Is Filco still the best TenKeyLess for the price?

[viodea]

I'm using a Filco TenKeyLess Brown.  For the most part, I love it.  There are a few complains though.
I've been using it for almost 2 years at work (5 days a week, at least 8 hours a day).
Typing is still a blast.  However, the little bump on the "F" key is wearing out.  It's almost gone flat.  Is this a common thing or just my typing style?

I'm thinking about getting another TenKeyLess keyboard for use at home.  Filco brown is not easy to get in the US.  I'm wondering how the alternatives (Ducky & Leopold) stack up against Filco.  I've read people complain about the Cherry stabilizer.  Is it only an issue on the early Leopold batch?

[woody]

However, the little bump on the "F" key is wearing out.  It's almost gone flat.  Is this a common thing or just my typing style?

It's mostly your skin combined with your typing style.

It's better to wear out your keyboard, that the keyboard to wear out you.

[viodea]

Is it possible to buy that single "F" replacement key cap?

[jinrawke]

From what I've been reading it goes like this :

1) Filco - slightly more expensive at 139 (no tax free ship on amazon), good quality
2) Leopold - 109 (+ tax + ship) slightly below the filco in terms of quality.  The biggest issue (or non issue) is that the large keys have a different stabilizer causing them to feel different from the regular keys.  This may or may not be an issue with you.
3) Ducky - from what I've been seeing - just say no

The Filcos will be back on Amazon soonish and looks like many of us are going to take another wallet hit

Bruce's post

[MrSneis]

Sure is!  The group buy forum is great for replacement keycaps,  dont ask me how they work though.

[viodea]

From what I've been reading it goes like this :
2) Leopold - 109 (+ tax + ship) slightly below the filco in terms of quality.  The biggest issue (or non issue) is that the large keys have a different stabilizer causing them to feel different from the regular keys.  This may or may not be an issue with you.

The Filcos will be back on Amazon soonish and looks like many of us are going to take another wallet hit

For those complains about the stabilizer, I recall most of them if not all are Cherry blue.  I wonder if the difference for brown is as much.  I like the Loepold OtaKu look but I would get a Filco if I can get it in the US just because I know what to expect from it.

[viodea]

Sure is!  The group buy forum is great for replacement keycaps,  dont ask me how they work though.

I know I can get a set but I only need one.  I don't want to spend $30 - $50 for me to find the home key

[viodea]

Filco price is not bad if I can get it from amazon with free shipping.  Too bad they don't cherry brown in stock at the moment.
I know people are going to Hong Kong, is there any good option I can find in Hong Kong?  I may get from there instead.

[jinrawke]

For those complains about the stabilizer, I recall most of them if not all are Cherry blue.  I wonder if the difference for brown is as much.  I like the Loepold OtaKu look but I would get a Filco if I can get it in the US just because I know what to expect from it.

I actually had a Leo brown and sold it off for a filco red... once the Amazon Filco stock hits, i may have to pick up a brown, a blue (just to try) , and a backup red and then maybe a realforce 87u once they become available.

[poco]

In the USA for the price the Leopold is hard to beat.

Somebody look at their Leopold USB cable.  OCN for some reason thinks it's USB Mini A but that would be crazy.

A on left, B on Right

Show Image

My Leopold is USB B.

[jinrawke]

Filco price is not bad if I can get it from amazon with free shipping.  Too bad they don't cherry brown in stock at the moment.
I know people are going to Hong Kong, is there any good option I can find in Hong Kong?  I may get from there instead.

Do you need one immediately?  If so, I would get a Leo brown and try it out for a week or two until the Filcos on amazon get in stock.  At that point you can either keep it or sell it off here and buy the Filco.

[pitashen]

- Filco is still pretty good for the price, as far as within US is concerned.
- Leopol is a good Filco alternative if you want to save a few bucks and if you don't mind the rounder edge. The stabilizer is more of a personal preference thing. I prefer the Cherry style for the ease of pulling off and installing the keycap, meaning it makes ur life easier if you are to clean up the keyboard. So i think a little sacrefice on the typing feel is worth the overall convenience.
- Ducky 1087 is also not bad considering the price point, but if you got the budget, it should not be your first choice. The 1000 series is their entry level line, meaning cheapened build design.

