Author Topic: Switch for rythm game?  (Read 15167 times)

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Offline Badkarma

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Switch for rythm game?
« on: Wed, 28 December 2011, 03:31:27 »
I'm looking for opinions on what you'd consider to be a good (or best) switch for rhythm games? I play a variety of games and spend alot of time typing so I'm looking for a mechanical as I'm tired of going through rubber domes. The main game that relies most heavily on the keyboard that I play is a little rythm game called "Osu" (keyboard+mouse game). I'm sure you can find videos on the tube if you're curious how it's played. The game is fairly demanding and with using only 2 keys there's times it will go over 200+BPM (beats per minute).  Being this is the most extreme task the keyboard will see, figured why not just get the best switch for it. What are your opinions on which switch would be best for such a game?

Offline domin8r

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #1 on: Wed, 28 December 2011, 03:57:09 »
If you want a keyboard that will allow you to use keys really fast you'll be best off with linear switches.. Cherry reds are VERY light so easy to press (fast) and Cherry blacks are the same, just slightly heavier. For me personally reds are too light to type on, but it's a personal preference.

Keyboards with Cherry blacks are much easier to get and usually cheaper (supply & demand blabla).
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Offline Tony

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #2 on: Wed, 28 December 2011, 04:01:06 »
Red.
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Offline ViciousXUSMC

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #3 on: Wed, 28 December 2011, 04:50:45 »
May sound strange but I would like blues for a game like that :D

Linear lets you spam a key very quickly, but thats more of world of warcraft spam style, rhythm games do not require as fast as humanly possible key spam it requires you to press various keys at the exact right time, and no switch can let you know when you pressed it better than blues.

That stronger tactile bump and click would let you easily sync up your key presses to the beat.  The only thing you would have to be sure of is to make sure you lift up the key enough to let it depress.

Also SUPER important is making sure the keyboard is full NKR, some games like say O2 Jam will use more than that 6 key limit that some keyboards have.

Im sure any key type will work well for you once you get used too it, but my first thoughts were just on how easy it is to time/sync blue switches.

Offline Badkarma

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #4 on: Wed, 28 December 2011, 05:51:23 »
Thanks for the suggestions! It's very much appreciated.

With a game like Osu, you're only using 2 keys (2 fingers) to do all the clicks, it could be up to 1000 key presses within just 2-5 minutes, so I feel  blacks would cause severe fatigue in such cases. I think I know what you're talking about Vicious but Osu is literally the only rhythm game I can see myself getting into...it's I guess, not your "typical" rhythm game, "o2 Jam" and the like are the more traditional rhythm games that basically use the home row, space bar, etc IIRC.

Anyways, the most keys I ever push down at once is 3 keys, usually in MMO games and I have some software desktop short cuts that are 3 keys. So any keyboard that can do 3 keys is more than enough for my needs.

That's the only thing I was worried about the blues was the moving mechanism inside not always fully releasing, wouldn't know if that would cause issues (also more moving parts = more possibility to fail?). I was leaning toward browns but was having second thoughts upon having seen very subtle statements occasionally how they're kinda generic in feel or "basic" I guess. However I figured being slightly tactile without the moving mechanism would suit it well. Being I haven't felt them, In my head I've kinda put browns as the middle ground between blues and reds, however I'm not sure if the same is true actually using them. Are the blues more "precise" than the browns as far as the tactile feedback and actuation? My neighbor owns a blue switch board, he's been busy but in a couple days I will go try them out.

As for reds, Vicious hit the nail on the head with my concerns with this. I think it would be an excellent switch, but my worries comes with the "accuracy" of the key press. However, I do think it would be a nice switch for it as well. Out of reds, blues and browns, which have a better bounce back or "recovery" rather?

Also this is probably a silly question, but are there low profile boards with MX switches (I haven't come across any)? or can soft landing pads be used to reduce travel?

