How do you define a mechanical keyboard's built quality to be good?

[Snapsniper]

Seems all mechanical keyboards are using mostly the same brand of switches
One of the differentiating factors is the built quality of the mechanical keyboard.
How does one define a keyboard to be of good "built quality?"

[pwnrhasta]

Keycaps, stabilizers, the chassis of the keyboard, and the features it comes with (detachable usb cable). etc etc

[Snapsniper]

Thanks for the welcome, Ripster! Awesome community in this forum too.
About the chassis, what is the a generally more preferred material?
Also, for stabilizers, i noticed there are two types, the dummy key type (Ducky style) or the metal rod type(flico style). Any idea which is the more preferred type?

[TacticalCoder]

How does one define a keyboard to be of good "built quality?"

When after 20 years of daily use it's good to go for another 20 years of daily use? (ok, ok, some may need a "bolt mod" but still...)   ; )

[duncan]

Seems all mechanical keyboards are using mostly the same brand of switches

Not true.
= Cherry
= ALP
= Buckling spring

All very different and that's not all the types of switch available let alone all the brands.
That's taking the contended position that Topre are not mechanical boards which is a whole argument of its own.

[Lanx]

what manufacturer or even mainstream manufacturer is using ALPS? only unicomp does BS, so yea it's really all cherry.

[itlnstln]

My criteria:

-Does it work as advertised or better?
-Are the case materials of good quality and fit (no gaps on seams, cracks, etc.)?
-Are the caps of good quality and legends are applied in a quality manner?
-Do the feet prevent sliding?
(There are probably others that I am forgetting about.)

I do not typically include styling preferences in quality assessments as that's more subjective (an ugly keyboards can be of good quality and vice versa).

[Findecanor]

what manufacturer or even mainstream manufacturer is using ALPS? only unicomp does BS, so yea it's really all cherry.

Matias TactilePro, Filco Zero, "Clicker"/"APC" Blue "ALPS" keyboard are all contemporary boards with clicky ALPS-type switches.

[Thinkpad Fan]

Build Quality?  Are you talking just the paint job?  Or what's under the hood?  Simple.  If it's a Model M, you're Good to Go.  IBM/Lexmark/Unicomp - slight differences, but all built to last.  Anything else is just Less.  TPF

[redpill]

There is some subjectivity to the question, as different aspects are more or less important to some than others.  But typically some things to keep in mind:

- Does the case feel solid, does it lay flat on a desk, is it make from amply thick material?  Or does it feel flimsy or easily breakable?  Does it fit together well, or are there uneven gaps and seams?
- Do the key caps feel good?  Do they wear quickly/irregularly?  Do they rattle or do they feel solid?  Do they have particularly noticeable sprue marks from manufacturing?
- Do the larger keys (shift, space, enter, backspace, etc)  feel appropriately stabilized in relation to the regular keys?
- Does the keyboard make appropriate and consistent sounds while typing? (this varies greatly by switch type, but typically typiing should sound similar regardless of what key you hit)  Does it make any sound that seems abnormal?
- Does the keyboard have extra features that seem well implemented? (If it has USB ports or a detachable cable, do the plugs seem solid and not wobbly or easily breakable)
- Do the plastic feet underneath feel easily breakable?  Do they keep the keyboard properly supported?  If they have rubberized feet are they securely attached?
- If backlit, do the LEDs seem fairly consistent in brightness?

I'm sure there are other things to look for as well, but you get the idea.

[itlnstln]

Model F AT weighs more than Model M.  Model F BQ > Model M BQ.

I call this theory of Build Quality "Ripsters RipOmeter Theorem of BQ".

Newton would approve. Deskthority.net would not.

For those that would think otherwise, this is an opinion where Ripster and I disagree. Adding 8 lbs. of lead to a rubber dome does not a better keyboard make. It is, however, interesting how BQ aligns on weight to a certain extent, but to say that a HHKB is of lower quality than a Noppoo if it were to weigh more would be ignorant. (Disclosure: I have not compared the weights of these two, so I do not know if the Noppoo does, in fact, weigh more than the HHKB. It feels like it, but I don't have hard numbers.)