[viodea]

I don't really need it now.  I just want to get the right one.
jinrawke - can you tell me why you sold the Leo brown?

[MissileMike]

The 1087 has improved.  I just got one and it has no build quality issues at all, and the stabilizer on my space bar feels identical to my filco.  I wouldn't hesitate to get another.

[heedpantsnow]

Just my $.02:
I own a Filco, played with a Ducky, used to own a No Poo, used to own a PLU.  If you know anyone going to China then I think the PLU tenkeyless is by far the best value.  If you must buy in the US, then Filco is probably the way to go.  I know nothing about Leos though.

[viodea]

Just my $.02:
I own a Filco, played with a Ducky, used to own a No Poo, used to own a PLU.  If you know anyone going to China then I think the PLU tenkeyless is by far the best value.  If you must buy in the US, then Filco is probably the way to go.  I know nothing about Leos though.

How is the quality of PLU compare to Filco?

[canon.tk]

Never thought I'd say this, but I'd get a Leopold over a Filco if you're getting a brown.  I actually like the way my Leopold feels over my Filco with browns.  The keys feel a little nicer, maybe because it's otaku, and the switches feel a little smoother.  The later part doesn't make sense to me, since they are both cherry browns.  For $30, not sure if a Filco is worth it over the Leopold.

I use the otaku at work and it causes problems when other people need to use my workstation.  So I ordered a normal Leopold with browns, and I'll swap them out quickly when I need to (take advantage of the USB cable).  Plus you can never have too many keyboards.  I'll have 3 at work after this.  

The stabilizers aren't as nice as the ones on the Filco but I don't think you'll notice if you've never used a Filco before.

[viodea]

Depends on how much you like NKRO versus 2KRO.

I'm not using it for gaming.  Mainly programming and typing stuff.  So, NKRO is not really that important to me at all.

[viodea]

Never thought I'd say this, but I'd get a Leopold over a Filco if you're getting a brown.  I actually like the way my Leopold feels over my Filco with browns.  The keys feel a little nicer, maybe because it's otaku, and the switches feel a little smoother.  The later part doesn't make sense to me, since they are both cherry browns.  For $30, not sure if a Filco is worth it over the Leopold.

I use the otaku at work and it causes problems when other people need to use my workstation.  So I ordered a normal Leopold with browns, and I'll swap them out quickly when I need to (take advantage of the USB cable).  Plus you can never have too many keyboards.  I'll have 3 at work after this.  

The stabilizers aren't as nice as the ones on the Filco but I don't think you'll notice if you've never used a Filco before.

Thanks for your insight.  I'm still torn.  Does you Leopold ever squeak?  That's my major concern.

[MissileMike]

Thanks for your insight.  I'm still torn.  Does you Leopold ever squeak?  That's my major concern.

There were reports of it.  Mine doesn't squeak at all.

[jinrawke]

I don't really need it now.  I just want to get the right one.
jinrawke - can you tell me why you sold the Leo brown?

 
I just wasn't a fan of the stabilizers and was willing to spend the extra on the Filco.  FYI - I live in Cali and the total cost of my Leo with shipping and tax was around ~120 (at the preorder price of 99).  I'm not sure how much people out of state paid.

[heedpantsnow]

How is the quality of PLU compare to Filco?

I felt like the quality of PLU was 85-95% of Filco.  But so much cheaper if you can get it from China without import/broker fees.

Depends on how much you like NKRO versus 2KRO.

Not everyone is a 1337 g4m3r like you! :happy:  And I'm sure someone of your stature & experience knows that Filco's aren't ALL NKRO either.  They just charge like 40% more for it.
 

I'm not using it for gaming.  Mainly programming and typing stuff.  So, NKRO is not really that important to me at all.

I don't either.  Neither my Filco nor my PLU have/had NKRO, and I never ran into problems.  I use a lot of custom Ctrl+Alt+whatever shortcuts and those all worked fine.

[The Solutor]

None of my 5 Filcos ever squeaked.

Good Quality or Good Karma?

You decide.

 
It depends from what one wants from a keyboard.

If it will be considered a fetishistic object every little detail counts.

If one wants just a good keyboard almost any mech keyboard is good enough.

