Author Topic: Microsoft Natural keyboards  (Read 4047 times)

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Offline Whiskey in the Jar-o

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Microsoft Natural keyboards
« on: Wed, 16 January 2008, 02:18:44 »
I have the latest one (Natural Ergonomic 4000). It looks awesome, but the key feel is just bleah.  It's sort of rubbery and vague, yet not soft at all.  I also have a Natural Keyboard Elite.  The one with the tiny cursor keys.  IMO, it feels a lot more precise, if not any softer.  In any case, both suck compared with my Cherry Cymotion.  I know that these mass-produced MS and Logitech membranes are a crap shoot. The feel depends on the particular OEM, year, etc..  But I was wondering if anyone has a Microsoft Natural Keyboard Pro and how it compares with the other naturals.  I've heard everything from "the best one they made" to "stiff, keys get stuck, don't take off-centre key presses very well, etc.".

Offline puntium

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Microsoft Natural keyboards
« Reply #1 on: Wed, 16 January 2008, 10:48:54 »
That's pretty much what I've heard as well. Out of the ones you can buy now, the Elite is the best in my opinion too. The 4000 is ok if you really slam the keys when you type. I personally hate the smoothness of the key tops, and how they're not cupped. Maybe my fingers are slipper or something.
FILCO FKBN87M/EB / Microsoft Natural Elite / HHKB2 Pro
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Offline fkeidjn

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Microsoft Natural keyboards
« Reply #2 on: Thu, 17 January 2008, 04:02:33 »
I'd get one, if it weren't for the ergonomic profile.  I see a few on ebay.  What's the model number?
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Offline Whiskey in the Jar-o

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Microsoft Natural keyboards
« Reply #3 on: Thu, 17 January 2008, 06:45:45 »
Quote from: fkeidjn;2488
I'd get one, if it weren't for the ergonomic profile.  I see a few on ebay.  What's the model number?


Dunno about the model number.  It's the Pro version - no longer being made.  I want to get one to round out my collection.  Some say it's great, but I've found quite a few, rather old, as one'd expect, reviews that complain about the general stiffness of the keys, keys not taking off-centre strikes well, and a general "hollow" feel and build quality.

The Natural Keyboard Elite is still being made.  However, I've seen reviews complaining about its degrading quality and key feel over the last 10 years. "They don't make'em like they used to. The first one lasted 5 years, the next 3, the last 1 year", etc.. This can be due to cost-cutting, changing OEMs, etc..  The one that I recently got off ebay new appears to be about 1999-2000 vintage.  It was made in Mexico, so   Keytronic is the likely OEM, and they've always made some of the best membrane keyboards. (OTOH, mine looks like the KB that reviewer comlained about in the last link - gray MS logo.)

Overall, I have to say I'm impressed with the Natural Elite.  It looks somewhat ugly in photos - the weird little cursor keys and transposed navigation block,  the "chunk chopped out" look of the middle of the keyboard where the cord is.  In that respect the Natural 4000 looks more balanced.  However, the Elite seems to have that minimalist aesthetic.  It just feels solid.  The textured sculpted keycaps, the space bar.  The 4000 is somewhat busy looking in comparison.  Also the 4000 has a pretty complicated assembly.  It's bigger and lighter.  If I hold it by the corner, the plastic creaks.  The Elite, OTOH, feels solid throughout.  I haven't disassembled it, but I suspect it to be a lot simpler on the inside as well.  It's just a sturdy little board.

Offline iMav

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Microsoft Natural keyboards
« Reply #4 on: Fri, 18 January 2008, 06:15:48 »
Quote from: fkeidjn;2488
I'd get one, if it weren't for the ergonomic profile.  I see a few on ebay.  What's the model number?

I don't understand what the appeal would be...aside from the ergonomic profile???  (which, BTW, doesn't at all appeal to me)

Offline Whiskey in the Jar-o

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MS Natural Multimedia
« Reply #5 on: Wed, 30 January 2008, 20:19:42 »
Just got a new MS Natural Multimedia off ebay.  It was an impulse purchase that I regretted at the time, but what do you know, it actually has the best keyfeel of all the naturals.  For the few that care, here is a summary of my  three MS Natural boards:

MS Natural Ergonomic Keyboard 4000 (Made in China, 2005-2006?):

Good: Sleek design, padded palm rest, quiet, light, reverse slope for those that need it, unmolested naviagtion cluster.