[Lanx]

Matias TactilePro, Filco Zero, "Clicker"/"APC" Blue "ALPS" keyboard are all contemporary boards with clicky ALPS-type switches.

and barely mentioned here every 6 months.

[jedcred]

Excuse this semi-rant, but I consider build quality to be good when you don't have keys start to stick or fail less than a year into use with switches that are supposed to last a very long time.  Today my Filco tenkeyless with Cherry Blues decided to lose the click on the "p" key and have the semicolon key start sticking (no, no sticky liquids or food got in there).  Short trip to Radioshack for a soldering iron, a swap with the Scroll Lock and Pause keys, and 15 minutes of work fixed this issue, but I thought it was a silly thing to have to do considering how short a time (relatively) I've been using the board, though on a daily basis.  Comparatively, my Model M from '93 still works fine, and I had hoped that the Cherry Blues would see the same kind of service. Guess I should stock up on some extra Cherry Blue switches...

[theferenc]

While longevity and build quality aren't exactly the same thing, they do tend to be related. But as others have mentioned, qualities to look for:

-Fit and finish: are the pieces that make up the keyboard put together well? Do they all fit properly? Think Mercedes S class interior compared to comparable age Ford Focus interior. There's nothing particularly WRONG with the interior of the Focus, but it's undeniable that the Mercedes looks and feels nicer, even if the materials are the "same" (plastic, leather, chrome, whatever).

-Feature robustness: if the keyboard has extra features, are they implemented in a robust, well thought out manner? As redpill said, consistency is important here.

There are many other factors, but I think those two are the most important. If the feature set is robustly implemented, and the fit and finish are of high quality, it clearly indicates a higher level of attention to detail, and by proxy, quality.

Then again, you have Model Ms and Model Fs still kicking around, nearly 30 years after they were introduced. Fully functional, if a little worn and dirty in some cases. Admittedly, sometimes work is necessary in order to restore them to full functionality, but I would make the argument that whether that work can be done at all is an indication of quality. High quality goods can be repaired, rather than requiring replacement when they have issues.

[dorkvader]

Knowing that metal is usually more dense than plastic, compare the weight:size ratio to other boards you know.

More metal means more build quality!

[Lanx]

Excuse this semi-rant, but I consider build quality to be good when you don't have keys start to stick or fail less than a year into use with switches that are supposed to last a very long time.  Today my Filco tenkeyless with Cherry Blues decided to lose the click on the "p" key and have the semicolon key start sticking (no, no sticky liquids or food got in there).  Short trip to Radioshack for a soldering iron, a swap with the Scroll Lock and Pause keys, and 15 minutes of work fixed this issue, but I thought it was a silly thing to have to do considering how short a time (relatively) I've been using the board, though on a daily basis.  Comparatively, my Model M from '93 still works fine, and I had hoped that the Cherry Blues would see the same kind of service. Guess I should stock up on some extra Cherry Blue switches...

the thing about BS is that it is relatively super genius simple, just one long @$$ spring and bam it works, while with a cherry switch we have a stem rubbing up against a casing then we have the stem hitting a leaf that is hitting another leaf.

[dorkvader]

There is some subjectivity to the question, as different aspects are more or less important to some than others.  But typically some things to keep in mind:

- Do the plastic feet underneath feel easily breakable?  Do they keep the keyboard properly supported?  If they have rubberized feet are they securely attached?
- If backlit, do the LEDs seem fairly consistent in brightness?

I'm sure there are other things to look for as well, but you get the idea.

I can address these two, with my WASD in mind.
1. I don't use them, but one of my feet rubs or something, and is a lot harder to snap into place. The other snaps nicely into and out of it's locked position.

2. They all seem the same brightness, but it's hard to tell, as I often use it as a lamp for the room. They're really bright. I'll probably put in some diffused ones later (or some resistors). Right now I keep an old ID card on top of it.

--
Clearly metal > plastic so higher density correlates to better build quality.

This does not apply to Magnesium cases, of course.

