Author Topic: Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses  (Read 17193 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline aogail

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 6
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« on: Fri, 16 December 2011, 13:55:06 »
In the day or so I have been using my TE keyboard (104 with blues), I have noticed one functional issue. The right arrow key does not register about a third of the time. In rarer cases, it will register twice for one press. I have sent a message to TE about it, but no response yet -- it'll be a while if history is any indication ;)

Has anyone else encountered any functional issues with their TE keyboard?

Offline Gerk

  • Posts: 816
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #1 on: Fri, 16 December 2011, 14:19:20 »
Nothing here so far in that regard.  But ... I have the model 109 and 3 out of 4 of the blank keys and the left space bar (when selecting to split the space bars) don't register any keycodes when pressing them in OSX.  Might be PEBKAC at this point, not sure.  I will wait a bit for things to settle with the TE folks and email them with some questions ... but for now I'm not seeing the issues you're having, all keys (that I get keycodes for) are working perfectly here.
Rosewill RK-9000RE (reds) | Das Keyboard Model S Professional Silent (browns) | Leopold TKL (browns) | F21-7D "Mechanical Keyboard" (Blue Alps) | Filco Majestouch TKL (blues) | Goldtouch V2 x 2 | Matias Ergo Pro

Offline Draconian

  • Posts: 15
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #2 on: Fri, 16 December 2011, 15:29:15 »
I think I'm getting some doubled-keypresses too. I've certainly noticed several repeated "t" characters, but when try to reproduce the sequence it registers correctly. I guess this is one of the risks in bleeding-edge technology?

Offline boli

  • Posts: 350
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #3 on: Sat, 17 December 2011, 05:20:27 »
So far I've not experienced any missed or double characters (105 brown here). Same issue with left spacebar (when mapped to "alternate") as Gerk, but I guess that's more of an OS X issue.
Keyboard: Kinesis Ergo Advantage (two LF editions with red Cherry switches, one regular with brown switches)
Keyboard layout: basically Colemak, with some remapping to end up with my custom Kinesis Advantage layout
Typing test profiles: typeracer.com / hi-games.net / keybr.com

Offline Gerk

  • Posts: 816
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #4 on: Sat, 17 December 2011, 12:15:05 »
Quote from: boli;472689
So far I've not experienced any missed or double characters (105 brown here). Same issue with left spacebar (when mapped to "alternate") as Gerk, but I guess that's more of an OS X issue.

Yep I think it is something specific to OSX as a Linux user reported that they are getting keycodes from the left space bar when it's set to alternate.
Rosewill RK-9000RE (reds) | Das Keyboard Model S Professional Silent (browns) | Leopold TKL (browns) | F21-7D "Mechanical Keyboard" (Blue Alps) | Filco Majestouch TKL (blues) | Goldtouch V2 x 2 | Matias Ergo Pro

Offline Architect

  • Posts: 250
  • TECK Lover
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #5 on: Tue, 20 December 2011, 07:35:56 »
Haven't seen that. I did another thread about a wake from sleep issue I'm having.

Otherwise ... I just found out that on the 109 the extra keys apparently aren't sending any key events when pressed? I'm using KeyDump and pressing the keys on the lower right and left hand of the keyboard don't register anything. Firmware probably, but if true how did they expect this to be used? The pain continues ...
TECK 209 Blank Keys; Leopold Number Pad; X-Keys Professional; X-Keys 84.

Offline boli

  • Posts: 350
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #6 on: Tue, 20 December 2011, 08:13:52 »
Quote from: Architect;474327
I just found out that on the 109 the extra keys apparently aren't sending any key events when pressed? I'm using KeyDump and pressing the keys on the lower right and left hand of the keyboard don't register anything. Firmware probably, but if true how did they expect this to be used?

Most likely a stupid question, but my 105's DIP switch was set to 104 mode, rather than 105/109 mode. Did you make sure the setting fits your model or set it accordingly?
Keyboard: Kinesis Ergo Advantage (two LF editions with red Cherry switches, one regular with brown switches)
Keyboard layout: basically Colemak, with some remapping to end up with my custom Kinesis Advantage layout
Typing test profiles: typeracer.com / hi-games.net / keybr.com

Offline Architect

  • Posts: 250
  • TECK Lover
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #7 on: Tue, 20 December 2011, 09:58:52 »
Quote from: boli;474334
Most likely a stupid question, but my 105's DIP switch was set to 104 mode, rather than 105/109 mode. Did you make sure the setting fits your model or set it accordingly?

They were all set to the default position. I set it up to 109, but all that seems to do is to remove the Del key in place of International 1, whatever that is. I'll just wait until the SDK so I can set it up the way I want.

The manual sure clarifies a lot of questions I had before, I didn't know that I also have a left control and right option up there.
TECK 209 Blank Keys; Leopold Number Pad; X-Keys Professional; X-Keys 84.