Offline RiGS

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #5 on: Wed, 28 December 2011, 07:17:29 »
Omron microswitches would be your best bet for this.
Last edited by RiGS; Jan 2011

Offline czarek

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #6 on: Wed, 28 December 2011, 07:32:55 »
I like NBM linear switches a lot. They are light to activate, but heavy to bottom out. Keys are mounted on them very solid so there is absolutely no wobble. I have only one keyboard with those switches which I can only use with my Amiga so I play on those old shoot em ups and pinballs with it. I can't think any better keyboard for such games. I'd love to have some adapter so I could connect this keyboard to my Mac and use it for modern games too!
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Offline Magna224

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #7 on: Wed, 28 December 2011, 08:33:57 »
MX Blacks won't necessarily cause fatigue in osu, it depends on how weak your fingers are. I gave one of my friends a keyboard with MX Blacks, the main game he plays is osu, and after using it for two days he said he was going to buy an MX Black keyboard. I don't use a keyboard when I play osu but I have tried it with MX Blacks for a short time and it felt pretty good.
« Last Edit: Wed, 28 December 2011, 08:36:05 by Magna224 »
If you live in AZ you can try my keyboards. I usually keep plenty of different ALPS and MX and buckling springs.

Offline Human

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #8 on: Wed, 28 December 2011, 08:41:07 »
Double Action mechanism of Cherry Blue may drive you nuts when repeated double pressing it at a fast rate.

P/S: If only you realise it... Many people don't even feel the double action of Cherry Blue

woody

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #9 on: Wed, 28 December 2011, 10:23:37 »
Har har.

Offline dimoniy

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #10 on: Wed, 28 December 2011, 11:03:05 »
I've heard pros use rubber domes
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Offline pitashen

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #11 on: Wed, 28 December 2011, 13:08:07 »
Quote from: dimoniy;478985
I've heard pros use rubber domes

I do see rubber dome might have some advantage in rhythm games. Considering that people tend to slam the keys when playing rhythm games and fact that rubber dome triggers when bottom out could actually help players do better timings.
« Last Edit: Wed, 28 December 2011, 13:10:29 by pitashen »
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Offline thegunner100

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #12 on: Wed, 28 December 2011, 13:18:30 »
Hello Badkarma! I play osu with a Filco Brown, and it's pretty amazing compared to when i played osu with rubber domes. The main thing about the brown switch for me is that it's light and the tactile touch is useful for confirming that i've actually hit a note(I.e triplets).

 I've tried using my friend's Rosewill w/ red switches and it just feels so much different with a linear switch. It's not neccesarily a bad thing, but like i said, i like having the tactile feeling.

Check out my profile at http://osu.ppy.sh/u/947714. If you're looking for more opinions on switches for osu, it might be better to ask in the Osu forums.
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Offline Badkarma

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #13 on: Wed, 28 December 2011, 18:34:40 »
Cool to see there's some people who've had experiences with Osu! Thanks for the replies again!

My neighbor had mentioned he had a Steelseries board with blacks and said the keys felt really mushy, then picked up a blue board and has loved it. I'm not sure if he still has the steelseries board, but if he does I'll check it out. Unforunately, it's 50 miles to the nearest place where they might have some display models set out, so it's simply easier to gather general information on experiences.

Quote from: ripster;478931
Blacks.

Obviously.

Touche

Quote from: pitashen;479058
I do see rubber dome might have some advantage in rhythm games. Considering that people tend to slam the keys when playing rhythm games and fact that rubber dome triggers when bottom out could actually help players do better timings.

In that aspect they do, to an extent, when single tapping but once you start doing "streams" (basically fast alternating between the keys, with high BPM) it gets significantly more difficult as you're having to bottom out every time. I alternate between two keyboards because of this, I use a more traditional rubber dome keyboard for typing and a classic 200 logitech that's low profile for osu. Because the keys on the logitech are still terrible, I've modded the two keys I use on the logitech by gluing a little metal ball underneath each of the key caps to reduce travel and help to firmly actuate the rubber dome without digging my finger into the key (people have done weirder things to be better at osu lol). This mixed with my typing board having problems not registering keys, I think it's just time to get something new.

Quote from: thegunner100;479064
Hello Badkarma! I play osu with a Filco Brown, and it's pretty amazing compared to when i played osu with rubber domes. The main thing about the brown switch for me is that it's light and the tactile touch is useful for confirming that i've actually hit a note(I.e triplets).

 I've tried using my friend's Rosewill w/ red switches and it just feels so much different with a linear switch. It's not neccesarily a bad thing, but like i said, i like having the tactile feeling.