[canon.tk]

Thanks for your insight.  I'm still torn.  Does you Leopold ever squeak?  That's my major concern.

Nope.  I was the same as you worried about getting one because of the squeaking and mine doesn't do it.

[viodea]

I'm more of a practical mechanical keyboard user.  I just don't want to spend over a hundred bucks for a squeak keyboard.

For me here are pros for each of them
Leopold - blank keys and "hopefully" better quality key caps.
Filco - better stabilizer. I'm using it, so I know what to expect.
Ducky - cheap.

Cons:
Leopold - squeaky stabilizer issue.
Filco - less than desire key cap quality. shinny, letters and bump worn off after 2 years of use.
Ducky - lesser build quality and QA.

[Gfresh404]

Just got my Filco Brown today and the keyboard actually squeaks!

Must be bad karma

I've heard that this can be fixed with a little WD-40. Maybe a dumb question but how exactly would I go about applying the WD-40?? I'm also a little hesitant to completely remove a key (it's only the spacebar) that big.. aren't you generally not supposed remove the larger keycaps because they're rather difficult to put back on? Thanks in advance.

[MissileMike]

I'm more of a practical mechanical keyboard user.  I just don't want to spend over a hundred bucks for a squeak keyboard.

For me here are pros for each of them
Leopold - blank keys and "hopefully" better quality key caps.
Filco - better stabilizer. I'm using it, so I know what to expect.
Ducky - cheap.

Cons:
Leopold - squeaky stabilizer issue.
Filco - less than desire key cap quality. shinny, letters and bump worn off after 2 years of use.
Ducky - lesser build quality and QA.

I would add "non detachable cord" to the list of filco cons.

[Gfresh404]

See this Cherry Key Pulling and Lubrication guide.

Our Wiki format is a bit of a mess right now because I give this link out at least once a day between Geekhack, OCN, and KBDthority.

But the new forum pic attachment HTML is nice.
(Attachment Link) 17729[/ATTACH]

Appreciate it

rofl @ the pic

EDIT: squeaking seemed to go away on its on

[canon.tk]

I would add nifty velcro cord wrapper to the plusses.  It picks up lots of lint though.  I've learned to adjust unlike some HHKB users with wobbly keys.

Both brands have the Velcro wrap on the cord.

[MissileMike]

I would add nifty velcro cord wrapper to the plusses.  It picks up lots of lint though.  I've learned to adjust unlike some HHKB users with wobbly keys.

Ohh, add that to the plusses for ducky too, along with 2 red esc keys, lavender wasd, and a carrying pouch.  You get lots of goodies for your 85$, everything except a better keyboard  (tho it's still good)

[canon.tk]

The Leopold one is burple with bronze lettering.

[alaricljs]

I wish the Limited Edition R came in Red.  It would make it more Limited Edition.

Sounds like it would just make it more R, not so much more Limited.

[viodea]

I would add "non detachable cord" to the list of filco cons.

To be honest, I really don't know what the big deal is regarding to the detachable cord.  I don't have multiple keyboard and I'm not moving my keyboard around either.  Once it's attached, it stays.

[woody]

Filco with detachable cable is moot. That weight is not exactly what you'd carry around.

[MissileMike]

I carry my tenless boards in my laptop bag.  My buddy has a ducky 1087 with blues that he uses at starbucks.  He gets stares for sure

[viodea]

Actually, only F, J is still fine.

[wanabe]

you must type a lot of F-words

[alaricljs]

The removable cable on a keyboard is for people like me who route their KB cable through a hole in their desk and behind some crap and bundle it up in velcro tie straps.  When you want to clean the keyboard it's easier to take it off the desk without a cable attached to it

[viodea]

you must type a lot of F-words

what can I say.... I work at a high stress environment

[viodea]

The removable cable on a keyboard is for people like me who route their KB cable through a hole in their desk and behind some crap and bundle it up in velcro tie straps.  When you want to clean the keyboard it's easier to take it off the desk without a cable attached to it

i c... I never deep clean my keyboard.  Usually I spray it with compress air then wipe it with wet paper towel.  That's pretty much it.... I guess I'm a abusive owner

[alaricljs]

My compressed air comes attached to a 100+lb hunk of equipment.  It's easier to bring the KB to the air.