can this be modded for use on modern computers?

[berserkfan]

this vintage model f lookalike looks very nice. i wonder if anyone knows how to do something about that telephone cable connector

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-IBM-Clicky-Keyboard-for-5155-Portable-Computer-83-Keys-w-Number-Pad-/400512307189?pt=US_Vintage_Computing_Parts_Accessories&hash=item5d4064cff5

this Affirmative 122 key looks a bit more flimsy than the average model m (or maybe it is my UNicomp = worse build prejudice), but hey it's cool looking and also ps2. Is hooking it up for use with a modern computer a relatively straightforward thing? I'm now at the level where I can use autohotkey to identify keycodes and map them properly, but haven';t worked up the courage to buy a teensy and solder it to the keyboard


http://www.ebay.com/itm/Affirmative-Model-M-1225T-PS2-Mechanical-Clicky-Click-Tactile-Keyboard-/200936169676?pt=PCA_Mice_Trackballs&hash=item2ec8baa0cc

[1391406]

Even if it could, that layout would be a deal breaker for me.

[rootwyrm]

Er, that's not a Model F lookalike. That's actually a Model F. No, seriously. The IBM PC Portable is - shockingly - a portable IBM PC. It uses the exact same parts including keyboard. The change to the RJ11 connector was for ruggedization and portability - it came with an RJ11->DIN5 adapter. Why? Because it's a PC5150 keyboard in a modified housing. Same protocol and all otherwise as a PC5150 keyboard.

The Affirmative doesn't just look like a Unicomp - all of Affirmatives keyboards are in fact, made by Unicomp. But that also means that yes, they come in the rubber dome version as well as the buckling spring version. It doesn't require drivers, but F13-F24 won't do squat.

[mich]

RJ connectors are little problem - get some cable with DIN or PS/2 plug, connect RJ socket at the other end and you have an adapter.

However, the layout looks like Model F XT and IBM 5155 was a portable version of the PC XT, so this keyboard probably speaks XT protocol instead of the newer AT. This means that it will only work on XT-era computers, Soarer's adapter or Linux with special driver bitbanging XT on the LPT port.

[rootwyrm]

RJ connectors are little problem - get some cable with DIN or PS/2 plug, connect RJ socket at the other end and you have an adapter.

However, the layout looks like Model F XT and IBM 5155 was a portable version of the PC XT, so this keyboard probably speaks XT protocol instead of the newer AT. This means that it will only work on XT-era computers, Soarer's adapter or Linux with special driver bitbanging XT on the LPT port.

Exactly this, yes. I don't have the RJ11 pinout handy. (That's not an RJ45, and it's not a 6-position modular.) Soarer's is the way to go, but it's same load as the PC 5150 XT.

[fohat.digs]

handy pinouts

[berserkfan]

Fohat, based on this diagram, it seems that there are 5 wires I have to get hold of from the RJ11 or RJ45. It's basically the same, right? Cut off the head off the RJ11/45, separate the wires, get teensy, hot glue teensy to a space on the PCB, stick wires on teensy and solder, and now it becomes USB, programmable, and plug and play to a modern computer all at the same time.

DId I get the basic concept right? (Before I actually do all that I'll start reading soarer's threads, but at least I want to know if I have the basic idea down right before spending hours in technical research.)

(you are talking to a techno peasant, so if I sound like a dumbass, well that's not surprpising)

handy pinouts

[berserkfan]

Oh, btw about the Affirmative, I like the color but also want to know if the extra buttons are usable. Do they send key codes that I can do something with, or are they just for show (aka waste of space due to poor design)?

I basically don't mind buying it as an experiment in working with the teensy, but of course I want my experiment to pay off aka result in a 122-key programmable keyboard. No point buying teensy and soldering if it actually requires more bolt modding or whatever serious work inside to get the extra keys to work.

Er, that's not a Model F lookalike. That's actually a Model F. No, seriously. The IBM PC Portable is - shockingly - a portable IBM PC. It uses the exact same parts including keyboard. The change to the RJ11 connector was for ruggedization and portability - it came with an RJ11->DIN5 adapter. Why? Because it's a PC5150 keyboard in a modified housing. Same protocol and all otherwise as a PC5150 keyboard.

The Affirmative doesn't just look like a Unicomp - all of Affirmatives keyboards are in fact, made by Unicomp. But that also means that yes, they come in the rubber dome version as well as the buckling spring version. It doesn't require drivers, but F13-F24 won't do squat.

[dorkvader]

handy pinouts

Fohat, based on this diagram, it seems that there are 5 wires I have to get hold of from the RJ11 or RJ45. It's basically the same, right? Cut off the head off the RJ11/45, separate the wires, get teensy, hot glue teensy to a space on the PCB, stick wires on teensy and solder, and now it becomes USB, programmable, and plug and play to a modern computer all at the same time.

DId I get the basic concept right? (Before I actually do all that I'll start reading soarer's threads, but at least I want to know if I have the basic idea down right before spending hours in technical research.)

