having a hard time picking red or black switch as my first

[link_tree]

I'm having a hard time picking a mechanical switch. I'm looking for either a poker / brandless CM QFR / TKL Filco and im not sure if I should get a red or a black switch.
I'm coming from a rubber dome keyboard and the keys does have some resistance to them I don't know how the blacks and reds would feel in comparison.
I think I want something a little lighter but not too light.
what do you recommend?

[BlindRAGE606]

A unbranded QFR in Blues/Greens would be the best way to pop your cherry. Buy more expensive boards from there.

[cytoSiN]

If you want something a little lighter and you're coming from membrane and you want MX Cherry I recommend Browns.  That was my first experience, and I'm still using my browns at home for gaming/typing on the regular.  Agree that QFR is the way to go in terms of getting started at a reasonable price.

[jeroplane]

I think I want something a little lighter but not too light.

That makes it very difficult to decide indeed )

Seems like you are pretty set on linear switches. I would say go with the Reds. The Blacks may be too heavy if you are coming from an RD. Also, if you go with a Poker, you could always swap the springs out to convert Reds to Blacks. Black springs are much more readily available/cheaper as many have these lying around from modding their Black boards to other switches.

[link_tree]

thank you all for the quick replays.
I'm not set on linear but I heard the tactile ones are harder to double click rapidly and spam and I'll be using the keyboard for gaming as well. I don't know though whether it's true or not...
something I don't understand about the green switches is how hard to press are they because every where I look I see they have 85 grams actuation force, that's almost 2 times the force of the red switch. but then I hear people saying they love them and on the other hand many people find the black switch too heavy while it has only 60 grams... this is confusing

[Sifo]

Gaming go reds. If you're mixing in some typing go browns.

A lot easier when you tell us what you're using the board for   also its not true, but if you're new to mechanical keyboards it'll be more enjoyable I guess.

[KuhnTang]

I hate blacks, sounds racist, but in talking switches they are too hard to press.  You get tired of them really fast.  If you are looking for a lighter switch anyway, reds are the way to go for linear switches, however, I agree with the guy above, browns are better.  I think their is a shortage on browns so you better get them while you can.  I constantly go back and forth between Browns/Blues as being my favorite switch.

As for keyboard, I know they're filco clones, but I don't like the QFR, however a lot of people do.  I would just get the filco if you are restricted to the boards you suggested.  Why mess around with a knock off when you can have the real thing.

[precarious]

I always suggest browns as a first switch since they have some tactility, a medium amount of resistance, and they won't drive you insane with clicking (blues).  After using browns you'd probably know if you wanted to switch to something stiffer with the tactile bump (clears), or just get rid of it and move to linear switches with approximately the same resistance (red) or a little more (black).

If you're focusing on the bit about being "harder" to press rapidly, or something of that nature, I wouldn't buy into it.  I've never had any issues gaming with my Filco with brown switches, and it's definitely leaps ahead of a rubber dome board.

[link_tree]

the tactility(<--is that a word?) of the browns interfere with double clicking/key spamming? I know that the brown switches are built somewhat differently to the blues and have only a little bump

[stonejoint]

Just got my qfr black its nice but if you can handle softer go for reds ill order filco this timer orda ducky for leds

[Sifo]

the tactility(<--is that a word?) of the browns interfere with double clicking/key spamming? I know that the brown switches are built somewhat differently to the blues and have only a little bump

It's not as big of a bump as you think, people say blues have double clicking issues because of how they're built with the clicking mechanism but browns are fine. I have no issues double tapping on either and I personally don't feel that you should have any trouble double tapping on browns. Especially if you're mashing keys. Even in FPS you're fine.

[jdcarpe]

I started with a Filco TKL w/MX blacks. The reason I chose blacks is that I had tried typing on an old WYSE terminal board (not connected to anything, since it wasn't compatible), and I liked the feeling. Well, modern blacks aren't as nice as those vintage blacks were. I ended up returning the Filco to Amazon.

