And it's that "help me pick a keyboard" thread again

[Rasori]

Hey everyone, new guy here. I've been doing some poking around and I'd like some help honing in on my first mechanical purchase.

Unfortunately, I'm broke (college student from the US studying in the UK), and I really would prefer a US keyboard layout despite needing to buy in the UK/EU.

It seems if I focus on "I'm broke," I find myself stuck choosing between the Razer BlackWidow and the Steelseries 6GV2, and even at that price (~70GBP) I'm not pleased to be putting out that much money for what I'm getting. I do believe that switching to mechanical is going to be a wonderful experience and worth the investment, but if I'm going to be spending the money I want to be picking a keyboard that really matches what I'm looking for, not one which only kind of gives me what I want.

So, my idea instead is to find "the ideal keyboard" and then figure out some way of saving for it. Hopefully, having a specific keyboard in mind will make that part of it easier.

Switches: Cherry Blue or Brown (I like the sound of the blues, I'm sure my girlfriend won't... so both are on the table )
Size: Full. I prefer to have the option of a number pad. If there's a keyboard in mind that has EVERYTHING else but the keypad, do feel free to share it.
Rollover: 6/NKRO preferred.
USB Hub: Big plus, as I'll often be plugging into my 13" MBP (which only has 2 USB ports)
Macro Keys: a handful would be nice.
Key Layout: US or US International - QWERTY or blank

Note on rollover: I don't type fast enough that I ever run into rollover problems, nor have I ever run into any issues while gaming. I fear that as my typing improves (I'm making a concerted effort to improve my speed for home-row touchtyping rather than the voodoo I've used all my life) I may start running into this issue, but if keyboard experts like yourselves encourage me that 6NKRO is not necessary then I'll take your word on it.

Finally, my intended use is mostly for programming and typing, and some gaming.

This post is primarily for getting recommendations on which keyboards best match my preferences, secondarily for determining where I can obtain said keyboards from within the UK, and lastly for confirming that the features I'm requesting seem to mesh well with the usage I intend.

Thanks for your time and input!

[fossala]

You best bet in the UK keep your eye on ebay, we don't get many cheap boards over here. Either that or push up your amount to £100 and order a filco from thekeyboardco.

[Rasori]

When talking about mechanical keyboards, just how heavy is "heavy," really? I've avoided the idea of bringing one with me from the States the next time I fly home, but if I'm overestimating the weight I do believe the cost and choice is much better (especially considering my layout preference) if I buy it over there.

[Tony]

With BWE or 6gv2 as a first mech keyboard, you will definitely be dissatisfied and buy another keyboard later.

Save your money and choose a Filco, since you will buy it anyway, and buy it as the first save you money in the long run.

[Culinia]

The tenkeyless models weigh 953g, the official value for full size is 1.2kg...
See here for details.

[M9Prime]

I have a few Keyboards, And I gotta say non of them have macro keys, I dont like Black widows there just not reliable, I find my Meka g1 is great though those are blacks, If you're really on a budget go for The CM Storm Rapid Fire, it's 66.96 at directcanada.com and its blues, no num pad no macro keys but the build quality and portability is flawless i use it as my school keyboard because it can fit right in my bag and i know it wont break due to the build quality, My Meka g1 is my home keyboard for typing, not sure why i like linear keys for gaming and typing

[Henry Allen Venture]

One thing with the USB hub, OP, be aware that they might not be as useful as you think. Before I had mechanical keyboards, I used a Logitech G110, which had two USB ports. The only thing is, these weren't powered, so they were next to useless. Even a 1GB flash drive with no LED drew too much power to be used with the ports on the G110.

I'm not certain, but I think you need to look at keyboards that have USB pass-through, i.e. a separate USB cable that goes from the hub on the keyboard through to the computer, in addition to the cable for the keyboard itself (the G110 did not have this). I don't know of any keyboards which have this feature, though. I know they exist, but I've never really looked into it. I just thought it was something you should be aware of.

The other thing is, if you've only got two USB ports on your MBP, you'll be using them both with a keyboard like this, and you might only have one or two USB ports on the keyboard, so you're really only breaking even.

[fossala]

I plug a kensington slimblade into the hub on the back of a kinesis

[Saviant]

I would suggest the Filco too, I have had the Steelseries 6Gv2, Blackwidow Ultimate and currently running with a Filco Tenkeyless Brown and you really can't go wrong with the choice of one. The only other thing is maybe look at one of the Coolermaster Mechanicals because I am reading they are pretty good.

[Surly73]

MX brown is a pretty safe choice.  I believe that blues have a larger difference in the switch make/break point (i.e. press vs. release) that could drive you nuts during gaming.  Considering that you've also expressed potential concerns about noise, brown is probably the way to go.