(you are talking to a techno peasant, so if I sound like a dumbass, well that's not surprpising)

I would recommend opening it up, putting a teensy inside it, and replacing the cable entirely with a coiled USB cable. The cable is likely detachable internally (though I don't know this for certain: I havent seen one taken apart yet.

Another option is to do a converterbox mod, where you get a female modular jack and just plug it in and go.

bytheway, rj** is not the name of the connector. The connectors are usually called modular connectors, ad refer to the number of populated pins vs the number of possible ones. My WYSE KB has a 4p4c connector on it.

I was actually considering bidding on that, as I always need more model F parts and the case is cooler than my XT.

[rootwyrm]

handy pinouts

Fohat, based on this diagram, it seems that there are 5 wires I have to get hold of from the RJ11 or RJ45. It's basically the same, right? Cut off the head off the RJ11/45, separate the wires, get teensy, hot glue teensy to a space on the PCB, stick wires on teensy and solder, and now it becomes USB, programmable, and plug and play to a modern computer all at the same time.

DId I get the basic concept right? (Before I actually do all that I'll start reading soarer's threads, but at least I want to know if I have the basic idea down right before spending hours in technical research.)

(you are talking to a techno peasant, so if I sound like a dumbass, well that's not surprpising)

I would recommend opening it up, putting a teensy inside it, and replacing the cable entirely with a coiled USB cable. The cable is likely detachable internally (though I don't know this for certain: I havent seen one taken apart yet.

Another option is to do a converterbox mod, where you get a female modular jack and just plug it in and go.

bytheway, rj** is not the name of the connector. The connectors are usually called modular connectors, ad refer to the number of populated pins vs the number of possible ones. My WYSE KB has a 4p4c connector on it.

I was actually considering bidding on that, as I always need more model F parts and the case is cooler than my XT.

handy pinouts

Wrong pinouts, man. It's a unique pinout based on the 6pc (gods, where is my head lately?) and has nothing in common with the SDL layout.

bytheway, rj** is not the name of the connector. The connectors are usually called modular connectors, ad refer to the number of populated pins vs the number of possible ones. My WYSE KB has a 4p4c connector on it.

Dude. Don't even try that around me, I will slap you for not knowing that modular connectors are in fact codified as RJ11, RJ45, RJ48, and there is no RJ12 there is only 6p6c. Oh and that RJ11/RJ45/etc have physical dimensions attached to said definition. I have dealt with way, way, way too many cables. (And yes, I goofed and forgot it's a 6p6c on that keyboard.)

Oh, btw about the Affirmative, I like the color but also want to know if the extra buttons are usable. Do they send key codes that I can do something with, or are they just for show (aka waste of space due to poor design)?

I basically don't mind buying it as an experiment in working with the teensy, but of course I want my experiment to pay off aka result in a 122-key programmable keyboard. No point buying teensy and soldering if it actually requires more bolt modding or whatever serious work inside to get the extra keys to work.

Oh, no, all the keys send scancodes. In fact, they send the exact scancodes they're supposed to. However, the Windows PS/2 driver basically dead-ends many without a driver. Depending on model, that's going to be 5250 or 3270. 1225T == 5250, AS/400 and iSeries. See more information here at the bottom. So a Teensy isn't actually required.
(Ha ha.. and 10Zig's also rebranding Unicomp, but with different firmware. Need to dig more.)

[Soarer]

Modular sockets are a pain because they are all PCB mounting. So to make some kind of adapter you'd need a breakout board or somesuch.

Wiring inside the keyboard is pretty easy - even possible to do without soldering, using a Teensy-with-pins and some female-to-female arduino/breadboard jumper wires.

Just be sure to triple check the wiring / connector pinouts, because IBM wire colours are not intuitive and, afaik, not consistent either! Most likely though, the connector inside the keyboard will be the same as on the XT (<-- guess!!).

[rootwyrm]

Modular sockets are a pain because they are all PCB mounting. So to make some kind of adapter you'd need a breakout board or somesuch.

Wiring inside the keyboard is pretty easy - even possible to do without soldering, using a Teensy-with-pins and some female-to-female arduino/breadboard jumper wires.

Just be sure to triple check the wiring / connector pinouts, because IBM wire colours are not intuitive and, afaik, not consistent either! Most likely though, the connector inside the keyboard will be the same as on the XT (<-- guess!!).

Look again, man. It's a 6p6c out, but it's Molex 5 pin internally I'm pretty sure. Whatever the 5150 non-SDL is by default. (I don't really mess with these so I honestly don't know if it's M-style 5-pin latch or soldered wires.) The cable is definitely non-removable on this one though.

As long as you go from the controller side and not the cable side, it should be exactly identical to the 5150 as far as pinout goes.

[Soarer]

Modular sockets are a pain because they are all PCB mounting. So to make some kind of adapter you'd need a breakout board or somesuch.