I now recommend MX Browns for anyone's first keyboard. They are a great all-around switch for typing/gaming/whatever. And they are still tied with MX Reds as my favorite switch. The tactile bump is very light. I tried a Poker with MX Reds after the Filco, and I didn't really like that, either. Felt almost wobbly. I now know that PLATE MOUNTED reds, like on a Filco, are the way to go for light linear action.

I obviously love the Filco TKL. I own 3 of them (all MX reds). It was 6, but I recently sold half of them off, since I can't use that many Filcos. The QFR is probably almost as good as the Filco (never owned a QFR), but I think many people eventually get a Filco, if only for the curiosity of what they are missing in a $150 keyboard versus a $75 keyboard.

Welcome to Geekhack, and good luck with your purchase!

[cytoSiN]

What games are you playing?  I spammed the crap out of my browns when I was playing WoW (I'm "sober" one year and six months now, thank you very much), and they never once caused me a problem.  I still love that keyboard even though it's an iOne...I guess I got lucky in terms of build quality and I like having something a little cheaper to beat the crap out of.  In my opinion you can't go wrong with browns if you're new to all of this.

[noisyturtle]

Black switches feel gross on my fingers and are the leading cause of whisker cancer in lemmings.

[Deicide]

its personal, all that stuff of what is better.
every one would say something else because of   diffrent taste.
in my opinion buy from wasd that starter pack and from there you will have better view point instead of buying blindly.
allso I got blacks as first keyboard and I love then, but for me they are 2 soft

[Turbo Slaab]

I constantly spam the spot button on bf3 with browns. I like the bump for spamming better than my qfr with blacks.

[Truday]

Well I have a few points of advice. You could go with Browns for your first switch as they are a highly recommended starting switch from from rubber domes. The tactile bump (won't notice it at all if spamming keys) does help ease the transition as it ever so SLIGHTLY resembles a rubber dome (taking cover! ) You could go with the Reds which I HIGHLY recommend if you are a gamer (I personally play WoW, Diablo 3, League of Legends, DoTa 2...) spamming keys is effortless and your hands will learn to type with a lot less effort. It really is like typing on a cloud of boobs. I've owned keyboards with all the main flavors of the Cherry MX line (Red, Browns, Blue, Black) and I can't say I would recommend Blacks. Of course everyone is different and many people enjoy Blacks, however, I would say the chances of you liking them is a lot lower then you not liking them. Also I'm the type of person that switches switches all the time. For gaming I primarily use Reds, and if I'm doing a lot of typing or just browsing the net I use Browns or Blues depending on how I feel. Blacks take awhile for your hands to get used to as they do require more force to type on and if I were to get used to Blacks and then wanted to switch to Reds... it wouldn't be as fast of a transition compared to the other 3 switches. You could also buy the switch sampler from WASD keyboards as others have mentioned, but it's not the same as actually trying out a keyboard for a few days.

I tried a lot of different keyboards and spent a lot of money paying return shipping and restocking fees. Hands down the best board for your buck is the CM QuickFire Rapid. The quality is second to none and is awesome to type on. I also like the Noppoo Choc Mini's layout for MMO's because the F keys are closer and the swapping ability between CTRL and Caps lock, but the quality isn't that good. Ultimately the choice is up to you, but honestly you can't go wrong with a CM QuickFire Rapid for your first keyboard. Best quality for a good price and even compared to really expensive computers. I can also confirm that Amazon.com and Newegg.com are shipping the new unbranded QF Rapids. Good luck.

-Truday

[iri]

can you recommend me a very high quality, buttery smooth mx red board?

[jdcarpe]

can you recommend me a very high quality, buttery smooth mx red board?

