Less than TKL like: Noppoo Choc Mini, Key Cool 84, KBT Race

[Kinaro]

Hi guys!

I'm looking for a high quality mechanical mini Keyboard, thats smaller than the TKL versions, but still has arrow keys.

The only keyboards that I know with that layout are: Noppoo Choc Mini, Key Cool 84, KBT Race.
Does/did anybody own all or two of those keyboards and is able to say which one has the best built quality? Or does someone know a quality brand, that built a keyboard with that kind of layout?

[TotalChaos]

Is a Key Cool 87 too big for you?

I might buy the backlit version for kicks, to use in my movie room.  If I get it I can totally tell you if it sux or not.

[Kinaro]

Actually the Key Cool 87 is too big, but I guess it is almost the same as the Key Cool 84 (except the 84 is smaller) so if the quality of the 87 is decent so will the 84.


Edit: Saw your typo But I'm interested in your opinion on the 87!

[Skull_Angel]

Keycool 87 is TKL, Keycool 84 is 75%. There are also some Cherry brand in 75% form factor as well as the Deck Ice 82, and a few korean customs (pricy though). There are others as well, but thoes are it for Cherry MX as far as I remember.

Edit: from a quality stand point, both the Keycool and Noppoo have very decent build quality (LEDs are questionable though). The Deck does as well, but has much better keycaps and LEDs. The quality on the Race seems to vary depending on who's manufacturing them at the time, iirc.

[Kinaro]

Keycool 87 is TKL, Keycool 84 is 75%. There are also some Cherry brand in 75% form factor as well as the Deck Ice 82, and a few korean customs (pricy though). There are others as well, but thoes are it for Cherry MX as far as I remember.

Edit: from a quality stand point, both the Keycool and Noppoo have very decent build quality (LEDs are questionable though). The Deck does as well, but has much better keycaps and LEDs. The quality on the Race seems to vary depending on who's manufacturing them at the time, iirc.

Thanks for the answer!

Would you prefer the Deck over the others? Price isn't my main concern.

About the "few korean customs", do you have more information about those? Quality, price, availability?

[davkol]

Keycool 87 is TKL, Keycool 84 is 75%. There are also some Cherry brand in 75% form factor as well as the Deck Ice 82, and a few korean customs (pricy though). There are others as well, but thoes are it for Cherry MX as far as I remember.

Edit: from a quality stand point, both the Keycool and Noppoo have very decent build quality (LEDs are questionable though). The Deck does as well, but has much better keycaps and LEDs. The quality on the Race seems to vary depending on who's manufacturing them at the time, iirc.

Would you prefer the Deck over the others? Price isn't my main concern.

It's available with linear switches only. Personally, I'm not a big fan of backlit keyboard, especially with blue LEDs. The layout is also a bit weird.

About the "few korean customs", do you have more information about those? Quality, price, availability?

Top-notch quality, price in a range similar to HHKB, availability... well, these boards are custom made.

[TotalChaos]

Another guy on the site told me that his Key Cool 87 NONbacklit version had "rough keys" and he wanted to replace them.

I forgot to ask him what he meant exactly by "rough keys".

[Kinaro]

About the "few korean customs", do you have more information about those? Quality, price, availability?

Top-notch quality, price in a range similar to HHKB, availability... well, these boards are custom made.

But where can I get them?

[Skull_Angel]

You can find them in a few places, I think mechanicalkeyboards.com should have them (the Deck); I much prefer the layout on the Keycool though, the Noppoo is very nice as well. The korean customs are nice, but for the price I'd rather custom mod the Keycool or Noppoo myself.

Iirc, curent versions of the Noppoo come stock with POM (black) or PBT (white) caps, and you can find the same for the Keycool. Unfortunately youu either need to go through a Taobao agent, ebay or Qtan's store to find them atm.

[davkol]

I guess you need contacts (in Korea or here). I don't really follow that kind of stuff due to lack of interest (ergonomic keyboards all the way).

[Kinaro]

Thanks again for all your answers!

I think I will go with the Key Cool 84 or Noppoo Choc Mini (not sure which I like more) and maybe mod it by myself, but wouldn't it be hard to find fitting caps for that kind of keyboard? Only replacing most and leave a few old caps looks kind of bad in my imagination.

Yea, importing them kinda sucks, especially since we have very high customs and taxes where I live (Germany), but I guess that's what you have to pay for special wishes!