Check out my profile at . If you're looking for more opinions on switches for osu, it might be better to ask in the Osu forums.

Hello! I was originally leaning toward browns because of this but I had read somewhere that they're basically good at everything but best at nothing. So it's good to hear you had a positive experience with them in Osu. Without having a way to feel the differences in switches, like you say and from what I hear, there's night and day differences between them. I had a look on the osu forums and didn't see a mechanical keyboard thread anywhere, so I simply didn't bother.

osu.ppy.sh/u/44800 <- Osu profile

Offline Badkarma

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #14 on: Thu, 29 December 2011, 01:57:05 »
Quote from: ripster;479427
Cherry Bluuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuues.

Clickaclickaclickaclickaclickaclicka....
[video=youtube;fexvSani1BQ]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fexvSani1BQ&feature=player_embedded[/video]

Audio AND tactile feedback.

That's a video by a player named "Cookiezi", #1 player in the world in Osu, the kid is a robot! I think he was given that Black Widow as a gift if I'm not mistaken (so I'm not sure if he actually specifically chose blue switches for their capabilities or not), but it gives credit to blue switches being able to play at the most demanding degree of the game.

Offline Badkarma

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #15 on: Sun, 22 January 2012, 04:57:53 »
Ended up buying a Razer Blackwidow. I was going to hold out for a CM Quickfire Rapid with reds but then came across an open box BW on newegg for 48 shipped...figured for that price I could try it out and if I didn't like it, could resell without a loss. So I've had it for about a week and a half now and played variety of games, definitely took some getting used to...especially for Osu. I'm pretty well adjusted now and enjoying it quite a bit. I'd probably be more satisfied with reds though as it feels you need to fully (or almost) depress the blues for them to reset, isn't really a big deal. Definitely nice hitting a key in osu and knowing it registered rather than having to jam the key down just to be sure. When playing osu the tactile feel, atleast to me, I can't really tell its even there however when typing and playing other games I can. Anyways for what I paid I'm satisfied with the result and the build quality of the board I was pleasantly surprised with. I'm not too big of razer stuff but this board definitely feels solid. I've yet to accidently hit the macro keys on the side, so I can't say personally they're a con...I don't actually use them either though. I ordered my neighbor and I some O-rings from a user here, going to give those a try and see how they do. Anyways, figured I'd add a little closure to this. Thanks for the help!

Offline Rumudiez

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #16 on: Mon, 23 January 2012, 15:56:37 »
i seriously don't understand how this is a debate >__> read the keys wiki, as ripster would normally have said.. for timing key presses, tactile feedback is going to be undoubtedly the best. blues in general would be better than browns because of the additional audio feedback, but you do have to wait an extra millisecond for the bottom to push back up over the switch, so when repeated keystrokes become incredibly fast like they can in osu, browns take the lead.
in general i go by this rule: blues for typing, browns for high APM games, blacks/reds for low apm or FPS games
40% layout, anyone?

Offline chel-

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #17 on: Mon, 23 January 2012, 16:16:07 »
Quote from: ripster;479427
Cherry Bluuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuues.

Clickaclickaclickaclickaclickaclicka....
[video=youtube;fexvSani1BQ]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fexvSani1BQ&feature=player_embedded[/video]

Audio AND tactile feedback.

lol at first I thought this guy was multitasking - playing and writing a paper or something. :p

My first thought for a switch for game like this is blues. I think the feedback would help more than going with something like blacks or reds.

Offline shogrran

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #18 on: Mon, 23 January 2012, 18:56:58 »
EDIT: WHOOOPS SORRY! Didn't read your post above that says you already got the razer bw keyboard. Sorry I was late in giving the feedback below. I might have saved you the trouble of buying the razer bw.

Here is what I say. Before you listen to any advice in this thread you might want to ask if they also tried playing a rhythm game, and a similar if not the same rhythm game that you are playing. And even if they are playing a rhythm game, its still a matter of how you play. Why don't you ask the person in that video for feedback regarding if he likes the mxblue switches on the razer bw?