Here are 4 of them:

Filco FKBN87MRL/EB2
Filco FKBN87MRL/EFB2
Filco FKBN87MRL/EW2
Filco FKBN87MRL/EFW2

[Leewei]

I am using a filco with mx reds. I game a lot, specifically starcraft, cs, dota and I came from a rubber dome (dt-35) switching keyboards a month or so ago. The first few days will take some getting used to as you can accidentally click keys with how light the mx reds are. After you get used to it (good time ~ a week) and assuming your hands are familiar with where keys are positioned mx reds become a joy to game and to type. I've used mx blues and browns, and it is nice to have tactile feedback for typing but it wasn't a huge factor for me. I would still pick the reds anyday =D

[CPTBadAss]

If you've never actually typed on red/blacks, maybe you should go try some out. I know that if you go to a MicroCenter and ask nicely, they'll let you unbox the keyboards and let you try them out. BestBuy also stocks Razer Blackwidows which have blue switches, and the cases have the arrow keys exposed so you can try those as well. I don't think they have the versions with the browns though. If you're not lucky to have a MicroCenter near you and you don't really want blues/browns, maybe you can try ordering a sampler kit from WASDKeyboards. They send you a bunch of keycaps and o-rings, but they also send you a Red, Black, Brown, and Blue switch. You can play with them and see which one you like the most.

Personally? I don't like the linear feel of reds and blacks. But if I did have to pick one, I'd take the reds. I'd say for a first board, get Browns if you're worried about the bump. They have a nice tactile feel without the bump and a quieter sound.

[nullstring]

With browns: If you're using the keyboard "heavy-handed" like you would with games, then you hardly even notice the bump and it doesn't get in the way at all.

[IvanIvanovich]

My only advice I will give, is go for a board with PCB mount like inexpensive used Cherry G80, not plate mount as your first board. It's super easy to exchange the stems and springs in the switches and give them a real try out. Give each type a few weeks and trade the stems and springs for the next one you want to try. Then if you want to, buy a more expensive board once you actually know what you like.

[jdcarpe]

^ I wish someone had given me this advice when I started this hobby.

[IvanIvanovich]

Coming from one that has owned probably in the range of 40 keyboards since I discoverd this forum... lol. I only have like 13 or so right now... hahahaha.

[KuhnTang]

Coming from one that has owned probably in the range of 40 keyboards since I discoverd this forum... lol. I only have like 13 or so right now... hahahaha.

I'm curious as to which keyboards someone with your experience keeps out of the 40?  i.e. which keyboards would you recommend, what's your favorite?

[IvanIvanovich]

I have 2 Pokers, and the rest of them are vintage mostly Cherry G80, except for a weird POS matrix keyboard with all 1.5 keys and a Chicony 5161CT that I'm working on something special with as a custom.
My favorites are my KBC Pokers with Cherry doubleshots, Cherry G80-1861HAU, and of course my Cherry ESA-3000HASRO. I favor linear and clicky switches, but red most of all.

[link_tree]

thank you for all the input guys!
I am not a very picky person. I believe that the first switch and keyboard I'll end up with will be the last until it will not work anymore then I'll have to replace it but with mechanical I heard it could take a few decades. makes you wonder what would become of keyboards in the next 10-20 years they will probably install chips in our brains that can transmit our thoughts to a receiver connected to the computer. 

[jdcarpe]

makes you wonder what would become of keyboards in the next 10-20 years they will probably install chips in our brains that can transmit our thoughts to a receiver connected to the computer. 

Keyboard. How quaint!

[SmallFry]

makes you wonder what would become of keyboards in the next 10-20 years they will probably install chips in our brains that can transmit our thoughts to a receiver connected to the computer. 

Keyboard. How quaint!

What happens when I get keybored?

[jdcarpe]

You go to longweight's web page.

(That's www.key-bored.net, for anyone who doesn't get it.)

[SmallFry]

eye ceee waht yew deed thar!

[RougeR]

go for blues if your going mx, good first experience, or go for clears.

[link_tree]

ain't considering blues at all and clears are MIA everywhere I look

[noisyturtle]

You could just say screw all this talk, and go with a BS board. A manly man of a BS board.