[davkol]

Try ohmykb.com, I think they ship at least Noppoo Choc Mini from France. I bought mine from qtan, and didn't have to pay anything (electronics is custom-free in my country, and I didn't have to pay tax either). BTW I guess there's one choc for sale at DT.

[Skull_Angel]

Thanks again for all your answers!

I think I will go with the Key Cool 84 or Noppoo Choc Mini (not sure which I like more) and maybe mod it by myself, but wouldn't it be hard to find fitting caps for that kind of keyboard? Only replacing most and leave a few old caps looks kind of bad in my imagination.

Yea, importing them kinda sucks, especially since we have very high customs and taxes where I live (Germany), but I guess that's what you have to pay for special wishes!

You'll probably need to piece together sets, but it can be done.

[davkol]

I'm not sure if there are any replacement spacebars for these keyboards.

[Skull_Angel]

The Keycool uses a standard 6.25x spacebar, but the stabilizer stand-offs are ~1mm off from standard; not a big problem though.

[davkol]

Yep, I forgot about that, but noppoo is trickier.

[IvanIvanovich]

If you want to easily replace full set keycap, the Keycool 84 is your best answer. Choc mini has odd size space bar not on any other board, replacement impossible. Race has uncommon 1.5 key on top row which is highly problematic at best. Deck 82, replace keycap forget it, it has all sorts of strange keysize that are near impossible to source.

[davkol]

Spacebar on Noppoo Choc Mini is actually _very_ tricky. It's unique, but that also means AltGr is moved few milimeters to the left, which makes it more comfortable to reach (and I use AltGr all the time). It's PBT/POM, so it should last a while.

[Kinaro]

I found a review for the Key Cool 87, which I guess is the same except for the layout.

http://deskthority.net/news-reviews-f4/keycool-87-blue-mx-t2650.html

The reviewer said that the keys have uneven gabs, that concerns me a bit. Does that mean that the caps are wobbly or that the switches are uneven placed? Does someone know this? Is it the same for the Choc Mini?

Edit: I wish there were a high quality keyboard like filco but with 75% layout. Maybe I could even settle with a 60% "pure" layout, although I think I would miss the arrow keys. :/

[davkol]

First series had issues with spacing, but I've heard they've (more or less) fixed it since then.

I don't have problems like this with my choc, quality is OK.

[hluo87]

choc key caps are shorter than the rest....

[polpo]

I got a Choc Mini and a KeyCool 84 when they both were first released. When the Choc Mini first came out, it had a strange layout for Home/End, which has now been fixed. When the KeyCool 84 came out, it had ABS keycaps, which are now POM or PBT depending on color. With both of those issues fixed, the keyboards are pretty much identical in my mind (I don't care about custom keycaps).

[vivalarevolución]

I got a Choc Mini and a KeyCool 84 when they both were first released. When the Choc Mini first came out, it had a strange layout for Home/End, which has now been fixed. When the KeyCool 84 came out, it had ABS keycaps, which are now POM or PBT depending on color. With both of those issues fixed, the keyboards are pretty much identical in my mind (I don't care about custom keycaps).

The only difference now that the layouts are the same seems to be:

1. keycap quality
2. backlit keys on Keycool 84.
3.  And Noppoo is a bit cheaper because the lack of backlit keys, at least at the price I obtained the keyboard.

[davkol]

I got a Choc Mini and a KeyCool 84 when they both were first released. When the Choc Mini first came out, it had a strange layout for Home/End, which has now been fixed. When the KeyCool 84 came out, it had ABS keycaps, which are now POM or PBT depending on color. With both of those issues fixed, the keyboards are pretty much identical in my mind (I don't care about custom keycaps).

The only difference now that the layouts are the same seems to be:

1. keycap quality
2. backlit keys on Keycool 84.
3.  And Noppoo is a bit cheaper because the lack of backlit keys, at least at the price I obtained the keyboard.

Physical layouts are almost the same (spacebar on Keycool is Leopold-like, while the one on Choc Mini is completely non-standard), but Fn layers are different.

I'm not sure about keycaps... they're similar to Cherry profile, thick, only almost flat on the Choc Mini — IDK about Keycool.

Both Keycool 84 and Choc Mini exist in backlit versions. However, Keycool 84LED is more common.