I also play a rhythm game, unfortunately probably not like the game you are playing. (DBAudition if you have heard of that). I have a razer blackwidow that uses blues but the tactile feedback DOESN'T help a single bit. For one  if you're wearing headphones or playing the music loudly, you wont even hear the click. The reset of the "click" part doesn't help when spamming keys as you have to really release the key to make sure it resets, I have tried to "hover" over the "click" part of the switch to spam a key quicker but that lead me to double pressing when I didn't intend to. You can take a look at the video and see that he is really lifting his fingers from the keys. If you don't play that way you might want to try a different switch. The only benefit I really get is the softness of the keys and that the feeling of a key press is the same every time.

The mxblues will still be better than rubber domes this I can tell you. I have used a variety of cheap and expensive rubber domes before I got the razer bw and the razer bw beats them all when it comes to the feel. (i have tried a4tech keyboards, scissor hp laptop keyboards, razer arctosa keyboards, etc)

I have an mxbrown keyboard but it doesn't have a numpad so I can't play the game I am playing with it. I can say though that because the browns also have a clicky feeling it may bother you in the same way. Not as much as the blues though because internally it does not have a separate mechanism that resets after the click (i just took a look at the pictures of blue and brown switches - don't quote me on this)

I will try and give you feedback once I get an mxred board. But I don't have money for that yet right now. Theoretically I think the red will be better, because it's linear and very light - but I'm just guessing. I however will not recommend any type of switch that is tough to press, you need your finger stamina to last more than a few sets.

I am NOT saying to listen to me and disregard everyone's advice all because I play a rhythm game. I am saying that this is still a question of your own personal preference.
« Last Edit: Mon, 23 January 2012, 19:04:21 by shogrran »
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Offline hazeluff

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #19 on: Mon, 23 January 2012, 19:02:08 »
I've just downloaded the game to play... @_@ damn you guys....I still need to finish katawa shoujo
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Offline Badkarma

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #20 on: Tue, 24 January 2012, 18:27:38 »
Quote from: shogrran;497167
EDIT: WHOOOPS SORRY! Didn't read your post above that says you already got the razer bw keyboard. Sorry I was late in giving the feedback below. I might have saved you the trouble of buying the razer bw.

Here is what I say. Before you listen to any advice in this thread you might want to ask if they also tried playing a rhythm game, and a similar if not the same rhythm game that you are playing. And even if they are playing a rhythm game, its still a matter of how you play. Why don't you ask the person in that video for feedback regarding if he likes the mxblue switches on the razer bw?

I also play a rhythm game, unfortunately probably not like the game you are playing. (DBAudition if you have heard of that). I have a razer blackwidow that uses blues but the tactile feedback DOESN'T help a single bit. For one  if you're wearing headphones or playing the music loudly, you wont even hear the click. The reset of the "click" part doesn't help when spamming keys as you have to really release the key to make sure it resets, I have tried to "hover" over the "click" part of the switch to spam a key quicker but that lead me to double pressing when I didn't intend to. You can take a look at the video and see that he is really lifting his fingers from the keys. If you don't play that way you might want to try a different switch. The only benefit I really get is the softness of the keys and that the feeling of a key press is the same every time.

The mxblues will still be better than rubber domes this I can tell you. I have used a variety of cheap and expensive rubber domes before I got the razer bw and the razer bw beats them all when it comes to the feel. (i have tried a4tech keyboards, scissor hp laptop keyboards, razer arctosa keyboards, etc)

I have an mxbrown keyboard but it doesn't have a numpad so I can't play the game I am playing with it. I can say though that because the browns also have a clicky feeling it may bother you in the same way. Not as much as the blues though because internally it does not have a separate mechanism that resets after the click (i just took a look at the pictures of blue and brown switches - don't quote me on this)

I will try and give you feedback once I get an mxred board. But I don't have money for that yet right now. Theoretically I think the red will be better, because it's linear and very light - but I'm just guessing. I however will not recommend any type of switch that is tough to press, you need your finger stamina to last more than a few sets.

I am NOT saying to listen to me and disregard everyone's advice all because I play a rhythm game. I am saying that this is still a question of your own personal preference.

