need advice on first mechanical

[ballzac]

Hi,
I am planning on buying a mechanical keyboard soon, and I need some advice.

I only found out about mechanical keyboards recently. I was actually looking for a blank keyboard, which inevitably led me to the Das Ultimate. I've looked into some other keyboards, but the Das is still looking pretty good to me. One of my main concerns, though, is that so many people here say Filco is superior to Das. I notice that most of the threads here claiming issues with the Das are a couple of years old, and I've read more recent posts saying that Das have fixed up problems that they had in the earlier versions. Is the high level of respect for Filco over Das just a hangover from the past? Or are there still good reasons to go for Filco other than aesthetics?

I use my keyboard mostly for coding and typing, with the very occasional FPS gameplay. I work mostly from home, so this is where the keyboard will be, and volume isn't really a problem. For these reasons, and after reading a few reviews, I am going to go with Cherry blues.

As I said earlier, I want a blank keyboard, basically for the coolness and geek factor. They don't need to be black, but I would avoid grey or beige. I realise key caps can be bought separately, and I reckon metallic ones would be cool to get somewhere down the line. But I am on a budget here, and buying key caps separately would also add cost. I am after a 104 key layout because it's what I'm used to (I'm on a razer lycosa at the moment) and I do use the numpad quite often. Again I have budget constraints. and a separate numpad would be cool, but would add cost.

The lycosa has very low profile keys, so the higher profile of the caps on the mechanical keys will probably take me a little getting used to, but it sounds like it would be worth it. So basically, I'm mostly after some advice on this, I know people disagree on whether the Das or the Filco is better, but it's possible people will have some suggestions of other keyboards I don't know about, or comment on some other aspect that I haven't thought about yet, so it's worth getting opinions from you guys. I would also like to get the keyboard from Australia if possible, to avoid any problems that may occur with international delivery, and also postage costs. These keyboards don't seem to be that easy to find, but I found an Australian site (http://www.auspcmarket.com.au/products/211/?page=1) that has both Das and Filco. The problem with the Filco is that at this site, they don't seem to have the blank key version. As I already said, buying them separately would add additional cost that I can't really afford at the moment.

The lycosa has a high gloss finish, and I'm fine with it, so I have no problem with the gloss finish on the Das. More of a problem on the lycosa is the rubber coating on the keys, which causes dust and hair to stick to them. Obviously this won't be a problem with the Das or Filco keys.

Most likely I will be going with the Das, but definitely look forward to hearing some advice from people here

Cheers

[czarek]

Get yourself Model M or Unicomp if you've never used mechanical keyboard. That's the most mechanical (and veeery satisfying) feel you can get in any keyboard. They may not be best gaming keyboards but are definitely usable in FPS/RTS, unless you're really hardcore gamer.

[mkawa]

the it turns out that the switch action is far more important than the look of the keys and casing. if you can, try some cherry blues and a buckling spring and see which you prefer.

[Lanx]

looks like you're an aussie
http://www.ebay.com.au/sch/i.html?_nkw=ibm+model+m+keyboard&_frs=1&_trksid=p3286.c0.m359
a few model m's for ebaying available.

model m is a must (altho if you don't have the budget and really know you want some type of cherry board, forgo a model m for now).

[ballzac]

Very interesting that you guys are mostly recommending the buckled spring switches. Because Cherry switches are the first ones I came across in my 'research', I hadn't really broadened my search to include other types of switches. I also looked at the different switch designs in animations, and the buckled springs looked kind of like they would be prone to failure, which is obviously erroneous now that I actually read into it more.

the it turns out that the switch action is far more important than the look of the keys and casing. if you can, try some cherry blues and a buckling spring and see which you prefer.

Well, that's up to the individual I guess, and aesthetics are somewhat important to me. If the Model M is undeniably, and substantially, better than the keyboards I was looking at, then I would go with it, but considering it goes against at least three aesthetic concerns of mine, and there are definitely people who say that the cherry switches are great, I think its unlikely I would go with the model M, though its definitely something I will look into. It is unlikely I will get a chance to try them out before buying.

Thanks for the advice guys. It's definitely given me food for thought.

[IvanIvanovich]

You could go for a Cherry G80-3000LPCXY-2.

[ballzac]

I was a little put off the cherry blacks, because a lot of people seem not to like them.

[IvanIvanovich]

There are haters, but they aren't that bad. Coming from domes, blacks will be similar force but easier on the fingers since you don't have to bottom out to actuate. Blacks were my first MX, and only now that I am used to reds as my daily board do I think they are a little on the heavy side. Another thing, with Cherry G80 is they are pcb mount, and it is very easy to swap out the stems and springs to try different switch. G80 is a great starter board for that reason, easy to mod. If it turns out you don't like blacks, you can get different stem and spring for usually around $25-30 instead of paying much more for a completely different board or doing a lot of solder work.
Alternately you might look around used markets for a Das II, its the exact same board but comes with mx blues.

[ballzac]

Ah, cool. Thanks for the advice

[ballzac]

Welcome to Geekhack!

http://geekhack.org/showthread.php?29631-Ripster-s-Blue-Cherry-Showdown-Filco-vs-Das-Keyboards

Cheers ripster. I already had a look at that comparison. It's very helpful.

Do the filco's come with a version with completely blank keys? I read a few posts that mentioned blank keys, but all I can find is the "ninja" ones that still have labels on them, just on the front rather than the top, but I really want completely blank ones, and if I was totally convinced that a keyboard that came with labelled keys was the one to go for, I would have to fork out for a set of blank keys as well.

