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Author Topic: Do Model M have different resistance depending on the key?  (Read 2727 times)

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Offline TacticalCoder

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Do Model M have different resistance depending on the key?
« on: Sat, 12 March 2011, 06:55:52 »
I was pretty sure, years ago, that I had a "map/layout/whatever" picture of the force that had to be applied on the Model M's keys and that the force was slightly different depending on the key (for example keys that you'd hit with your pinky requiring less force).

Did I just dream that? I'm sure there's at least one keyboard that was made like that, which one(s) would it be?

If such keyboards do actually exist, how would that difference be done? By using different springs for different keys? (then I take it you have to be careful not to mix up your springs when you work inside the board)
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HHKB Pro JP (daily driver) -- HHKB Pro 2 -- Industrial IBM Model M 1395240-- NIB Cherry MX 5000 - IBM Model M 1391412 (Swiss QWERTZ) -- IBM Model M 1391403 (German QWERTZ) * 2 -- IBM Model M Ambra -- Black IBM Model M M13 -- IBM Model M 1391401 -- IBM Model M 139? ? ? *2 -- Dell AT102W -- Ergo (split) SmartBoard (white ALPS apparently)

Offline Surly73

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Do Model M have different resistance depending on the key?
« Reply #1 on: Sat, 12 March 2011, 07:17:08 »
I haven't seen that data, nor have I observed different force with my model Ms (1397599 and 1392595) but I'm watching with interest.  I've also never seen any indication in bolt modding instructions (or similar) to be careful to put springs back in specific locations, for example.
« Last Edit: Sat, 12 March 2011, 07:24:53 by Surly73 »
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Offline ch_123

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Do Model M have different resistance depending on the key?
« Reply #2 on: Sat, 12 March 2011, 07:37:42 »
This is not the case. All the springs in a given buckling spring keyboard are the same.
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Offline TacticalCoder

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Do Model M have different resistance depending on the key?
« Reply #3 on: Sat, 12 March 2011, 07:50:52 »
OK but then I'm nearly sure I found such a map/layout so it had to exist for at least one keyboard...  I'll try to find that picture back on a old harddrive : )
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HHKB Pro JP (daily driver) -- HHKB Pro 2 -- Industrial IBM Model M 1395240-- NIB Cherry MX 5000 - IBM Model M 1391412 (Swiss QWERTZ) -- IBM Model M 1391403 (German QWERTZ) * 2 -- IBM Model M Ambra -- Black IBM Model M M13 -- IBM Model M 1391401 -- IBM Model M 139? ? ? *2 -- Dell AT102W -- Ergo (split) SmartBoard (white ALPS apparently)

Offline TacticalCoder

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Do Model M have different resistance depending on the key?
« Reply #4 on: Sat, 12 March 2011, 08:58:29 »
OK, so I wasn't seeing things... Keyboards that do have varying keystroke force do indeed exist.  I googled a lot and eventually found one such keyboard (I didn't check if it was a mechanical switch or not).

Here's part of the text:

Code: [Select]
... keyboard that has three different built-in keystroke forces, 70 grams, 60 grams and 50 grams allowing professional gamers to intuitionally make accurate commands with these different keystroke forces.

The Gigabyte Aivia K8100 Gaming Keyboard also features mainstream gaming control buttons such as WASD, Ctrl, Space and arrow keys, which are most commonly used gaming keys are assigned 70g weight for elastic force.

The other keys commonly pressed by the little finger such as Tab, Caps-Lock and Shift buttons are assigned 50 grams to reduce pressure on the finger.

Now I'm 100% sure I remember seeing a mechanical keyboard's "pressure map" that showed which key had how many "gram".

I don't remember which keyboard it was but it makes a lot of sense: my pinky's would be happier if the keys I'm hitting with them were a little bit lighter than the other ones (I love my Model M, but I'd still like the keys to be easier on my pinkys).

If I bolt mod one of my M, can I someone do a mod that would make a few keys lighter?
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HHKB Pro JP (daily driver) -- HHKB Pro 2 -- Industrial IBM Model M 1395240-- NIB Cherry MX 5000 - IBM Model M 1391412 (Swiss QWERTZ) -- IBM Model M 1391403 (German QWERTZ) * 2 -- IBM Model M Ambra -- Black IBM Model M M13 -- IBM Model M 1391401 -- IBM Model M 139? ? ? *2 -- Dell AT102W -- Ergo (split) SmartBoard (white ALPS apparently)

Offline didjamatic

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Do Model M have different resistance depending on the key?
« Reply #5 on: Sat, 12 March 2011, 09:36:07 »
Some buckling springs receive more keystrokes than others so a well used board may have some variation but there is not a buckling spring board that had "variable resistance".  The spacebars on some were heavier (Model F AT spacebar for instance)
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Offline TacticalCoder

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Do Model M have different resistance depending on the key?
« Reply #6 on: Sat, 12 March 2011, 10:04:05 »
Very interesting, thanks all.

I googled a bit more and the keyboard above indeed ain't a bucklink-spring one.

But, well, keyboards with different pressure do exist (sadly no mechanical ones apparently), my memory wasn't completely playing tricks on me : )
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HHKB Pro JP (daily driver) -- HHKB Pro 2 -- Industrial IBM Model M 1395240-- NIB Cherry MX 5000 - IBM Model M 1391412 (Swiss QWERTZ) -- IBM Model M 1391403 (German QWERTZ) * 2 -- IBM Model M Ambra -- Black IBM Model M M13 -- IBM Model M 1391401 -- IBM Model M 139? ? ? *2 -- Dell AT102W -- Ergo (split) SmartBoard (white ALPS apparently)

Offline ch_123

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Do Model M have different resistance depending on the key?
« Reply #7 on: Sat, 12 March 2011, 10:30:05 »
Quote from: didjamatic;310387
Some buckling springs receive more keystrokes than others so a well used board may have some variation but there is not a buckling spring board that had "variable resistance".  The spacebars on some were heavier (Model F AT spacebar for instance)


It's important to note here that this is due to the design of the stabilizer bar, and not of the spring used.
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Offline Surly73

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Do Model M have different resistance depending on the key?
« Reply #8 on: Sat, 12 March 2011, 10:53:51 »
Quote from: TacticalCoder;310377
OK, so I wasn't seeing things... Keyboards that do have varying keystroke force do indeed exist.  I googled a lot and eventually found one such keyboard (I didn't check if it was a mechanical switch or not).



OK, you didn't say "any keyboard", you said "model M".  There most certainly are variable force boards out there.  Keytronic 360x models in the last decade have an "ergo" designation which is variable force.

http://geekhack.org/showthread.php?t=9997

Topre Realforce is one of the better known high end boards with variable force.

http://geekhack.org/showwiki.php?title=Topre+Realforce+Reference+-+all+things+topre
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Offline kill will

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Do Model M have different resistance depending on the key?
« Reply #9 on: Sat, 12 March 2011, 11:01:30 »
my 8/7 1987 ssk has a lot of different pitches for every key.  sometimes i wish i could tune it like a steel drum player.
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