I echo what some others have said about the USB hub - drop that from your list of requirements.  The best-typing keyboards don't have this, and it's a requirement that really ties your hands (and may not even work well for you)

KRO can't be generalized because it depends on the specific matrix used by the keyboard designer.  My model M is 2KRO officially, but I had no problems whatsoever when I played a couple of games on it.  I had a Logitech Illuminated which was also 2KRO, and right away I noticed I couldn't SHIFT+W+SPACE.  "2KRO" does not mean "2 keys at the same time".  It means "guaranteed AT LEAST 2 keys at the same time".  Shopping for 6KRO or higher gives a certain level of comfort.  In general NKRO is only available on PS2, and anyone advertising NKRO on USB (or 18KRO on USB like Leopold) is doing some controller tricks that *might* cause problems down the road depending on your platform and OS.

If you want to save money, have patience and watch the classifieds here for good product.  If you have instant gratification tendancies or don't like used gear there is the keyboardco.  Filco's probably my top pick if you want a Cherry switch (with pingi-ness being the major gripe I've seen about MJ2s).  I've seen a lot more complaining about Leopold and controller problems or sticky stabilizers (Cherry stabilizers vs. Costar) but there are also lots of satisfied Leopold owners.  I believe Rosewill and Das are less expensive ways to whet your appetite, especially because more major retailers (like newegg) stock them and sometimes put them on deep discount.

There's always a model M too.  Forget all that USB stuff without an adapter though.

[Rasori]

Thanks everyone, lots of replies and useful input. It sounds like dropping the USB hub is a given -- I should just be investing in a hub direct into the computer, where I can get a powered USB 2.0 hub and not worry about incompatibilities. (I'm getting by with a USB 1.1 hub at the moment, which would be nearly useless except it was free.) I'm glad to see a lot of support behind Filco, it seems like the number one recommendation as an "entry-level" mechanical. I can also give up the macro keys mostly given the lack of availability -- I don't use them now so I can get by without them. Besides, that's what VIM is for

It's looking like I'm going to save up/keep my eyes open for one of these: FKBN104M/EFB2, with a Das Keyboard serving as a backup if I wind up back in the States with some money. These keyboards are heavy but not so ridiculous as to be the difference between under- and over-weight luggage. If I do go with Das, any recommendations on whether to go Ultimate or Professional? I'm a decent touch-typist but I do have the typical issues with typing symbols which I hear going with blank keycaps will help alleviate. Plus I can go with any keyboard layout I want without having the labels confuse me.

Thanks for all your help!

[M9Prime]

About the USB situation das usbs are weaker then most. The meka g1 has a dedicated cable to power two  2 usbs and they work flawlessly. Do some research

[alaricljs]

On the NKRO:  I've never heard of a typist having issues with rollover, it's the gamers that want to be able to either play some weird game with 4 friends on the same KB or somehow manage to rocket-jump-crouch-strafe-weaponswitch-wtf in one keymash.

For the USB stuff, it seems that mechanical keyboards are getting the short end of the tech-stick.  Either the ports are weak, or you have a second cable for the ports.  One of the things I loved about my Dell SK-8135 RD was that it had a couple USB ports integrated, only used 1 cable and I could use anything except a HDD on it without issue.  I used my USB headset, flash drives of all kinds, a flash card reader, and of course my trackball.

All that said you might want to consider having a separate USB hub.  Depending on which KB you go with you might consider modding the hub onto or into it.

[hazeluff]

Doesn't the Razer BlackWidow fufill what he needs?

Switches: Blue
Size: Full
Rollover: Only thing I think it's missing
USB Hub: Has 1 slot
Macro Keys: 6 of them
Key Layout: US or US International - QWERTY

Also it's fairly cheaper than a lot of boards.

It's not the classiest of boards, but it fits almost 100% with your spec and is a good price.

Just be careful where you buy it from. Alot of UK vendors will carry UK layout, and you need check with the seller its US layout. If you get it straight from Razer you can choose.

[shogrran]

hmm how about a ducky? are ducky's really so bad that no one recommends them? Its cheaper than the razer blackwidow thats for sure.

[Surly73]

Thanks everyone, lots of replies and useful input.

Good observations, except I wouldn't call a Filco an "entry level" mech keyboard.  The only consistent complaint seems to be about their key cap quality and a "ping" fad last year.  Among the Cherry MX crowd (Topres and ALPS are another sphere entirely) it seems that most people compare other boards to the Filcos.  It's not that they're better than everyone else, but they seem to be the board against which most are compared.

[Tony]

Have you typed on a Filco lately?

[rhizo]

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DAS-Professionall-Mechanical-Keyboard-UK-Layout-Only-used-week-/330678688706?pt=UK_Computing_ComputerComponents_KeyboardsMice&hash=item4cfdfc5bc2#ht_744wt_1185

its going to be cheaper, and just as high quality as everything else, just depends on if you care more about the shiny finish than the keyboard itself.. due to its one week of usage it will be a (relativly) cheap, yet very reliable keyboard