Offline boli

  • Posts: 350
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #8 on: Wed, 21 December 2011, 02:45:31 »
Quote from: Architect;474402
I set it up to 109, but all that seems to do is to remove the Del key in place of International 1

Right, International-1 is a key we have on swiss keyboards:

Maybe it's an OS thing, dunno. Hopefully they'll release their software soon (but I'm not holding my breath).
Keyboard: Kinesis Ergo Advantage (two LF editions with red Cherry switches, one regular with brown switches)
Keyboard layout: basically Colemak, with some remapping to end up with my custom Kinesis Advantage layout
Typing test profiles: typeracer.com / hi-games.net / keybr.com

Offline aogail

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 6
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #9 on: Tue, 24 January 2012, 15:58:39 »
It appears that my problems have disappeared. I don't know when it happened, really; just that I was going through some code last week (I am a software engineer) and realized that the right arrow wasn't missing a beat. The 'a' key has stopped doubling, too. Neither has recurred since then. My guess is that I got a couple switches that needed a break-in.

Offline heuristicist

  • Posts: 57
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #10 on: Wed, 08 February 2012, 22:16:42 »
I've seen a whole bunch of double keypresses. I found that my enter key was missing a bunch of keypresses but this is OK now... hopefully the double-keypress issue goes away too. We'll see. I may just end up returning this keyboard (or selling it)...

Did anyone else see progress on the double-keypress issue? Is the general consensus that it goes away after a while?

Offline kuato

  • Posts: 16
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #11 on: Wed, 08 February 2012, 23:03:42 »
Quote from: heuristicist;509800
I've seen a whole bunch of double keypresses. I found that my enter key was missing a bunch of keypresses but this is OK now... hopefully the double-keypress issue goes away too. We'll see. I may just end up returning this keyboard (or selling it)...

Did anyone else see progress on the double-keypress issue? Is the general consensus that it goes away after a while?


That's unfortunate :(

I've run this on my Windows and OSX machine and so far have not noticed this issue on either machine.

Offline boli

  • Posts: 350
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #12 on: Thu, 09 February 2012, 01:45:34 »
Quote from: heuristicist;509800
I've seen a whole bunch of double keypresses. I found that my enter key was missing a bunch of keypresses but this is OK now... hopefully the double-keypress issue goes away too. We'll see. I may just end up returning this keyboard (or selling it)...

Did anyone else see progress on the double-keypress issue? Is the general consensus that it goes away after a while?

Haven't noticed anything like this during my rather limited testing (105 browns on OS X). Will test more soon and update.
Keyboard: Kinesis Ergo Advantage (two LF editions with red Cherry switches, one regular with brown switches)
Keyboard layout: basically Colemak, with some remapping to end up with my custom Kinesis Advantage layout
Typing test profiles: typeracer.com / hi-games.net / keybr.com

Offline PetriW

  • Posts: 2
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #13 on: Thu, 09 February 2012, 03:39:11 »
Quote from: heuristicist;509800
Did anyone else see progress on the double-keypress issue? Is the general consensus that it goes away after a while?
Yes I had this issue but it seemed to be due to me having a custom keyboard dll created with MKLC. Once I switched to a normal dll and AutoHotKey it went away.
It could be that it's the same as what others have though and it went away on its own.

Offline heuristicist

  • Posts: 57
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #14 on: Thu, 09 February 2012, 22:34:25 »
I'm in Linux, and have seem this problem whether in plain TTY or else in a DE, accross multiple distros (mostly live environments). So far it hasn't really gone away---maybe some reductions but it's too random to tell. I'm getting a lot of double-spaces, double-down-arrows, double-ts, and now I'm also seeing backspace show up randomly! So some character I typed gets spontaneously wiped!

Ugh, I think I could like this keyboard but this problem is making it unusable. Too bad the company doesn't know how to conduct a business...

Offline Boerta

  • Posts: 22
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #15 on: Fri, 10 February 2012, 09:24:39 »
I got my TE board yesterday, and I haven't noticed any problems yet, for what it's worth.

Offline biochem

  • Posts: 228
  • Location: New England
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #16 on: Fri, 10 February 2012, 10:06:38 »
Quote from: aogail;472282
In the day or so I have been using my TE keyboard (104 with blues), I have noticed one functional issue. The right arrow key does not register about a third of the time. In rarer cases, it will register twice for one press. I have sent a message to TE about it, but no response yet -- it'll be a while if history is any indication ;)

Has anyone else encountered any functional issues with their TE keyboard?

I got my TE keyboard on Monday (also 104 with blues). The X and Down-Arrow keys have the same intermittent problem where they do not register ~1/3 of the keystrokes. The V key misses about one out of ten keystrokes.

