Author Topic: [GB] Austin R2 - Int'l GB waiting for PCBs, US GB is all shipped!  (Read 28873 times)

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Offline roguesystem087

  • Posts: 90
  • Location: Hong Kong
Re: [GB] Austin R2 - GB Starts May 16th! (check post for times)
« Reply #50 on: Sun, 17 May 2020, 00:30:30 »
CABERNET GANG RISE UP

Ah I see you're a man of culture as well XD
| Cypher F-rowless 1800cp | Rama U80-A | HBCP | TX HJCP |REKT 1800 | Austin R2 |

Offline SLPNick

  • Posts: 14
  • Location: Australia
Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #51 on: Sun, 17 May 2020, 01:05:24 »
I appreciate everyone's passion for this board. I just wanted to clear things up since it seems like there are some assumptions that I don't believe to be true.

The limit of 75 boards for both US and Int'l is not to keep the board exclusive. If you compare this round to round 1, we are delivering 4x more boards in total once GB and extras are done. If I am trying to make an exclusive board, I would have kept it the same number or less than R1.

Most GBs run by GB runner not sponsored by a full time vendor are limited groupbuys. Novelkeys has been around for a few years now and have enough manpower and capital to run an unlimited GB. Even if I did have more money, that does not reduce the amount of effort it takes to run a GB, not to mention my full time job that I still have.

As a one man crew, I am only comfortable handling up to 75 boards at this moment in time. If I become more efficient and adding more boards would not cause the quality to lower, I might consider doing more at that time.

For those who think running unlimited groupbuys means that the cost of materials essentially become zero, I would like to disagree. The design changes for this round actually made cost of materials higher than round 1 even with the increase in units. However, I felt that the changes were beneficial and made the decision to take that risk. So even though I am ordering what I consider to be a lot more than the first round, the costs from the manufacturer is more per unit than what I paid the first round. I can only do this because of the faith and support I had from R1 participants.

Thanks for your understanding and patience. I'm trying to push as many boards as I can to whoever is interested. I'm really grateful there are so many people interested. Hopefully I can strive to do more in future rounds.

Totally understand, thanks for increasing the units even though I missed it, you did say there will be R3 right?

Offline whinmeister

  • Posts: 39
Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #52 on: Sun, 17 May 2020, 19:29:10 »
Congrats to everyone that was successful. I didn't have a chance as they were all gone by the time I was entering CC info lol. Next time.

Offline dom

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Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #53 on: Mon, 18 May 2020, 05:53:37 »
It would be nice to appreciate everyone next time (not only those with the right tools) and run a raffle instead.  :blank:

Offline driftingbunnies

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Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #54 on: Mon, 18 May 2020, 06:42:09 »
It would be nice to appreciate everyone next time (not only those with the right tools) and run a raffle instead.  :blank:

Thanks for the feedback, I'll consider doing that for the extras.

Offline chits

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Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #55 on: Mon, 18 May 2020, 15:43:31 »
not only those with the right tools

what're the right tools?

Offline r4bbl3d4bbl3

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Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #56 on: Mon, 18 May 2020, 15:44:39 »
not only those with the right tools

what're the right tools?

Apple Pay, that was the only way I could score one, just double clicked my side button and boom done, didn't have to enter anything.

Offline DukeEsquire

  • Posts: 440
Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #57 on: Mon, 18 May 2020, 16:24:22 »
not only those with the right tools

what're the right tools?

Apple Pay, that was the only way I could score one, just double clicked my side button and boom done, didn't have to enter anything.

If you've used Shopify before, then your information was already autopopulated.

My friend and I did ours together on FaceTime and he used Apple Pay.while I used Shopify. Mine checked out about 10 seconds before his.

Offline toanta

  • Posts: 16
Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #58 on: Mon, 18 May 2020, 18:05:13 »
not only those with the right tools

what're the right tools?

Apple Pay, that was the only way I could score one, just double clicked my side button and boom done, didn't have to enter anything.

If you've used Shopify before, then your information was already autopopulated.

My friend and I did ours together on FaceTime and he used Apple Pay.while I used Shopify. Mine checked out about 10 seconds before his.

I always use google wallet. Apple pay is definitely the fastest solution though as google wallet requires your 3 digit code and apple pay doesnt.

Offline DukeEsquire

  • Posts: 440
Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #59 on: Mon, 18 May 2020, 19:55:35 »
not only those with the right tools

what're the right tools?

Apple Pay, that was the only way I could score one, just double clicked my side button and boom done, didn't have to enter anything.

If you've used Shopify before, then your information was already autopopulated.

My friend and I did ours together on FaceTime and he used Apple Pay.while I used Shopify. Mine checked out about 10 seconds before his.

I always use google wallet. Apple pay is definitely the fastest solution though as google wallet requires your 3 digit code and apple pay doesnt.

Doesn't everything ultimately still need to go through Shopify?