[Deverica Wolf]

I just base it on the quality of the base, the quality of the keycaps, and the quality of the clicks.

My Unicomp feels cheap compared to my Deck. After trying a Filco, the Deck is still the best made keyboard I own. It is like a tank and the keycaps are just wonderful.

[litster]

Excuse this semi-rant, but I consider build quality to be good when you don't have keys start to stick or fail less than a year into use with switches that are supposed to last a very long time.  Today my Filco tenkeyless with Cherry Blues decided to lose the click on the "p" key and have the semicolon key start sticking (no, no sticky liquids or food got in there).  Short trip to Radioshack for a soldering iron, a swap with the Scroll Lock and Pause keys, and 15 minutes of work fixed this issue, but I thought it was a silly thing to have to do considering how short a time (relatively) I've been using the board, though on a daily basis.  Comparatively, my Model M from '93 still works fine, and I had hoped that the Cherry Blues would see the same kind of service. Guess I should stock up on some extra Cherry Blue switches...

You went through all the trouble to open your Filco and de-soldered the bad switches for swap, you could have fixed the bad switches by opening them up for a good cleaningand you would have a keyboard-full of good switches, not just swapping them to the less-used locations.

[litster]

If we measure BQ with drop test, IBM Model Ms would win, hands down. But then, other keyboards don't have broken rivets.  Then again, you can fix them with bolt mod.  Also, IMO IBM and Realforce's PBT dye sub keycaps are better quality than Filco and other modern keyboards that are available today.  Are there any non-Cherry brand keyboards being sold today with double shots?

[theferenc]

If you can't bludgeon a zombie to death with it, then immediately use it to blog about the experience, it isn't well built enough. Would anything other than an IBM pass this test? Just think of a Model F terminal, or even an older Model M terminal. 10 pounds of plastic and steel, nearly 2 feet long...that's a lot of leverage behind that bad boy.

[nhwhaup]

In my opinion, build quality is exactly that - quality of the build. Fit and finish. for example fit of the seams, consistency of the plastic case, etc. It is what the fussy customer would would not accept.  Before my career in HR, I worked as an inspector for auto parts. Now you would think that the quality for a seal in your vehicle would strictly be related to function as the end customer doesn't see the seal but just expects it to work correctly functionally.  However, customers would reject parts based on if the color of the case was not consistent. This had nothing to do with how well the part would function.  

I am an extremely fussy consumer and won't purchase a product with shoddy build quality. Perhaps it's my inspector eye that won't let me be happy with any issues that I can see, even if they don't affect the functionality.  The other piece to this is that if the visual quality is lacking then most likely the overall quality would also be poor.

[jedcred]

You went through all the trouble to open your Filco and de-soldered the bad switches for swap, you could have fixed the bad switches by opening them up for a good cleaningand you would have a keyboard-full of good switches, not just swapping them to the less-used locations.

I did do that initially. The 'p' key's click issue seemed to come from the fact that the metal leaves had come apart slightly and bending them towards each other fixed that issue somewhat, but the click wasn't as crisp as the other keys, so I decided to do the swap.  As for the sticky key, I couldn't find a good reason for the stickyness besides a defect that I couldn't find somewhere in the plastic parts; there was no material caught in there, especially after a good alcohol cleaning.  It happened once every 10 or so presses.  I suppose some lubricant might have been the answer there, but I didn't have any on me.  

And when you say "all the trouble," I used to fix things like this pretty often, and soldering is a actually a bit of fun for me.  My primary annoyance was that I was trying to get work done on a Saturday (bleh) and I had to get an iron because my other one was 100 miles away.  Also, as a vi user, having your semicolon key stick every now and again (as you prefix commands with a colon in vi) is pretty darn annoying.

[Snapsniper]

hi all, these are awesome information. thanks all!
Do you guys prefer Flico styled space bar metal rod stablizers



or

Ducky's style dummy switches space bar stabilizers?