I put in a RMA request Thursday evening. Hopefully this won't be a big hassle.
« Last Edit: Fri, 10 February 2012, 22:43:29 by biochem »
Filco MJ2 tenkeyless (blues)
Heatware

Offline boli

  • Posts: 350
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #17 on: Fri, 10 February 2012, 11:11:21 »
Have been using my TE at work since noon yesterday, no missed key presses so far (however the keyboard didn't work 4 out of 5 times after restarting my computer; had to replug it).
Keyboard: Kinesis Ergo Advantage (two LF editions with red Cherry switches, one regular with brown switches)
Keyboard layout: basically Colemak, with some remapping to end up with my custom Kinesis Advantage layout
Typing test profiles: typeracer.com / hi-games.net / keybr.com

Offline heuristicist

  • Posts: 57
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #18 on: Fri, 10 February 2012, 13:25:46 »
Quote from: biochem;511000
I put in a RMA request Thursday evening. Hopefully this won't be a big hassle.

Please keep us (or at least me ;p) updated on how that goes. I sent them an email and if I don't hear back soon I am also going to submit an RMA. I haven't yet decided if I want to take a risk on another one (maybe going with a 109/browns this time rather than the 104/blues) or just buy some crappy keyboard to hold me over until the ErgoDox's completion.

Offline biochem

  • Posts: 228
  • Location: New England
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #19 on: Fri, 10 February 2012, 22:49:42 »
It is now Friday evening and I didn't get any email from TE about the RMA. I'm going to give them 2 more business days to respond before I tell PayPal that I want me money back.
Filco MJ2 tenkeyless (blues)
Heatware

Offline heuristicist

  • Posts: 57
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #20 on: Sat, 11 February 2012, 22:28:28 »
Quote from: biochem;511483
It is now Friday evening and I didn't get any email from TE about the RMA. I'm going to give them 2 more business days to respond before I tell PayPal that I want me money back.

You've *definitely* got to keep us up-to-date on that one!

BTW, I wonder if the 104/blue line is the problem. Not to say all are bad, but I haven't heard someone with 105/109 or 104/brown say anything about it yet... Then again this is problem my human brain doing what it does best: find patterns in patternless data.

Offline zombieball

  • Posts: 1
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #21 on: Mon, 13 February 2012, 22:46:22 »
Quote from: heuristicist;512224
You've *definitely* got to keep us up-to-date on that one!

BTW, I wonder if the 104/blue line is the problem. Not to say all are bad, but I haven't heard someone with 105/109 or 104/brown say anything about it yet... Then again this is problem my human brain doing what it does best: find patterns in patternless data.

Hi guys,

I thought I would pipe in about my experiences so far.  I purchased a 104/blue and experienced issues with key presses not registering or registering twice.  This could certainly be an issue with the 104/blue line. For an idea about the rate at which my problems occurred I repeatedly typed my name and posted the results here: https://gist.github.com/1727786.  

I contacted TE and I asked if my problems were due to a firmware issue that could be fixed by flashing a new firmware or if there was a unique hardware issue that warranted my keyboard being replaced.  They gave me a long winded email describing troubleshooting steps such as ensuring it is not an OS / driver issue (tried the keyboard in Windows + OSX and encountered the same problems), gave me a link to a silly little troubleshooting app that lights up keys on a virtual keyboard when they are pressed (I imagine just to ensure there are no dead keys), and instructed me to ensure I had a good USB connection, etc.   1 or 2 days after telling them none of these steps solved my problem they instructed me to fill out an RMA and return the keyboard.  I shipped it back via Canadapost Express COD on Weds. Feb 8th.  I received my replacement keyboard today, Mon. Feb. 13th.  I have only used the keyboard briefly, but unfortunately it seems the problem still persists.  The problem is not as bad as it was with my previous keyboard (double key presses registering about 1/2 of the rate they used to) but it is still present.  I will use the keyboard a bit more this week and post back as to if the issue goes away.  However, in my opinion I feel like the problem is due to poor firmware (lousy software key de-bouncing perhaps?) and not hardware, so I don't imagine repeated use of the keyboard will solve the problem.

I do have a tip for anyone trying to contact Truly Ergonomic.  As many of you who have tried contacting them are probably well aware of almost all their email addresses seem to go to a general inbox that probably gets checked once in a blue moon and responds with a frustrating auto-reply.  Instead I took a shot in the dark and looked up their admin contact email registered with their domain (e.g. http://whois.domaintools.com/trulyergonomic.com).  They seem to have registered their domain using a private domain name registration service (whoisproof) but it lists an email address that promisses to forward all messages to Truly Ergonomics.  Hoping I would get through to a different inbox I have CC'd this address on all my contacts with TE.  Not sure if that is what eventually got their attention or not but its worth a shot.

Offline boli

  • Posts: 350
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #22 on: Tue, 14 February 2012, 07:07:45 »
Maybe I'm doing it wrong, but I currently I can't find any reference to blue or red switches on the TE homepage. If I'm not being an idiot I doubt this is coincidence.
Keyboard: Kinesis Ergo Advantage (two LF editions with red Cherry switches, one regular with brown switches)
Keyboard layout: basically Colemak, with some remapping to end up with my custom Kinesis Advantage layout
Typing test profiles: typeracer.com / hi-games.net / keybr.com

Offline Himatin

  • Posts: 1
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #23 on: Tue, 14 February 2012, 07:21:17 »
I noticed the same. But is it really possible, that it has to do with this issue?
How can the internal mechanics of the keyswitches trigger this kind of behaviour? Shouldn't they be interchangable?