Stamina hasn't really been an issue for me with the blues so far. However, they have proven to be problematic with "streams" in osu "long lines of steady paced alternating key presses" where I don't quite pull my finger up enough to reset the switch, otherwise, in mini streams (like 5-7 key presses) and triplets have been a breeze and noticed an all around increase in my performance in such situations. I think the increase in performance could be partially due to increased confidence knowing my key presses have actuated instead of hammering down into the rubber dome hoping they activated and having to acknowledge the keypress in-game to subconsciously see if it actuated...if ya know what I mean. You're likely correct on your assumption of reds being better, which is what I starting leaning to the second I played with these switches as well. Like you say, when playing a rhythm game, the tactile feel is non existant...usually hitting the keys so fast that they don't even matter. I usually wear headphones, so I don't hear the click at all either. I'll likely sit on this board awhile and see if I can't get used to it...I would've asked the kid in that video, but unfortunately he only speaks Korean :P

Offline shogrran

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #21 on: Tue, 24 January 2012, 22:56:44 »
Quote from: Badkarma;497996
Stamina hasn't really been an issue for me with the blues so far. However, they have proven to be problematic with "streams" in osu "long lines of steady paced alternating key presses" where I don't quite pull my finger up enough to reset the switch, otherwise, in mini streams (like 5-7 key presses) and triplets have been a breeze and noticed an all around increase in my performance in such situations. I think the increase in performance could be partially due to increased confidence knowing my key presses have actuated instead of hammering down into the rubber dome hoping they activated and having to acknowledge the keypress in-game to subconsciously see if it actuated...if ya know what I mean. You're likely correct on your assumption of reds being better, which is what I starting leaning to the second I played with these switches as well. Like you say, when playing a rhythm game, the tactile feel is non existant...usually hitting the keys so fast that they don't even matter. I usually wear headphones, so I don't hear the click at all either. I'll likely sit on this board awhile and see if I can't get used to it...I would've asked the kid in that video, but unfortunately he only speaks Korean :P

Right on the mark! :D Sometime in the future I will get a full mx red board to test out on Dance Battle Audition and see if it does play better on spam keys. I'll try and let you know but that will be in a very long time ahead as right now I haven't got the cash. That is really the only problem with the blues - the reset concern. Everything else you'll definitely like - even the softness of the press. The blues are really the epitome of a mechanical switch for the cherry mx switches.

One more thing though... the bw is a good board overall but I did encounter one pesky little problem. I don't know if its a problem with the firmware itself or just a powersupply problem of my computer.

My computer is plugged into a wall socket with two power outlets. The other poweroutlet is being used by a refrigerator. Everytime the fridge motor "clocks down" I guess the power fluctuates a bit and it affects the psu of my computer. But what is strange is that the bw never really recovers and you have to reseat the usb cable. All my other usb devices work fine but whenever that happens the bw is unable to use the macro keys . The drivers reset I think. I'd try and explain in more detailed  way if you encounter this problem. But I doubt you will.
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Offline Chron-O-John

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #22 on: Wed, 25 January 2012, 15:12:39 »
Just downloaded the game and made my first tries..

Wow so many colors and fast.. just crazy!

Like the game.
« Last Edit: Wed, 25 January 2012, 15:20:04 by Chron-O-John »

Offline Chron-O-John

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #23 on: Wed, 25 January 2012, 16:20:36 »
Okay, my finger already hurts ;)

I know, that you already have cherry mx blues. Anyways, i find that topic interesting, so I post my thaughts:

I've tried a few Keyboards. Here is my Ranking beginning with the WORST (was a surprise for me ;)

MX Black < White ALPS < Rubberdome

So rubberdome are the best so far as I tend so slam the Keys. The actuation at the bottom comes in handy here.  I'm typing on it right now: cough...

Black ALPS and my brand-new(old)Blue ALPS to come...

Offline Badkarma

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #24 on: Wed, 25 January 2012, 20:52:37 »
Quote from: Chron-O-John;498952
Okay, my finger already hurts ;)

I know, that you already have cherry mx blues. Anyways, i find that topic interesting, so I post my thaughts:

I've tried a few Keyboards. Here is my Ranking beginning with the WORST (was a surprise for me ;)

MX Black < White ALPS < Rubberdome

So rubberdome are the best so far as I tend so slam the Keys. The actuation at the bottom comes in handy here.  I'm typing on it right now: cough...

Black ALPS and my brand-new(old)Blue ALPS to come...