[stonejoint]

I am interesting with mech keyboards about 3 months from now, got my 1st mechanical kb as razer blackwidow blue swtich, IT was ok but software was crap also keycaps and feeling was not that solid, but It was way better than my membrane board so I thought It is really good. After a little search in geek hack I saw blackwidow is a disspoinment so I got offered Cm reds or blacks (mostly reds) But I got blacks,

As my 1st linear switch. It is very good keyboard if I have to compare with blackwidow shape size layout bigger shift etc.

But after you get your 1st swtich youll get an addiction and you are going to get othert switches too so go for red then youll find your way.

[daerid]

Is that an Apple II?

[link_tree]

You could just say screw all this talk, and go with a BS board. A manly man of a BS board.

BS board? bull**** board? I'm sorry not sure what it means lol.

[esoomenona]

Buckling spring. They really are nice to type on.

[link_tree]

Buckling spring. They really are nice to type on.

that would be only the IBM models am I right?
I dislike the size of them I'm looking for something with smaller form factor. Ideally a poker but they are hard to come by and the only one I could get is 3 months away from now unless I could find a nice deal in classifieds...

[daerid]

If you're set on a linear switch, I'd go with the reds. You have a much higher chance of loving them (statistically).

[link_tree]

I think I'll go for either reds or browns with a preference for reds. but it's probably gonna be whichever available.

[TheQsanity]

Browns feel very similar to blues but a little faster
you can deff dbl tap with browns
reds are my favorite
blacks are most similar force as ruber dome

[iri]

can you recommend me a very high quality, buttery smooth mx red board?

Here are 4 of them:

Filco FKBN87MRL/EB2
Filco FKBN87MRL/EFB2
Filco FKBN87MRL/EW2
Filco FKBN87MRL/EFW2

thank you very much, jdcarpe. live long and preposterous!

[jdcarpe]

thank you very much, jdcarpe. live long and preposterous!

пожалуйста

[PRISONER 24601]

First mechanical?

Blue, no doubt.

But if I HAD to pick between red and black for an introductory 'board...
black.

[Niomosy]

First mechanical?

Blue, no doubt.

But if I HAD to pick between red and black for an introductory 'board...
black.

This is where trying things out comes in really handy.  I discovered very quickly that blues are, thus far, my least favorite switch.  Luckily I knew from the beginning that blues, given their noise, were automatically disqualified and had initially looked to browns, not knowing any better.  After getting to try out blues, browns, reds, and blacks, I discovered that I much prefer linear switches and favor reds.

I'm curious, why black?  I'd probably lean toward red unless it's going to heavily favor gaming or you want a heavy switch.

[daerid]

To be honest, if noise is you're primary concern, then Blacks will be your friend. Browns and Reds are measurably just as loud, although the sound is lower in pitch so it's perceived as quieter. Even though it's not.

Blacks are quieter because the stiffer spring causes lower force when bottoming out, thus a quieter "clack", and also helps to prevent bottoming out entirely.

[precarious]

44444

To be honest, if noise is you're primary concern, then Blacks will be your friend. Browns and Reds are measurably just as loud, although the sound is lower in pitch so it's perceived as quieter. Even though it's not.

Blacks are quieter because the stiffer spring causes lower force when bottoming out, thus a quieter "clack", and also helps to prevent bottoming out entirely.

I'm assuming you have a keyboard with MX switches.

Press a key down all the way, hold it in place.

Now, pull your finger off of it as quickly as possible.

Listen.

[JPG]

I just got my first mech keyboard recently and when faced with the step of choosing the right switch, I must say that it was not an easy thing.

So, in order to find the best switch for me, I first tried to imagine myself typing on one and asking myself: what is the feeling/sound I want to get.

Then I went on youtube, and watched videos of people typing on the different switch. Just with the sound, you can somewhat know how it "feels".

Personaly I ended up chosing browns and I am very satisfied with them so far.

Also, try to listen to those different switches on the keyboard you intent to buy because different keyboards feels/sounds different.

Mine is a filco (camo, TKL, browns) and I just love it.