Offline heuristicist

  • Posts: 57
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #24 on: Tue, 14 February 2012, 08:34:47 »
Quote from: boli;514031
Maybe I'm doing it wrong, but I currently I can't find any reference to blue or red switches on the TE homepage. If I'm not being an idiot I doubt this is coincidence.

Interesting! Looks like only browns now. I do remember seeing that a bunch of the keyboards were backordered.

Quote from: Himatin;514035
I noticed the same. But is it really possible, that it has to do with this issue?
How can the internal mechanics of the keyswitches trigger this kind of behaviour? Shouldn't they be interchangable?

That's what I thought! But it's always possible they got/used a bad batch of blues.

Offline biochem

  • Posts: 228
  • Location: New England
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #25 on: Wed, 15 February 2012, 08:49:22 »
I followed up my Feb 9 request for an RMA with an email on Feb 13 but still got no response. I just opened up a PayPal claim against them. We'll see if this gets a response from TE.
Filco MJ2 tenkeyless (blues)
Heatware

Offline biochem

  • Posts: 228
  • Location: New England
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #26 on: Wed, 15 February 2012, 19:39:36 »
The PayPal claim prompted a quick response from TE. It's unfortunate that I had to resort to that to get them to respond. In any case, they will pay to have me ship the keyboard back to them and I can get a replacement or a refund. I am satisfied with this resolution.

In the email they said:
Quote
[SIZE=-1]We have spent several days researching this issue, and  we have concluded that the problem you are having in regard to the  key(s) that appear to malfunction lies within faulty keyswitches. This  issue is neither the keyboard's electronics nor the firmware itself.[/SIZE]
As suggested earlier in this thread, it appears that they may have had a bad batch of blue switches.
Filco MJ2 tenkeyless (blues)
Heatware

Offline heuristicist

  • Posts: 57
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #27 on: Thu, 16 February 2012, 00:47:15 »
I just got the same email. I submitted an RMA yesterday but no PayPal claim yet. I'm probably going to ask them to send me browns instead, since a) I'd like to avoid more trouble and b) I haven't tried browns before. I had tried blues and blacks before this, and was pretty sure I didn't like linear keyswitches, and didn't really mind the noise of the blues, but I should probably give browns a go sometime too, and this might be the right opportunity.

Offline djcybermyth

  • Posts: 22
Got the Blues
« Reply #28 on: Thu, 16 February 2012, 09:50:43 »
Quote from: heuristicist;515883
I just got the same email. I submitted an RMA yesterday but no PayPal claim yet. I'm probably going to ask them to send me browns instead, since a) I'd like to avoid more trouble and b) I haven't tried browns before. I had tried blues and blacks before this, and was pretty sure I didn't like linear keyswitches, and didn't really mind the noise of the blues, but I should probably give browns a go sometime too, and this might be the right opportunity.


My friend and I both ordered 104 blues which have shown to have the chattering key problem and both received this same RMA email today.  It seems that they are having a massive blue switch problems since they are no longer offering blues on the website, and from what I can tell, only people with blues seem to be experiencing problems.  Anyone else agree?

I really like the feel / sound of the blues, but in the interest of getting a keyboard that works, I'm going to see if I can get browns via exchange.

I'll let you know how it goes for both my friend and I.

Offline sordna

  • Posts: 2853
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #29 on: Thu, 16 February 2012, 13:13:44 »
Anyone with 109 / blues ? I wonder if this problem affects the 109 keyboard as well, or just the 104/105.
Kinesis Contoured Advantage LF with Cherry MX Red switches / Extra keys mod / O-ring dampening mod / Dvorak layout. ErgoDox with buzzer and LED mod.
Also: Kinesis Advantage Classic, Kinesis Contoured Model 110, Data911 TG3, Fingerworks Touchstream LP, KBC Poker (Cherry MX Red), IBM Space Saving keyboard (Buckling spring), Goldtouch GTU-0077 keyboard

Offline PetriW

  • Posts: 2
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #30 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 03:18:49 »
Quote from: sordna;516219
Anyone with 109 / blues ? I wonder if this problem affects the 109 keyboard as well, or just the 104/105.
I had this problem with both my 109 blues.