Wouldn't it make sense that the fastest checkout option would be to use Shopify?

Offline prangano

  • Posts: 40
Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #60 on: Wed, 20 May 2020, 02:49:45 »
No chance for foam as an extra before the boards are delivered?

Offline quadrotiles

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Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #61 on: Wed, 20 May 2020, 07:25:01 »
I liked ilumkb's system of using a google form and then being emailed invoices later. It allowed for a wait list if people weren't paying and helped prevent people buying to flip their spot.
(I may be biased because I did get in via the waitlist lol). It also means no one has to rush to enter payment details faster than everyone else.

Offline driftingbunnies

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Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #62 on: Wed, 20 May 2020, 07:36:45 »
I liked ilumkb's system of using a google form and then being emailed invoices later. It allowed for a wait list if people weren't paying and helped prevent people buying to flip their spot.
(I may be biased because I did get in via the waitlist lol). It also means no one has to rush to enter payment details faster than everyone else.

I agree that there are some pros there but the cons would be how much more time ilumkb has had to spend due to this situation. All invoices need to be sent manually, chased manually, and checked manually. I did this for R1 and while it was manageable for 40 units, it prevents you from growing any larger. It also delays the time when you can pay the manufacturers to start work which just adds to the wait time on a GB.

No chance for foam as an extra before the boards are delivered?

Sorry, foam would be too difficult to coordinate with ilumkb. You can ask in the discord if R1 owners feel like they really needed foam between plate and pcb. If you're talking about form between pcb and bottom piece, any foam will do.
« Last Edit: Wed, 20 May 2020, 07:45:12 by driftingbunnies »

Offline DukeEsquire

  • Posts: 440
Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #63 on: Wed, 20 May 2020, 11:45:44 »
I liked ilumkb's system of using a google form and then being emailed invoices later. It allowed for a wait list if people weren't paying and helped prevent people buying to flip their spot.
(I may be biased because I did get in via the waitlist lol). It also means no one has to rush to enter payment details faster than everyone else.

Why do you need a waitlist at all if people pay at checkout?

Offline eniigma

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Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #64 on: Wed, 20 May 2020, 12:01:43 »
I liked ilumkb's system of using a google form and then being emailed invoices later. It allowed for a wait list if people weren't paying and helped prevent people buying to flip their spot.
(I may be biased because I did get in via the waitlist lol). It also means no one has to rush to enter payment details faster than everyone else.

Why do you need a waitlist at all if people pay at checkout?
I agree with this sentiment. I think just paying upfront for the group buy is the way to go.

Offline roguesystem087

  • Posts: 90
  • Location: Hong Kong
Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #65 on: Thu, 21 May 2020, 02:51:42 »
well db's group buy worked really well for r1, and i think most people on ilmkb also liked the idea of the google form,
it seems like with the google form adding/changes/cancellation and transfers went pretty smoothly.
Whatever people may prefer, it works reliably and i think that's what matters in the end.
| Cypher F-rowless 1800cp | Rama U80-A | HBCP | TX HJCP |REKT 1800 | Austin R2 |

Offline Void225

  • Posts: 5
  • Location: New York City
Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #66 on: Thu, 18 June 2020, 16:16:54 »
I would love to have this board in hotswap. I don't understand why people on this site insist hotswap availability is a negative. Hotswap is a feature; I don't see car buyers scoffing at any car that dares come with Leather seats. You want to solder, go ahead, but if I want sockets, why does the make me a jerk?

Offline DukeEsquire

  • Posts: 440
Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #67 on: Thu, 18 June 2020, 16:24:24 »
I would love to have this board in hotswap. I don't understand why people on this site insist hotswap availability is a negative. Hotswap is a feature; I don't see car buyers scoffing at any car that dares come with Leather seats. You want to solder, go ahead, but if I want sockets, why does the make me a jerk?

1. It adds to the design cost because the designer then needs to either pay or design himself a hotswap PCB. You also divide the PCB population in two which may impact volume pricing.
2. It adds to the QC cost because now there are more variables to check.
3. GBs sell out completely anyways without a hotswap option so there is no additional profit for the GB runner.
4. If you want hotswap capability, you can always solder mill-max sockets yourself.

So, in summary, adding a hotswap option results in more cost and minimal additional profit for the GB runner.

It doesn't make you a jerk for asking, but there is a pretty clear answer why most GB runners don't offer it for limited runs.

Someone like Rama that works on an unlimited basis will offer it because he will get incrementally more buyers. For smaller runs, it doesn't matter if you lose out on the hotswap only customer because you're going to sell out either way.
« Last Edit: Thu, 18 June 2020, 16:27:46 by DukeEsquire »

Offline Gondolindrim

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Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #68 on: Thu, 18 June 2020, 16:29:58 »
I would love to have this board in hotswap. I don't understand why people on this site insist hotswap availability is a negative. Hotswap is a feature; I don't see car buyers scoffing at any car that dares come with Leather seats. You want to solder, go ahead, but if I want sockets, why does the make me a jerk?