I'd have to say you'll notice the advantages more in higher tier play. Doing the 1-4 star maps, rubber domes are just fine. However, at higher beats per minute and fast changing patterns, rubber domes quickly become obsolete. It's a really fun game, I'd recommend everyone try it! However even as fun as it is, it's also just as unforgiving and will frustrate the hell out of you at times. :)

Offline shogrran

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Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #25 on: Wed, 25 January 2012, 23:15:30 »
Quote from: Chron-O-John;498952
Okay, my finger already hurts ;)
I know, that you already have cherry mx blues. Anyways, i find that topic interesting, so I post my thaughts:
I've tried a few Keyboards. Here is my Ranking beginning with the WORST (was a surprise for me ;)
MX Black < White ALPS < Rubberdome
So rubberdome are the best so far as I tend so slam the Keys. The actuation at the bottom comes in handy here.  I'm typing on it right now: cough...
Black ALPS and my brand-new(old)Blue ALPS to come...

It is still good that we have people who try and test the game. Not everyone has every kind of switch type available.
In my experience I have tried several rubber domes, mx blues and mxbrowns. The order is Mxbrowns > MxBlues > Rubber domes. MxBrown being the best I have tried.

I have been playing rhythm games for about 4 years in total now, and here is what I have learned regarding keyboards from experience.

The rubber domes aren't so bad if they are good quality rubber domes and if they are new. Once the rubber gets old though, no matter how good quality the keyboard is the 'feel' changes. Another thing that is not ideal about rubber domes is that there is a tendency for the feel of each key press to be different. In mechanical keyboards a key press feel is pretty much the same all through out the board and even as the board ages it doesn't change as much.

One more thing that can be said about rubber domes and I consider this as the most relevant to rhythm games is that the key activates at the bottom, unlike mechanical switches where the 'actuation' point (I hope I am using the term right) is near the top of the press. Rhythm games are very much dependent on the how quick the player can react to a game. In many cases they require you to press a key at the same time a command appears on screen -- and within milliseconds of timing difference from a "cool" rating to a "perfect" rating. (@Badkarma  please correct me if this is not the case with osu) And the microsecond of difference relies on the distance between your finger can press the button, and the distance the button travels up until it actuates.

What players usually does, is they adjust when they press the key... long time players do this consciously and new players do this unconsciously... they press the key earlier by a few milliseconds than the supposed "perfect" timing - and when the key actually actuates.. then "perfect". This is more noticeable in slow bpms than in fast bpms.

But nothing really beats the 1:1 ratio of when you press the key -  the key actuates. Although this is still not the case with mechanical keyboards it is definitely better than with rubber domes where the key actuates at the bottom. Even if the player actually still bottoms out the mechanical switches while playing, it really helps the timing of the player since it moves the 'actuation' point closer to when the player actually presses the key. This makes timing a lot more easier than having to account for the travel distance of the key.

Other people may have different experiences with this I am not sure.

The reset problem with blues however is its weak point when it comes to rhythm games. As mentioned in one of the posts above, in order to be totally sure - the key has to be released totally for mxblues. This is quite a problem when spamming keys as you have to raise your finger more than when you are using mxreds or mxblacks. For blues there are times that the key can be actuated without having to reset the click part but if @Badkarma can back me up on this - this is not really a 'stable' way of pressing the mxblue keys. The problem is still present a bit with mxbrowns but not as much since there is no mechanism for the 'click' sound for the mxbrowns. In my theory the mxreds will eliminate this totally because you can pretty much leave the key depressed a bit above when the key activates.. and then just 'vibrate' (for lack of a better term) your finger and it will spam better.

I will try once I get my hands on mx reds. (Any donations will be much appreciated)
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Offline Chron-O-John

  • Posts: 28
Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #26 on: Thu, 26 January 2012, 02:51:06 »
shoggran, thanks for your comments. I also recognized this when playing with the white ALPS. Higher levels are (yet) unplayable for me. but as I get better I hopfully get more different keyboards ;)

Offline OkGold

  • Posts: 52
Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #27 on: Thu, 26 January 2012, 13:27:55 »
Blacks! maybe with some O-rings?