Offline sordna

  • Posts: 2853
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #31 on: Tue, 21 February 2012, 13:00:46 »
Thanks! Hmm, I wonder if blue switches need some particular handling by a keyboard's firmware, or if indeed TE got a bad batch of blue switches that don't make good contact.
Kinesis Contoured Advantage LF with Cherry MX Red switches / Extra keys mod / O-ring dampening mod / Dvorak layout. ErgoDox with buzzer and LED mod.
Also: Kinesis Advantage Classic, Kinesis Contoured Model 110, Data911 TG3, Fingerworks Touchstream LP, KBC Poker (Cherry MX Red), IBM Space Saving keyboard (Buckling spring), Goldtouch GTU-0077 keyboard

Offline nomaded

  • Posts: 218
  • Location: Andover, MA
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #32 on: Wed, 22 February 2012, 11:55:32 »
That's too bad about the Blues. I am glad I got a 109 with the Browns. I'm quite satisfied by the feel of the Browns, and I do find that they are still pretty clacky sounding, but not overly so. I'm using mine in a cube farm, so I think the Blues would have been too loud.
Dvorak
ErgoDox fullhand (clears) w/Penumbra || ErgoDox classic (clears) w/Calm Depths || TECK 209 (browns) || TouchStream ST
Kensington Slimblade Trackball || Logitech Cordless Optical Trackman || Apple Magic Trackpad
Current Dvorak-based ErgoDox layout || Current Dvorak-based TECK layout

Offline djcybermyth

  • Posts: 22
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #33 on: Wed, 22 February 2012, 12:18:48 »
So does anyone know if TE is replacing the blue RMAs with refurbished blues or swapping them with browns?  I have come to like the feel of the blues and am not sure if I really want to give that up.

Also, the chattering with the "b" key seems to have gone away, so the only problems that remain are with the left and right arrow keys.

What to do...

Offline oneproduct

  • Posts: 1095
  • Location: Montreal, Canada
  • @Ubisoft
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #34 on: Wed, 22 February 2012, 20:45:57 »
Was there a problem with the reds at all? They took those off their site as well but I don't think I've seen someone talk about this problem with reds. That was the switch type I was interested in getting.
Filco Tenkeyless | Realforce Tenkeyless Variable Silent | Truly Ergonomic | Kinesis Contoured Advantage | IBM Model M SSK | Cherry G80-3600LYC | TG3 w/ trackpad | CM Storm QuickFire Rapid | Ergodox
Kensington Slimblade | RollerMouse Free2 | Logitech M570 | Logitech G500 | Evoluent Vertical Mouse 3
Colemak

Offline djcybermyth

  • Posts: 22
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #35 on: Wed, 22 February 2012, 23:15:47 »
I just saw that they are offering the reds again on their website.

Also, my roommate just got a 104 with browns and I'm typing on it right now.  There seems to be zero key problems.  But I forgot just how strong the fumes are from this thing for the first week or so :/

This is my first experience with brown switches, and on first impression, I like the blue ones better.  They feel alright, but just don't have that satisfying sound ;)

Offline boli

  • Posts: 350
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #36 on: Thu, 23 February 2012, 02:35:50 »
Quote from: djcybermyth;522674
I just saw that they are offering the reds again on their website.


Right, nice find. Only the 104 model with legends seems to available with reds though - no 105, 109 or blank versions. Maybe the red version didn't sell well enough to keep offering different models.
Also their Mechanical Keyswitches info page still only mentions browns.
Keyboard: Kinesis Ergo Advantage (two LF editions with red Cherry switches, one regular with brown switches)
Keyboard layout: basically Colemak, with some remapping to end up with my custom Kinesis Advantage layout
Typing test profiles: typeracer.com / hi-games.net / keybr.com

Offline heuristicist

  • Posts: 57
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #37 on: Sat, 25 February 2012, 02:14:48 »
Has anyone gone through with sending the keyboard back to them and getting a new one? (And getting them to refund your shipping costs.) I haven't gotten around to it yet, just wondering how it's gone for others...

Offline biochem

  • Posts: 228
  • Location: New England
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #38 on: Wed, 29 February 2012, 19:00:09 »
I sent my keyboard back to them. It got there yesterday and they issued a refund for the keyboard today. I haven't gotten a refund for the return shipping costs yet, but so far so good.
Filco MJ2 tenkeyless (blues)
Heatware

Offline treigle

  • Posts: 106
    • http://www.neuron0.net
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #39 on: Thu, 01 March 2012, 00:23:19 »
Quote from: oneproduct
Was there a problem with the reds at all? They took those off their site as well but I don't think I've seen someone talk about this problem with reds. That was the switch type I was interested in getting.


My reds have been fine so far.

