Author Topic: got these from ebay (uk )  (Read 1648 times)

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Offline collector of junk

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got these from ebay (uk )
« on: Tue, 25 October 2011, 15:47:59 »
I’ve got these two model m from ebay (sorry cannot post url's)


IBM Vintage Clicky Keyboard
1390886
1988-03-17
 and

This keyboard was connected to
IBM 3151 terminal
Terminal is: 93/02 Type 3151-035
SN 55-GRTG4





and was wondering how easy (hard) it will be to get them working on pc (running windows 7 64 bit)

I don’t really have any electronics or programming skills so go easy on me !!!
Built my own pc and modded the case and done other basic modds


I’m quite good with a soldering iron so changing a lead to ps/2 would be easy (but think there’s going to be more to it than that !!!!)
 
Would it be possible to change the keyboard controller boards from the ibm’s  for one’s from old keyboards that work on pc .I know the ribbons may not be laid out the same . but then use a key mapper to make any changes ?

Thanks for any help

Offline fohat.digs

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got these from ebay (uk )
« Reply #1 on: Tue, 25 October 2011, 16:57:11 »
"THE MAN" otherwise known as "Soarer" has figured this all out and done your homework for you.

View his wonderful instructions at:

XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
"It's 110, but it doesn't feel it to me, right. If anybody goes down. Everybody was so worried yesterday about you and they never mentioned me. I'm up here sweating like a dog. They don’t think about me. This is hard work.
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Offline dfj

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Fave Switch manus: IBM, Topre, Matias, ...

Offline dfj

  • Posts: 171
  • Location: Canada
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got these from ebay (uk )
« Reply #3 on: Fri, 28 October 2011, 12:51:08 »
So - these two keyboards are Model M, so buckling spring over membrane, hence, not nkro regardless of converter used.

  The 102 might well work as is with a mere cable-swap to PS/2. The 122 can be made to largely work with windows or linux via a cable-swap and messing with your XP drivers, but it's not fun, and at least one key simply cannot be remapped and will always generate an error (where home is normally on the cursor pad, if I remember correctly - more details are available on the other threads here) and hence we sometimes call it the 'beep key'. :)
  A Teensy can be used to make a converter (as opposed to a whole new controller) from the variant protocol that the 122 uses, to USB. This ends up working much like the cheap PS/2 to USB converters that one can purchase, except it supports the 122 (and other PS/2, AT and PC/XT keyboards if you use Soarer's firmware, which I recommend as mine just supports 122, and is poorly maintained at present.) I might get key-mapping working before Christmas, and I might not - but Soarer is very close to the same, now so will surely have that feature working first.

So: I suggest a quick conversion to PS/2 for the 102 key, confirm that it 'just works', then worry about the 122. If the this doesn't work (and you confirm you got the pinout correct) then check for jumpers on the IBM PCB - might have one to default to AT-protocol (the PS/2 protocol is the same as the AT protocol, just the connector changed), otherwise it might be stuck using the same protocol as the 122...

Poke around on this site a bit more for info on the 102, I don't think I have one, so I'm largely guessing on that front. I very much suggest building a converter to USB for the 122, however, as the patches required to get it working under windows and linux are a right PITA, and you can kiss mac support goodbye. The USB conversion is transparent, the keyboard will now work with almost any device that accepts a USB keyboard, laptops, macs, lucky PS3 consoles... :)

g'luck!
dfj
Fave Switch manus: IBM, Topre, Matias, ...

Offline collector of junk

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got these from ebay (uk )
« Reply #4 on: Sat, 29 October 2011, 12:36:45 »
well update so far for the 102 keyboard

no jumpers to change on the keyboard controller board so just hacked the cable mod (whats the spare cable ribbon socket with a metal shim in it for ????)(j3)

plugged into pc (running windows xp) booted up ok and nothing worked on keyboard !unplugged and plugged back in ps2 lead and keyboard works (sort of )some keys wrong or dont do anything but can get round that with key mapper

so my main question is how do i get round the unplugging and plugging back in of the keyboard

Would it be possible to change the keyboard controller boards from terminal keyboards for one’s from old keyboards that work on pc .I know the ribbons may not be laid out the same . but then use a key mapper to make any changes ?

Offline dfj

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got these from ebay (uk )
« Reply #5 on: Sat, 29 October 2011, 13:24:16 »
so - sounds like it is using the same protocol as the 122, then - so, a couple've options:
  For the 102, if you had a dead IBM 101, it you could swap the controller, and it would likely work - as the membrane might well be laid out the same.
 For the 122, I'd go with a teensy-based converter to USB. The converter will also work for the 102, likely.

 The driver patch is possible here - but it's a pain. It would work for both the 102 and 122 as well I expect, though.
these two links kinda go over it in some detail, but ... pain:
http://geekhack.org/showwiki.php?title=Island:8046
http://geekhack.org/showwiki.php?title=Island:7306

I suggest you follow the advice given and do a teensy build. If you are handy with an iron, then the cabling and a hunk of perfboard will present no problem. Works fine from a breadboard too. This has the additional advantage that you get LEDs, should you desire locklights. :)

cheers,
dfj
Fave Switch manus: IBM, Topre, Matias, ...