Mechanical virgin seeks KB to love and grow old with

[YetAnotherDeveloper]

Hey everyone... i have been reading GH for a few days now and i need some help.  It seems that the more i read the more questions i have and the more i doubt the options i have already formed.

About me
I'm a programmer and spend 15+ hours a day typing and coding. I also like to play some games, most of which are FPS. My current KB has macros, media keys, lcd et al (g15 v2). i really find most of the time i just ignore these extra features, so they are not a requirement.  The one requirement that i do have is that its full size, i'm not sure i could live with a tenkeyless for my main work KB, but then again maybe i dont need it and i could always use a stand alone.


I would like to stay under 200$ but this is not in stone.  Can you help point me in the right direction?  i think i like the idea of the the cherry blues but then again i'm not sure if thats best for what i do on a day to day basis.

.tia

[keyboardlover]

Hey everyone... i have been reading GH for a few days now and i need some help.  It seems that the more i read the more questions i have and the more i doubt the options i have already formed.

Welcome to GeekHack! Don't worry, what you're experiencing is normal. It WILL get worse

Considering your requirements there are a lot of options. What kind of keyboard are you using now? Do you like it? Do you work in a team environment? Would others be annoyed by a keyboard that's too loud?

Edit: Just saw that you play FPS games, so you'll want a keyboard with 6-KRO. See the link in my sig for more details.

[YetAnotherDeveloper]

• i work at home so there is no one to piss off except my wife; so a loud kb is not an issue.
• i have a g15 v2 and i dont really like it all that much, i liked my old saitek eclipse v1 better.
  
• i do play games and most of those are FPS.

[keyboardlover]

Ok cool. I recommend checking out the keyboards in the NKRO wiki and the Start Here wiki should help you too. If you don't feel comfortable ordering from a foreign country elitekeyboards.com seems to be the popular choice here. However, at the moment they only have Topre keyboards (they are supposed to restock their cherry-switch keyboards in the near future). Of course, you may also be interested in a Deck or some other type of keyboard so don't assume that EK is THE place to buy from. However they do have a good track record and a presence on the forum.

If you're looking for something like your Saitek (which I believe is a decent rubber dome but correct me if I'm wrong), then a Realforce may be a good choice. They have a capacitive switch which feels in someway similar to a very good rubber dome but MUCH better. Cherry blues are an option but some gamers have complained that they are too loud. Since you code, type and game I think that you'd probably be happier with a lighter switch than a heavier switch (I definitely wouldn't recommend cherry blacks). That's about all I can think of for now...I'd have a look in the wikis and let us know what you're thinking.

[theferenc]

There is a realforce in the classifieds section for $200.

It was still for sale when I asked a couple days ago. I can't believe it lasted even that long though, as that's actually a pretty damn nice price for that keyboard. If I wasn't already (way) over budget, I would definitely pick it up myself.

Then again, you could also look into the Unicomp keyboards, if you are interested in buckling springs (my preferred switch), or look to snag an Apple Extended Keyboard II from ebay, if you want to try an Alps switch.

I also spend a lot of time on my keyboards, writing code (about comparable). If you're a UNIX guy, definitely take a look at the HHKB, for layout, rather than size. Unicomp can make a PS/2 Customizer with that layout for a small upcharge. Total would still be under $100, even with their recent price increases, I would expect (mine was under $90).

You could also see if a bolt modded model M comes around on the classifieds, as well. As I told a friend of mine, they make you a better coder :-P.

[calavera]

I was going to recommend a brown or black switch but that realforce is the best choice by far IMO. I went through all cherry switches and a few alps switches and as much as I love them all, realforce was my "daily driver" for three years.

[audioave10]

The term "Mechanical Virgin" made me look twice! LOL

[nocturn4l3030]

i came from a rubber dome (keytronic) and i game too (fps, mmorpg, rts)... i tried the cherry browns because it seemed like the common consensus that it was the best medium between typing and gaming

after a few days of trying, even though i did get used to it.. for typing in general i just found it too darn light. when i gamed i didn't notice the lightness so much at all.

then i ended up with a topre real force (like the one theferenc linked) and been in love since

i have tried a few cherry blue switches that are a really fun keyboard to type on, especially if you're coding for 10+ hours a day. they're fine to game FPS on as you dont' spam the same button over and over (which cherry blues aren't the ideal for, but is still managable).

if you want something similar to the rubber domes that you're used to but at the finest level, go with the topre real force.. it's just expensive

if you want something with the macro keys like the g15 you were using, the Razer BlackWidow uses Cherry blues

let us know what you end up buying!

EDIT:
the realforce is rather quiet, but the cherry blues are kinda loud if you have a significant other that you have to keep in mind of. you can hear clips of the cherry blues in the audio section or a simple youtube search

[chimera15]

Post title indicates only one logical choice and it's a Cherry.

It's CHERRY 2000!!!!

lol  That film was awesome.


I never thought of it before, but a lot of that film really does apply to where we find ourselves with keyboards and peripherals today.  The older ones are quality and the newer ones are all cheap with no romance. lol

[Azuremen]

I myself love Cherry Blue switches. If you ever typed on an older Model M, you will automatically love the sound and feel. I've tried Browns, Black, I have a Model M I still use from time to time. Blues are my favorite. Just something about how crisp they sound.

If you don't mind the "gamer" look, the Razer Blackwidow is an awesome deal for the price it can be found at sometimes. If you want something a bit more subdued and minimal the Rosewill RK-9000 is another solid board. Personally, I love my Filco Tenkeyless because of where it puts the mouse relative to my hand.

[keyboardlover]

Then again, you could also look into the Unicomp keyboards, if you are interested in buckling springs (my preferred switch), or look to snag an Apple Extended Keyboard II from ebay, if you want to try an Alps switch.