The ANSI red page is still up, but I don't know if it's legit, cause it's not linked from the main page, and the price is the same as the browns (used to be $249). This page has been updated since they took reds off their main page, as at that time it still said $249/5 in stock... I couldn't find the other red variant pages after they officially took reds down...

http://www.trulyergonomic.com/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=59_60&product_id=62

If I end up preferring my Kinesis, I may sell my ANSI/red TE, but it'll be at least a month (just got both a week ago), and I rather like the TE so far.
Kinesis Advantage, Truly Ergonomic (ANSI), Filco 87

Offline heuristicist

  • Posts: 57
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #40 on: Mon, 26 March 2012, 12:19:16 »
So as much as this company is not so good for replying to most emails I've had a pretty solid experience with getting my 104/blue TE replaced. Here is what happened for me:

9/2/2012: Sent them an email about the problems with my 104/blue TE.
15/2/2012: Get a reply stating that there is a problem with the keyswitches and an offer to replace the keyboard, including refunding return shipping. This was pretty cool as most places get you to pay the return shipping. They also requested knowing that I let them know which keys had problems, but neither the replacement nor the refund were contingent on that. They just said "We will appreciate if you can let us know..."
9/3/2012: I finally get around to sending them back the keyboard. I am in Toronto and the return shipping cost me $19.15. I scanned the receipt and sent it to them, along with the info on which keys had problems, and also requested that they send me a 104/brown instead of 104/blue just so I can avoid issues (and because I wanted to try the browns out). Within some five-odd (!) hours I got the shipping refund in my PayPal account and an email saying that they will send the replacement 104/brown as soon as they receive the faulty keyboard.
16/3/2012: I send them an email because FedEx was unable to deliver the keyboard on the 15th and the 16th. They reply back within half an hour asking for the tracking number so they can make sure to pick it up. They say that the new keyboard will ship on the 19th. I gave them the tracking number.
19/3/2012: FedEx shows the keyboard as delivered.
20/3/2012: I email them asking about the replacement. Within three hours I get an email with the tracking number.

The point is, while they tend to ignore emails from people who haven't bought a keyboard (which is annoying, I know), I think they handled this replacement beautifully. Just wanted to let people here know!

Offline Marilla

  • Posts: 1
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #41 on: Thu, 29 March 2012, 13:17:52 »
I bought a TE keyboard (105) with Cherry MX Blue keyswitches back in February and encountered many of the same problems as here, and I also found the same problems with TE reacting very slowly indeed to e-mails. The situation at the moment is that they've said that they were provided with a faulty batch of Blue keyswitches and so various of the keyboards with these will be faulty (depending, presumably, on which faulty switches went into which keyboard etc.). They say they are now not going to be producing any keyboards with the Blue switches.

Although I was struggling with the uneven functioning of the keys (amongst the worst was the 'E' key, wouldn’t you know), I still found this keyboard to be the best, ergonomically, I've ever tried - and I've tried a load. There's something about not only the layout but also the weight and firmness of the base which makes it feel absolutely right. Coupled with the Cherry Blues, which are my absolute favourites, I determined not to give up on this keyboard.

However I am still negotiating with TE (s-l-o-w-l-y). My main problem is that not only do I want the keyboard as is, but I also want another one because I'm on the keyboard day and night and I can't afford to be without one - and nor can I afford the time lost if I have to change over to one with a different configuration. I also need something that will last and be capable of refurbishment every now and again - because I'm fed up with purchasing another keyboard of the type I've been using only to find that they've changed the layout or something since I last purchased.

So the state of play at the moment is that TE have agreed in principle to my purchasing a second keyboard with the Cherry Blues, before they run out of stock of these keyboards, and I keep the keyboard I have but have the faulty keys replaced (by someone else). In recompense for their supplying a faulty keyboard to me they will supply the second keyboard at half price. However they say that, this transaction concluded, there will be no guarantee for either keyboard.

I have talked to The Keyboard Company (I'm in the UK) and they are confident they can sort out the keyboards. When the second keyboard arrives (just supposing I ever get to the point with TE where it can all be agreed, ordered, shipped...), I am going to send both keyboards to them and - well, pray.

Please keep your fingers and everything else crossed for me, because these keyboards are going to be the most expensive ever (and I've paid for two Maltrons in my time)...

I'll keep everyone posted.

Offline sordna

  • Posts: 2853
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #42 on: Thu, 29 March 2012, 22:46:11 »
Good luck and thanks for sharing your story, very interesting! Yeah, if Kinesis stopped producing the Advantage with my favorite switches (cherry reds) I would do the same as you, stock up on spares even if they came with issues, no warranty, etc. Oh well, maybe the warranty argument is not very convincing in my case:

Kinesis Contoured Advantage LF with Cherry MX Red switches / Extra keys mod / O-ring dampening mod / Dvorak layout. ErgoDox with buzzer and LED mod.
Also: Kinesis Advantage Classic, Kinesis Contoured Model 110, Data911 TG3, Fingerworks Touchstream LP, KBC Poker (Cherry MX Red), IBM Space Saving keyboard (Buckling spring), Goldtouch GTU-0077 keyboard

Offline Draconian

  • Posts: 15
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #43 on: Thu, 05 April 2012, 06:13:06 »
I too have the TE 105 International with Cherry MX Blues.

I've also been experiencing repeated keypresses and skipped keypresses of certain keys. Most annoyingly, one of the keys that most often fails to register is the key!