Bad: vague keyfeel, slippery keycaps with minimal cupping feel like the fingers are not getting good purchase, USB only - will not work with PS/2 adapters (bad for KVM users, I suppose), not the stiffest case design - plastic creaks a little if you hold it by the edge.  The space in the middle taken up by a useless zoom lever, though it can be hacked for scrolling.  

MS Natural Keyboard Elite (Made in Mexico, 1999?):

Good: Minimalist design which looks better in real life, about the same weight as the 4000, but smaller and denser which means that it feels very solid and doesn't creak.  Key feel is tactile and fairly quiet.  The key tops are cupped and "grippy".

Bad: Half-size cursor keys arranged in a cross, rather than an inverted-T.  This isn't actually that bad.  Transposed navigation cluster with half-size keys.  Again, you can get used to it, though I'd rather not have to.  Half-size function keys.  The lettering on the keys is pale-grey and doesn't look like it will last a long time. PS/2 (needs a USB converter).

MS Natural Multimedia Keyboard (Made in Thailand, 2004?):

Good: The best keyfeel of all three.  The keys are cupped and "grippy".  A lot like the Elite, but perhaps lighter touch (and longer travel?). Clicky - I know it's just the plastic rattle, but the tactile and aural feedback is the best of the lot. You just know when you've pressed enough. Though the design is definitely WinXP chic, it's actually not bad when you see it in person.  

Bad: As big as the 4000, but much heavier.  I was really surprised by how hefty it is.  I don't use the rear incline legs, but to me they look too flimsy for this keyboard.  Plastic creaks and groans all over the place.    The noisiest of the bunch by far. PS/2 connection.  F-lock could be an annoyance to some.  Some of the bigger keys don't take off-center strikes very well.  For example, if you press the left Shift on the left-most edge it will get stuck and grind its way down.  This doesn't bother me much, since when typing fast I usually hit all keys in the centre.  In any case, the action of the main keys is much smoother than on my Northgate Evolution (white Alps) mechanical board.  Navigation cluster - ****ed.  I can see the sense of a large delete keys, but it just feels "lop-sided" to me.  For example, on a normal cluster, 3 fingers control 2 keys each, and it's the same finger, for the same kind of action.  For example - middle finger for Home/End, ring finger for PgUp/PgDown.  With this warped layout, my ring finger is responsible for End/PgUp/PgDown.  It just doesn't feel logical.   Also, relative to the 4000 and the Elite, the right Ctrl key is much closer to the centre.  I suppose that's not such a bad thing.

P.S.
Take all of the above (and what follows) with a spoonful of salt.  The quality and keyfeel of these mass-produced MS boards varies from year to year, OEM to OEM.

Offline puntium

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Microsoft Natural keyboards
« Reply #6 on: Wed, 30 January 2008, 23:37:47 »
Is the natural multimedia you're talking about the one with the blue tinge? does it have the stupid f-lock problem?

The best by far is the natural keyboard pro, which is the second (i think) one they every came out with.. the good feel of the multimedia, with out the other dumb things like f-lock.
FILCO FKBN87M/EB / Microsoft Natural Elite / HHKB2 Pro
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Offline Whiskey in the Jar-o

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Microsoft Natural keyboards
« Reply #7 on: Thu, 31 January 2008, 01:35:21 »
Quote from: puntium;2697
Is the natural multimedia you're talking about the one with the blue tinge? does it have the stupid f-lock problem?

The best by far is the natural keyboard pro, which is the second (i think) one they every came out with.. the good feel of the multimedia, with out the other dumb things like f-lock.

Yeah it's the one with the blue tinge.  The one I have is the retail version.  There is also an OEM version.  I would think they are the same.  There is also a wireless version, which is supposedly a bit softer.  The wireless version is the only one still made by MS, I believe.

It does have the stupid f-lock, but as far as I understand it's more of a nuisance i.e. the fact that you have to switch it on after every reboot to get normal function key behaviour?  The reason I got this one, was that I was pissed to have been outbid at the last minute at an auction for a new Natural Pro.  In the end, the multimedia turned out to be only a bit cheaper (and from the same seller to boot).  That seller has another Pro, but in "near new condition".  I think I have enough and I've had enough.

P.S.
I believe the Elite came out before the Pro in 1997.  The Pro came out in 1999 and was only made for a coupel of years.  The Elite is still made.