Hotswap offers several disadvantages over solderable:

(1) It hinders compatibility of layouts, so much so that we wouldn't be able to offer an ISO-compatible PCB by other means than making one ANSI and one ISO, confusing the user and making logistics and kitting harder, hence ramping prices. This considering that each socket costs ~0.12USD and in a 100-key board like this, it would mean 12 USD more in sheer materials

(2) Hotswap sockets are friction-based and have a considerably low life of a couple years before start giving up. That is not to mean the countless examples around of sockets just popping out of PCBs hendering that key unusable

(3) It is very expected from people that are going to buy a 500-dollar keyboard that they know what they are doing or at least will buy the recommended equipment (a good soldering iron and a good tin). Although a huge chunk of the R1 buyers were first timers we did help them get the tools and the soldering

(4) Just like you said, hotswap is a feature, that is, something that sould be added on and not offered in the first place. So much so that 99.9% of GBs that offer a hotswap version will deploy it as a add-on and the default kit as a solderable PCB

(5) If you absolutely want hotswap, you can use those Millmax sockets

It doesn't make you a jerk for asking at all and we always love feedback, but the reasons for not adopting hotswap are crystal clear and very fundamented from user, vendor and GB runner standpoints
« Last Edit: Thu, 18 June 2020, 16:31:35 by Gondolindrim »
A pessimist will tell you the cup is half empty. An optimist will tell you the cup is half full. An engineer will tell you it's exactly twice the size it needs to be.

Offline driftingbunnies

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Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #69 on: Fri, 19 June 2020, 09:38:09 »
I would love to have this board in hotswap. I don't understand why people on this site insist hotswap availability is a negative. Hotswap is a feature; I don't see car buyers scoffing at any car that dares come with Leather seats. You want to solder, go ahead, but if I want sockets, why does the make me a jerk?

Wanting hotswap doesn't make anyone a jerk. I think there have been some people who do come across entitled when asking for hotswap/ISO/etc.

We've definitely weighed the pros/cons as a team on whether hotwap makes sense. For such a large board, I believe there are more risks to offering a hotswap PCB that was mentioned in Gondo's response. If someone purchases a hotswap PCB with the intention of never soldering, it will be quite difficult to fix a socket that has fallen off the PCB. At least more difficult than soldering in a switch.  I honestly think you can't win when it comes to offering a product to this community. If you look at the Vega, hotswap is included in the base kit but a lot of people are asking for solderable PCBs.

I would say though after building multiple Austin's, it's one of the easier PCBs to build on (due to Gondo's amazing work) so if you're hesitant to solder, don't be! It's really a good experience.

Anyway, I think many designers and GB runners do listen to what people want. If hotswap does become more and more popular, then it's inevitable that more boards will have it. At this point in time, it doesn't quite make sense for us to include it. Maybe sometime in the future if HS sockets are improved and costs come down, it will be included with all PCBs.

Thanks for coming to my ted talk

Offline outsider

  • Posts: 61
Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #70 on: Sun, 23 August 2020, 18:35:31 »
Any chance on there being any extras?

Offline driftingbunnies

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Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #71 on: Sun, 23 August 2020, 18:51:44 »
Any chance on there being any extras?

There will be extras for sure. :)

Offline outsider

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Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #72 on: Mon, 24 August 2020, 12:22:11 »
Any chance on there being any extras?

There will be extras for sure. :)

That is awesome news. Let me know if I can sign up!

Offline driftingbunnies

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Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #73 on: Wed, 26 August 2020, 08:56:49 »
There isn't a sign up for it yet but I'll announce details after we get all the GB boards out.

Offline jrfhoutx

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Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Orders closed! See second post for updates
« Reply #74 on: Tue, 22 September 2020, 21:20:05 »
looking forward to extras, hoping I can grab one!

Offline Damogron

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really excited for extras :)
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Offline driftingbunnies

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Will start shipping out batches starting tomorrow. Hopefully I can get them out all by Saturday. :) Extras will be announced in October!

Offline driftingbunnies

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Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Int'l GB waiting for PCBs, US GB is all shipped!
« Reply #77 on: Sat, 26 September 2020, 23:30:40 »
UPDATE! - All the US orders have been shipped. Please be patient if you're in the int'l group, Louis is still waiting for PCBs. For those who are scouring the market for a second hand one, please be patient as extras will be announced in Oct. I'm waiting for packaging but hopefully you will be able to pick one up for a price lower than the aftermarket. I am also considering part vickery so if you're unable to get a raffle spot, you still have a chance to purchase one. Thanks!

Offline ireverliat

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Re: [GB] Austin R2 - Int'l GB waiting for PCBs, US GB is all shipped!
« Reply #78 on: Sun, 27 September 2020, 14:15:20 »
Amazing keeb! GL with the GB