I've received the following email from them after telling them of my keyboard's problems:

Quote
As your Truly Ergonomic Keyboard uses Light-click-sound (Cherry MX Blue) keyswitches, we can mention that during the production of Truly Ergonomic Keyboards with these keyswitches, our manufacturer received a bad batch of these keyswitches that were unfortunately used in some of our keyboards. Hence, yours amongst other keyboards are malfunctioning.


We have researched your keyboard's problem and have concluded that only lies within faulty keyswitches; this is neither the keyboard's electronics nor the firmware itself.

 

We have also further researched the advantages and disadvantages of the Cherry MX Blue keyswitches and have concluded that we will no longer manufacture the Truly Ergonomic Keyboard with these keyswitches. We will only continue manufacturing Truly Ergonomic Keyboards with SILENT (Cherry MX Brown) keyswitches.

 

Hence, we can offer the following options:

 

1.    Replace your keyboard with a Truly Ergonomic Keyboard with SILENT (Cherry MX Brown) keyswitches - English US QWERTY - Model 104 (In Stock).

 

2.    Replace your keyboard with a Truly Ergonomic Keyboard with SILENT (Cherry MX Brown) keyswitches - English Europe or International - Model 105 (In Stock).

 

3.    Replace your keyboard with a Truly Ergonomic Keyboard with SILENT (Cherry MX Brown) keyswitches - English Asia or International - Model 109 when available. (Out of Stock - delivery estimated for mid May 2012). We can provide a partial refund of $50.00 USD should you choose this option for the inconvenience.

 

4.    Replace your keyboard with a Truly Ergonomic Keyboard with SILENT (Cherry MX Brown) keyswitches - Blank Layout - either Model 104-105-109 when available. (Out of Stock - delivery estimated for mid May 2012). We can provide a partial refund of $50.00 USD should you choose this option for the inconvenience.

 

5.    Provide a Full Refund of your purchase after you return this keyboard.

 

Some customers have told us that after pressing the faulty key(s) several times (probably hundreds of times), the keyswitch works normally, but we cannot guarantee this.

 

Another option: If you, or someone you know, are proficient and would like to exchange the faulty keyswitches, you can buy these nearby and we will reimburse you for the trouble by means of a partial refund of $50.00 USD. This is the only option if you want to keep your keyboard with Cherry MX Blue keyswitches.

 

We apologize for this inconvenience.

 

Please take all the time you require to consider the above options and to let us know your decision. We are extending your Money-Back guarantee until this matter is resolved. Please make sure as well you read our Terms & Conditions section before making your decision.

 

Please send us an email should you have any questions or require additional information.


I'm wondering if their suggestion to refer to their T&Cs means that they're going to ask me to pay for the return shipping? After checking the WayBack archive, I can see no mention of International Customers having to pay for return shipping, and certainly not at the time I placed my order. I'm hoping that, if pushed, they'll pay for this.

I love the sound of the Cherry MX Blues, but am wondering if the Browns would suffice. If I opt to get the keyboard repaired here in the UK, I get $50 back. Is this a repair that I could feasibly complete myself? How easy is it to replace the faulty keys?

Any recommendations as to how to proceed?

Thanks

Nick

Offline heuristicist

  • Posts: 57
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #44 on: Fri, 06 April 2012, 01:09:42 »
Quote from: Draconian;567495
I too have the TE 105 International with Cherry MX Blues.

I've also been experiencing repeated keypresses and skipped keypresses of certain keys. Most annoyingly, one of the keys that most often fails to register is the key!

I've received the following email from them after telling them of my keyboard's problems:



I'm wondering if their suggestion to refer to their T&Cs means that they're going to ask me to pay for the return shipping? After checking the WayBack archive, I can see no mention of International Customers having to pay for return shipping, and certainly not at the time I placed my order. I'm hoping that, if pushed, they'll pay for this.

I love the sound of the Cherry MX Blues, but am wondering if the Browns would suffice. If I opt to get the keyboard repaired here in the UK, I get $50 back. Is this a repair that I could feasibly complete myself? How easy is it to replace the faulty keys?

Any recommendations as to how to proceed?

Thanks

Nick

In my case (full details in a post above) they offered to pay the return shipping without my even asking for it. If you're trying to decide with blues vs. browns it's a tough question if only because it's so subjective. I had mine replaced with browns and while I haven't had a chance to really use it I sort of get the feeling that the browns don't feel quite as crisp as the blues. (Then again, it could be psychological based on the sound of the blues... who knows.) Doing the repair yourself is unlikely unless you have experience with this kind of thing. I'm not sure how much the blue switches cost but I doubt the $50 would cover it even if you bought a full 104 switches. And then you would have to go to the work of desoldering them and soldering in the new ones.

If you *really* want blues on your TE a self-repair is the only option it seems, and you have no guarantee right now how it'll work out. If you're willing to live with browns then get it replaced. If you'd rather have another keyboard over a TE with browns, then return it. Personally I'd rather have a TE with browns than a regular keyboard so that's the option I took. (The ErgoDox may supplant this though, we'll see.)

