had to say the truth about it, half of this keyboard is built as are built current rubber dome keyboards.

I will call it "The best semi-mechanical keyboard". That's all !

Regards, B.P.

[Snowdog993]

You can say they are mechanical, and it's half the truth, there is indeed a mechanism, but as a polytechnics senior engineer, I had to say the truth about it, half of this keyboard is built as are built current rubber dome keyboards.

I will call it "The best semi-mechanical keyboard". That's all !

Regards, B.P.

Let me see, you come to this conclusion because a membrane is used instead of a PCB or something?
Is that your argument?
Well, I guess you're right. Is there anything else you can tell us? Uh maybe the way it feels as you use it?
It sure feels different than any rubberdome keyboard I have ever used. It also feels a lot better than other linear mech switches I have used in the past and present.
I guess your knowledge will be noted in our archives as being the whole truth about the Model M keyboard.
QED.

Next.

[fohat.digs]

As a rhetorical exercise, defining exactly what "the switch" is will determine the status of the buckling spring mechanism - is the switch itself mechanical or does it employ a mechanism that activates a switch which is not mechanical?

[yui]

if you want to get real pedantic rubber dome keyboards do fall into the mecanical category as does everything but virtual and projected keyboards, so don't look too far into it, as modern mechanical often try to emulate the older M and F.

[Findecanor]

Here we go again... debating what "mechanical" means.

Personally, I think the best definition is that a "mechanical switch" is one that has an actuation mechanism containing at least one rigid part that performs the role of a simple machine element (such as a lever, mechanical linkage, wheel, pulley, inclined plane, wedge or screw) that changes the direction of a force which leads to actuation.
How the actuation is sensed (via conductive ink pads on membrane, metal contact, capacitive, hall effect etc.) is irrelevant, as long as it is the movement of the mechanism that triggers the actuation.

* Model M qualify because the switch's buckling spring is connected to a foot which acts as a lever.
* Cherry MX, Alps SKCL, Romer-G and SMK qualify because the slider has a surface that act as an inclined plane against an internal leaf spring.

* Rubber domes don't qualify, because the dome is not rigid and the slider's direction is only down.
* Common scissor switches don't qualify because the scissors are part of the levelling mechanism, and plays no part in actuation.

I'm not sure how to include Fujitsu Leaf-spring, Rafi and Ericsson switches in the definition though. They all have leaf springs that actuate downwards, either pressed or released by the slider's down-movement.

[yui]

and it is the whole reason i tried to say to not be pedantic, there is no definition of mechanical that really apply to keyboard so it doesn't make any sense to argue, some even like rubber domes and some hate model M or alps that does not make any more or less mechanical, just tastes.
(btw i am typing on a model M right now and i could not care less if you think it is mechanical or not i came here expecting an other discussion given the title, i do expect that a vast majority here knew about the membrane nature of Ms, it was a cost reduced model F)

[rxc92]

You can say they are mechanical, and it's half the truth, there is indeed a mechanism, but as a polytechnics senior engineer, I had to say the truth about it, half of this keyboard is built as are built current rubber dome keyboards.

I will call it "The best semi-mechanical keyboard". That's all !

 
 
Who cares? This may be one of the most pointless (and poorly written)  threads I've ever read. Model M is a good mechanical keyboard. To most everyone, mechanical = non-rubber dome. The people who most fiercely debate this (i.e. you) are invariably idiots who want to think they're superior.

[Myoth]

Mine is currently for sale on french e-Bay for 300€ and will surely find a buyer. I promised myself to keep it for life, but need cash for a  professional project. But it's an AZERTY french configuration so I dubt one of you will like that, or only if one french member is searching for hardware on this forum, who knows ?

Heh, did you also think it would find a buyer when you put it for sale for 1000€ ? yet it didn't sell, then 600€, still not, I wonder how low the price will be until you actually sell it, might end up in the 2 digits with that paintjob

for the record, I sold one, that was in good condition and had much more expensive switches for about the price you're asking

SKCM Black are basically worth less, so you can guess how much your keyboard is worth 

[saint_james]

When is a keyboard "mechanical"?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H66XwhzhdnA

[Snowdog993]

Hi all geeks 

I just create this post to give you my opinion about this ergonomic IBM keyboard I used a while...

First of all, I agree that the typing quality and the curved host makes it very good for fast typing.

But I had to dismount it after a humidity issue and can tell you 2 things that are IMO very important :

1. This is NOT a fully mechanical keyboard, althought there is a mechanical part with a patented spring and hammer system, the plastic hammer has to hit a 3 films connectors sandwiched between 2 curverd metal plates pressed by plastic fixations, making it hard to dismount and almost impossible to mount it correctly with nuts and bolts, as the pressure must be perfectly the same on all fixation points !

2. Once you know all about the first point, you must know that this keyboard final contacts use the same system as cheap dome keyboards, which can easily get broken in a humid environment (there are no silicon joins around the "sandwich" to ensure films are kept dry.

Now you know that, I own a truly vintage full mechanical keyboard which wheight 2 Kgs, all components made in Japan, all the keys lettering is made of plastic injection, so that letters will never disappear even if you use aceton on them ! Alghough mine has a not-curved inox plate under the ALPS pcb, all components have the ALPS brand, made in Japan. Switch are complicated black ALPS, this is a true vintage mechanical keyboard, very close to the DELL AT 101 mechanical keyboard which are often made in Thaïland or Mexico, but only available currently on used market in QWERTY configuration. Mine has great value because it's currently the only model available for sale in the world, under the Bull Micral french brand. These keyboards were sold with Bull PC in the 80ies that were very expensive and mainly sold to government administrations (education and others).

I customized it a bet (desert storm camouflage with trenslucide epoxy layer), which maybe was a bad idea, but past is past and you cannot change it 

Mine is currently for sale on french e-Bay for 300€ and will surely find a buyer. I promised myself to keep it for life, but need cash for a  professional project. But it's an AZERTY french configuration so I dubt one of you will like that, or only if one french member is searching for hardware on this forum, who knows ?

Have a nice W-E, and don't feel nervous if I say that "I hate Halloween which has nothing to do in my country" 

B.P. - France.

After reading this several times, if you can actually figure out what a Bull Micral computer keyboard is. There is no cross-reference. I hope you find some emphatic soul that will shell out your request for 300 Francs for that keyboard you painted so well.
I hope you sold it and got a Model M.

[didjamatic]

By any definition, an IBM Buckling spring switch, mechanism and keyboard are mechanical. 

Buckling Spring Patent Description: A snap-action switch and actuator are disclosed in which a resilient columnar compression member is axially loaded to the point of catastrophic buckling. In one embodiment, the column serves as both an electrical conductor and contact. In this embodiment, it buckles into contacting with another conductive member to complete a circuit. Alternatively, the buckled column may actuate a piezoelectric, optical, or other signal producing means to produce signals used for switching or to close other contacts.

Mechanical: having to do with machinery
Machinery: an apparatus consisting of interrelated parts with separate functions, used in the performance of some kind of work
Apparatus: a group or combination of instruments, machinery, tools, materials, etc., having a particular function or intended for a specific use