[alaricljs]

It's called Otaku and for some reason there are none listed on Amazon, that's a bit of a surprise really.  And KeyboardCo doesn't have them listed any more either... wtf?

Here's a review of one tho

[ballzac]

Ah, thanks alaricljs.

[ballzac]

I've been having a bit of a rethink. It would be very convenient for me to have a tenkeyless and a separate numpad. I think I have my heart set on the cherry blues at this stage still. The only problem with the tenkeyless is that if I'm buying in australia, it looks like the only options come with letters on the keycaps. So I'd have to fork out for both a numeric keypad, and new keycaps, which is pushing it a bit as far as my budget goes.

Also, the keypads at AusPC don't look that great. I think I would really want a keypad with the same (or at least similar) switches.

At this stage I am still tossing up between the Das ultimate, filco/ebay-keycaps, and filco-tenkeyless/ebay-keycaps/numpad

[longweight]

If you like dust and fingerprints then get the DAS.

[Caaaarrrt]

Another good place in Australia to buy keyboards from is http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=113_1276

They don't have Filco, but you could have a look at the CM Quickfire Rapid or Leopolds and with the money you have saved you should be able to get new keycaps.

[ballzac]

Hey thanks for the link. That's broadened my options. They've got numpads too. I'm going back to original plan though I think. The numpads are almost as expensive as the keyboard themselves. Another option is to get a tenkeyless and simply not use a numpad. Most of my work I am using the number row anyway because if, for example, I'm writing some code, it will be a few numbers in the middle of something that has letters and other symbols in it. But quite often I will use the numpad for things like testing code, where I might run my code as a console app and enter a series of numerical parameters with the numpad. If I found I was missing the numpad too much I could always buy one afterwards.

Having said that, I think I will most likely end up going with the Das. It will work out the cheapest in the longrun (apart from the ones you mention Caaaarrrt. I'll have to look into those before I decide ) I got plenty to think about now though. Thanks to everyone for your help.

[Tony]

Can you touch type? If so, brown switch is very light on your weak pinky fingers.

Otherwise, blue switch is more tactile and heavier, better for people who hunt and peck, since they mostly use stronger index and middle fingers.

[ballzac]

Yes, I touch type. My choice of keycap design is a clue :biggrin:

I hadn't really considered that issue, because so many people recommend the blues for typing. The main thing that draws me to the blues over the browns is that I like the idea of getting a nice "click". It's a real shame I won't have the opportunity to test these  different boards out. AusPCmarket has both versions at the same price, so there's no problem there.

[Tony]

I touch type and I get both blue and brown. You will likely buy both switches in the future too since both are equally popular for touch typers, so it doesn't matter which switch you buy first anyway.

[N8N]

I find blue surprisingly more tactile, but at the same time they are "wobblier."  I used to think that tactility was where it was at, and I still have a preference for clears and buckling springs, but I still find even blacks (currently typing this on a Wyse board) to be preferable to most rubber domes.  After a while your fingers learn where the actuation point is without the tactility, so you don't bottom out hard like you do on rubber dome boards, making it easier on the fingers (a big part of the reason I started looking into alternatives to the $5 "gimme" keyboards in the first place.)

[ballzac]

I won't bother telling you where that is.   Nobody reads it anyway.

Hey, thanks. I had actually looked at that, but I think my eyes must have skimmed over PC Case Gear because it's not a hyperlink :redface: By the way, it seems like mechkeyboards is no longer around, unless there's just an issue with my DNS or something. Cheers.

Read The Blessed Wiki (RTBW)

Main reason I felt comfortable posting stupid questions here while my research was still in its infancy, was that I saw that most threads here people are doing the exact same thing. I guess this is not by design.

[ballzac]

Well, I did a bit of a turn around and ordered the majestouch 1 tenkeyless, and some blank keys from wasd. I was partly influenced by the fact that the Das were currently out of stock, and I'm impatient . I also began to realise that I use the numpad so rarely that I should be able to adjust to using the other number keys for the same purposes. I have limited desk space, and the Filco has a very small footprint. I also thought it would be cooler to have white keys than black, so the extra money spent on keys isn't a total waste. If I get sick of not having a numpad, I can get a separate one at a later date. I'm sure I would be happy with any good mechanical, so I'm sure I won't be disappointed. Thanks again to everyone for all the help and advice .
Cheers,
Zac

[eisenhower]

Get yourself Model M or Unicomp if you've never used mechanical keyboard. That's the most mechanical (and veeery satisfying) feel you can get in any keyboard. They may not be best gaming keyboards but are definitely usable in FPS/RTS, unless you're really hardcore gamer.

I agree. If you're going to use a mechanical keyboard for the first time, use one that is unabashedly mechanical. Buckling springs feel and sound awesome.

[ballzac]

So my first impressions are really positive. I love the compact size. I'm glad I went with the blues over the browns, because there's something really satisfying about that "click". My typing speed at the moment is about the same (65-70wpm) but I'm actually typing a lot faster, just that I'm used to the very low profile keys and I often hit a couple of keys at once and have to correct my mistakes. My fastest words have gone up from around 80wpm to over 100wpm, so I'm really stoked, because it means once I am used to the higher keys, my typing speed should go up significantly.

It's actually exceded my expectations. I'm sure that's not down to switch choice, but just going from rubber dome to any sort of mechanical.