Offline Draconian

  • Posts: 15
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #45 on: Fri, 06 April 2012, 11:04:41 »
Thanks for your sensible suggestion. I'm leaning towards having it replaced with browns. My question here would be - do the browns still have a nice sound when pressed. I know they're supposed to be silent, but do they actually make a click when pressed, or is that only when they're bottomed out?

Has anyone reading this thread had any luck with their comment:

Quote
Some customers have told us that after pressing the faulty key(s) several times (probably hundreds of times), the keyswitch works normally, but we cannot guarantee this.

I've certainly noticed that the keys misbehave differently on different days. I'm wondering quite how long I'd have to thump all the keys before it behaves normally?

Does anyone have any idea as to what the defects are with this batch of blues. If they might eventually work normally, then it must be a minor defect?
« Last Edit: Fri, 06 April 2012, 11:07:59 by Draconian »

Offline heuristicist

  • Posts: 57
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #46 on: Fri, 06 April 2012, 21:50:55 »
Quote from: Draconian;568896
Thanks for your sensible suggestion. I'm leaning towards having it replaced with browns. My question here would be - do the browns still have a nice sound when pressed. I know they're supposed to be silent, but do they actually make a click when pressed, or is that only when they're bottomed out?

No, the browns don't make the same click as the blues. If you press it down super-slowly you won't hear a thing. Press it faster and bottom out and it'll make the typical noise of the keycap bottoming out, and that's about it.

Quote from: Draconian;568896
Has anyone reading this thread had any luck with their comment:



I've certainly noticed that the keys misbehave differently on different days. I'm wondering quite how long I'd have to thump all the keys before it behaves normally?

I did try and mash the keys a lot. I just sat there with my laptop doing other stuff with one hand and just going through groups of four keys at a time pressing them a whole bunch of times with my other hand. I might've seen a key or two get better with this. Doing each key a hundred times sounds like a lot but doesn't take that long as long as you move your fingers quickly. You can certainly try this but I wouldn't get my hopes up. (OTOH you do sound like you *really* want the blues so might as well give it a go.)

Offline djcybermyth

  • Posts: 22
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #47 on: Mon, 16 April 2012, 00:50:09 »
I'm also weighing my options.  I looked on Mouser.com and it seems that the keyswitches are 75 cents or 98 cents depending on which keyswitch is on the keyboard.  I think the more expensive one is the right one, but I haven't fully taken my keyboard apart yet to find out.  There are only two keys that I would replace if I decided to take that option, and even those two are pretty good now.

Back when I emailed TE support the first time and hadn't heard anything back in two weeks or so, I bought another TE 104 with browns so I could have one if I did end up sending the original back and also would have one at home and one at work once this all blew over.  Also, these are my first mechanical keyboards ever, and since I didn't really know the difference between blues and browns, I thought I would try them both out.  I seem to like them both, though I find them to be very different.  The browns are not best described as quiet blues, because the blues have more "wiggle" and actually squeak a bit like an office chair might once it's been around awhile.  The browns don't do that at all.  They feel very tight on the horizontal axis, but also slightly easier to push, though that might be purely psychological.

Since they are so different to me, I really like the idea of repairing the blue one to give them both an extended trial, in case there are future keyboard purchases ;)

Speaking of disassembling the TE, has anyone taken their keyboard apart yet?  I unscrewed all of the screws, but there seemed to be some plastic tabs or catches that were hidden somewhere so I backed off.

EDIT:
I forgot to mention that I wish I had purchased the blank layout model as I am now experimenting with moving a few of the keys around and there is something a little strange about having key labels not match key output.  Maybe TE sells a blank keycap set, but I haven't looked into this yet.

Offline heuristicist

  • Posts: 57
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #48 on: Tue, 17 April 2012, 00:18:49 »
I'm also wishing I had grabbed a different model particularly the 109. The placement of the non-alphanumeric keys is really pissing me off.

BTW, if you want different keycaps, the TE ones are pretty close to ones you can get from WASD. Check out boli's experience thread.

Offline heuristicist

  • Posts: 57
Truly Ergonomic missing right arrow key presses
« Reply #49 on: Fri, 18 May 2012, 00:41:02 »
Aw damn. I'm now getting double keypresses on one of my keys. Ever since I tried sordna's Kinesis it's been growing on me, and I think I'm about ready to say that I'm done with the TE. I'm probably going to pick up a Kinesis when I'm in the US this summer and be done with it.

Even without the bad key though I'm finding that the key placement isn't nearly as optimal as the Kinesis. While the pronation is less (not gone though) than a regular keyboard, my fingers have to make some rather annoying stretches depending on the bigram I'm typing, which I didn't find with the Kinesis. So I'll either go with that or else just say "screw ergonomic" and buy a regular keyboard (maybe a Das?) with blues.