Offline Badkarma

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 8
Switch for rythm game?
« Reply #28 on: Fri, 27 January 2012, 13:33:10 »
Quote from: shogrran;499283
It is still good that we have people who try and test the game. Not everyone has every kind of switch type available.
In my experience I have tried several rubber domes, mx blues and mxbrowns. The order is Mxbrowns > MxBlues > Rubber domes. MxBrown being the best I have tried.

I have been playing rhythm games for about 4 years in total now, and here is what I have learned regarding keyboards from experience.

The rubber domes aren't so bad if they are good quality rubber domes and if they are new. Once the rubber gets old though, no matter how good quality the keyboard is the 'feel' changes. Another thing that is not ideal about rubber domes is that there is a tendency for the feel of each key press to be different. In mechanical keyboards a key press feel is pretty much the same all through out the board and even as the board ages it doesn't change as much.

One more thing that can be said about rubber domes and I consider this as the most relevant to rhythm games is that the key activates at the bottom, unlike mechanical switches where the 'actuation' point (I hope I am using the term right) is near the top of the press. Rhythm games are very much dependent on the how quick the player can react to a game. In many cases they require you to press a key at the same time a command appears on screen -- and within milliseconds of timing difference from a "cool" rating to a "perfect" rating. (@Badkarma  please correct me if this is not the case with osu) And the microsecond of difference relies on the distance between your finger can press the button, and the distance the button travels up until it actuates.

What players usually does, is they adjust when they press the key... long time players do this consciously and new players do this unconsciously... they press the key earlier by a few milliseconds than the supposed "perfect" timing - and when the key actually actuates.. then "perfect". This is more noticeable in slow bpms than in fast bpms.

But nothing really beats the 1:1 ratio of when you press the key -  the key actuates. Although this is still not the case with mechanical keyboards it is definitely better than with rubber domes where the key actuates at the bottom. Even if the player actually still bottoms out the mechanical switches while playing, it really helps the timing of the player since it moves the 'actuation' point closer to when the player actually presses the key. This makes timing a lot more easier than having to account for the travel distance of the key.

Other people may have different experiences with this I am not sure.

The reset problem with blues however is its weak point when it comes to rhythm games. As mentioned in one of the posts above, in order to be totally sure - the key has to be released totally for mxblues. This is quite a problem when spamming keys as you have to raise your finger more than when you are using mxreds or mxblacks. For blues there are times that the key can be actuated without having to reset the click part but if @Badkarma can back me up on this - this is not really a 'stable' way of pressing the mxblue keys. The problem is still present a bit with mxbrowns but not as much since there is no mechanism for the 'click' sound for the mxbrowns. In my theory the mxreds will eliminate this totally because you can pretty much leave the key depressed a bit above when the key activates.. and then just 'vibrate' (for lack of a better term) your finger and it will spam better.

I will try once I get my hands on mx reds. (Any donations will be much appreciated)


You're correct, Osu has 3 levels of accuracy, 300 points (perfect) 100 (slightly off) 50 (noticebly off but doesn't quite break combo). The timings become less obvious in higher play as it just starts to come natural once you gain the ability to read whats going on and properly relay it. Blues can indeed actuate without being fully released, but its rather finicky and unreliable...you can just tell it just doesn't want to reactuate until you fully let go and press again.

I believe I stated earlier that I had a low profile rubber dome I used specifically to play Osu with due to its reduced travel and ontop of that, I had glued little metal balls underneath the keycaps to further reduce travel to about 1-2mm, it also seemed to help actuate the presses a bit better but misses with rubber domes in high tier play seem to be inevitable...there's always that ONE press out of 500 that for one reason or another just doesn't register..so figured I'd give mechs a whirl and see what they had to offer. If I catch a cheap red keyboard I might pick it up to see if it better suits Osu but for now I'm satisfied with blues...it's better than my other two rubber dome keyboards I was swapping out anyways. Overall I've bested some of my best scores on maps and can keep up with faster maps alot better, I feel I'm playing ahead of the maps now instead of lagging behind or just trying to keep up. I get on a roll every now and then and can do some pretty nice beat streaming, I'm sure eventually as I adjust more to the playstyle of blues I'll get it going. Until then I'll just keep my eyes peeled for a reds to try out and see how that goes, then I'll just sell the BW if I take a liking to the reds. Still waiting on some O-rings I ordered from a forum member here, I'd like to see how they effect the overall feel of the board.