[Findecanor]

The "Ducky Style" is what Cherry's own keyboard use. I believe it to be more durable. The other style has broken for me. Keys that are stabilized with the Cherry/Ducky stabilizers are soft when you bottom out -- which is different from non-stabilized keys. Not so with the Filco-style stabilizers, and there are members who prefer that style for that reason.
However, you won't feel any difference if you mod the keys to be soft when you bottom out, with O-rings or orthodontic bands on the key stems.

[itlnstln]

I prefer the Filco-style but not so much that I would avoid a keyboard with Cherry-style stabilizers.  My Duckys feel fine.  I have heard the Leopolds might feel a little mushy or something, but I don't own one, so I don't know if they are truly worse or it's just over-hyped whining.

[SmallFry]

To me, more metal the merrier. See sig, my Zenith actually is comparable in weight to my model M. Metal is good stuff, hence why they should make the modding capability of pcb mounted cherries and the stability of plate mounted.

[nhwhaup]

To me, more metal the merrier. See sig, my Zenith actually is comparable in weight to my model M. Metal is good stuff, hence why they should make the modding capability of pcb mounted cherries and the stability of plate mounted.

For me I love the lighter weight keyboards and the Poker with the PCB mounted reds is my favorite over my Filco and even maybe my silent TKL Realforce which is as solid as they come. I love the sound of the keys on the PCB.

[pitashen]

For keyboards, gernally the build quality is more associated with the sturdiness of the materials used for the enclosure as well as the keycaps. Meaning usually thicker plastics (like those vintage keyboards) would give you a sense of better build quality.

If you want to get into more details, then you might look into things such as the soldering quality of the PCB, the printing method used on the keycap and some of other stuff mentioned above. You get the idea.

[spolia optima]

I replace my keyboard when the switches get worn out, so IMHO they don't need to be so heavy-duty.

[Lanx]

from this link
http://www.pcpop.com/doc/0/710/710515_all.shtml
linked from here, i conclude that "heavy" keyboards which is really just plate mounted keyboards, are nothing more than an easy way in which they can assemble cherry keyboards. They use the plate mounted holes to sit and line up cherry switches easily so that they can mass soldered.
So in conclusion, plate mounted keyboards are just a byproduct of making cherry keyboards faster.

[jpc]

The Kinesis Contoured boards are an exception to the weight theorem.

They're light weight. You can put a lot of miles on them with no deterioration. They don't flex or chatter while you type on them. There are no stabilizer issues, none of the keys have or need stabilizers.

Best board in the world

[theferenc]

The Kinesis Contoured boards are an exception to the weight theorem.

They're light weight. You can put a lot of miles on them with no deterioration. They don't flex or chatter while you type on them. There are no stabilizer issues, none of the keys have or need stabilizers.

Best board in the world

You, sir, must hereby relinquish that UNIX Beard immediately. The best keyboard in the world would obviously be the HHKB, the true UNIX Beard's keyboard of choice*.



*Unless of course they have an RSI issue, in which case the beard can be kept with another keyboard, though must be trimmed and maintained, rather than allowed to grow on its own.

[jpc]

You may be onto something: could poorly trimmed facial hair be causing RSI?

There's correlation in certain circles...

[jpc]

On the actual topic. Input devices are tools, a good one lets you be productive without incurring much wear and tear on your body.

If the build quality is good enough to support that, then it's good enough. And if an input device is uncomfortable or inefficient, build quality cannot redeem it.

[Lanx]

You, sir, must hereby relinquish that UNIX Beard immediately. The best keyboard in the world would obviously be the HHKB, the true UNIX Beard's keyboard of choice*.

gimme a quick lesson why the hhkb is great for unix? i haven't used unix since college years of 01 and never plan to if i have to i don't even remember a single command, i do however still remember basic and dos commands however...

[theferenc]

Well, I was partially joking. But the HHKB is based on the Sun Type 3, which was specifically designed for UNIX text processing. As such, the layout is more optimized for emacs and vi use.

[spolia optima]

On the actual topic. Input devices are tools, a good one lets you be productive without incurring much wear and tear on your body.

If the build quality is good enough to support that, then it's good enough. And if an input device is uncomfortable or inefficient, build quality cannot redeem it.

well put