Wiring inside the keyboard is pretty easy - even possible to do without soldering, using a Teensy-with-pins and some female-to-female arduino/breadboard jumper wires.

Just be sure to triple check the wiring / connector pinouts, because IBM wire colours are not intuitive and, afaik, not consistent either! Most likely though, the connector inside the keyboard will be the same as on the XT (<-- guess!!).

Look again, man. It's a 6p6c out, but it's Molex 5 pin internally I'm pretty sure. Whatever the 5150 non-SDL is by default. (I don't really mess with these so I honestly don't know if it's M-style 5-pin latch or soldered wires.) The cable is definitely non-removable on this one though.

As long as you go from the controller side and not the cable side, it should be exactly identical to the 5150 as far as pinout goes.

Err, yeah - isn't that exactly what I said?!

Socket for 6P6C - to plug that jack into - is only available as PCB mounting.
Molex/whatever on the inside is easy to attach to.

In the XT keyboard it's 2x7 way. The socket on the cable has 4 positions filled, mating to a latching plug which has the central 2x5 pins fitted.

[berserkfan]

this discussion is way over my head. But someone has bid, and I think I will bid also because I like  collecting these things. I'll probably come back to beg for help when I run into issues (Assuming I win)

[rootwyrm]

Modular sockets are a pain because they are all PCB mounting. So to make some kind of adapter you'd need a breakout board or somesuch.

Wiring inside the keyboard is pretty easy - even possible to do without soldering, using a Teensy-with-pins and some female-to-female arduino/breadboard jumper wires.

Just be sure to triple check the wiring / connector pinouts, because IBM wire colours are not intuitive and, afaik, not consistent either! Most likely though, the connector inside the keyboard will be the same as on the XT (<-- guess!!).

Look again, man. It's a 6p6c out, but it's Molex 5 pin internally I'm pretty sure. Whatever the 5150 non-SDL is by default. (I don't really mess with these so I honestly don't know if it's M-style 5-pin latch or soldered wires.) The cable is definitely non-removable on this one though.

As long as you go from the controller side and not the cable side, it should be exactly identical to the 5150 as far as pinout goes.

Err, yeah - isn't that exactly what I said?!

Um, maybe? It wasn't clear at all to me.

Socket for 6P6C - to plug that jack into - is only available as PCB mounting.
Molex/whatever on the inside is easy to attach to.

In the XT keyboard it's 2x7 way. The socket on the cable has 4 positions filled, mating to a latching plug which has the central 2x5 pins fitted.

Er, no it's not.. if it was, the barrel adapter wouldn't have been possible. Even now, have a whole stack of them. (Okay, so it's 5 from one company, but still.) Also available in SDL.

The XT side of the house, I don't know well enough - I don't work with XTs. All I know is that the 5150 portable has the same PCB as the PC5150 and uses a permanently fixed 6p6c cable.

[Soarer]

Modular sockets are a pain because they are all PCB mounting. So to make some kind of adapter you'd need a breakout board or somesuch.

Wiring inside the keyboard is pretty easy - even possible to do without soldering, using a Teensy-with-pins and some female-to-female arduino/breadboard jumper wires.

Just be sure to triple check the wiring / connector pinouts, because IBM wire colours are not intuitive and, afaik, not consistent either! Most likely though, the connector inside the keyboard will be the same as on the XT (<-- guess!!).

Look again, man. It's a 6p6c out, but it's Molex 5 pin internally I'm pretty sure. Whatever the 5150 non-SDL is by default. (I don't really mess with these so I honestly don't know if it's M-style 5-pin latch or soldered wires.) The cable is definitely non-removable on this one though.

As long as you go from the controller side and not the cable side, it should be exactly identical to the 5150 as far as pinout goes.

Err, yeah - isn't that exactly what I said?!

Um, maybe? It wasn't clear at all to me.

Socket for 6P6C - to plug that jack into - is only available as PCB mounting.
Molex/whatever on the inside is easy to attach to.

In the XT keyboard it's 2x7 way. The socket on the cable has 4 positions filled, mating to a latching plug which has the central 2x5 pins fitted.

Er, no it's not.. if it was, the barrel adapter wouldn't have been possible. Even now, have a whole stack of them. (Okay, so it's 5 from one company, but still.)

Fair enough, I stand corrected! Replace 'only' with 'generally only' ) Those look pretty useful for DIY stuff

But... are you sure the barrel adapter didn't have a little PCB inside? I hacked up an ethernet extension cable to make an adapter, and there was a PCB in there!

Also available in SDL.

Hmm... not really sure what those on that link are... says 21 and 31 positions!

The XT side of the house, I don't know well enough - I don't work with XTs. All I know is that the 5150 portable has the same PCB as the PC5150 and uses a permanently fixed 6p6c cable.

Permanently fixed... until you open the case
(If I wasn't clear before, I meant removable, not detachable... i.e. not soldered to the PCB inside).