Unless you're Ripster's son (who I'm pretty sure if one of the spies who stabbed me in the back in TF2) buckling spring are typically not a good choice for FPS gaming. They have 2-KRO which means that strafing, jumping, ducking etc. could have some snafoos.

[Daniel Beaver]

They have 2-KRO which means that strafing, jumping, ducking etc. could have some snafoos.

Meh, people keep saying that, but I played for years on a Model M without problems.

[keyboardlover]

Maybe you just thought you were playing well...

[YetAnotherDeveloper]

This the first time that i have noticed that the realforce boards have a different switch type. Do most people like these better that the cherry switches?  I have also noticed that most people here tend to not like the gamer keyboards as much, is that becuase they are just not as good or is it more of the gamer look that makes people not like them.

[keyboardlover]

Some prefer cherries, some prefer topre. Personally I prefer topre but red cherries are a close second. Looks are subjective but I personally don't like the looks of "gamer" boards.

[theferenc]

I think it's partially the looks, partially the hype, and partially the unnecessary extras that can just lead to early failure of the keyboard.

At least, those are my reasons. My computer is a tool. It is not a toy. I choose my peripherals with that same belief. Also, glossy just looks SO GROSS after about an hour of typing.

[YetAnotherDeveloper]

yeah i have used a few of razers products and in the past have been really happy with them. i did have a mouse die on me after a year or so and they were nice enough to replace it no questions asked.  But the glossy finish on the blackwidow really does bother me; im not sure i would call it a deal breaker esp when you are talking about a nice Kb for ~80$.

would it be true to say that the topre switches are more like the membrane boards?  I think they look like they would just be a more heavy duty/reinforced membrane than a switch, is this right? is there a review of these switches that you could link me to??

another question if i were to pick up that used realforce and not like it are there plenty of people looking for those that i would be able to sell it without much problem?

[keyboardlover]

Check out the "all things topre" wiki for everything you need to know about these mysterious switches.

[bugfix]

Yes, Topres will feel closer to a rubber dome than the springier Cherry MX or ALPS.

I'm kinda scared of not liking them when I get my Realforce next month :frown:

[keyboardlover]

I bet you'll like them! Why are you worried?

[bugfix]

Because I particularly like the springiness(?) of buckling springs...

[YetAnotherDeveloper]

After reading and thinking about it i think i want to try something a little more along the lines of the blues or the browns, at least for my first one.

so what does one get for 200$ with cherry blues/browns?  I think i want a fullsize board unless someone can talk me out of it.

[keyboardlover]

Currently most people are waiting for EK to restock with Leopolds, which will be available with both switches. They are EK's successor to their previous line of cherry switch board (Filco brand). However I believe you can still order full-size Filcos with browns or blues from PCHome (maybe someone can correct me on this) and also from The Keyboard Company which is in the UK. Not sure if you'd be comfortable with that but the "Worldwide keyboard buying" wiki should have the most up to date info.

And by the way, any Filco with browns or blues should be WELL under $200. Average is usually around $140 I believe. If you do get a full size Filco, make sure you get the NKRO version, for gaming purposes.

[theferenc]

Also, there is a concern (that has maybe been worked out?) that Leopold doesn't make full size keyboards.

So if you want full size, your choices are Filco, Ducky, Deck, Black Widow, or Das, I believe. The last two are both glossy. The Deck can be had in clears though, which are like browns, but light years better.

Edit: the Deck has two versions with clears (they call them tactile): frost and ice. Basically, white or blue backlight, respectively.

[YetAnotherDeveloper]

Also, there is a concern (that has maybe been worked out?) that Leopold doesn't make full size keyboards.

So if you want full size, your choices are Filco, Ducky, Deck, Black Widow, or Das, I believe. The last two are both glossy. The Deck can be had in clears though, which are like browns, but light years better.

Nice thanks for the list!  i'm was just starting to look over what my options were.

[keyboardlover]

The Deck can be had in clears though, which are like browns, but light years better.

That's your opinion. Personally I prefer cherry reds to clears (and the cherry G80-3494 in my sig is another option from PCHome for ~ $180). Not that clears aren't a good switch IMO, I do like them. But I think they may be too heavy for long periods of coding. Although that one guy who came here from StackOverflow liked his so who knows

[bugfix]

If you don't want to wait, the Das is a great keyboard (imho). If you're a student they'll give you a 25$ discount btw.

[theferenc]

Well, sure, but reds are harder to come by (international shipping and all), and this whole thread was asking for opinions.

Besides, the Cherry G80 keyboards never felt particularly well made to me. The Decks have a much nicer heft to them, and don't have that flexing issue the Cherry keyboards exhibit.

[keyboardlover]

That's true, the Decks have better build quality. I just usually try to not sway people one way or another. It's better to let them make up their own minds, otherwise they just get more confused

[theferenc]

That's true, but I felt he was asking for opinions. And I do try to make sure they have as much information as I can give them, which is sometimes overwhelming, I'm told.

Maybe I should do less of that...

[cyberphine]

I don't believe PCHome stock Filco's.  Something about redistribution issues coming from diatec.  (not sure on that one, just read what ripster posted)  That and I just bought a Filco from armygroup.  Still waiting on it though.

Chicken has two archiss's coming in the mail.  He accidentally bought two blue boards, I was going to buy one, but I wanted a brown.

[keyboardlover]

Ok yea thanks for the update on that stuff. Archiss' seem interesting but I don't believe we have enough info on them to be able to recommend them.

[theferenc]

Archiss is Leopold. At least, so says iMav and others.

[keyboardlover]

Ahh ok. I supposed that'd be a good choice then.